NTE's interpretation of the characters

[Blockio]

It really isn't, no. I do like NTE, but its handling of Shiki in particular does leave things to be desired

[RussianRiz]

Unfortunately, the major flaw of NTE is that it is too Shinji-centric. Any additional character development is diminished by this narrative construction. It's not that there isn't a story without Shinji, but it's far from being in the same level in the plot.

[FelipeFritschF]

What I always liked the most about NGE was that it didn't feel like the world revolved around Shinji, how Misato, Asuka, Rei and others had their whole lives independent of Shinji. Then in EoTV and EoE both one of the central conflicts is Shinji having to realize these other characters are separate individuals and he has to learn how to deal with their individuality, their separation of him even if this gap is bridged by Instrumentality. This isn't really a thing in NTE anymore, which saddens me greatly. I don't like how Shikinami acts like a bit of a plot resolution device for Shinji, but she's still not nearly as affected by this in comparison to her NGE self as Misato is. I feel she lost the most characterization.

[Archer]

^ Asuka is by far the most egregious example of this, I HAVE to believe that the “curse of Eva” also kept her mentally stunted because the alternative proposition is that this 28 year old woman still has hang-ups over some boy she knew for a couple months 14 goddamn years ago.

[kuribo-04]

^ Asuka is by far the most egregious example of this, I HAVE to believe that the “curse of Eva” also kept her mentally stunted because the alternative proposition is that this 28 year old woman still has hang-ups over some boy she knew for a couple months 14 goddamn years ago.

You probably shouldn't take it too literally.

[The Killer of Heroes]

I don't think its fair to frame Shinji just as some random high school crush Asuka never got over (There's uh, kind of a lot of near-apocalyptic and outright apocalyptic events that relationship is all tied up in!), and I never really got the impression that Asuka had spent the whole 14 years pining over Shinji or anything. I always figured its that Shinji suddenly being back in her life is what caused old feelings and frustrations to bubble back up to the surface much like with Misato and Kaji, particularly in the original series.

[FelipeFritschF]

I think that, much like Episode 22 before the DC, this was a more reasonable interpretation. Regrettably, -120min, I think, made her character way more attached to Shinji.

Even now, however, I think we can generally think that Shinji meant a lot to her because he influenced her life so much and her sole friendship with Mari clearly didn't fill the void completely. In NGE Sohryu was also not all that close to Misato, and I always found it interesting how she did try to get close to Sohryu but ended up kinda giving up in later episodes. Shikinami seems much more distant from "the colonel" in comparison, so she is even more dependent on Shinji for her development and it seems Mari doesn't do much on her own. I'm not satisfied with it frankly, I think Asuka's character deserves independence.

[Blockio]

Yeah, -120 really does not do Asuka any favors. A shame, really

[kuribo-04]

I don't really take -120min into account when thinking about Rebuild.
It's a fanservice short by someone other than Anno. It was fun for what it is and very pretty but that's about it.

[Blockio]

Dito. It came up elsewhere the other day, and the more you think about it, the less sense it makes. Ah yes, Asuka has to wear her old plug suit for this mission because clearly, Shinji would not recognize her otherwise. Because that makes sense.

[BernardoCairo]

It's a fanservice short by someone other than Anno.

If these are the reasons why you don't take it into account, I have bad news for you... XD

[FelipeFritschF]

It's authored by the co-directors Tsurumaki, Anno's right hand and likely candidate for a new Eva thing, and Maeda, a very notable director Anno specifically brought on the NTE project with 3.0 and Matsubara, the new character designer who apparently supplanted Sadamoto after his noodle incident, and it was Anno's personal idea and initiative.

https://webnewtype.com/report/article/1041222/

Anno is still credited with "planning, original story and supervisor" but that might just be the usual attribution of him within the larger franchise.

https://www.evangelion.co.jp/news/210607-2/

He at the very least told them to do it, which is less involvement than he had with some NGE episodes, particularly 4, which Satsukawa worked on alone (and his absence from NTE has left a void, possibly). Eva is not just Anno, including NGE, but especially not NTE where he had to ask Ogata for her opinions on how to end it, and yet he was still involved in it. And that was before they elevated it and chose to re-release it as an OVA alongside - 48h, deliberately removing any ambiguity because of it being originally included in the EEE fanservice pamphlet. So whether you like it or not (and I don't), we can't discount it.

[Axx°N N.]

Yeah, if Asuka's characterization being penned by Tsurumaki makes it secondary canon ... so would her writing in NTE, which Tsurumaki has largely (almost exclusively) been attributed.

[Blockio]

Personally, I don't really care who wrote it; it's a badly thought out, badly executed afterthought of a sidestory, so I treat it the same way as I treat the equivalent sidestories in Gundam: Ignore its existence unless absolutely necessary. We've been blessed in that regard that we didn't have many of those for Eva, but I strongly recommend adapting some variation of that maxim; it makes navigating ever-expanding stories so much less of a pain to deal with

[silentleviathan]

I don't think its fair to frame Shinji just as some random high school crush Asuka never got over (There's uh, kind of a lot of near-apocalyptic and outright apocalyptic events that relationship is all tied up in!), and I never really got the impression that Asuka had spent the whole 14 years pining over Shinji or anything. I always figured its that Shinji suddenly being back in her life is what caused old feelings and frustrations to bubble back up to the surface much like with Misato and Kaji, particularly in the original series.

I know I'm bumping an old thread here but I wanted to add my own thoughts here. For context, I watched the original series and movies (D & R and EoE) when they came out in the 90s when I was in high school. I fell away from NGE and anime in general but recently rewatched NGE and the 2 movies as well as Rebuild for the first time.

Personally, the above take is how I view Asuka in Rebuild. She hasn't been pining for Shinji for 14 years and figured she got over him but I think seeing him again reawakened old feelings in her.

We saw in NGE during the mind violation episode and during instrumentality her real feelings towards Shinji and her frustrations with him over his perceived rejection of her and her own frustrations with even having feelings for someone like Shinji who represented everything she claimed to hate (weakness, boring, "unmasculine", etc.)

In Rebuild, I can understand and sympathize with her reaction to Shinji returning and her anger with him. She blames him not only for the N3I but also the loss of her humanity. Her and the others have been dealing with an almost destroyed world and have been at war with NERV for the last 14 years and the first thing Shinji does when he returns is start making it all about himself and how much his life sucks. I know someone who went through an almost year long episode of crippling depression where they were in bed almost all the time. They lost a lot of friends because people didn't understand why they couldn't "get over it" because other people in the same situation (death of a parent) do and there are people out there in much worse situations. So I completely get Asuka's anger at Shinji moping about and her trying to force feed him but at the same time, I understand Shinji's position too. At the same time, Asuka may be angry at Shinji but she's also trying to help him in the only way she knows; just powering through any obstacles.

Despite her anger at Shinji we still see her secretly following him to the lake to check up on him. Later on, Mari asks if there's been any progress with the doggy. Asuka correctly says that he doesn't need a lover, he needs a mother (which is also perhaps a comment on herself). The fact that Mari asked that question makes me wonder if Asuka ever shared her feelings towards Shinji with her over the previous 14 years. Finally, the biggest indicator to me that she realized she still had feelings for him, is when she went to tell him that she didn't. I can understand wanting to tie up loose ends before going on a suicide mission but telling someone "I think I liked you but I don't anymore" isn't the way to do it. I would expect something like "I'm sorry for how I treated you. I was angry at myself because I saw myself in you and I took it out on you." That would show personal growth and introspection over the last 14 years. Instead, it sounds like she's either trying to convince herself or trying to hurt Shinji as she was hurt when he disappeared. People lying to themselves and to others to hide their feelings has been a constant theme in this series. Even the comment "I think I had a crush on you" isn't true. We know from NGE during the mind violation episode and during instrumentality that's she's aware exactly how she feels about Shinji but she can't admit it to herself. She can't parse the image she wants to present to the world and also being attracted to someone like Shinji.

I would also add that her talking to herself about how she'll always be alone when she's at Kensuke's place makes me wonder about how much growing she really did in the past 14 years. She's still putting up walls around herself and not allowing anyone to get close. This goes back to her comment to Shinji about how she "grew up first" and makes me wonder how much truth is behind that statement.

[Axx°N N.]

I would also add that her talking to herself about how she'll always be alone when she's at Kensuke's place makes me wonder about how much growing she really did in the past 14 years. She's still putting up walls around herself and not allowing anyone to get close. This goes back to her comment to Shinji about how she "grew up first" and makes me wonder how much truth is behind that statement.

Good post.

That last bit gets me to thinking about the contrasts between emotional and physical growth. It seems a deliberate theme and it's pretty interesting to probe. One could even say that Asuka is using her stunted physical maturity as a scapegoat, or to be more sympathetic, a coping mechanism. When she's thrust back into reality all growth-spurted, she seems almost dazed. I'd imagine that she'll have to reconcile and reckon with the fact that her maturity is its own separable mental condition, not just something inflicted by someone else biologically.

[silentleviathan]

I think without Shinji around to trigger feelings in her, Asuka fell back into her old ways over the last 14 years. She convinced herself that "getting over him" was personal growth and went back to putting up walls.

Asuka and Shinji need each other; not only for battle but also for personal development. Asuka is really the only one who pushes Shinji out of his comfort zone and tries to forces him to take a stand and also to be honest with himself. Shinji shows Asuka that it's OK to need someone else and that takes nothing away from her own skills and abilities and doesn't make her any less of an independent person. The thing is, neither of them are really aware of what they're doing for the other person. So when Shinji was absent for 14 years, Asuka didn't really have anyone to advance her personal growth.

[C.T.1290]

In Rebuild, I can understand and sympathize with her reaction to Shinji returning and her anger with him. She blames him not only for the N3I but also the loss of her humanity.

But was Shikinami even human to begin with? I mean, she was artificially created, maybe even spliced with Angel DNA, the same way as Rei and Kaworu.

[silentleviathan]

In Rebuild, I can understand and sympathize with her reaction to Shinji returning and her anger with him. She blames him not only for the N3I but also the loss of her humanity.

But was Shikinami even human to begin with? I mean, she was artificially created, maybe even spliced with Angel DNA, the same way as Rei and Kaworu.

Well, when I say humanity I mean her human traits like being able to eat and sleep. Ever since she interacted with the Angel while in the entry plug.
think at the end of Rebuild she is converted into a human.

[Tim Julius]

NGE is a classic anime with a heavy focus on its iconic cast of characters. NTE, as a movie tetralogy, had to change these characters up to make things work and tell the new story the directors were envisioning. Of course, some of the decisions made weren't to everyone's taste and this is a general thread to discuss that.

I totally agree, the original NGE cast had such depth, so it makes sense that NTE had to alter them for the new story direction. Some changes were refreshing, but others didn’t sit well with me either.