Is Anno really making it up as he goes along?

[FrDougal9000]

With the controversial events that happened in 3.0, not to mention the several rewrites for 2.0 mentioned in the CR interviews, I guess the question does have to be asked: is Hideaki Anno, along with the rest of the production, team really making up the plot to NTE as they go along?

Maybe the obvious answer is a big giant YES but I dunno; it's possible that they just have the general idea of what they're going to do (timeskip included) but the details just happened to get changed as time goes along (as a writer, this happens to me practically all the time).

On the other hand, it is pretty strange to assume all of these people who've been in the anime industry for years and have had many projects under their collective belt are basically writing on the seat of their pants for one of the biggest anime projects in recent years.

In either case, what do you guys think? Are they really that impulsive as to throw out whatever they've set up for another potentially cool idea? Or is Anno just being a masterful troll again? (Congratulations, anyone?)

[FreakyFilmFan4ever]

This post seems to answer a lot of those questions.

It seems like they discussed before they were even finished with the first film was the general plan of attack was in the series, and nuances changed along the way. Mari was always gonna be in 2.22 and have generally the same mission (whatever that is, I think it was helping Kaji form WILLE, but it's still up for debate), but the fan reactions to her two shots in the "Next Episode Preview" at the end of 1.11 seemed to inspire Khara to place her in more scenes that previously intended. it even seems like the time-skip was being prepared for. I mean, why else would 2.22 throw 5 Angel attacks in one movie if it wasn't to lock Shinji up in Unit 01 and have him loose track of time, like the 30 days he spent in Unit 01 in NGE? If they weren't clearly building up to something by ending it there, Asuka's near-death experience would have been a better place to end the movie in a cliff-hanger.

[Mr. Tines]

The big rocks were probably set very early on -- the Ishida interview gives some tantalising hints on the matter -- but the CRC material gives us plenty of backing for the view that the fluff (which probably encompasses everything that isn't directly about Shinji) is entirely fluid

[Sailor Star Dust]

If you go through the old Newtype USA threads (Go to Threads, click on the Rebuild subforum and Control + F "Newtype USA" for the transcripts/scans*), the different staff at khara mention a vague outline of the film series was planned out.

*One of the last posts in those threads should be scans of the articles I made those transcripts of years ago.

I think this quote is very telling:

While Tsurumaki freely admits that the first of the four film installments--slated to hit theaters in Japan sometime mid-2007--will run like a digest of the TV series, employing key scenes to bring viewers up to speed on the basic story and setting, no one is very willing to speculate on the content of the second, third, or final films.

"Frankly, it just got too chaotic," Tsurumaki comments on the brainstorming sessions that were initially meant to provide an overall plot outline and final resolution to the story. "We're all working from the assumption that we weren't able to reach our destination with the original TV series, but the exact nature of that "destination" is still unclear to everyone on the staff. Since we're going to all the trouble of making these new productions, we'd at least like to take the story as far as we took it back then, but it's been an uphill struggle so far. I get the feeling this project is going to be a very unstable project--in a lot of ways."

[ObsessiveMathsFreak]

The CRC and related interviews make it painfully obvious that many elements of the films are being reworked continuously. Simple things like character design are obvious, but even major plot elements like Asuka in Eva-03, or the design of the Angels and introduction of Eva-02 were being continuously reworked. This goes absolutely double for any "lore" in the show. Anno emphasises emotion and theatrics over explnation -- as always.

Here's a smoking gun or two, from Gwern's interview archive.

Asuka/7th Angel development  SPOILER: Show

Tsurumaki: As far as the seventh Angel is concerned, the truth is that the original reason [for the change in design] was that the genga for that episode had been entirely lost, and we couldn’t use the "BANK." If the genga had remained, even if the key animation director decided to redo them, episode eight would probably have remained [in the film] in its entirety. [We thought,] if we can’t make use of the genga, let’s completely change Asuka’s introductory scene. The design was put together by Shigeto Koyama-san and Daizen Komatsuda-kun […].89

I found this one particularly amusing.

Tsurumaki:
The impression that Anno-san mainly wanted to convey was that Gendou and Fuyutsuki were devising a secret plot. Because Shinji happens to go to Rei’s room just after that, that was what they discussed. When "secret plot" and "Shinji and Rei" were combined, it probably appeared something like "a strategy to bring together Shinji and Rei".

— Rather than being disappointed, I’m impressed. All the more, I have a pleasant feeling that things have become "Eva-esque". The fact that this consistency is inherent [makes it] extremely valuable; I am delighted [to think] that this may be the much-discussed "live feeling".86 In any case, there will surely be many viewers who have the impression that, this time, Gendo’s Human Instrumentality Project [somehow depends on] this "love love strategy". Fuyutsuki also says something like, "As we thought, owing to those two Unit-01 has awakened".

Tsurumaki: And Gendou replies something like "A little while longer, and our project is complete". I had doubts storyboarding that conversation, and sent Anno-san a series of questions about it. "So Gendou knew this would happen to Unit-01? Or was Gendou also surprised and troubled? Or was Gendou surprised, but pleased with the outcome?" I didn’t understand the specific meaning of the statement, so I struggled to interpret it. Anno-san replied that, "For now, we’ll say he aimed at this and things went the way he expected". I wondered if that was enough. For myself, I am still skeptical that even Gendou isn’t really panicking inside, but…

I almost have the impression of Gendo and Fuyutsuki as two delusional paranoid schizophrenics with a penchant for the dramatic. Given how much 3.0 changes Gendo's level of knowledge -- let alone plans -- I tend to side with Tsurumaki here.

[Gendo'sPapa]

The best answer would probably be a mix of YES & NO.

When making a story it goes through a natural state of evolution & change & more often than not ends up being about subjects & themes the writer never originally intended. I can only imagine telling one story over a series of films with each entry released years apart only exaperpates the natural storytelling dilemma.

More likely than not Anno has always had the core storyline & arch of Rebuild - Shinji's emotional journey - mapped out in his head since day one. He's probably had the emotional arches for the other characters loosely mapped out as well. But the inconsequentials - things like how many Eva Units are gonna show up, what 'Random Terminology #5' means & WHAT HAPPENS WHILE Shinji IS ASLEEP IN UNIT 01 - are constantly changing as the story grows, shrinks or changes from rewrite to rewrite.

Having made several films myself I can tell you that your original vision or story you start out with in your head changes drastically when committed to page, changes even more when made visual, then goes through another equally drastic change when edited together. Your final product is a whole new beast from what you came up with that first time you said "Hey, wouldn't it be a cool story if..."

Having to tell a story over 4 films? Having that same story now taking from conception to completion almost a decade to tell? Yeah, things are gonna change.

So my answer is NO - Anno has always known where he's wanted to take Shinji & what the emotional impact of every entry was supposed to be.
But my answer is also YES - Anno probably did not originally plan for there to be 13+ Eva's, space battles, or know exactly how Gendo & Fuyutsuki's plans were "going according to plan" every step of the way.

[riffraff11235]

I'd rather Anno and Khara leave room for new ideas rather than have the entire thing bolted down, honestly.

[peripateia]

@Gendo's Papa

that's an insightful perspective on the process of storytelling! In response to the thread topic, I'd have to lean closer toward yes, though. I recall an interview given by Toshio Okada, a former executive at Gainax regarding NGE's production process where he explained Anno's directorial style:

When I talked to Mr. Anno a month ago, he said he couldn't decide the ending until the time came. That's his style. So, if I had made EVANGELION with him, I couldn't do such a thing. I'd think I'd have to fix the ending, what would happen with every character. Then, everything would follow: the first episode, the second episode...If I wanted to show a boy's coming-of-age story, a *bildungsroman,* the last scene would show the grown-up man; the first scene, a boy who hates everything about the adult world. That would be the structure; I'm very careful about a regular construction.

But Mr. Anno's style on EVANGELION was not so. He wants to put it together episode-by-episode. It's just like the style of a manga. In your typical manga, the artist doesn't have any picture of the last scene, or the last episode. They just think of building up on past episodes. And finally, the manga artist, and his assistants, and editor...[BURIES HEAD IN HANDS], they work out an idea about the last sequence. If it's a good idea, the whole episode is very good. If they can't make a good idea, the whole episode is not so good. It's an unhappy story.

And I think that's what happened with the last two episodes of EVANGELION. Mr. Anno and his staff couldn't make a good idea for it. He told an anime magazine in Japan that he couldn't make what he wanted because of schedule or budget. But that's not correct. I talked with Mr. Yamaga and Mr. Anno. They said, "It's not only a problem of schedule or budget. It's a problem of what the ending is going to be." Mr. Anno couldn't decide. Mr. Anno's and my own style of production are very different.

[Changed to quote-block. - Monk]

Apologies for that block of text, but if it helps to suggest a direction for the thread, I'm all for it! TL, DR: Anno was a rather impromptu director/writer during NGE, up until the end of the TV series.

But 1.0 and 2.0 had, as people have mentioned, clear parallels to NGE, a certain direction if you will.
That's why 3.0 and Final are going to cement Rebuild's legacy as hit or miss! Anno has breathing room now to "make it up on the spot" and go back to his directorial roots. Here's to hoping that he remains 'consistently inconsistent.'

[kuribo-04]

The day Anno wrote the first episode of Evangelion, he was already imagining how people would react to 4.0

[BlueBasilisk]

He made Nadia the way it is just so 3.0 could harken back to it.

But like most people said, he's probably got a general outline and makes up or rewrites the details as he goes. That's how the creative process seems to work for most; new ideas take root or characters are determined to act in a certain way and things start bending and twisting around that. Not a bad thing at all provided the results are cohesive and coherent.

[wiser3754]

Didn't Anno use the 2011 tsunami disaster as the cause for the redirection of Rebuild. I swear I read an article where he saw the disaster (and lived it apparently) and he asked himself the question "what if I was did this, if I were responsible, how would people react to what I've done?" If that were true, he only had 18 months to get Q out the door.

[ElMariachi]

That's not exactly that, the interview you're talking about is probably this one :

"There was a period of time when I felt it good to imagine Japan or the whole of modern society being destroyed. But, in becoming an adult, and thinking about it realistically - what would happen to the people living there? - I became unable to find pleasure in it. The images of March 11 were also a great shock. Even if I can enjoy it as a fantasy, I don't want to see the real thing."

What he's saying that the plot of using a world-shattering catastrophe to start anew with a clean slate appealed him when he was young(and that's what he did in EoE with Instrumentality), but now that he's older and actually saw what a terrible catastrophe brings(mainly pain and suffering for everyone) that he can't thing that kind of scenario appealing anymore, and probably prefers now more soft ways to bring change.

Personally I took it as a sign that Final will have a more upbeat end that EoE.

Also in an interview from the 3.0 theatrical booklet, Ishida Akira(Kaworu's VA) clearly implies that Anno planned the time skip since the beginning and put Akira in the know(but not the rest of the VA) :
http://wiki.evageeks.org/Resources:Evangelion_Q_Records_Collection#Akira_Ishida_as_Kaworu_Nagisa

[Warren Peace]

Anyone who doesn't revise their story after years of collaboration is stubborn for stubborn's sake. Disavowing the influence of time, inspiration, and perspective is chopping down trees for the love of a seed. Fans tend to think an unchanging road map is a virtue, but that couldn't be more wrong. Tales like this are about evolution. Growth. Change. If Anno didn't understand that, we wouldn't have cared about Evangelion in the first place.

[Monk Ed]

^ I think the reason an "unchanging road map" is preferred is because of what it implies for analysis of earlier entries in the given work. It makes it harder to "justify" earlier scenes that become confusing as a result of later revelations as anything other than the unfortunate fallout of A Dreaded Retcon.

To give an example from NGE analysis, how are we supposed to interpret the early Human Instrumentality Committee meetings and their contradiction with what we later know Seele's true aims to be? Is it valid to come up with a justification, probably long-winded, or is it simply an inconsistency that cannot be explained and can only be ignored, like the fluctuating size of the Evas? Or how about mentions of Adam prior to episode 24? Did Lilith even exist in Anno's mind back when Ireul was invading Nerv? Or when Kaji told Shinji about Adam? And so on.

[Nuclear Lunchbox]

All stories evolve. Anno probably has the most general of ideas about where he wants to go, but is allowing the story to change and evolve as he sees fit. I do the same thing when I write; I have the most basic of guidelines, and I just add things in as I see their applications to the story.

[Giji Shinka]

I'd say that Anno had in mind the whole story line from the beginning, but characters and their interactions (plus some little details) were shaped during the production.

[Nuclear Lunchbox]

Sometimes, a flexible story is better than an unchanging one. You can add in details that you may have never noticed before, or make minute changes if a new story occurs to you that you had never noticed before.

[kuribo-04]

He made Nadia the way it is just so 3.0 could harken back to it.

I imagined him doing that and I couldn't stop laughing. Gendo is Anno's self-insert, not Shinji. Shinji is the audience.

[Warren Peace]

^ I think the reason an "unchanging road map" is preferred is because of what it implies for analysis of earlier entries in the given work. It makes it harder to "justify" earlier scenes that become confusing as a result of later revelations as anything other than the unfortunate fallout of A Dreaded Retcon.

To give an example from NGE analysis, how are we supposed to interpret the early Human Instrumentality Committee meetings and their contradiction with what we later know Seele's true aims to be? Is it valid to come up with a justification, probably long-winded, or is it simply an inconsistency that cannot be explained and can only be ignored, like the fluctuating size of the Evas? Or how about mentions of Adam prior to episode 24? Did Lilith even exist in Anno's mind back when Ireul was invading Nerv? Or when Kaji told Shinji about Adam? And so on.

Late response FTW! I dunno, I guess I don't understand getting bent out of shape about that stuff, now or then. When I think back on the story, logical whack-a-moles about Lilith having cords in the back of her head, then not, don't particularly leap out at me. It's like the "shouldn't Eagles have flown Frodo to mount doom?" problem... you can either accept it as the cost of enjoying an epic and innovative multi-year story, or you can let it ruin things. I find the former much more rewarding.

[Deva Victrix]

50% making shit up, 50% pre-configured storyline.

You can't ignore the juicy foreshadowing events in each movie.

In 3.33, Shinji's fugue leads him to reject Womanhood entirely, in the form of Wille, Asuka, Captain Katsuragi, and her crew. He more or less renounces his heterosexuality, or minimizes it till it is nearly as dead and neutered as ReiQ is. ReiQ is wearing black, a traditional funereal color, and is totally emotionless, possibly mirroring Shinji's view of the opposite sex at this time - unresponsive and useless to his needs.

He then proceeds to throw himself whole into his disturbing relationship with Gendo, which Gendo is co-signing and encouraging in order to GTD(Get Things Done). Gendo is one sort of emotional predator. Don't be fooled by Gendo's mean exterior - he's a needy child-Parent. In reality, he is sort of forcing Shinji to fight his battles for him, and makes Shinji do the heavy lifting. And that's radically unfair, because c'mon - Gendo is Shinji's FATHER. HE should be doing the heavy lifting. (Misato overcompensates entirely for this, of course, by reducing Shinji's role and doing all the heavy lifting HERSELF.)

Kaworu, meanwhile, preys on Shinji's emotions simply to slake his own Bacchanalian thirsts - represented by his luxurious, cultured excesses of music and emotions.

.....before all of this occured, our man Kaji alludes to Shinji's latent homosexual desires in 2.22. He successfully engages it by approaching Shinji with the Iced Coffee, and later by actually getting Shinji to admit to wanting to have a man date. And let's not forget the beautiful, inspirational one-liner Kaji hits him with. "Love has no gender", or something. I died with love. Kaji, you can part my thighs ANYTIME. But then, we all already loved him from the original series.

I feel like the Rebuild series should be called Shinji's Journey of Self Discovery. Alas, Kaworu died(again), so that's the end of that. I admit that the whole Shinji/Kaworu sequence in 3.33 was more or less one of the high points of the movie, for me.