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Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final installment is scheduled to debut in Japan on January 23, 2021.

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Postby artesox » Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:26 pm

Mariasu is slowly approaching LAS (Asuka Shinji) in one of the most popular Japanese art websites (pixiv), soon enough it might become the second most popular eva couple there, loosing obviously to KawoShin.
But that is just shipping I guess. I myself have no hope of seeing the two doing anything but being friends.

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Postby obliterates » Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:50 pm

In Japan Kaworu/Shinji, Mari/Asuka, Ritsuko/Maya and Misato/Kaji are referred to as the all-accepted "Official Pairings" because of the canon support (Misato/Kaji and Kaworu/Shinji in show, manga, and rebuild series/Ritsuko/Maya in the movies) OR supplementary-work support (Mari/Asuka).

So yes, Mari/Asuka has been included with the likes of Kaworu/Shinji and Misato/Kaji as the "norm accepted ship" and a lot of people ship it for that reason.
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Postby ElMariachi » Fri Sep 12, 2014 3:58 pm

^
Most of these ships are simply pandering: GAINAX/Khara know that cute yaoi and sexy yuri sells well, so we have lots of KawoShin and MariAsu, but nothing in the show clearly shows a romantic relationship between them, even if there was tons of "Ho Yay" moments between Shinji and Kaworu.
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Postby El Squibbonator » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:14 pm

That's the problem. The fact that Gainax/Khara puts this stuff on their merchandise in the first place implies that they support it in some way, but then as you say they could just be doing it because it's what sells. It makes it very difficult to tell what the the real accepted position is.
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Postby Nuclear Lunchbox » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:15 pm

Most shipping is really just a fan thing, isn't it. There's no need to ship if they're a couple in the show.

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Postby ThanatosII » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:17 pm

View Original PostNuclear Lunchbox wrote:Most shipping is really just a fan thing, isn't it. There's no need to ship if they're a couple in the show.

That's the mindset I agree with. I really dig Asushin, but I can at least separate my fantasies from the real story.
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Postby Nuclear Lunchbox » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:22 pm

Don't get me wrong, though. Shipping is awesome. :nyao:

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Postby obliterates » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:25 pm

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:^
Most of these ships are simply pandering: GAINAX/Khara know that cute yaoi and sexy yuri sells well, so we have lots of KawoShin and MariAsu, but nothing in the show clearly shows a romantic relationship between them, even if there was tons of "Ho Yay" moments between Shinji and Kaworu.


Even though I disagree that Mari/Asuka and Kaworu/Shinji are simply pandering, I was just making a comment on what the general consenues "ships" are.

If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Shinji with? It's Kaworu.
If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Misato with? It's Kaji.
If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Asuka with? It's Mari.

And like others have pointed out there are similarities between all those characters. Khara is doing it on purpose I think.
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Postby El Squibbonator » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:34 pm

That's what I'm saying. It's hard to tell if Khara is doing it because of the positive fan reaction to the pairing, or if it's the cause of it. My guess is that it's a little of both.
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Postby ThanatosII » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:39 pm

Anno and camp know all about pandering to their target audience, I mean that's what jump started their career in anime in the first place, so it's no secret they intentionally do what they do to make easy cash. Don't really blame them, as they have to get paid somehow since animators aren't Hollywood actors and directors.
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Postby artesox » Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:50 pm

It's far from official or canon, but I'm pretty sure Khara fuelled and created said shipping without a single bit of innocence. It will not be canon but please buy our paired figures :hahaha:

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Postby ElMariachi » Fri Sep 12, 2014 5:25 pm

View Original Postobliterates wrote:If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Shinji with? It's Kaworu.

Surely, although Asuka would come equally, or close second.
View Original Postobliterates wrote:If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Misato with? It's Kaji.

This one is easy, since it's canon.
View Original Postobliterates wrote:If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Asuka with? It's Mari.

Doubtful, most of America didn't saw 3.0 yet, and I'm sure that even then Shinji will come first.
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Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

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Postby obliterates » Fri Sep 12, 2014 5:43 pm

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:Surely, although Asuka would come equally, or close second.


You honestly don't believe that. One look at the Evangelion Pixiv tag and it's mostly Kawoshin. There are official Kawoshin wedding rings sold in Japan courtesy of Khara. The Asushin tag in Pixiv is so feeble compared to the Kawoshin tag and even then it's mostly R-18.

Asushin is a niche ship. The Japanese fandom, men and women included, adore Kaworu and fully support Kaworu/Shinji. Asuka's and Misato's VAs are in full support of Kaworu/Shinji.

People believe that Kaworu/Shinji is right up there with Misato/Kaji. And from how Khara is acting with Mari/Asuka that ship is also looking to join the ranks.

Doubtful, most of America didn't saw 3.0 yet, and I'm sure that even then Shinji will come first.


Trust me most American HAVE seen 3.0. And most Americans definitely ship Kaworu/Shinji. You must not be American.
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Postby pwhodges » Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:25 pm

View Original Postobliterates wrote:You honestly don't believe that. One look at the Evangelion Pixiv tag and it's mostly Kawoshin.

On the other hand, multiple critics have told me that my fanfic will not get much interest on FFN because it's not LAS-based. So it depends where you look.

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Postby obliterates » Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:31 pm

View Original Postpwhodges wrote:On the other hand, multiple critics have told me that my fanfic will not get much interest on FFN because it's not LAS-based. So it depends where you look.

Heh! I guess it's time to change my avi! But perhaps not, it's a bit soon, and still works for me...


I have noticed FFN is a niche site for the Evangelion fandom where Asushin is dominate. Same with 4chan. But again you get the same small demographic and that's not representative of the larger fandom and definitely not representative of what the Japanese fans think. There are many hate boards on 2chn that are dedicated to bashing LAS. Like I said there are Khara-made Kawoshin wedding rings that are sold in Japan.

And that is not getting into the fact that Kaworu and Mari are similar personality-wise and connected to Kaji for a reason. It is not simply pandering. Anno has a single "archetype" for the love interests he writes and that stays constant through his works.
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Postby Na7e » Fri Sep 12, 2014 6:59 pm

View Original Postobliterates wrote:Trust me most American HAVE seen 3.0. And most Americans definitely ship Kaworu/Shinji. You must not be American.


You must have a survey on this right? I mean at least Khara came out with actual statistics of what the most popular pairing was with Kaworu/Shinji as the most popular followed by Rei/Shinji and then Asuka/Shinji. Though that shouldn't be surprising considering Rei and Kaworu are of particular importance in the new movies.

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Postby ElMariachi » Fri Sep 12, 2014 8:15 pm

View Original Postobliterates wrote:And that is not getting into the fact that Kaworu and Mari are similar personality-wise and connected to Kaji for a reason.

Since when Kaworu is connected to Kaji? Since when Kaworu is connected to anyone who isn't Shinji? (or SEELE)
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EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

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Postby Jäeger » Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:23 am

View Original PostEl Squibbonator wrote:That's the problem. The fact that Gainax/Khara puts this stuff on their merchandise in the first place implies that they support it in some way, but then as you say they could just be doing it because it's what sells. It makes it very difficult to tell what the the real accepted position is.


If I have to pay attention to merchandaise, my first conclusion is that Asuka and Rei are hot for each other. But if you want to talk about merchindise, pay attention to mangas likes ISRP o Petit Eva and witness Kaworu's role.

Please :facepalm:. Seriously people fanfic and slashfic are cool, but be realistic.

I've seen Evangelion since 1998 and there always have been a big kawoshin fanfic since the series, and it's fine, it's funny and everyone has to right to fantasize but the closest thing to an "official"couplel has been S/A, and as example of merchandise, videogames (from EVA o SRW) never have hide that fact. Of course, never as the same level of YUi/Gendo, Misato /Kaji because....well, their "special and decontructive" relationship Maya and Ritsuko? A couple of pictures side by side make them a couple? You should separate your fantasies (which are legitimate) from the show.

You honestly don't believe that. One look at the Evangelion Pixiv tag and it's mostly Kawoshin. There are official Kawoshin wedding rings sold in Japan courtesy of Khara. The Asushin tag in Pixiv is so feeble compared to the Kawoshin tag and even then it's mostly R-18.

Asushin is a niche ship. The Japanese fandom, men and women included, adore Kaworu and fully support Kaworu/Shinji. Asuka's and Misato's VAs are in full support of Kaworu/Shinji.

People believe that Kaworu/Shinji is right up there with Misato/Kaji. And from how Khara is acting with Mari/Asuka that ship is also looking to join the ranks.

Quote:
Doubtful, most of America didn't saw 3.0 yet, and I'm sure that even then Shinji will come first.


Trust me most American HAVE seen 3.0. And most Americans definitely ship Kaworu/Shinji. You must not be American.


You're talking in the name of a lot of people witout showing staTistics. Fine if you are head over heels over that ship, but don't spit that data without numbers. And no, a fanfic website is not a reference. Because it's what they are : fantasies. Of course there is gonna be a lot of Kawoshin fanfic......because that relationship is just a fan fantasy, it's fanfic fuel. The hell, even evageeks is not a reference? How many have watched Eva? How many are here?

Neither Mariachi and me are americans and I don't think that is a key factor. In Europe there have been dubs from the beggining (Spanish dub for 3.0 since 2013), a lot of people have seen the Rebuild movies, the series and everything ABOUT "Asushin is a niche ship" (I would said the same if you talked about Rei) it's just your invention. It seems that every shipping that doesn't agree with your POV is a niche. Seriously, what is the point to be american or not in this discussion??? Are you invested with the will and opinion of all americans who watched EVA? And I agree with Mariachi : I doubt western audience ships Kawoshin the most, I doubt it a lot.

The wedding rings?? My god, is just merchandise a joke to milk money because khara knows it's audience How many times have you seen similar things with Asuka, Misato o Rei??? Thousands. In the ISRP o GOS games Kaworu is the only man you can date, but is more a joke, a a callback to fans, than anything. It's not even taken seriously.

You must have a survey on this right? I mean at least Khara came out with actual statistics of what the most popular pairing was with Kaworu/Shinji as the most popular followed by Rei/Shinji and then Asuka/Shinji. Though that shouldn't be surprising considering Rei and Kaworu are of particular importance in the new movies.


That's information, and probably 15 years ago, was similar. And if you question westerN audience, the results will change. That's shipping, many times a fantasy. How many a time in anime the most popular shipping is not the "official couple"?? HundredS because....well....they fit together or people like to pair them because they are the most popular characters, etc......Probably we'll find more FF VII fanficspairing Cloud and Aerith than with Tifa, but that is not gonna change the girl he ends up with.

Most of these ships are simply pandering: GAINAX/Khara know that cute yaoi and sexy yuri sells well, so we have lots of KawoShin and MariAsu, but nothing in the show clearly shows a romantic relationship between them, even if there was tons of "Ho Yay" moments between Shinji and Kaworu.


They don't seem to understand what "give the customer what he wants" means
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Postby Bagheera » Sat Sep 13, 2014 5:44 am

View Original PostEl Squibbonator wrote:That's the problem. The fact that Gainax/Khara puts this stuff on their merchandise in the first place implies that they support it in some way, but then as you say they could just be doing it because it's what sells. It makes it very difficult to tell what the the real accepted position is.


The real accepted position is what we see in the show/movies. There is nothing else.

View Original Postobliterates wrote:Even though I disagree that Mari/Asuka and Kaworu/Shinji are simply pandering, I was just making a comment on what the general consenues "ships" are.

If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Shinji with? It's Kaworu.
If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Misato with? It's Kaji.
If you ask most people in Japan and the USA who they ship Asuka with? It's Mari.


[citation needed]

Claiming it doesn't make it so. IME most people ship Shinji with Asuka, leaving Mari and Kaworu out in the cold. I've yet to find any proof on the matter one way or the other (though Misato/Kaji is obviously canon, since it's what we see in the show/movies).

View Original Postobliterates wrote:I have noticed FFN is a niche site for the Evangelion fandom where Asushin is dominate. Same with 4chan.


Calling both ff.net and 4chan niche is absurd. They're the norm, dude. There isn't much beyond that. Again, [citation needed]

And trust me, most Americans have not seen Q. Most don't know a damn thing about Eva, because they aren't anime fans. Anime has very little penetration in the U.S.
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Postby Squigsquasher » Sat Sep 13, 2014 5:59 am

I'm still holding out for Rei X Shinji. Or Kaworu X Shinji. Or Misato X Shinji. Or really anyone X Shinji that isn't Asuka as I hate Asuka X Shinji more than just about anything else. Seriously, I'd be up for pairing Shinji with Gendo if it meant avoiding the Red Menace.
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