3.0 Film Reaction Thread

[ElMariachi]

And will all the clusterfuck about their delay of the release date and whatever it's happening with Khara that made that delay, I don't think we'll get many info from them until at least when they will have a release date.

[Bagheera]

From another thread:

I personally really enjoyed Rebellion, and at the risk of sounding blasphemous, felt it was far better than Eva 3.0, and even did some things better than it (more comprehensible story, allowed the themes to be unveiled through the characters' actions rather than the themes dictating the characters' actions, can stand on its own far better, less mean-spirited and one-sided, etc).

Again though, that's just me.

It's not blasphemy, it's just a silly thing to say since the movies are completely different beasts and are meant to do different things (well, it's also silly because what you say re: Q is flat-out wrong, but that's a separate issue). I've noticed this issue with many different posters here: they don't seem to get the point of Q, and run into trouble when their expectations get in the way of appreciating the movie for what it is. ANNO IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR EXPECTATIONS. That's a truism for filmmakers in general, but particularly for Anno, who's made a career of subverting expectations. And I think audiences get that over time, even though it takes a bit with his more divisive works (e.g. EoE and Q).

Far as I can tell the sustained audience reaction to the ENT series goes something like this:

Jo: "Wait, didn't you say this wouldn't be a remake? This looks an awful lot like a remake. It's nice to see the series updated, I guess, but this is kinda boring. Ramiel battle was cool, though."

Ha: "Oh Christ, now you're just pandering. WTF Anno? Asuka's gone full tsundere, there's mediocre fanservice all over the place (you used to subvert the fuck out of that, what happened?), who the fuck is Tits McGee, there's a fucking cooking subplot? I used to respect you, man."

Q: "Oh, I see. This is you saying 'silly Otaku, I have more money than God, I don't need to sell out. I'm making this because I still have something to say.' Alright then, well played. Let's see what you can do with Final."

IOW Q was meant to get our attention. It was meant to tell us this wasn't a retread of the series, and nor was it Anno selling out -- something's happening. All of this has been setup for the real heart of the story, which is Final. Is it a great strategy? I don't know. Will it pay off? I'm honestly not sure. But I wish more fans would recognize the fact that everything we've seen up until now is not the result of incompetence, cashing in, or (most laughably) mean-spiritedness; it's a careful strategy on Anno's part meant to evoke a particular reaction from the audience, and it seems to be working pretty well so far. Let's just give him the benefit of the doubt for a bit until we see how he brings it all home with Final.

[thezeppo1138]

I think 3.0 is awesome. And the doubters can't win that debate cause what do they get? Butthurt and bitterness. What do we get? More Eva. Yay! Also, I don't see why Madoka Magica is being treated like such a big deal and being compared to Eva. It's a fine series that's a fun deconstruction, but it isn't all that deep. It's clever and cool but that's about the extent of it. Compared to Eva, especially NGE, makes Madoka look as superficial as a big titted, blonde cheerleader who's dating a football jock. It's a pretty short series and the movie, while cool, is on a whole, unnecessary. They said everything they had to say in the series. It seemed finished. The movie was just an unnecessary add-on that's just beating you over the head at that point. 3.0 isn't unnecessary, it's part of a story in progress. All the Madoka and Attack on Titan craze is just a trend. I like those shows, but I've seen way better anime than those in recent time. And Madoka is in no way a game changer like NGE. No series has come close.

[Adaminator1]

From another thread:



It's not blasphemy, it's just a silly thing to say since the movies are completely different beasts and are meant to do different things (well, it's also silly because what you say re: Q is flat-out wrong, but that's a separate issue). I've noticed this issue with many different posters here: they don't seem to get the point of Q, and run into trouble when their expectations get in the way of appreciating the movie for what it is. ANNO IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR EXPECTATIONS. That's a truism for filmmakers in general, but particularly for Anno, who's made a career of subverting expectations. And I think audiences get that over time, even though it takes a bit with his more divisive works (e.g. EoE and Q).

Far as I can tell the sustained audience reaction to the ENT series goes something like this:

Jo: "Wait, didn't you say this wouldn't be a remake? This looks an awful lot like a remake. It's nice to see the series updated, I guess, but this is kinda boring. Ramiel battle was cool, though."

Ha: "Oh Christ, now you're just pandering. WTF Anno? Asuka's gone full tsundere, there's mediocre fanservice all over the place (you used to subvert the fuck out of that, what happened?), who the fuck is Tits McGee, there's a fucking cooking subplot? I used to respect you, man."

Q: "Oh, I see. This is you saying 'silly Otaku, I have more money than God, I don't need to sell out. I'm making this because I still have something to say.' Alright then, well played. Let's see what you can do with Final."

IOW Q was meant to get our attention. It was meant to tell us this wasn't a retread of the series, and nor was it Anno selling out -- something's happening. All of this has been setup for the real heart of the story, which is Final. Is it a great strategy? I don't know. Will it pay off? I'm honestly not sure. But I wish more fans would recognize the fact that everything we've seen up until now is not the result of incompetence, cashing in, or (most laughably) mean-spiritedness; it's a careful strategy on Anno's part meant to evoke a particular reaction from the audience, and it seems to be working pretty well so far. Let's just give him the benefit of the doubt for a bit until we see how he brings it all home with Final.

In my eyes, the larger meta theme of Rebuild is comfort zones.

The first film was "Hey, this is what you wanted, isn't it? I mean, it's slightly better, small things have been refined to enhance stuff, but this is exactly what you wanted".

The second film is "I'm gonna give you what you wanted but /not what you expected/."

The third film? "Fuck what you wanted AND what you expected. Here's what I want to show you. Bear with me, here." (And I like all of the movies in the series.)

And if I'm right, I can imagine 4.0 will throw all caution to the wind, with a major theme of change and acceptance (or resistance) of change. Which has me hopeful.

[Sailor Star Dust]

Heh, both you and Bagheera have the right of it, as far as I'm concerned. Bring on Final!

[thezeppo1138]

In my eyes, the larger meta theme of Rebuild is comfort zones.

The first film was "Hey, this is what you wanted, isn't it? I mean, it's slightly better, small things have been refined to enhance stuff, but this is exactly what you wanted".

The second film is "I'm gonna give you what you wanted but /not what you expected/."

The third film? "Fuck what you wanted AND what you expected. Here's what I want to show you. Bear with me, here." (And I like all of the movies in the series.)

And if I'm right, I can imagine 4.0 will throw all caution to the wind, with a major theme of change and acceptance (or resistance) of change. Which has me hopeful.

I like this a lot. Sounds about right. I love that 3.0 did that, it just makes me more excited for 4.0 cause now I know it will be a big surprise. He has made it clear at this point that we are in for something new and I am very hopeful about it as well. I like when an artist shakes things up like this.

[Gendo'sPapa]

Anytime I see someone say "Hideaki Anno is the George Lucas of anime" it infuriates me because it's criticism on the most shallow & surface level way possible.

But I love 3.0. I enjoyed the first two Rebuild films for what they were - fun & pretty adventures - but while a lot of people on here were hating on 2.0 for being a Pander-fest I always felt there was something extra going on with all that in the second film. Anno is a very strong writer for women & his writing is one of the few cases where his women characters - dependent on their role in the narrative - are strong & real women characters in total & not just strong because they "kick-ass". It struck me as curious that the male-female interactions in 2.0 so heavily played into otaku/virginal male fantasies. Asuka pretty quickly softened up to Shinji even though he never even attempted to reach out & connect with her - hell, she crawls into his bed in the middle of the night for god's sake, an absolute male fantasy - & the film ends with Shinji "growing a pair" & saving the hot, naked fan favorite female character. 2.0 is an enjoyable film but it's an oddity in Anno's work since the female characters were the weaker element of the piece.

Then 3.0 came around & turned everything on it's head. If 2.0 is Eva perverted into a male fantasy then 3.0 is that fantasy rejecting the dreamer & turning into a nightmare.

I love the Rebuild franchise clearly. But, more so than any other series - besides maybe Lord of the Rings - I think the entire franchise will work best as a whole where each film can play off each other.

I trust Anno. 4.0 (or 3.0 + 1.0 or Final or Fan-Service or Whatever) is gonna be great. It'll underline, highlight & put an exclamation point on what the three current films have set up.

[thezeppo1138]

Anytime I see someone say "Hideaki Anno is the George Lucas of anime" it infuriates me because it's criticism on the most shallow & surface level way possible.

Oh no, you missunderstand. I wasn't comparing the directors or their works with each other. What I meant was just that Eva is my favorite anime and I don't see that changing, the way Star Wars is my favorite movie and don't see that changing. It's just a phrase I use. Like Buffy is my Star Wars of TV shows cause it's my favorite of all favorites. It was any deeper than that. I wasnt making direct comparisons, just comparisons of my feelings towards both. Sorry for the confusion. I hope that made sense.

EDIT: I just realized I had said that in a different thread, so if you were talking to someone else, then my bad dude. Plus the fact that none of the words in this sentence ("Hideaki Anno is the George Lucas of anime") have ever been in a post of mine. lol Sometimes I get the convos I'm having in different threads mixed up.

[robersora]

51 pages and counting in a thread about reactions, One and a half year after the release. I know, we are crazy for Eva, but it's astonishing what an impact this movie had.

I sometimes say Evangelion is the Star Wars of Anime to sell it to people who are reluctant to watch it.

[hui43210]

=
I sometimes say Evangelion is the Star Wars of Anime to sell it to people who are reluctant to watch it.

TBH Gundam is waaaay more like star wars than Eva. I don't have time to list similarity's right now/off topic anyways, but there are a bit.

[Ray]

Bottom line, she hates him now. Maybe not as much as I once thought, but still. . .

At this point I just hope Final can prove my pessimism wrong and prove Shinji can still be redeemed.

[Sailor Star Dust]

Whatever happened to lowering the pessimistic posts?

[Ray]

Check the departures thread I'm taking a break for a while.

Sorry. . .

[Topic split into "3.0 In Shinji Shoes -- Shinji and Wille's perspectives". - OMF]

[Asavarii]

Blown away by the audio visual quality, stunned by the changes and have come to accept that 3.0 needs the context of 4.0 to make complete sense.

In short, 3.0 will be remembered as a team player in the Rebuild series that maintained the aesthetic quality established so far.

[airman4]

Blown away by the audio visual quality, stunned by the changes and have come to accept that 3.0 needs the context of 4.0 to make complete sense.

In short, 3.0 will be remembered as a team player in the Rebuild series that maintained the aesthetic quality established so far.

If only everyone who saw the movie was like you ..

[Asavarii]

If only everyone who saw the movie was like you ..

I find a lot of the criticism levelled at 3.0 comes from frustration at not understanding what the F was going on. Fight the good fight, and all that! ;)

I too felt this frustration, but I want to wait until I have the full picture before passing judgement.

[Sicarius VI]

I find a lot of the criticism levelled at 3.0 comes from frustration at not understanding what the F was going on. Fight the good fight, and all that! ;)

I too felt this frustration, but I want to wait until I have the full picture before passing judgement.

I never did think once 3.0 was bad in anyway, I believe people like to put confusing and bad/horrible in the same category. As with all of Evangelion you must be paying attention to try and understand what's going on.

On another note-
I want a way to describe the reason the models for almost everything seem diffrent. For example I compared the Quantum Rei appearance in 3.0 to Rei in 2.0 and before this I thought it was the angels on some parts of the characters like say the chin looks sharper, but then after that I can't be sure anymore. 3.0 is just made to look diffrent, which I actually think is fitting for the environment 3.0 is set in. Anyone know what I'm talking about? Help?

[Guy Nacks]

I want a way to describe the reason the models for almost everything seem different. For example I compared the Quantum Rei appearance in 3.0 to Rei in 2.0 and before this I thought it was the angels on some parts of the characters like say the chin looks sharper, but then after that I can't be sure anymore. 3.0 is just made to look different, which I actually think is fitting for the environment 3.0 is set in. Anyone know what I'm talking about? Help?

3.0 had a lot more CGI in it than any of the Rebuilds thus far, which already had a fair bit of it to begin with. But those were mostly for the Angels and not so much for the characters.

As for the actual characters, that's more because of the general trend in the anime industry towards character models with sharper features. If you look at a lot of anime from the 80s, characters' features were generally more rounded, but got a little sharper in the 90s and then to what we have now. I'm assuming that this is moreso the reason because Rebuild retains many of the same key animators and animation directors from NGE like Takeshi Honda, Masayuki, and Kazuya Tsurumaki, whose art styles in the 90s were much rounder than they are today.

Another example would be to look at the animation from Dragonball from the mid to late 80s and compare it with late series DBZ or GT, it's really just seems to be a trend in the industry much the same way cars in the 80s were all square and boxy and now they're curvy and more more stylized.

[Lennik]

I think one of the biggest reasons that a lot of people dislike 3.0 is because they irrationally feel personally hurt by it. Hopeful details aside, it really is an emotionally grueling film, and some people can't handle tragedy, so they reject it and claim that the problem is the movie itself--rather than their reaction to the movie.

Another example would be to look at the animation from Dragonball from the mid to late 80s and compare it with late series DBZ or GT, it's really just seems to be a trend in the industry.

This. The rounder style carries into about halfway through the Saiyan saga, and it's especially noticeable when you compare how Vegeta and Nappa look before and after they land on earth. By the time the Frieza saga rolled around, the new style was set in stone.

[Sicarius VI]

I think one of the biggest reasons that a lot of people dislike 3.0 is because they irrationally feel personally hurt by it. Hopeful details aside, it really is an emotionally grueling film, and some people can't handle tragedy, so they reject it and claim that the problem is the movie itself--rather than their reaction to the movie.

Considering how much more "upbeat" 1.0 and 2.0 are, 3.0 is very tragic and all Fan speculation aside we really don't know what's going with anything other than Shinji, it is really sad to know that he created this "Near Third Impact" and it was all for nothing because he didn't physically save Rei II, and on top of that most of the other characters besides Kaworu, Rei Q, and Fuyutsuki resent Shinji one way or another.

So I'm saying I agree with you Lennik, I hope you don't mind be building off of your comment.

@Guy Nacks
That helps clear it up, but I still wonder why is seems so different when there was only 2 years between 2.0 and 3.0. Who knows maybe they used more CGI then we realized.