Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby Reichu » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:42 am

@Mr. Tines: Nerv is Seele's own executive branch. What reason could they possibly have to destroy part of it?

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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby Mr. Tines » Sat Mar 24, 2018 7:54 am

At that point they were already starting to have their suspicions about Gendo getting too independent; Second Branch is wiped off the map very shortly after Misato returns from their inconclusive debriefing following the Iruel incident. As for why, they later tell us

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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby Reichu » Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:00 am

Gendo doesn't have jurisdiction over the other branches of Nerv, though. Seele does. They put them all to work mass-producing Evas and don't tell Nerv HQ about it. Seele doesn't gain anything by wiping out Second Branch. They only hurt themselves, evidenced when they comment in EoE they have fewer MP Evas than they wanted.

If by "too independent" you mean "has control over too many Evas", it would have been much simpler to just not let him have Eva-04 at all, rather than deliberately destroy a costly investment they could later use for their own plans, along with expensive facilities and several thousand useful minions.

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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby ACGT-Samael » Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:21 am

View Original PostMr. Tines wrote:At that point they were already starting to have their suspicions about Gendo getting too independent; Second Branch is wiped off the map very shortly after Misato returns from their inconclusive debriefing following the Iruel incident. As for why, they later tell us


If they didn't want an Eva with an S2 Engine, it would be easier for just not do the test at all. Doing something they don't seem to do just to destroy the idea own resources is beyond idiotic.

And the reason Eva-01 was considered a God is because it had Lilith's Fruit of Knowledge, since it was derived from her. The other Adam-derived Evas would not, so they'd not be Godly. After all, the ME Evas were never referred to as such. (Kaworu might defy this, but he's a really weird case and there's a lot about his and Rei's physiology we don't know.)

To me it makes far more sense they just accidentally pushed for S2 Engine too far, or perhaps rushed development and didn't have enough time for QC work.

That said, I still don't know why Adam went kaboom but Unit-04 dragged Second Branch off to Hammerspace.

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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby Mr. Tines » Sat Mar 24, 2018 2:26 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Seele doesn't gain anything by wiping out Second Branch.
"Only we now have the secret of how to install an S2 engine into an Evangelion. Without the experimental material or our secret notes, it would take too many months for Gendo to duplicate our work, and thus be able to upgrade his squad next time they all need repairs verging on full rebuilds."

If by "too independent" you mean "has control over too many Evas"
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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby Reichu » Sat Mar 24, 2018 8:20 pm

View Original PostMr. Tines wrote:"Only we now have the secret of how to install an S2 engine into an Evangelion. Without the experimental material or our secret notes, it would take too many months for Gendo to duplicate our work, and thus be able to upgrade his squad next time they all need repairs verging on full rebuilds."

Seele control Nerv HQ's funding. They can't even keep their personnel armed, let alone give the Evas expensive upgrades willy-nilly. Seele really, really don't need to sabotage themselves. They're not complete morons.

And it bears repeating:

(A) Gendo has no jurisdiction over the other branches of Nerv.
(B) They are, however, fully under Seele's control.

Furthermore, how in the world does destroying Second Branch purposefully to keep S2 secrets out of Gendo's hands make any sense whatsoever when Seele's next order of business is to put ALL REMAINING NON-H.Q. PARTS OF NERV to work using said "secrets" to mass produce Evas with S2s? I mean, by the logic in this thread, Seele should have made sure they all got imploded.

They also can't give that many shits about Gendo knowing stuff about the S2 engine, since he has all of the documentation from Antarctica, which would include the work of the S2 guru Dr. Katsuragi himself. Between that and the amount of time Shamshel's core spends in Gendo's care, without any kind of suspicion on Seele's part that Gendo might be secretly building S2s in HQ, the conspiracies ESPECIALLY don't pan out.

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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby Mr. Tines » Sun Mar 25, 2018 2:13 am

I think we just have to agree to disagree.
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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:26 pm

Didn't Gendo indicate in episode 17 that Seele hadn't planned for Unit 04 to disappear? This part here: https://wiki.evageeks.org/FGC:Episode_17_Cut_123 The way his dialogue plays out with Fuyutsuki and him not being concerned because Germany has the back-ups makes it sounds like he might have been pulling some strings there.
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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:32 pm

^ Well, if Gendo did have something to do with it, like he did with Jet Alone, then it was to keep the next two pilots from being selected by someone other than himself and then the US transferred Unit-03 to Japan, so perhaps the pilot for an EVA is chosen by the NERV branch it resides at.
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Re: Nerv Nevada, S2 Engine Installation, Unit-04 Sabotaged?

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Postby ACGT-Samael » Sat May 12, 2018 5:12 pm

At the risk of adding fuel to a wildfire, my twisted brain recently noted that Unit-04 has a very similar colour scheme (based on official merchandise) to the Mass Production Evas, whose numbers begin at 05 (ie the one immediately after 04). Now that may just have to do with the fact white is a colour associated with death in Japan, but it makes me wonder if Unit-04 was going to be the initial member of that group, and the failed test run forced them to redesign it slightly.

Meanwhile, this failure only makes me wonder what they changed when making the MP Evas to get the S2 Engines to work properly, but given something Reichu recently said I have two possible theories. The first is my preferred one for personal read, though that admittedly doesn't mean much; namely, I believe the pilot may actually be the confounding variable. Unit-01 only took in its S2 Engine after going berserk, which occurred after the Sync was broken and then pushed to 400% and left Yui herself at the wheel. The MP Evas, meanwhile, are governed by the Dummy System, whose entire raison d'être was to take sympathetic pain and other human weaknesses out of the equation. These sort of represent two extremes, but in neither case is the Eva relying on a pilot to function properly.

This makes me wonder if the initial tests of the S2 Organ failed because the pilot (assuming they had at least a test pilot) may not have been able to handle the S2 Engine in some way, panicked, and the imbalance from a bad sync or AT Field fluctuations destabilized the S2 Engine. By the time Nerv Branch 2 realized what was wrong, it may have been too late.

Under the other scenario, a lack of a pilot is the possible problem, if they did try to test it without one as suggested earlier. As Reichu said earlier, Unit-01 may have relied on its AT Field to reconfigure the S2 Engine to work within itself, which the MP Evas could similarly achieve through the Dummy System. However, if Unit-04 just had the Engine added and then they tried to jumpstart it, a "hardware mismatch" may have overloaded it in short order.

Why might this happen? The Wiki points out that Unit-01 is deployed with an Umbilical Cable against Armisael, despite obviously not needing it; the stated hypothesis was that an UC's power output can be regulated while an S2E's cannot (keeping the Evas restrained being a common theme). If they tried to install some kind of Limiter on the S2 here, it may have not worked properly, like what happened with Adam.


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