GUNBUSTER - before EVA anno's greatest work ;D

[symbv]

Ahh, thanks. Yeah, I figured I'd hear that. It's just that after last spring I've been slightly unsure if you'd rather identify as Chinese or citizen of Hong Kong first of all :)

It depends on the context actually. If the question is about my ethnicity, then without question I am Chinese, but if the question is in a context about my life, my place of adobe, my history and past, my speech, my behavior pattern, my line of thought or something related to politics or government, then I will answer I am a Hongkonger.

y'know, I never realized Noriko Sakai sang Gunbuster's OP before....

Yes! Another 11th heaven moment I must say. I wonder how much effort they went through to get the dream come true: Noriko Sakai actually sing the OP for an anime with her in it !! It was a godsend matching... Oh gosh... oh gosh...

And I wonder if Noriko Sakai got to watch the anime and saw her doing all the fan service there :)

I also wonder whether Noriko Hidaka got to voice Noriko because of her name :p

That's certainly interesting! I'm not sure what you mean with "mirror-like associations" between the two Norikos beyond the names though. I mean, being idol and being mecha pilot are quite different things...

Well, idol can show up in TV drama, right?
The character design of Noriko is just the mirror image of RL Noriko. I remember how much my jaws dropped when I saw the character design sketches of Noriko in Gunbuster....

and while Noriko's appeal probably works on non-otaku too Gunbuster was very much otakucentric work and I doubt many non-otaku saw it at the time so I think it's justifiable to put it like that :)

We know how many otaku are also fans of idol -- Mikimoto who made the character design is definitely one, and I think Anno is same too.




EDIT: Something is wrong with this Gunbuster:
http://youtu.be/nu8cl4_GDwA

[Xacebans]

To you who said you weren't watching Diebuster/Gunbuster 2 because of ONE exaggerated and rather biased review, WATCH IT. It is a great work in its own right; it has some different elements to it than the original but I and many others found it to be a wonderful companion to the original Gunbuster. The visuals are impressive (aside from some rather conspicuous CG in the first episode), and while at first the protagonists seem to be clones of Noriko and Kazumi, Nono and Lal'C are actually quite different from their Gunbuster counterparts, especially Lal'C.

Give it a chance; don't just not watch it because some people happened to dislike it. As an Evageek, you should know that mixed reception of a work is no reason not to try it!

[Viking]

To you who said you weren't watching Diebuster/Gunbuster 2 because of ONE exaggerated and rather biased review, WATCH IT. It is a great work in its own right; it has some different elements to it than the original but I and many others found it to be a wonderful companion to the original Gunbuster. The visuals are impressive (aside from some rather conspicuous CG in the first episode), and while at first the protagonists seem to be clones of Noriko and Kazumi, Nono and Lal'C are actually quite different from their Gunbuster counterparts, especially Lal'C.

Give it a chance; don't just not watch it because some people happened to dislike it. As an Evageek, you should know that mixed reception of a work is no reason not to try it!

I don't know if you're talking about me, but I saw DieBuster last WE.
Having seen Gurren Lagann two weeks ago surely made things a lot easier. I mean, having already seen an example of a Gainax post-Y2K production gave me a hint on what I should have expected.

That said, let's get OT just for a moment. Did I like Gurren Lagann? Yes ( sort of... more or less... ). Why? Because it's "brand new", not related to anything already existing ( episode 6 doesn't count of course ). It's a story with a beginning and an end. Period.

Did I like DieBuster? No. Why? Because I like GunBuster and DieBuster is a completely different story that shouldn't be classified as a 'sequel'. It's like comparing the Burton's "Batman" and the Nolan's one. It's okay if we consider them as two completely separate works that share the same origins.
Probably if the title would have been different from "Top wo Nerae 2!" I could have intended it like another show, unrelated with GunBuster but based on similar ideas.
But the intentions of the creators of DieBuster were to create a 'sequel' to GunBuster and this, IMHO, doesn't work.

The worst part is that in the show there were actually good ideas, for instance, like GunBuster introduced to the viewer the effects of a WARP speed travel and what that means for the main characters, one of the problems in DieBuster is the loss of know-how in realizing WARP speed capable space ships and thus the impossibility to fight the space monsters outside the solar system.

The ultimate reason that conviced me to watch DieBuster at least once, is that, after all, is a Gainax show. But I don't think I'll ever gonna see it again ( exactly like Nadia: the secret of Fuzzy ).

Of course everyone has his own opinion...

Bye

[Azathoth]

Good post. I do agree that as a sequel it has no value, and I don't really think it's a very good show in any case - although there are numerous ideas in it I do like, and I wish it had been a full-cour show instead of an OVA because I feel like they definitely compressed some of those ideas. But I am glad they made it. It's always interesting to see how a studio evolves over time, and Diebuster is the clearest statement we ever got to show how much Gainax had changed. Hideaki Anno made a bizarre pastiche of Top Gun and Starship Troopers, full of nationalist sentiment, protagonist impotence, grimdark, and pyrrhic victory. Fast forward ten years and we're watching a Gurren Lagann prototype about empowerment and hot-blooded manliness saving the day (and pyrrhic victory, to be fair, although it isn't portrayed anything like as coldly and realistically as Anno's statistics flashing on screen during the final battle of Gunbuster).

We'll never get a real sequel to Gunbuster, and maybe we shouldn't. I have no idea what modern Anno thinks of the show, but really, the only episode which I feel inclined to rewatch on a pretty regular basis is ep6, which is brilliantly directed regardless of its plot. Diebuster's what we got. It doesn't pick up the story of Noriko and Kazumi. I think it's pretty telling, in fact, that it picks up the story of someone who wants to be like Noriko. It's a story about looking back on the legends of the past and trying to outdo them. It's about Gainax, in other words, and if the result wasn't a very good show, that's unfortunate but the subtext comes through anyway.

Although that said, I really do hope Anno does make another space mecha anime at some point in his life, Top-related or not. I know mecha is dead and all, but if he finishes Rebuild and decides to adapt some other terrifyingly banal slice-of-life, I'll waltz over to Japan and choke him.

[Xacebans]

I prefer not to think of it as a sequel. I actually--and please don't kill me for this--liked it better than the original. I liked them both, sure, but Gunbuster had some issues with pacing...I dunno. Gunbuster just seemed more erratic and experimental and, well, it's easier to do things right when you're trying after the experience of making a lot more crazy shows. I also liked the FLCL references . I also just like Gainax's more recent works. Sure, I like Eva, but as a whole I prefer the Gurren Lagann way of doing things--in other words, kill it with awesome.

I'm not saying Gunbuster wasn't good. In fact, I'm not saying it wasn't great, either. It was very good and I can see what made it stand out in its early days. But I just happened to prefer the second one.

[Azathoth]

tbh I don't actually think Gunbuster is very good either, with the exception of episode 6 (and episode 1 for comedy value)

[FreakyFilmFan4ever]

I really liked Gunbuster, though I wouldn't say that the show was, as a whole, "Amazing". I agree that only a few episodes in the series can be considered great. I do find it strange that I somehow started to care enough about the characters throughout the series enough to where the last few shots of Ep. 6 was really powerful. I don't know when that started happening. Maybe it was from the start with Ep. 1 when we find out Noriko's father died. Anno tends to have a lot of parental issues present in his early animated works (Gunbuster, Nadia, NGE...) and he seems to handle them quite well.

The romance between Coach and Amano was as realized as it could have been in 6 half-hour episodes, I guess. It felt rushed, but it still managed to bring a emotional aspect to the series that did work in its favor. It wasn't as good as it could have been, but it wasn't horrible in the way it was handled either. It was just kinda there and it did make you feel for the characters more than it would if it had not been there at all, and that's the important part in my opinion.

I'm convinced Jung Freud was there just as a nod to Anno's interest in sexual psychology and to appease his need for various shades of red-headed females in all of his animated shows. (Jung, Marie and Grandis, Asuka, Yukino Miyazawa, Cutie Honey... in fact all of his red-headed females tend to support sexually physiological ideas to some degree, some more in depth while other in a naively comedic fashion...) He just managed to get that character an emotionally strong moment by the end of Ep. 6, even though she didn't appear in the scene itself. (Lighting planet Earth to say "Welcome Back".) Beyond that, she was just kinda there to pose as a very basic rival to Amano. Not much to the character other than that, and because she served to create that emotionally powerful ending, I can't say she was a completely useless character either.

In the end, I basically see Gunbuster as Anno in a nutshell. These are the techniques he's interested in developing throughout his career (we even have an example of musical cognitive dissonance in the show, which he perfected in his D&R, EoE, and 2.22 films), the tropes and archetypes he's interested in (red-heads and sex, issues between child and parent(s)), and to test his basic emotional range in story-telling (everything from comedy to tragedy). I can't honestly say any part of it was "bad" or "poorly handled". The parts that are good I think are astounding, and the rest is simply "okay". Not a bad piece of work for a debut in the Chief Director's chair.

[Xavierla]

Look I know all of you are going to hate me for saying this but come on! First of all, Gunbuster was the first anime that combined the super robot type of mecha with the real robot type of mecha. Also for the 1980's, Gunbuster is extremely powerful. I should also point out that while Evangelion is considered Anno's greatest work Gunbuster is what truly put Gainax on the map. You wouldn't believe it but elements of Gunbuster have been copied so many times that barely anyone knows there from Gunbuster! Gunbuster also was unique in taking elements of shojo and teen drama and mixed that with Einstein's time dilation concepts making the story very emotional, much more so than Evangelion.

Don't get me wrong, I love Evangelion and have quite the obsession with it but lets give credit where credit is due. Evangelion: AMAZING, Gunbuster:EPIC.

AIM FOR THE TOP! http://forum.evageeks.org/images/smiles/peace.gif

[NAveryW]

First of all, Gunbuster was the first anime that combined the super robot type of mecha with the real robot type of mecha.

And the result is a super robot type of mecha!

Also for the 1980's, Gunbuster is extremely powerful.

You wouldn't believe it but elements of Gunbuster have been copied so many times that barely anyone knows there from Gunbuster!

Gunbuster is largely a pastiche itself. Its main contribution to the anime medium at large is the GAINAX bounce.

Gunbuster also was unique in taking elements of shojo and teen drama and mixed that with Einstein's time dilation concepts making the story very emotional, much more so than Evangelion.

That element comes directly from The Forever War. Which isn't a teen drama, but it uses time dilation for dramatic effect in the same fashion.

I really like Gunbuster, in any case; as I've said, it has my favorite ending to anything ever.

[Xavierla]

I never said that Gunbuster is the strongest mecha, I am aware of Ideon's strength but for it's time it is one of the stronger and while I will admit that gunbuster's copies a lot off of other works (on purpose) it is unique in the fact that at the time it wasn't just anime, NOBODY ever made a sci-fi mecha that was super robotish and real robotish while being filled with drama. For six episodes, Gunbuster did a lot in my opinion. If not for all anima and film media as a whole, than at least for studio gainax, you really think the themes represented in Gurren Lagann are original.

[Xavierla]

Everyone needs to watch this anime! It is so under ratted. First of all there would never be Gurren Lagann if there wasn't Gunbuster and Diebuster and it is where Evangelion gets just about all of it's emotional back drop from. Seriously I'm tired hearing people praising Evangelion and Gurren Lagann. Yes they are both great and very emotional works that are very inspirational and I love them both but Gunbuster is truly the most epic Gainax mecha ever made! WATCH GUNBUSTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Agentomega]

I wouldn't exactly say all of its emotional backdrop. Studio Gainax does use a lot of the same themes in their works (especially since Anno wrote both Gunbuster and Eva), but it's more the author's influence than the prior series. Not to mention, Eva came between Gunbuster and Diebuster, as did FLCL. Sure, Gurren had a lot of elements that Diebuster did. However, I can appreciate them all as wonderful series, even moreso because I understand the connections between them.

Also, I feel like your opinion comes on a liiiiiiiiiiittle too strong (especially all those exclamation points). Not saying it isn't a valid one, just a bit too final.

[Xavierla]

(especially since Anno wrote both Gunbuster and Eva)

I thought Yamaga wrote Gunbuster.

I wouldn't exactly say all of its emotional backdrop

Most of it.

Also, I feel like your opinion comes on a liiiiiiiiiiittle too strong (especially all those exclamation points). Not saying it isn't a valid one, just a bit too final.

Yeah sorry about that. I get a little too passionate about Gunbuster.

[cyharding]

I thought Yamaga wrote Gunbuster.

According to the booklet that came with my copy of Gunbuster, Toshio Okada is credited with the original story and screenplay and Anno is credited with the screenplay for episodes 5 & 6.

[NAveryW]

Yamaga wrote the first four episodes of Gunbuster uncredited.

it is unique in the fact that at the time it wasn't just anime, NOBODY ever made a sci-fi mecha that was super robotish and real robotish while being filled with drama.

Watch and read every pre-1988 giant robot anime and manga and get back to me on that.

[Hyper Shinchan]

Watch and read every pre-1988 giant robot anime and manga and get back to me on that.

THIS, a whole load of THIS! Honestly I don't even see a lot of "real robot" elements in Gunbuster, admitting that this is really a separate genre.

[Fireball]

Watch and read every pre-1988 giant robot anime and manga and get back to me on that.

BU-BU-BUT GUNBASTAH IS THE BESTEST!!!

[Dream]

Man, you really like Gunbuster don't you?

[FreakyFilmFan4ever]

Anno really didn't start doing things with "mechs" that no one else did until Eva, and that technically wasn't even mecha. (And even then the main ingredient to Eva's difference between it and other animus was simply not giving the audience what they wanted how they wanted it.)

Though I will say that Gunbuster surprised me that it told its story as well as it did in as little time as it did it. I usually don't feel that strongly for characters after only 6 half-hour episodes of run time.

[Xavierla]

Man, you really like Gunbuster don't you?

It's like my religion.

Watch and read every pre-1988 giant robot anime and manga and get back to me on that.

The only other type of mecha like that before Gunbuster was Sunrise's works
but they were not as influential to the hybrid mecha genre as Gunbuster.