Do we need to know about the timeskip?

[Nuclear Lunchbox]

Hate to say it, but I really would pay if we got more than one final. I mean, One More Final, right?

[Chuckman]

Boy would they have egg on their face if there was actually another one after that.

[Warren Peace]

I don't see why. The only reason there are four is because of some kind of Japanese sequencing gimmick nobody really cares about.

[Chuckman]

I prefer to think of 2.0, 3.0, and Final as a trilogy of original films, prefaced by 1.0 which has little or nothing to add to the mythos and almost feels disconnected at this point.

[WunderBah]

I've seen a lot of shows in which information was jam-packed into final episodes, and some of them have managed to pull it off. Knowing Anno, he'll be in that category.

He did it well with Misato's info dump with Shinji during EoE anyhow.

[pwhodges]

I don't see why. The only reason there are four is because of some kind of Japanese sequencing gimmick nobody really cares about.

I thought that was a three-part structure (Jo, Ha, Kyuu), and final is already tacked-on.

But then Wikipedia tells me this:

Zeami, in his work "Sandō" (The Three Paths), originally described a five-part (five dan) Noh play as the ideal form. It begins slowly and auspiciously in the first part (jo), building up the drama and tension in the second, third, and fourth parts (ha), with the greatest climax in the third dan, and rapidly concluding with a return to peace and auspiciousness in the fifth dan (kyū).

[ElMariachi]

^
But according to that Wikipedia article, "Ha" takes three parts, and "Kyu" is the fifth and last one, and here with Rebuild we already got "Kyu"/Q.

By the way, is the title for the fourth movie, "Final", official or it's just a fan name and the official one is still "?" ?

[pwhodges]

I realise it doesn't match up; but since Kyuu is the last part that's already true! I was just amused to find a justification of sorts for my 5-part idea.

[ElMariachi]

^
Well, TMB raised an excellent point that FINAL could encompass the fourth and fifth act of the traditional Jo-Ha-Kyu structure : the fourth act is a "journey which eases out of the intense drama of the climactic act"(which was the previous one, or here 3.0), and the fifth one is a rapid conclusion where "all the loose ends are tied up, and the play returns to an auspicious setting." (said auspicious setting being the first act, or 1.0)

Now the "fourth act being a journey easing the previous drama" correspond very well to Shinji and the other pilots' journey across the red desert and him finding hope at the place he ends in, and the fifth one being a rapid conclusion corresponds very well to a final battle after which the war will finally be over and everyone can come back to a more normal life as it was in 1.0.

Read his whole post, here, it's an amazing one and I wouldn't be surprised if Anno makes the last movie follow this route.

[Jornophelanthas]

Referring back to that post by TMBounty_Hunter that ElMariachi kindly links to, I offer a slightly different take.

I propose to apply the five-act structure to Rebuild of Evangelion in the following way:

Act 1:

He described the first act as "Love"; the play opens auspiciously, using gentle themes and pleasant music to draw in the attention of the audience.

I agree with TMBounty_Hunter that this is covered in Rebuild 1.0.

Act 2:

The second act is described as "Warriors and Battles" (shura). Though it need not contain actual battle, it is generally typified by heightened tempo and intensity of plot.

I also agree with TMBounty_Hunter that this is covered in Rebuild 2.0.

But from here I start digressing.

Act 3:

The third act, the climax of the entire play, is typified by pathos and tragedy. The plot achieves its dramatic climax.

TMBounty_Hunter interprets this as being run over the course of Rebuild 3.0. I disagree. In my opinion, this part of the story has not been told, because it is the part that has been left out in the time skip.
(So where is the tragedy if Shinji does not feature in it? Well, for example, someone or something could have removed the Spear from Unit-01 during the attack of the 12th Angel or a similar crisis, and Third Impact could have just continued from there. The tragedy would then be how Shinji's decision back in 2.0 achieved the exact opposite of what he really wanted (but didn't know he wanted).)

Act 4:

Takemoto describes the fourth act as a michiyuki (journey), which eases out of the intense drama of the climactic act, and often consists primarily of song and dance rather than dialogue and plot.

TMBounty_Hunter speculates that FINAL will cover this, given the "wandering the desert" scene that ended 3.0. Personally, I would rather apply this part of the structure to Rebuild 3.0, as it actually consists of Shinji wandering the new world he finds himself in. Also note that there is relatively little dialogue in the movie, as well as the piano scene with Shinji and Kaworu.

Act 5:

The fifth act, then, is a rapid conclusion. All loose ends are tied up, and the play returns to an auspicious setting.

TMBounty_Hunter speculates that this act will not be part of the Rebuild of Evangelion story (as resolution is anathema to Evangelion). I disagree, and argue that FINAL will actually fill this part in the structure. It could take the shape of the prophecied Final Impact suddenly threatening to occur, where all main characters struggle to find their suitable place in the story, or all will be for naught.

I don't know myself what I mean by "finding their suitable place". However, I can see that all the main characters have been struggling throughout 3.0, that they have all been forced out of their comfort zones, and that they are now all on the verge of a personal breakthrough that has yet to materialize:

- Shinji has to draw the conclusion that he can't live in the past any more and must face life in front of him.
- Asuka has to learn how to forgive, in order to not be consumed by her (failing) hatred.
- Rei 3.0 has to develop her own individuality, no matter how simple.
- Misato has to learn how to reconcile her love of Shinji with her fear of Impacts.
- Gendo has to let go of his obsession with Yui. (Arguably not going to happen...)
(And yes, I have left Mari out of this, because she does not appear to exhibit any character growth at all, even though she is a pilot.)

[speculation] Therefore, Shinji must pilot Unit-01 one last time in order to protect what he holds dear (i.e. Asuka), Asuka must willingly aid and co-operate with Shinji, Rei 3.0 must sacrifice herself for her own wishes and desire instead of someone else's, Misato must back Shinji up for his own sake despite the danger of Impact, and Gendo must willingly abandon his Master Plan when it is on the verge of succeeding. (Gendo is a special case. He may not actually overcome his hang-up, but he may be put in a position of choice nevertheless - and choose the wrong path.) [/speculation]

Once all this "clicks into place" for every character, and they manage to all overcome their hang-ups in a single moment of revelation/enlightenment, the world will indeed be saved ("return to auspicious setting"), no matter how close to the brink it may have gotten.

Remember, even a sense of hope in a blasted wasteland can be auspicious. (And who knows, Kaworu did suggest that a return to pre-3I paradise could be possible if both Spears can be somehow found and utilized.)

[Ray]

[speculation] Therefore, Shinji must pilot Unit-01 one last time in order to protect what he holds dear. . .

Remember, even a sense of hope in a blasted wasteland can be auspicious. (And who knows, Kaworu did suggest that a return to pre-3I paradise could be possible if both Spears can be somehow found and utilized.)

It would/could be interpreted as a lack of narrative conviction to have the planet be restored/everyone brought back from the dead in Final. It would create a world without consequences, and make the narrative lack conviction.

Even if Shinji can somehow reconcile with his surrogate family (which seems quite a bit unlikely given the 14 years of physical and emotional separation), will he want to keep living in a world where he is considered irredeemable by everyone else and will constantly be rejected for something that he didn't intend? What kind of future is that? He will be denied new experiences, and every emotional connection and experience normal people take for granted. Him directly causing N4I isn't exactly going to help his case either,

Can Shinji live in a world that hates him for N3I and Fourth Impact? Where he will likely never be forgiven? Here is a quote from Kendrix that I believe sums up his situation in spades.

SPOILER: Show

everyone who meets Shinji and finds out who he is will reflect having lived in a world shaped by this catastrophe. Even an exemplary reasonable and compassionate person who really wants to be fair to him, like Sakura, will have to visibly fight down her anger, and Shinji will see/notice that for the rest of his life.
The question of, "How do I deal with having caused this hell we all live in" and "Just what can I do to atone just a little bit..." (and killing billions is a bottomless pit as far as atonement goes, unless you could undo it, which Shinji already tried and failed/found to be impossible) is never going to go away.

Even if he decides to keep living just for the sake of it, unless we get some plot validation for a change in character, or something to change the worlds opinion of him as 'Impact Boy' Ikari, eventually he's going to grow up to become a bitter, jaded, individual, just like his father before he met Yui.

---
We do need details on the time skip to help us out in finding out if Shinji can be exonerated in any way.

[Stillborn]

But unlike his father he will have a stigma that most likely prevent him from ever finding someone like Yui to bring some light into his bitter existence (since it would hardly be a life).

[Ray]

Rei Q? Maybe Sakura if Anno is merciful?

[Stillborn]

For the sake of her own developement she should stay away from Shinji or she will be accused for becoming "copy of Poka Rei with her life revolving arund Shinji" so no, it would not fit.

Sakura may be civil to Shinji but she is afraid of him like he was a box with a desease that may open suddenly. Nope.

[xyz346]

Well considering his state at the end of 3.0, he's going to have to crawl out of it at one point. And to do so, Shinji IS going to need a reason to keep going.

Shinji can't be held completely responsible for N3I. Namely because of the fact that he, much like everyone in NERV sans Gendo, had no reason to believe his Eva could cause 3rd Impact. It would be really jarring if humanity hated Shinji more than his father. You know, the guy who willingly manipulated the people around him into causing the apocalypse, then going to war with humanity for his own desires?

What's more, there's no solid evidence that proves that Shinji is universally reviled by humanity...only the words of an Angel whom we have good reason to be suspicious of.

[Dataprime]

Shinji IS going to need a reason to keep going.

I honestly for the life of me cannot think of what that will be.

[KingXanaduu]

I honestly for the life of me cannot think of what that will be.

Simple: To Rebuild. We've already analyzed this to DEATH people. If Wille wanted him dead, he would be dead now, end of story. But they clearly want him on their side, albeit under a tougher watch and scrutiny, which is to be expected considering he was being very self-centered. But his story is clearly not over, and he has a chance to Renew and Rebuild. :)

[Dataprime]

Simple: To Rebuild.

Evangelion Final: you can (not) rebuild

[KingXanaduu]

Evangelion Final: you can (not) rebuild

Uh, no, cause that implies that he CAN'T Rebuild, which isn't the case.

It would be more like "Evangelion Final: You can (Not) Surrender", as in Shinji cannot just wallow in a pit of self-despair and give up. The possibility of Rebuilding does exist, and Wille can give him that, if Shinji wants it, but also considers their needs and LISTENS to them instead of just himself.

Like Fuyutsuki said, Destroying the world is easy, but Rebuilding isn't always that easy. For Shinji, considering what he's done, it's going to be pretty tough. It's going to take a lot of hard work, endurance (both emotionally and psychically), and a lot of time, maybe even years. But as long as the possibility exists, that should be reason enough to keep going.

I think because we're so inter-personalized and fast as society, we've become kind of dependent on "Instant gratification", in that if we can't see an immediate way out of a bad situation, a lot of us are prone to just giving up and throwing in the towel, especially when in comes to Shinji's situation. What we need to see that these things take a lot of time and effort. So a hell of a lot of patience is required, as well as a HELL of a lot of endurance. :P

[ElMariachi]

I was about to answer to Ray's latest defeatist comment, but xyz346 beat me (I really like you pal!)

@ Jorno : It's a very sound interpretation, I agree with you that the fifth part will give us closure, if only because Rebuild is much more straightforward than NGE was.
But I disagree with acts 3 and 4 :

Act 3:

TMBounty_Hunter interprets this as being run over the course of Rebuild 3.0. I disagree. In my opinion, this part of the story has not been told, because it is the part that has been left out in the time skip.
(So where is the tragedy if Shinji does not feature in it? Well, for example, someone or something could have removed the Spear from Unit-01 during the attack of the 12th Angel or a similar crisis, and Third Impact could have just continued from there. The tragedy would then be how Shinji's decision back in 2.0 achieved the exact opposite of what he really wanted (but didn't know he wanted).)

Act 4:

TMBounty_Hunter speculates that FINAL will cover this, given the "wandering the desert" scene that ended 3.0. Personally, I would rather apply this part of the structure to Rebuild 3.0, as it actually consists of Shinji wandering the new world he finds himself in. Also note that there is relatively little dialogue in the movie, as well as the piano scene with Shinji and Kaworu.

While it would be interesting thematically speaking to have one of the acts happening off-screen as way to symbolize how the world doesn't revolve around Shinji and that he should stop being so me-centric, there's a key element of the classical fourth act is that it's supposed to eases out of the intense drama of the climactic act (act 3), but in Q the drama and tragedy wasn't eased one bit for anyone : Shinji never was more crushed emotionally and falling into despair, and WILLE, the ones who according to your theory lived through the drama of act 3, didn't got a reprieve either : sure they retrieved EVA-01 and finally managed to activate the Wunder, giving them a mean to fight the NS and directly attack neo-NERV HQ, but it was revealed at the end of the movie to have been part of Gendo's plan all along, and besides their short reprieve of their victory against the NS got cut short barely hours later when Mark.09 attacked them and took Shinji, which forced them to patrol around neo-NERV HQ during days with the stress of waiting for Gendo's next move, and finally got Fourth Impact on their face barely stopped thanks to an outside intervention. (Kaworu sacrificing himself)
Also Fourth Impact brought the final destruction of what was left of Tokyo-3, one of the great symbol of Evangelion, and the emergence of the Black Moon, both events being part of the climax of EoE.

As for the "dance an music" supposed to be present in part 4, I think you're too literal in your interpretation : don't forget that the Jo-Ha-Kyu system is originally made for the Noh theater, not animated movies. The dance and music probably means to have a contrast compared to the previous acts full of fighting scenes and drama, in the case of Rebuild, it could mean a return of the "everyday life" scenes where we get to see the characters interacting and living their lives while outside of battle, like the school scenes in 2.0, and indeed, if you look back at the description of the first act :

He described the first act as "Love"; the play opens auspiciously, using gentle themes and pleasant music to draw in the attention of the audience.

And remember that the first half of 2.0, can be considered as a continuation of 1.0's role as a prologue by presenting us another pilot that will be important in Shinji's life : Asuka. And the first half of 2.0 is notorious for it's almost slice-of-life scenes, like the school scenes, the cooking war or Shinji hanging out with Toji and Kensuke. The action beginning only with Sahaquiel and the big dramatic turn telling us that shit just got real coming just after with of course Bardiel.