Thoughts about Mari

[lclbloodtransfusion]

Well, it's because 3.0 is really all about Shinji, so most of speculation has to do with "how does this character treat Shinji" or "how does Shinji treat this character". We have to use the character's interactions with Shinji as reference, as we very rarely see them interacting with each other significantly. Particularly in the case of the criminally under-developed Mari. Thus Shinji's own mental state and reactions come into play, and the devolution starts from there.

This is a great argument for why Shinji is NOT relevant to this thread.

Anyways, I think that picture is really interesting Mako. When was that issue of the manga published, and can someone remind me how much impact Anno has or has had on the manga? I know it's mostly separate now, but obviously it's official and holds a little more weight than a fanfic or something.

It's interesting that not only is the design similar, but that the characters in question are playing a very similar role to Mari; Asuka's intensely competitive nature no doubt fostered resentment toward Mari regarding piloting Eva. In the more condensed Rebuild series, Asuka has even less room for variation in her interests, so piloting Eva is pretty much it for her. This makes Mari, especially in 3.0 where we didn't really see other people in a position to compete with her, THE only "rival" or source of competition for her. And then in the manga, there's this other girl.

On its own, I would have taken her to be a representation of the archetype rival for Asuka, i.e. not necessarily representing an actual person but more of a hypothetical "that child[, and that child, and that child, etc...]." Thus, it's interesting that there are these similarities. Even if the design of both the woman and her child were completely without anything to compare them to, there would still be case to make for a connection to Mari (even if only in spirit).

Because Asuka's mom knows the woman, it'd make sense if it were someone in the same line of work; it's obviously someone she herself is competitive with, and is seeking to best her vicariously through Asuka. And if they are in the same line of work, it makes it all the more likely that the girl would be a pilot.

(I unfortunately haven't been able to read the manga, but if there is a good thread or article here with information about it, a link to that would be appreciated )

[Merior]

It's interesting that not only is the design similar, but that the characters in question are playing a very similar role to Mari; Asuka's intensely competitive nature no doubt fostered resentment toward Mari regarding piloting Eva. In the more condensed Rebuild series, Asuka has even less room for variation in her interests, so piloting Eva is pretty much it for her. This makes Mari, especially in 3.0 where we didn't really see other people in a position to compete with her, THE only "rival" or source of competition for her. And then in the manga, there's this other girl.

On its own, I would have taken her to be a representation of the archetype rival for Asuka, i.e. not necessarily representing an actual person but more of a hypothetical "that child[, and that child, and that child, etc...]." Thus, it's interesting that there are these similarities. Even if the design of both the woman and her child were completely without anything to compare them to, there would still be case to make for a connection to Mari (even if only in spirit).

Because Asuka's mom knows the woman, it'd make sense if it were someone in the same line of work; it's obviously someone she herself is competitive with, and is seeking to best her vicariously through Asuka. And if they are in the same line of work, it makes it all the more likely that the girl would be a pilot.

That scan was an interesting find (i've read the manga but couldn't even remember it...) and unless the two women were simply used as a symbol (as you pointed out), it may be relevant. I guess it could be used as a proof that Mari isn't a clone(?) and that the woman in the photo is simply her mother. We know for sure that the girl in the scan didn't become a pilot in the manga storyline. This is the rebuild though, who knows. It doesn't help that we didn't even witness Asuka and Mari's first meeting.

As for Mari being Asuka's rival, you'll prob agree that it isn't really the case. They have other things to worry about and not even once their relationship is portrayed as a rivalry. They're simply cooperating.
Also, Asuka isn't competitive (well she is and she is not at the same time). Not even once we are shown that she enjoys competing with other people. She obviously want(ed) to be the best but competing annoys her because it forces her to put herself on the line, exposing herself to an additional defeat (she alrdy risks getting beaten by angels, a rival would only cause her more troubles). She's no Ash, if you excuse the stupid comparison...
Mari couldn't care less either...

When was that issue of the manga published, and can someone remind me how much impact Anno has or has had on the manga? I know it's mostly separate now, but obviously it's official and holds a little more weight than a fanfic or something.

It's Sadamoto's take on NGE pretty much. Both story and drawings. It follows the tv series more or less, adding more background to the characters and somehow simplifying their personalities too. It's NGE+EoE plotwise and rebuild 1+2 character wise. Less "Asuka-centric", more space for Rei to develop and the other characters seem to have less problems than their tv counterparts.
Judging from this i'm pretty sure Anno didn't have much of an impact. It doesn't rly prove anything though, it probably wouldn't take much to ask Sadamoto to add a scene in it.
No idea when it was published.

[bladerj]

Asuka is anno favorite character while sadamoto has made no secret he likes Rei better,so i expect more exposition from the later in his manga.
The only intervention i know of anno had in the manga was in relation to the movie plot where he and sadamoto changed notes, this was in a old anime magazine here in brazil and truthly i dont even know if this is true becouse later with internet i found out most of their new onsaint seiya was full of fan speculation and not news at all.

[Warren Peace]

Mari's "Hey, come on!" is adorable enough for me to lament that it's her only English phrase in Q (I think). In fact, I wish ALL of Sakamoto's lines had been English from the beginning. That would have been kewl.

[Guy Nacks]

Mari's "Hey, come on!" is adorable enough for me to lament that it's her only English phrase in Q (I think). In fact, I wish ALL of Sakamoto's lines had been English from the beginning. That would have been kewl.

It would definitely be more realistic someone like Mari, who is British, to project her thoughts out loud in English when she isn't explicitly conversing with someone who is Japanese.

Same for Asuka, but substitute German for English.

Problem No. 46 for the Rebuild Series.

But hey, subtitles are for hipsters, right?

[Warren Peace]

Well, Asuka's German is a problem for Evangelion in general. Mari's English is adorable. Asuka's German... I think she should stick with Japanese.

[Guy Nacks]

Well, it's not Asuka's German so much as it is that her VA can't speak it convincingly worth a damn.

[Lance of LoL]

Praise the English dub in that respect, least when they're doin' one language over they bothered their asses to do the German right too.

Still, thoughts on Mari, seems her role was weaker in this than the previous movie. I really like her, but over all it seems Anno is having a hard time just getting us through the same old 3 pilots without trying to expand on a fourth we've only just met. She's clearly the foil to Asuka's more aggressive nature, being confident, but not outwardly hostile. Though like I said she seemed rather weak in this movie. An extra pair of hands to help in fights and to grab Shinji when he's blowing up planets again, but her character just really doesn't get anything new to tackle if you ask me.

[StratoSakuya...AF]

I feel Mari's relevance so far has hiked too slowly. I mean; first, she gets shady support, then hacks an Eva out of the storage facility with the help of the UN's IPEA. Just what is she and what are her plans? Was she aware of what would happen when Shinji and Rei fused? Is she aware about Kaji's death?

It's all too confusing. Damn! They wasted a perfectly good plot...

[Warren Peace]

Don't speak too soon, there's still another movie where that may be hashed out...

As I see it, Mari is Q's representative in 2.0, representing the world that is to come (though not in a literal, time travely way or anything!). The latest movie seems like home turf for her. She crashed into the familiar world of old Eva and dragged it into the new era post time skip.

[Bagheera]

I still don't know why anyone is suggesting the unknown woman in the photo has any relation to Mari. The only point of similarity that I can see is the fact that both wear glasses. That's it. Everything else just screams "this is Kyoko Soryu!" I mean, that might not be true -- we don't know anything about Kyoko this time around, or even if there is a Kyoko to begin with. But even still the Mari connection seems like a pretty big leap, and one informed by nothing apart from eyewear.

[Shinoyami65]

What I want to know is how Mari initially wound up with IPEA instead of Nerv, and what happened to IPEA later. Did they all die after 3I? Did Mari just ditch them and join up with Nerv/Wille? And what is the IPEA anyway? They initially seem like another Eva-related support organisation under Nerv/Seele, similar to the Marduk Institute, but they seem to have their own agenda, which involved Mari engaging the Tenth Angel (whether they were planning on supporting Nerv or just wanted to kill the Angel is another thing we don't know).

[Merior]

It would definitely be more realistic someone like Mari, who is British, to project her thoughts out loud in English when she isn't explicitly conversing with someone who is Japanese.

Same for Asuka, but substitute German for English.

Problem No. 46 for the Rebuild Series.

But hey, subtitles are for hipsters, right?

Provided they have spent half of their life in Japan, it doesn't make sense that they'd still think in their original languages.
Personally i can tell you that it doesn't take much to get used to "think" in another language that you know well (especially when you use that language in your everyday life).
If nothing else Asuka Soryu in NGE talked far too much in german (you know what i mean...)

I still don't know why anyone is suggesting the unknown woman in the photo has any relation to Mari. The only point of similarity that I can see is the fact that both wear glasses. That's it. Everything else just screams "this is Kyoko Soryu!" I mean, that might not be true -- we don't know anything about Kyoko this time around, or even if there is a Kyoko to begin with. But even still the Mari connection seems like a pretty big leap, and one informed by nothing apart from eyewear.

Probably because people who watched the movie in theatres reported that the woman looked like Mari and now everyone (myself included) is unable to forget about it. It has something to do with Mari referring to Gendo as Gendo-kun and saying to Rei that her original (whether she means Yui or ReiII we don't know) was friendlier(?), making it seem like she's older than 28 and somehow connected to the older woman in the photo that, more likely than not, knew both Gendo and Yui.
It may not even be relevant but Asuka's mother looks different than that woman, in the manga at least. She's blonde, if i'm not mistaken.

[StratoSakuya...AF]

What I want to know is how Mari initially wound up with IPEA instead of Nerv, and what happened to IPEA later. Did they all die after 3I? Did Mari just ditch them and join up with Nerv/Wille? And what is the IPEA anyway? They initially seem like another Eva-related support organisation under Nerv/Seele, similar to the Marduk Institute, but they seem to have their own agenda, which involved Mari engaging the Tenth Angel (whether they were planning on supporting Nerv or just wanted to kill the Angel is another thing we don't know).

Exactly my point; Anno brings IPEA in and gives us no bloody clue as to their mission or agenda or anything. I was expecting an Anti-SEELE organization, and instead we get WILLE.

As I sai, they wasted a perfectly good plot; Guess I'll have to make it into Fanon instead.

[Bagheera]

It may not even be relevant but Asuka's mother looks different than that woman, in the manga at least. She's blonde, if i'm not mistaken.

Yeah, but that's the manga. Sadamoto changed so much there that I wouldn't be surprised if Anno ignored it completely.

[A.T. Fish]

Mari's "Hey, come on!" is adorable enough for me to lament that it's her only English phrase in Q

The accent didn't sound british though, that was a bummer.

[Warren Peace]

I've actually never understood the "Mari speaks with an English accent" thing. I'm not saying she definitely doesn't, British natives may be more sensitive to it. But to my unsophisticated American ear, her English sounds thoroughly Japanese.

[Mr. Tines]

Mari's English, as recall it, sounded generically foreign -- it could even be French rather than Japanese -- and definitely not an English accent of any form. The original disappointment is that the "English" dub wasn't any better.

[lclbloodtransfusion]

so I've just finished reading the manga and wanted to offer a more complete thought on the woman Asuka's mother referred to. Here are all (I think) of the pages she appeared:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/ba2bd93685f4a10ec98d1a636324c9be/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o1_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/e8379b609dcae600b50b02e314ff320c/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o2_1280.jpg
http://24.media.tumblr.com/19125b82118fcbdbad47e0f9b7e3b0c9/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o3_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/759b34e0d6e7d4f5594b0e44b600a223/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o4_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/3d960a83012ecc0c1ab73c34e7e6ece6/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o5_1280.jpg

If I understand correctly, she is not a hypothetical woman but is the woman Asuka's mother's husband had an affair (and child) with; she also is Asuka's stepmother (?). I don't really think it's likely at this point that this is relevant to Mari, and if it is, especially in this way, I can't imagine it ever actually being explained in 4.0. :(

[Giji Shinka]

so I've just finished reading the manga and wanted to offer a more complete thought on the woman Asuka's mother referred to. Here are all (I think) of the pages she appeared:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/ba2bd93685f4a10ec98d1a636324c9be/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o1_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/e8379b609dcae600b50b02e314ff320c/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o2_1280.jpg
http://24.media.tumblr.com/19125b82118fcbdbad47e0f9b7e3b0c9/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o3_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/759b34e0d6e7d4f5594b0e44b600a223/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o4_1280.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/3d960a83012ecc0c1ab73c34e7e6ece6/tumblr_mhnhnlVRzu1rtqm81o5_1280.jpg

If I understand correctly, she is not a hypothetical woman but is the woman Asuka's mother's husband had an affair (and child) with; she also is Asuka's stepmother (?). I don't really think it's likely at this point that this is relevant to Mari, and if it is, especially in this way, I can't imagine it ever actually being explained in 4.0. :(

Yea, i also think, that this is completly irrelevant to Mari. We also can say much about Asuka's mother in NME. All we know about Asuka that she's been alone for all her life without mother. (or father) Manga is also a little differently portrayed compared to anime.( not to mention rebuilt.) And as you said, we might not get answers to this never. (But who knows, maybe Anno decides explain it. No one could predict 3.0, we are (not) probably able predict 4.0 either.)