Some thoughts on Yui and Shinji

[Iuvenal]

Once you realize that the use of the MPEs is separate from their primary plan involving Yui and the Lance many pieces of the puzzle begin to fall into place.

Their words indicate that their primary plan involved Lilith and the Lance, and that Unit 01/Yui came into play because the lance was in space.

[Bagheera]

Their words indicate that their primary plan involved Lilith and the Lance, and that Unit 01/Yui came into play because the lance was in space.

To my way of thinking Unit 01 was central to both plans, and it was just a question of how humanity's souls would be moved to their new home (which would be Unit 01). With the Lilith route Seele would (somehow) use the Lance to force her to tang humanity, combine their souls together, and put the new being into Unit 01. With the MPE route the MPEs would do that instead of Lilith. But Unit 01 seems to be important either way.

[Ispellnogood]

They always planned to implant one, they just didn't want Gendo doing things ahead of schedule (they didn't know Yui was working toward her own goals at the time). Note that Seele's plan had several contingency elements, and that not all are needed to do what they wanted to do.

I always figured it had something to do with Unit one being born from lilith and them not wanting something Lilith-born to get an S2 engine.

Their words indicate that their primary plan involved Lilith and the Lance, and that Unit 01/Yui came into play because the lance was in space.

That what I think. It's only after the lance is missing that they're forced to resort to using Unit One. As it's the only one created from Lilith.

Once you realize that the use of the MPEs is separate from their primary plan involving Yui and the Lance many pieces of the puzzle begin to fall into place.

I think the MPEs were always going to be used in their primary plan, using unit one instead of Lilith seems to be the only thing stated as being different from their original plan.

[mehdi_saada]

If you try to find a clear-cut rational and logical events unfolding, you will get full of "somehow". So I made my mind : this series is entirely abstract, it doesn't even remotely work to think on the material basis of the Eva world. This isn't at all sound SF like Gundam Astray. When science is used a metaphor for spiritual things, it just gets confused, no matter the way around. So, let's stick with this fuzziness and take that strange science lore (and all that fall into it, like überbeing's working, or S2's engine) as such: images.
Maybe with ten years of preparations, and way less pressure from the Gainax, or pressure for improvement, toward soundness, coherence, no fuzziness yet the same fucking profound psycho-spiritual insights, would have change things but too bad, too late ! And now Anno is free, there's no way anyone will ever pressure him to police his wild inspiration a little bit.

[Ispellnogood]

If you try to find a clear-cut rational and logical events unfolding, you will get full of "somehow". So I made my mind : this series is entirely abstract, it doesn't even remotely work to think on the material basis of the Eva world. This isn't at all sound SF like Gundam Astray.

That is very true, the laws/motivations/vague dialogue in Evangelion is a clay-like sludge that is molded to fit the narrative.

[Bagheera]

I think the MPEs were always going to be used in their primary plan, using unit one instead of Lilith seems to be the only thing stated as being different from their original plan.

No, they were explicitly labeled as Seele's backup plan. If they were using Lilith they wouldn't need the MPEs since Lilith can generate her own anti-ATF.

If you try to find a clear-cut rational and logical events unfolding, you will get full of "somehow". So I made my mind : this series is entirely abstract, it doesn't even remotely work to think on the material basis of the Eva world.

I have not experienced this problem. I find that most of the show makes pretty good sense, so this sort of argument is a non-starter for me.

[unz]

@saada I'm not sure if you want to talk about eva's inner workings or plot but I got ninja'd.

Otherwise this is how the eva works
www.depauw.edu/site/sfs/backissues/88/orbaugh.html

[mehdi_saada]

Sorry, I meant you can't actually speculate with much sense on what is possible and what is not is Eva's universe. Anno is god, and if god had wanted to change only one thing and did it, you would still be speculating the same way for naught on what is possible and what is not in a absolute sense in Evaverse.
Bagheera : I dislike profundly hard science SF, maybe that's an explanation ? When something is not real, I feel it's stupid to ape it too much. Or even worse : to argue mordicus that the author had, when he never intended that first of all

[unz]

Though, I do think that the significance of Shinji holding a red marble is to visually foreshadow all of the souls that GNR collects during Third Impact. Yes, it's a marble. But it might mean so much more in the context of the show.

I think this is pretty close.
I watched some eps again keeping an eye on the arguments the show makes on the evas, basically the slow reveals, pretty boring shit which helps answering some threads I wanted to browse again but whatever.
The link above about how the evas work is one thing but some deal about mind contamination is made in ep2, ep5 has 00 going berserk showing activation is painful and evas' will, ep14 features 00 attacking Shinji's mind and almost killing everyone with ritsuko wondering if the eva was trying to absorb Shinji ("the same as before? blhablha, it's what they feared in the first couple of episodes other then Rei's incident), then we get to ep16 and given the reveals the show makes on the inner workings of the eva the audience can only assume it's going to absorb shinji- except we find an ethereal yui instead of monster Rei or something who does try to become one with Shinji but leaves him the final decision (I just wanted to meet them again) and ultimately they just get out.
Not too different from megarei and shogoki