Did Shinji defeated Sachiel ?

[bladerj]

So i plugued the blu rays in for the first time, and now seeing 2.0 something came to my mind, did Shinji effectively defeated Sachi ? I always have since the series ,took it as a victory for the mommy eva 1, but seeing as Shinji reactivates eva 01 in rebuild 2.0, maybe he actually did it the first time as well ?

Sure,visually there was a diferent glow, but that can be explained as simply as they havent figure that back then yet.... Being that Shinji in 2.0 seems a bit psicotic,it is not so far fetched. Would this revelation dramatically change your view of the scene ? Your thoughs.

i realy hope this havent been argued before..

[Marduk]

You mean this [s]guy[/s] gal? That's Zeruel. Sachi is the one from 1.00/1.11.

Regardless, NGE and NME are two different, completely unrelated things till proven otherwise... SHIT! PUT THE PITCHFORKS AWAY!. Therefore, nothing that happens in NME will change the meaning of anything from NGE.

[bladerj]

You mean this [s]guy[/s] gal? That's Zeruel. Sachi is the one from 1.00/1.11.

Regardless, NGE and NME are two different, completely unrelated things till proven otherwise... SHIT! PUT THE PITCHFORKS AWAY!. Therefore, nothing that happens in NME will change the meaning of anything from NGE.

no no, i know. i mean Shinji reactivated the eva to save Rei, i was wondering what if he did the same in the battle agains sachiel, instead of momy eva doing it ? unlike the series we dont see Shinji looking at the eva eye and screaming, we dont know what happened at all, all we know is the eva went beserk, but not why.

[Final Messenger]

Shinji desperately wanted to save Rei and he was going to do whatever it took to save her. He reactivated his mommy through sheer force of will and instead of going berserk the Eva went into a pseudo “god mode”. He was in control from what I could tell unlike in NGE where yui-sama was in control

[Azathoth]

no no, i know. i mean Shinji reactivated the eva to save Rei, i was wondering what if he did the same in the battle agains sachiel, instead of momy eva doing it ?

Good question, actually. I'm sure it was raised at some point between 1.11 and 2.22, since 1.11 minimizes Yui's input so much that people were wondering if she wasn't actually in Unit 01 until 2.22 confirmed she was. But while I suppose it's possible that Shinji himself went berserk on Sachiel, the fact that the scene is basically identical to the ep02 equivalent suggests to me that it's a case of the same thing happening, Yui goes nuts and tears shit up.

As to why the eye-to-eye scene was removed...who knows. I guess the idea is that in Rebuild, Shinji remains completely ignorant of what Eva is?

[SaltyJoe]

You would think the people at Nerv would notice something like that. I mean, wouldn't it be an adequate reaction to start screaming about "Holy crap, the pilot has reactivated the Unit, [s]synch ratio[/s] plug depth over nine thousand"? Not to mention that Shinji going berserk as early as that would pretty much negate the idea that what's happening at the end of 2.0 is something as of yet unprecedented (Beast Mode was a completely different thing, before someone narrows things down to "pilots eyes are glowing, it's the same stuff").

Also my memory is hazy on this one, but isn't it mentioned that Shinji lost consciousness before Unit-01 goes nuts on Sachiel (inb4 it was Shinji's unconcious side taking over, because Freud and Id)?

[Eva 04]

Uh,no. Did you forget? Sachel was the first angel he fought against. He had no experience what so ever for piloting Eva. And since that's the case,obviously Eva 01 defeated it when it went berserk.

[Axell]

Yui also roared against sachi, I think its safe to assume she was in charge of the battle.

[Sachi]

The point of Shinji's "awakening" in 2.0 is actually quite climatic when compared to the rest of the film, and possibly to the first film as well. The entire time Shinji insists that he has nothing to live for, nothing to die for, and nothing to fight for; he finds no reason in himself to make his own decisions. However, as he becomes closer and closer to Rei, Shinji finally finds that one thing that makes all mistakes worth it, and it's that inner-strength that allows him to reactive Unit-01 against Zeruel. The vast difference in the Sachiel and Zeruel fights shows his development into a stronger person, more driven person.

So, no. Shinji is not responsible for the victory against Sachiel.

[bobbyfischer's ghost]

I'd say it's similar to Asuka and kyoko-sama in EoE,
Shinji was just along for the ride. It's more like yui was granting Shinji's whish.

[ipwnuall]

I think it was his love for Rei and his force of will that awakened his true power and defeated the angel at the end of 2.0.

[TheFriskyIan]

It's pretty obvious that Shinji reactivated Unit 01, but I'm not so sure he was piloting it. Look at all the crap in the entry plug, how the heck can he see through that?

[Sailor Star Dust]

TheFriskyIan: You mean the entry plug? But speaking of, the 2.22 Script mentions Shinji was in the Entry Plug the entire time (similar to him in EoE, I guess).

[Kendrix]

What he did in 2.0 is very different from the usual Berserk, it's more like what Asuka did in EoE, except with more special effects. You actually see it from his PoV and his imput to the situations, while everything is way more vague with the "classic" Berserk.
It was certainly a very different process - and clearly visually distinct. While the EVA appeared to revert to a creature of instinct in a classic berserk, god mode/pseudoevolution looks more like an ancesion instead. One version gives us ghastly biological horror, the other surreal wtf-ness. Both displays of raw power, but different ones.
I wouldn't assume that we can infer anything abojut previous battles from Shinji doing something completely different.

Of course, while the consesus seems to be that berserk is 100% the resident soul, there's been some debate about wether the pilot has any influence on it or not. But it's certainly nowhere near as much control and deliberate action as we saw it in 2.0. Shinji's part in the instances of berserking seen in Old!NGE was, if anything, something vague like: "I don't wanna die! Someone help me! Mommy!", "I dun wanna die all alone!" and "I dun want everyone else to die!", respectively, with Yui doubtlessly doing the bulk of the action. He couldn't have possibly fought Sachiel by himself, he could barely get the EVA to move at the time.
(Still, my personal theory is that some participation of his was needed, if only to "link" stuff together, because... well, in some of the situations, Yui certainly would've saved him earlier if she could, instead, the Berserk seemed to have been "started" by intense emotional moments... also, he reacalled what happened in a weird way, we didn't get his "personal" inside-the-entryplug perspective until it was all over - that, and this one line in the proposal saying it was his will which defeated the Angel, tiough that sounds like an artistic overstatement to conceal teh big reveal...)
It's very different to what we saw in 2.X: While he obviously didn't completely understand all he was doing - he almost accidentally caused TI - but everything that was happening was somehow related to his will, wishes and desires. His input (as we gatter from the scenes where we see him in his entry plug) was something more concrete, willful here, something like "Make Angel go splat in the most painful way available and grab Ayanami at all costs"