Q does (not) suck

[Guy Nacks]

Yeah about that, I was sure that it was discussed years ago that that was from an earlier fan sub translation and that was inaccurate.

Does anybody have the correct translation on hand then?

[kboyrulez12345]

Yeah, I believe she said something akin to "Stand down, Brat Shinji!" ElMarchi would know about it, as we had the conversation before.

Oh yeah, and in the dub, she says, "Shut up and take your punishment!"

[BlueBasilisk]

Yeah about that, I was sure that it was discussed years ago that that was from an earlier fan sub translation and that was inaccurate.

TMBounty_Hunter talked about it here: [url]http://forum.evageeks.org/post/654365/Translation-of-Evangelion-30/#654365[/url]

[Sailor Star Dust]

Yeah, that flub was mentioned awhile ago.

Github/EGF fansub translation: [code:1]01:11:45 {Shinji} Asuka!
01:11:46 {Shinji} I'm begging you, stay out of the way!
01:11:49 {Asuka} Go down already, bratty Shinji![/code:1]

Hopefully it's one of the things Funimation is fixing with 3.0.

Also, some food for thought for film fans. Relevant parts of the post quoted here:

A film professor friend of mine once shared an idea with me...

If you see something in a movie that somehow seems "wrong" to you, rather than assuming it is a "mistake" or thinking of it as a "flaw" in the movie, instead consider that perhaps it is *exactly* as it is supposed to be, and that the filmmakers worked very hard to make it *exactly* as you see and hear it. Then from there think about *why* that shot, scene, etc. might be just as it is, and how that contributes to - rather than detracts from - the desired goals of the filmmakers.

It is one thing to dislike a movie because it did not fulfill your personal expectations. It is entirely something else to approach movies as works of art that are unique expressions of someone's vision, and then to see if you can interpret the content and meaning of that vision using the material of the films themselves, as well as seeking out interviews or other tangential information that surrounds the making of films.

For example, Anno himself said that "there was a total of more than forty revisions of the script" for 2.0. I think we can therefore safely say that after all that revision there was not one single word of dialog or frame of image that ended up on the screen that was not exactly what Anno wanted up there.

Similarly, I think we can guess that 3.0 was exactly as Anno wanted it to be.

Now, if you personally didn't like it for whatever reason, then you are welcome to that, of course.

As for me, I find it more interesting to, by analysis and interpretation of what's up there on the screen, see if I can work out some of the ideas that Anno was trying to communicate to me (and the rest of the audience).

[Sachi]

^Yes, to all that above. When confined to such a limited runtime, attention to detail is vital, especially to animators working within that medium, and even more so in particular to Anno himself as a storyteller. What's most important to content creators is working toward the overall goal of expressing something, anything, whether it be giant robots and saving the world or... the fragility of human connection and the repercussions associated with miscommunication and skewed perceptions. Everything within the work is working toward the goal of what they (the collective conscious that puts forth the work) are trying to creatively convey, and it's important for us (the audience) to interpret what that is that they have said. When it comes to awork such as this, one that demands multiple viewings, it's important to refrain from reactionary judgements and attempt to come at it from an understanding point of view. Isn't that one of the important lessons Eva has to offer?

Treat Eva like a person; try to get an know him/her before writing him/her off; try and see things their way.

[WunderBah]

Every time I watch Evangelion 3.0, I like it less. I can't say the same for any of the other movies, including Death.

Its funny. The first time I saw Q I was more irritated than ever with anything Eva related. After multiple viewings, however, I've developed a newfound respect for the film, which I partially believe could become a classic in the future (especially) depending on how well FINAL is executed.

[Jimbob]

I get that 3.0 can come off as genius depending on how Final turns out, but I'm not going to just patiently wait and twiddle my thumbs for 3 years for it. Sorry I refuse to be that obedient and I think Anno expecting people to just sit tight for literally a few years is asking too much of his audience.

A good film should be enjoyable stand alone, even if its its part of a series. Having one film's quality bank entirely on its sequel that's not coming out for years is just not how you're supposed to do things. I could very lose interest in Eva in that timeframe and never bother to see Final.

[WunderBah]

If you want to call Q a masterpiece, a work of art, or anything super positive, go ahead. But every time you say so I'm going to look at you like you have three heads.

With all do respect, this is hands-down one of THE MOST ignorant posts you've displayed in a while.

Its when thing to dislike a film (which is quite fine as others have previously repeated in the past), but its another to shroud your personal viewpoints in a highly dubious manner.

[KingXanaduu]

^

Well, it is his opinion. Art is supposed to be something that evokes a multitude of responses instead of just one intended one, and whose to say that his opinion is ignorant just because he just doesn't see what others see? People have different viewpoints, and sometimes, it's hard to see from the other side of the spectrum.

[Bagheera]

Yeah, that flub was mentioned awhile ago.

Github/EGF fansub translation: [code:1]01:11:45 {Shinji} Asuka!
01:11:46 {Shinji} I'm begging you, stay out of the way!
01:11:49 {Asuka} Go down already, bratty Shinji![/code:1]

Hopefully it's one of the things Funimation is fixing with 3.0.

Sounds like one of the best localized translations might be "Give it up already, you brat!" Not literally correct, but that does seem to be her intent.

[ElMariachi]

@SSD: In short, what we saw and heard is exactly as Anno wanted it to be, and we should wait for FINAL to have the remaining pieces of the puzzle, well said!

Just want to add this in, I don't believe that Asuka was trying to kill Shinji. I believe she was just trying to subdue him actually. I know that doesn't really change your argument much, but I just wanted to point that out for the sake of clarifying it.

Except that Shinji isn't psychic, he has no ways to know that, he can only interpret what he's seeing, and what he's seeing is Asuka trying to plant a giant naginata on his face while screaming like a berserker, from here the logical conclusion is "she's trying to kill me!".

And personally I wouldn't be inclined to listen to people wildly flailing blades at my face, at all.

[WunderBah]

^

Well, it is his opinion.

I've realized that a while ago.

It's more of his paragraph I quoted (last sentence that felt very unneeded compared to the rest. The rest of his previous posts in this topic were fine, however.

[FreakyFilmFan4ever]

I get that 3.0 can come off as genius depending on how Final turns out, but I'm not going to just patiently wait and twiddle my thumbs for 3 years for it. Sorry I refuse to be that obedient and I think Anno expecting people to just sit tight for literally a few years is asking too much of his audience.

With the exception of the 5 year gap between Episode I and Episode II and the 22 year gap between Episode VI and Episode I, there was a 3 year gap between all of the Star Wars films. (Soon another 10-year gap will be added with the release of Episode VII in 2015.)

There was a 3 year gap between Batman Begins and TDK, with a 4 year gap between TDK and TDKR.

There was a 2-3 year gap between all of Sam Raimi’s Spider-Man movies.

The only films that actually delivered one sequel a year was Peter Jackson’s LOTR trilogy, and that was (and still is) unheard of.

The only other film series consistently coming close to that rate of release is Micheal Bay’s Transformers movies at one every other year, and those can’t have a large enough gap between releases. (Age of Extinction has the longest wait of those movies, spanning the average 3 years.)

There was a 4 year gap between all of the current Jurassic Park titles, with a new 14 year gap added with Jurassic World in 2015.

And the NTE films had a 2 year gap between 1.0 and 2.0, with a 3 year gap between 2.0 and 3.0.

I don’t think the average 3 year wait is asking too much of any film audience. It is as common as it may be tedious.

[Mr. Tines]

The only films that actually delivered one sequel a year was Peter Jackson’s LOTR trilogy, and that was (and still is) unheard of.

And that only because they effectively shot all the location footage in one, before dividing it up into production.

[NemZ]

eh... depending how you look at it the marvel Avangers and related films could be seen as a single series, in which case they actually have lotr beat.

[ElMariachi]

I think that Jimbob's problem is that 3.0 isn't a movie that stands really well on its own, it's painfully obvious that we're missing a big chunk of the general picture and that most of what we saw in Q was just a preparation for what's to come, which can be very frustrating to have to wait three years or more to see the rest of the story.

Instead of movies, I would rather compare Q as cutting a series mid-season on a cliffhanger and make us wait years before releasing the rest.

[TheFriskyIan]

With all do respect, this is hands-down one of THE MOST ignorant posts you've displayed in a while.

Its when thing to dislike a film (which is quite fine as others have previously repeated in the past), but its another to shroud your personal viewpoints in a highly dubious manner.

Shroud them? I made it perfectly clear that I don't like Q. I made it obvious before I even typed up that sentence, I'm not hiding anything. Movies are going to invoke multiple reactions, and it's pretty stagnant to say that's a reaction I can't have when people react to Q as if it was the second coming of Christ and ignoring the obvious flaws that leave a bad taste in people's mouths. I understand the whole point of the posts above with "Try to think that the creator intended the movie to be this way." but that doesn't automatically exempt them from criticism. Movie Makers don't always make good movies, if that were the case Star Wars Episodes I-III would also be considered masterpieces because "That's how Lucas wanted it."

[FreakyFilmFan4ever]

eh... depending how you look at it the marvel Avangers and related films could be seen as a single series, in which case they actually have lotr beat.

Star Wars is about to undergo the same production methods. In these instances, if they count, they’re quite seamlessly released with over-lapping production schedules that focus on different characters. The consistently frequent updates these movies provide are nice and do kind of spoil us in terms of when we should except the next installment in a broadly defined sequel.

Though, I think we’d all pitch a fit if Anno decided to produce Eva in a similar manner. Not very many people would be happy with an Evangelion film series where Anno only shows up intermittently to direct and oversee production. In that sense, the MARVEL movies wouldn’t count on the same level as LotR, Eva, or the TDK trilogy within terms of consistent direction and a more focused overarching narrative goal. The canon in Eva is too tight and complex to allow for very many spin-offs handled by other creative teams with different goals and motives for their stories.

Instead of movies, I would rather compare Q as cutting a series mid-season on a cliffhanger and make us wait years before releasing the rest.

Well, The Empire Strikes Back ended in much of the same way. Luke gets his hand chopped off before finding out who his daddy is (spoilers: it’s Darth Vader) and the movie ends with people trying to get a kidnapped Han Solo back. It was met with similar outcry then as NTE is now, but upon reflection we’ve realized that Empire was actually the best Star Wars had to offer.

All that to say movies can end any way they please, I guess. And even if we don’t like it at first, we may grow to love it later.

[ElMariachi]

Well, The Empire Strikes Back ended in much of the same way. Luke gets his hand chopped off before finding out who his daddy is (spoilers: it’s Darth Vader) and the movie ends with people trying to get a kidnapped Han Solo back. It was met with similar outcry then as NTE is now, but upon reflection we’ve realized that Empire was actually the best Star Wars had to offer.

I'm not saying that I don't like it, I'm just trying to find an explanation of people's frustration, and admit that the frustration is pretty hight!

[kboyrulez12345]

Shroud them? I made it perfectly clear that I don't like Q. I made it obvious before I even typed up that sentence, I'm not hiding anything. Movies are going to invoke multiple reactions, and it's pretty stagnant to say that's a reaction I can't have when people react to Q as if it was the second coming of Christ and ignoring the obvious flaws that leave a bad taste in people's mouths. I understand the whole point of the posts above with "Try to think that the creator intended the movie to be this way." but that doesn't automatically exempt them from criticism. Movie Makers don't always make good movies, if that were the case Star Wars Episodes I-III would also be considered masterpieces because "That's how Lucas wanted it."

The thing is, it's okay to criticize a movie, and I actually understand all your criticisms. Heck, my viewpoints of movies(and any entertainment media actually) changes over time once I see other people's opinions on the flaws of movies. For example, the movie Noah. At first I liked it good enough, but later on, when I was really thinking about it and hearing a relative of mine how it detracts from the Bible(not that that's a bad thing, there was just some context in the Bible that would have made more sense if it was kept in the movie) I later determined that it's a pretty bad movie overall for me.

The thing is though, it's okay to have different opinions, and you can express them however you want, EXCEPT like this:

But every time you say so I'm going to look at you like you have three heads.

I'm going to say to you again, that I understand why you don't like the movie(hell I pretty much understand why anyone wouldn't like this film) and you can express it as vigorously as you want, with the exception of a quote like this. Opinions differ from person to person, they may see things that other people can't(through their eyes), and vice versa. So imo, it's not fair to treat someone else's with a different viewpoint then yours like they have three heads. They may indeed think it's a masterpiece for their own reasons, and that's okay. (I personally don't see it as a masterpiece, but I like Q none the less.)

Except that Shinji isn't psychic, he has no ways to know that, he can only interpret what he's seeing, and what he's seeing is Asuka trying to plant a giant naginata on his face while screaming like a berserker, from here the logical conclusion is "she's trying to kill me!".

And personally I wouldn't be inclined to listen to people wildly flailing blades at my face, at all.

Well yeah, that's why I said I knew it wouldn't change her viewpoint on the matter. Just wanted to point out that small tidbit.