Official 3.0 title: You Can (Not) Redo

[Hyper Shinchan]

How is the "old sequel theory" more probable than a cycle? That's utter BS and doesn't make any sense at all.

So your keyboard woks correctly, I'm happy to see that. Anyway, a sequel would be more probable than recurring timelines because it's simpler and especially it's less awkward.

[qu4d]

And Evangelion is simple? And well yeah... it would be "simple", but it still doesnt make any sense. How would this be supposed to work?!

[Ornette]

Should take this convo to here: http://forum.evageeks.org/thread/6022/A-remake-or-a-sequel/80/?

[symbv]

Besides the "re" prefix, the similarity is weak. "Retake" would be to get something back you've lost, where as "Redo" would be to get a second chance at an action. A comparison could be made that you can "Retake" your past by "Redoing" your actions, or that you could "Redo" the past to "Retake" something you lost in the original timeline, but I don't see how it goes much farther than that.

I dunno, the similarity is there, but I don't think it's close enough to raise eyebrows. But then again, that's from a native English speaker, so my exposure to the language is larger than Khara, which gives me a biased perspective, and thus I might be unable to judge their intentions correctly.

No, I do not mean Retake in the meaning of get something back you have lost, but the sense that a retake in filming is where you do something again and hope that you can do it better this time. It is all what the doujin ReTake is about, and so it is precisely the same as Redo -- with the meaning you put as "get a second chance at an action".

It's because "take" also refers to an attempt to shoot a scene of a TV show or film; a "retake" is another take of the same scene. In that sense "Re-Take" and "redo" are indeed similar, but there's nothing about Re-Take's title that's specific enough for the similarity to have any real meaning to it. It could just as easily refer to the sequel theory or even just acknowledging the fact that you can't undo the things you've done no matter how much you might regret them.

Perhaps my English is not up to par, because for me there is a good similarity - in a movie a retake - a take of the same scene or sequence of scenes - is a redo of scene. And we all have heard life is just like a movie, and there is the meta level of the anime being a movie after all.

While I do not deny there can be link to sequel theory or just a simple fact that you cannot undo things, I do not see why I cannot draw a link between retake and redo as well.

It's not clear as daylight, if only because ... it's not like "ReTake" was a very original name in the first place. Just google "fan fiction retake" and see how many stories come up with that exact same title.

Hmm... Whether the link is clear has nothing to do with its originality, right? Besides, how many Japanese doujin have you seen with a title named "Retake"?


Perhaps there is one thing I can show that will strength my case:
In filming, a retake is called "yarinaoshi" やり直し
The Japanese translation of "redo" is also "yarinaoshi". やり直し

See?

[Seen]

I'm really hoping the movie won't be all Shinji-angst. Maybe it means he'll have to come to terms with the fact that everything that's happened can't be undone, and maybe that will happen within the first 30 minutes. Here's hoping Asuka will still be changed by that epiphany she had right before she got into Unit 03, and here's hoping Rei and (hopefully) Yui will meet.

[tomfrom994]

Well, if it really won't be FINAL, there's one missing line from that part of Anno's statements:

So maybe it'll be "You can (not) stand up" or something like that.

Now, I can't help but feel like FINAL will be "You Must (Not) Run Away."

[liquidus118]

I'm really hoping the movie won't be all Shinji-angst.

Welcome to Evangelion.

In all seriousness, I think he'll probably just be going "WTF" during the inevitable mindfuck sequence in Unit 01. Then when he gets out he'll probably be too busy going "Oh shit what have I done? (And who's that hot piece of ass Kaworu?)" when he sees what his tantrum achieved. He'll angst though, of course. Just in time for a new angel to appear to make it all super-dramatic and make him learn whatever the moral is of this particular film.

Here's hoping Asuka will still be changed by that epiphany she had right before she got into Unit 03, and here's hoping Rei and (hopefully) Yui will meet.

Judging by the mini trailer we've seen it appears that she either just kicked Shinji into space then blew him up or she came out relatively stable and un-pissed.

[Monk Ed]

Hmm... Whether the link is clear has nothing to do with its originality, right?

What I mean is, the title is so easy to come by that the likelihood it's a reference is pretty low. It's like finding a guy named Smith and assuming he might be related to that other Smith you knew back in high school. No, it's not likely, Smith is just a really common name. Likewise, words that refer to repeating something happen to be pretty common in fan-work titles, so the likelihood that a movie title which contains a synonym for 'repeat' is specifically referring to a particular fan-work seems pretty low.

Perhaps there is one thing I can show that will strength my case:
In filming, a retake is called "yarinaoshi" やり直し
The Japanese translation of "redo" is also "yarinaoshi". やり直し

( I think you're reaching. If the title had been "You Can (Not) Retake" then I would think otherwise, but as it is, it's just too tenuous for me to buy. Maybe if some unambiguous borrowing from ReTake shows up in the film I'll change my tune but until then color me unconvinced.

[Gendo'sPapa]

What if the title "You Can (Not) Redo" is directed at Kaworu? For two movies now we've had to hear Kaworu refer to how much he's looking for to seeing Shinji again & making him happy "this time".
Just a thought.

[CJD]

No, I do not mean Retake in the meaning of get something back you have lost, but the sense that a retake in filming is where you do something again and hope that you can do it better this time. It is all what the doujin ReTake is about, and so it is precisely the same as Redo -- with the meaning you put as "get a second chance at an action".

Yea I caught on after Bagheera explained it. Sorry, it just went right over my head. But is that why Retake is named that way? I never knew that.

In filming, a retake is called "yarinaoshi" やり直し
The Japanese translation of "redo" is also "yarinaoshi". やり直し

That's actually a big deal, should have led with that!

What if the title "You Can (Not) Redo" is directed at Kaworu? For two movies now we've had to hear Kaworu refer to how much he's looking for to seeing Shinji again & making him happy "this time".
Just a thought.

An entire movie with Kaworu as the MC? I'd watch it.

[AngelNo13Bardiel]

An excellent piece of news to start the new year with. But for now, the waiting continues...

[Bagheera]

Perhaps there is one thing I can show that will strength my case:
In filming, a retake is called "yarinaoshi" やり直し
The Japanese translation of "redo" is also "yarinaoshi". やり直し

See?

I think that weakens your case, actually. Anno is surely aware of Re-Take; the fact that he chose to translate the English title of Q to "Redo" instead of "Retake" is telling IMO.

Also "redo" is more generic than "retake", so I don't think you have much to work with there. It's possible, but I don't think it's likely, let alone the obvious interpretation.

But don't take our word for it. Check the Japanese blogs and see what they think.

[Jayfive]

Isnt Kaworu's 'this line' a matter of conjecture as its a shaky translation? Whats the line in the original Japanese?

[Mr. Tines]

Whats the line in the original Japanese?

This got picked up at the time; and the sense is very close to the way it was rendered in English, including ambiguities.

[shinji_ryoji_89]

BLASPHEMER!



He shall be sent to the gulags... yes...

Hey, the more EVA the better. But I hate to wait so long haha. That said, I hope we get two great movies here.

[symbv]

What I mean is, the title is so easy to come by that the likelihood it's a reference is pretty low. It's like finding a guy named Smith and assuming he might be related to that other Smith you knew back in high school. No, it's not likely, Smith is just a really common name. Likewise, words that refer to repeating something happen to be pretty common in fan-work titles, so the likelihood that a movie title which contains a synonym for 'repeat' is specifically referring to a particular fan-work seems pretty low.

My point is the title may be easy to come by in the wets, but in Japan I rarely see title with "redo" or "retake". Then you see both used in material related to the same animation series. I think that speaks volumes about possible connection (or at least related thinking).

( I think you're reaching. If the title had been "You Can (Not) Retake" then I would think otherwise, but as it is, it's just too tenuous for me to buy. Maybe if some unambiguous borrowing from ReTake shows up in the film I'll change my tune but until then color me unconvinced.

I would like to stress I am NOT advocating that 3.0 will be just like ReTake, or even it has a cycle plot line like ReTake, but I am saying the title could be a tribute to ReTake and we may see certain elements from ReTake used in ReDo. I do not believe Anno or Khara will ever publicly admit that they are lifting things from ReTake but some references in the movie may be their way to tip their hat towards ReTake as their inspiration.

I think that weakens your case, actually. Anno is surely aware of Re-Take; the fact that he chose to translate the English title of Q to "Redo" instead of "Retake" is telling IMO.

Also "redo" is more generic than "retake", so I don't think you have much to work with there. It's possible, but I don't think it's likely, let alone the obvious interpretation.

No no no... Precisely because Anno and Khara would not want to make the reference so explicit, they will definitely not call it "retake". Even before the announcement, I never thought that "retake" is a possible title for the movie. Calling it "redo" is the closest that could be to "retake".

Again I am not saying Redo will be just like Retake, but that the title may be a reference to Retake and I am hoping we can see more references to Retake in Redo.

[esselfortium]

Tons of products in the Evangelion franchise use a Re- prefix. Death and Re-Birth, Re-Newal of Evangelion, Re-Vival of Evangelion, now more recently Re-Build...

If anything, Re-Take is Re-Ferencing the naming scheme already used by Evangelion Re-Leases, not the other way around.

:P

[Warren Peace]

Maybe the title is aimed at all those who have ripped off Eva over the years. There was a line in Rebuild's original mission statement, something like "since Eva's creation, there have been no newer anime than Eva". Maybe he's criticizing the imitators. Ya hear that, Rahxephon?

[symbv]

Tons of products in the Evangelion franchise use a Re- prefix. Death and Re-Birth, Re-Newal of Evangelion, Re-Vival of Evangelion, now more recently Re-Build...

If anything, Re-Take is Re-Ferencing the naming scheme already used by Evangelion Re-Leases, not the other way around.

:P

True, but none of those Re-whatever is as close in meaning between Re-take and Re-do (heck, they share the same Japanese translation!)

Re-take of course took the Re- naming scheme to heart (and I was aware of it long time back and have never denied that), but isn't it something a cross re-ference come full circle, when the next re- (redo) re-fers to this re-take doujin effort ?

[Jornophelanthas]

Maybe the title is aimed at all those who have ripped off Eva over the years. There was a line in Rebuild's original mission statement, something like "since Eva's creation, there have been no newer anime than Eva". Maybe he's criticizing the imitators. Ya hear that, Rahxephon?

I don't think I would agree with your interpretation of the movie title. (Although I do believe that it is chosen deliberately as an inside joke in referring to the Rebuild project itself, as a secondary or tertiary meaning. Its primary meaning will, of course, still concern the movie's main psychological themes.)

However, the point you make about the quotation would be relevant to another discussion that I'm taking part in. See the link.
http://forum.evageeks.org/post/515428/Evangelion-30-Speculation/#515428