Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment made its debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby dzzthink » Thu Dec 09, 2021 9:10 pm

I think this topic might deserve some more discussion considering it is an essential aspect of the series and finale. My main question is what was the driving force behind Shinji's transition to maturity in the finale? This seemed more like an instantaneous revelation rather than a gradual build-up, occurring at the moment after his last conversation with Rei III and her untimely death. I think there are some interesting scenes that might highlight what ultimately led to Shinji's change:

-There is a scene where Shinji is sitting in the farm fields and the smell of dirt reminds him of his conversation with Kaji when planting watermelons about the good in this world and how pain is natural.
- His previous conversation with Rei III that snapped him out of his initial despondence. The way she says 'because we like you' seems to reveal to Shinji the faith people place on him and how his negative perceptions were false.
-when fighting with Gendo in the Antiuniverse, there is a flashback of Kensuke, Toji, and Rei III, which leads to Shinji putting down his weapon and start talking to his father.
-Shinji's final conversation with Rei III, where she details her own personal growth and fondness for Shinji

Overall, the scenes where Shinji grows spiritually in the finale are not very prominent and you can only make guesses on what was the main event that led to his awakening. The farm segment focussed more on Rei rather than Shinji and many of the characters actually left him alone rather than provide advice or encouragement. Perhaps time was the healing factor and after gaining perspective from his friends and witnessing Rei's death, Shinji learns that everything in life is a learning experience (I don't know :???: ).

In the end, the changes Shinji show include:
-self-sacrifice: by offering himself to be impaled by the spear to change the world, which is in direct contrast to his self-serving ambitions and people-pleasing ways
-responsibility: as noted by Gendo in the anti-universe train ride, he is willing to accept the sacrifice of others to carry on their plans
-determination: which contrasts with his hesitance with piloting the EVA throughout the series

From my own personal experience, we can't control who we are and what affects us. We can only choose to open our hearts to what matters (God, family, love, responsibility) and allow it to motivate us, letting the work and grace flow through naturally. After watching Rebuild, this reinforced my feelings for growth and I experienced some more maturation of my own, and the only way I was able to sustain it was by reflecting on the good and Holy parts of my life that built the foundations to my new perceptions.
"Everything is permissible, but not everything is beneficial. Everything is permissible but not everything is constructive." - 1 Corinthians 10:23

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Derantor » Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:19 am

This is actually an interesting topic, and I'd like to hear other peoples opinions on it. Because personally, I see very little development on Shinji's part, and nothing that makes intuitive sense. He saw Kaworu die and that made him catatonic. Then, still in the depths of depression, he sees Rei6 go splat, but instead of traumatizing him further, it has the opposite effect, and he suddenly has no problem at all facing Gendo. So, uh ... has he crossed the despair event horizon enough times to come back out in healthy-land?

Silly pet theory of mine is that he simply suffered a psychotic break and has gone insane, and that's why he's so calm about everything.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby The18°angel » Fri Dec 10, 2021 9:14 am

View Original PostDerantor wrote:This is actually an interesting topic, and I'd like to hear other peoples opinions on it. Because personally, I see very little development on Shinji's part, and nothing that makes intuitive sense. He saw Kaworu die and that made him catatonic. Then, still in the depths of depression, he sees Rei6 go splat, but instead of traumatizing him further, it has the opposite effect, and he suddenly has no problem at all facing Gendo. So, uh ... has he crossed the despair event horizon enough times to come back out in healthy-land?

Silly pet theory of mine is that he simply suffered a psychotic break and has gone insane, and that's why he's so calm about everything.


so Shinji due to all his past traumas became a sociopath or a possible psychopath. And that would explain why he keeps calm when he sees Asuka die, I think at that point Shinji is simply ignoring everything that is not related to defeating gendo, which is why when they threaten to kill / injure him so that he does not pilot the eva, he is simply indifferent.

In fact, during the entire fight with gendo Shinji he was willing to fight and destroy every place that was once his home or that was important to him until he reached village 03 where it was the only moment where he really stopped ... And unit 01 demonstrates exactly how Shinji felt at that moment every time they change the place of fight, eva 01 roared in the same way as it did when entering berserk mode and each one showed for an instant that the eva was becoming more savage and violent each time.

There is also the fact that in the end, since Shinji is in full control of the impact, he remembered each previous loop in the same way that kaworu is aware of the other repetitions.

I imagine that in the end Shinji applied the same way of thinking as Vaas montenegro from far cry 3.

"Insanity ... the definition of insanity is doing the same thing every time waiting for something to change ... that's the definition of insanity."

an ironic contrast to kaworu who basically told Shinji to just repeat the same things until he was happy in 3.0 during the piano duet.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Konja7 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 9:29 am

View Original PostThe18°angel wrote:an ironic contrast to kaworu who basically told Shinji to just repeat the same things until he was happy in 3.0 during the piano duet.


The point of Kaworu is to repeat in order to understand what you are doing wrong and correct it. That is the way musicians learn to play musical instruments and correct their mistakes (until they are happy with the song).

The problem is that Kaworu (and Shinji too) failed to understand what they are doing wrong. In 3.0+1.0, Shinji finally understood it and could correct it

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby The18°angel » Fri Dec 10, 2021 9:52 am

View Original PostKonja7 wrote:
The problem is that Kaworu (and Shinji too) failed to understand what they are doing wrong. In 3.0+1.0, Shinji finally understood it and could correct it


true that musicians repeat mistakes until they are happy with the song. but I was referring more to the fact that kaworu has been doing exactly the same thing for an indefinite time and has not managed to change anything and the reason why he likes Shinji so much is that he does not change and remains the same every time.

and the real problem with Shinji is that his mistakes always involve death and the apocalypse ... which leaves a very small margin to "repeat things until happy" for Shinji whereas for kaworu it doesn't really matter if he fails or not in a loop ... he has thousands more to keep practicing and after all those loops he still can't solve the problem. there is a serious implication that kaworu has been doing the same thing each time looking for something to change ... and that is what I say about insanity.

and Shinji can't really understand the problem to fix it in 3.0 because he basically doesn't know about the problem in the first place.

the movie ends with mari yelling at Shinji to learn how the world works and with Asuka taking him to the lillims ... Shinji literally couldn't understand the problem in 3.0 because he didn't really know anything except vague details or a very small part of the information.

It is as if someone gave you the weight of a brick and asked you to calculate the weight of a skyscraper.

You lack very important information to make that calculation and being able to be successful with just that information is like winning the lottery.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby EvaChero » Fri Dec 10, 2021 10:11 am

I agree with the Zero to Hero statement for rebuild.... I think for me the main difference is it feels like after the death of Kaworu there is a grace period where he gets to think things through....self-examination maybe...and then slowly while watched over by friends and without imminent endless trauma he comes out of it and starts to live again. This is in stark contrast to "EOE" where he personally pops the head off of his new friend and then goes on to experience one trauma after another until there is just about a complete mental shutdown. That's just my own take.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Konja7 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 11:43 am

View Original PostThe18°angel wrote:true that musicians repeat mistakes until they are happy with the song. but I was referring more to the fact that kaworu has been doing exactly the same thing for an indefinite time and has not managed to change anything and the reason why he likes Shinji so much is that he does not change and remains the same every time.

and the real problem with Shinji is that his mistakes always involve death and the apocalypse ... which leaves a very small margin to "repeat things until happy" for Shinji whereas for kaworu it doesn't really matter if he fails or not in a loop ... he has thousands more to keep practicing and after all those loops he still can't solve the problem. there is a serious implication that kaworu has been doing the same thing each time looking for something to change ... and that is what I say about insanity.

Kaworu is trapped in an eternal cycle (which we don't know how started) and he is pretty unhappy for that. Shinji is also trapped in the loop, so he has likely been trapped in the same mistake too (even if he is not aware).

I really doubt Kaworu tries to do the exact same thing. It's pretty likely that he has tried to change several things in order to achieve his goal of making Shinji happy.

The problem is that Kaworu doesn't understand that his wish to make Shinji happy is a problem in itself. Shinji needs to grow and find his own happiness by himself.

Also, although it's true that Kaworu likes the "vulnerable" Shinji, he's not against Shinji changing (that's why Kaworu accepts it pretty well in the Instrumentality). The problem is that Kaworu failed to see that Shinji changing would be necessary for Shinji to be happy.



View Original PostThe18°angel wrote:the movie ends with mari yelling at Shinji to learn how the world works and with Asuka taking him to the lillims ... Shinji literally couldn't understand the problem in 3.0 because he didn't really know anything except vague details or a very small part of the information.

The point of 3.0 isn't the lack of information. In fact, Shinji doesn't have a lot more information in 3.0+1.0.

Mari yelling at the end of 3.0 is because Shinji has a centrist behaviour (the mistake he always repeat). In 3.0+1.0, Shinji finally stop his centrist behaviour.

In 3.0, Shinji tries to repair the World, because he wants to escape pain and guilt, that's why he is punished at the end. Instead, in 3.0+1.0, Shinji wants to repair the World, because he wants to help others, that's why he gets his goal.
Last edited by Konja7 on Fri Dec 10, 2021 1:56 pm, edited 6 times in total.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby pwhodges » Fri Dec 10, 2021 11:50 am

Things is, wanting to help others yourself is also in a sense self-centred. At the end of 2.0 Shinji tries to save Rei; obviously, he wants Rei back as a companion for himself, but that doesn't preclude wanting Rei to be back for her own sake.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Konja7 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 12:03 pm

View Original Postpwhodges wrote:Things is, wanting to help others yourself is also in a sense self-centred. At the end of 2.0 Shinji tries to save Rei; obviously, he wants Rei back as a companion for himself, but that doesn't preclude wanting Rei to be back for her own sake.


It's implied that Shinji has an impulsive "selfish" wish in 2.0. That's why Shinji says he doesn't care what will happen to the World if he could save Rei.

In 3.0, it also has a similar impulsive selfish wish that makes him to takes the Spears. In this case, because Shinji wants to escape pain and guilt.

In 3.0+1.0, Shinji's intentions are more selfless. Sure, he wants to help his friends, but he also wants to help the World. Also, he doesn't want to escape the guilt and pain anymore.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby The18°angel » Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:40 pm

View Original PostKonja7 wrote:
In 3.0, it also has a similar impulsive selfish wish that makes him to takes the Spears. In this case, because Shinji wants to escape pain and guilt.

In 3.0+1.0, Shinji's intentions are more selfless. Sure, he wants to help his friends, but he also wants to help the World. Also, he doesn't want to escape the guilt and pain anymore.


Do you realize then that the only difference between 3.0 and 3.0 + 1.0 is that Shinji was on the side of the "good guys" seeing it that way. because basically kaworu's plan was to alter reality using magic powers with spears and an impact and that is exactly what happens in 3.0 + 1.0.

only now Shinji is allowed to change reality because he will no longer "run away" from his responsibility / guilt / pain and my favorite because he intends to commit suicide to make it happen. He literally went from "selfish piece of shit" to such extreme altruism that he wanted to kill himself to save the world (something that was ironically selfish because guess what, one can be altruistic and at the same time selfish) after he "fixed" the world using the same magical powers he was punished for in 3.0.

The truth is, I feel that to make Shinji's arc made sense, it should have been explored in another format that was not the last movie because in the end things happen too quickly and I personally can't help but wonder if Shinji in the end, just closed himself from the wolrd and focused only on the goal of stopping gendo and saving the world after the death of Rei Q.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Konja7 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 3:25 pm

View Original PostThe18°angel wrote:Do you realize then that the only difference between 3.0 and 3.0 + 1.0 is that Shinji was on the side of the "good guys" seeing it that way. because basically kaworu's plan was to alter reality using magic powers with spears and an impact and that is exactly what happens in 3.0 + 1.0.


In 3.0, the idea of using magic powers (and even an Impact) to repair the World wasn't a bad thing. The bad thing was that Shinji still tries to escape from guilt and pain.

In 3.0+1.0, Shinji stopped escaping from the pain; therefore, he had the strength to face Gendo and take control from the Instrumentality.

3.0 and 3.0+1.0 seems to focus on Shinji's personal emotions and growth. As someone mentioned to me, all problems are solved once Shinji dares to face Gendo.


PS: I know that there were interpretations about 3.0 that using an Impact to repair the world was a bad thing, but 3.0+1.0 seems to prove that this was not the intention from the writers.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Axx°N N. » Fri Dec 10, 2021 7:42 pm

Personally, I don't see anything heroic about Shinji or the mindset he appears to be exemplifying.

The thesis of NTE strikes me as screenwriter's desperation. There was no way to make Evangelion feel more conclusive than it's ever been without ending it on a so there, even if it's undeserved. There was no more a sense of finality to reach than shelving the characters, even if it reduced them as a handful of bad repetitive traits or disappeared them literally from the screen and from their own continuity. But even more than that, I can't help but play armchair psychologist and wonder if it's more ideology and neurosis than philosophy on the part of the writer(s): "I have arranged around me all the things I think are good and make me happy, avoided all the things I think are bad and that harm me, things have to be good." I myself have been on the receiving end of epiphanies that I wake up from eventually if not immediately, so I uderstand the desire to just be done with even the concept of struggle. The thing is, it may seem like grace for now, but it's like the difference between knowledge and wisdom: it ceases to be grace a couple moments later when it becomes complacency.

Now, I agree very much with the necessity of grace, and it's entirely true that when one unburdens themselves of unhelpful striving, worry, paranoia, desiring, obsession, etc. that things often show their truer colors. Shinji rightfully stops himself from dwelling on negativities rooted in misunderstanding or outright ignorance. But NTE goes a step too far and seems to wish to switch the stage light off of capital n Negativities in toto, almost as if it's all part of the same package that must be disposed of, when in reality one must face certain prevailing negatives and walk through trials by fire in order to do anything of actual heroism. I might be making an assumption in saying that it feels like NTE is suggesting Shinji & Mari will waltz smiling eternally or that Misato will farm forever in peace, but NTE withholds any semblance of followup anyway. Shinji has given up his attachments, righted his mental and physical association to others, and cleared his mind--what now? He runs off toward Ube, but what might he think of the makeup of the city underneath the catchy pop tune? What about the (very much still there) daily sorrows of its dwellers? Does he care about anything of tangible effect, like pollution and governmental corruption? What does his newfangled sense of how to interact with others look like, outside an eager tone of voice and quips about big boobs? It's just like the third village, and the way the narrative draws a convenient border around the village's development right before the point of any problems manifesting from within--there's no crime, there's no in-fighting, there's no feeling that they'll ever get big enough to face the return of, say, wealth disparity and bloody union struggle ... in fact, it even feels like the thesis here is "there's no bad people here, so everything will work out dandy anyway," and the blame lies only past the border, in the plot contrivance of the apocalypse and the man who doesn't hug his son enough.

The problem isn't only that we're withheld from seeing the application of the supposed grace, the beforehand argument to the thesis is also incoherent.

To set up Shinji's heroism, a contrast is established between his selfishness in 2.0 and his lack of knowledge and failed redo in 3.0 against his selflessness, attained knowledge and successful redo in 3.0+1.0. But the selfishness made even less sense than his heroism. I can't remember what user said it, nor the thread it was said in (forgive me!) but it went like this: "Blaming Shinji for the impact is a bit like blaming someone for causing a house fire because a faulty device they bought erupted while they slept." There's absolutely no way Shinji could comprehend what he was doing in the moment, nor that it could destroy so many lives. Gendo is the one who knowingly, willingly has been seeking catastrophic impact events. Rei's attraction to Shinji was something scientists put into her neurons. It makes zero sense for other characters or himself to place blame on his shoulders, not even when viewed through the lense of Japanese cultural differences about blame, because he merely isn't the correct target. And as for Asuka blaming him to the point of needing to apologize, it's like blaming someone risking their life to save you because the floor falls out from underneath them in an inferno, but replace inferno, of course, with manning a giant pseudo-human against a nebulous foreign entity when your father has programmed an override into your console, and also you're fourteen.

Comparisons aren't needed, but I much prefer the treatment of the tragedy of Shinji killing Kaworu in NGE. The situation is unavoidable, and although Shinji is upset and questions what he could have done differently, Misato's coldness is realistic in the moment--it's realistic because it's not desired, but it's also not without sympathy. It's a sad, uncomfortable, human moment that makes sense in its thought pattern. Despite what NTE tries to posit, not everything in life can be resolved by an attitude change or different approach--there are lingering discomforts that can't truly be done away with, especially misfortunes of the past. I also greatly prefer the overall thesis of EoE--I don't agree, as someone said above, that Shinji suffers a mental break and that's it. The conclusion to his dialogue with himself, with Rei, Kaworu and with his mother is that pain can't be done away with, it or its foretelling will occur again no matter what, but the pain is worth the destination it leads you toward, and anyway, you can't go anywhere without overcoming it to its various degrees each time. Not only does that ring true to me on its own accord, the arguments leading there pan out as arguments.

The wrong finger is on the wrong pulse in NTE, also, in the case of the way NTE suggests social connection and understanding as solution. You can't reduce genocide (ala Gendo) down to a man who didn't hug his son enough, or wasn't open enough with people--despots in real life, in fact, form extremely intimate social circles around themselves. That's how they build their reach, infamy, and get to the point where they can commit atrocities. They give people a sense of belonging and community. They use (and abuse) positive feelings. And frankly, the psychological process to be able to live with oneself in that situation is exactly what Shinji arrives at--you just turn off or do away with what causes cognitive dissonance and focus on the positives. Shinji localizes suffering (much like a scapegoat, the oft-useful tool of regimes) to Eva units themselves. Ridding them does most of the work needed, repositioning his relationships with his friends does the rest. But his friend's problems, unless they're humans as neatly composed as a math problem, surely can't be resolved that easily. There must be deeper issues or features of themselves that were the cause, instead of being caused by, these more surface level behaviors and attachments: I just don't buy that they're resolved simply because Kaworu vows to no longer try to make Shinji happy, or Asuka merely lodges with a different dude.

Shin attempts to completely break the continuity of suffering and treat it as plain cause and effect, crafting effigies out of thin air, but there's no heroism if you're granting yourself a win against an imagined threat. Platitudes are not victories.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Konja7 » Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:35 pm

View Original PostAxx°N N. wrote:Shinji localizes suffering (much like a scapegoat, the oft-useful tool of regimes) to Eva units themselves. Ridding them does most of the work needed, repositioning his relationships with his friends does the rest. But his friend's problems, unless they're humans as neatly composed as a math problem, surely can't be resolved that easily. There must be deeper issues or features of themselves that were the cause, instead of being caused by, these more surface level behaviors and attachments: I just don't buy that they're resolved simply because Kaworu vows to no longer try to make Shinji happy, or Asuka merely lodges with a different dude.


Shinji isn't dissapearing all their friends problems. I don't think the story tries to imply this.

Shinji is just freeing Asuka, Rei and Kaworu from the things that made the miserable (the "curse" for Asuka, the Eva for Rei and the eternal loop for Kaworu). The point is to give these characters a chance for a fresh start.

Asuka will still have her emotional problems when she returns to the Earth, but she won't need to handle these alone.

Kaworu and Rei are a complicated case, because we don't know what happened with them after that. However, the point was that both characters are finally willing to move on.

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Postby Axx°N N. » Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:58 pm

View Original PostKonja7 wrote:Shinji isn't dissapearing all their friends problems. I don't think the story tries to imply this.

Shinji is just freeing Asuka, Rei and Kaworu from the things that made the miserable (the "curse" for Asuka, the Eva for Rei and the eternal loop for Kaworu). The point is to give these characters a chance for a fresh start.

I'm not sure I see the difference. Shinji's heroism is attained through his decision to stop wallowing, and he only gets to reality-bending powers by confronting his father and helping him to the same place. That's the root of the heroism and the product of it as reward. If that's not what the story wanted to imply, he wouldn't have wished anything away or talked anyone out of anything, nor would the narrative avoid showing anyone exhibiting emotional problems afterward, which it unilaterally does. And I don't disagree, the point is clearly fresh starts and a willingness to move on, my issue was the framework around that point.
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Postby Derantor » Sat Dec 11, 2021 7:33 am

So, uh - has anybody gone through Shinji's scenes and tried to compile all the hints of what might be going through his head? What are peoples opinions on how his journey plays out, step by step? I called my theory that he simply suffers a psychotic break silly for a reason, but does anybody have a better one? I haven't spent much time on NTE!Shinji yet, so, is there justification for his behaviour/growth? Seems so far that nobody has a clear answer, and most people agree that his change is handled offscreen/comes without buildup, it's just that some people see that as a flaw and other's don't. But what's actually happening to Shinji? What are the hints that there's something more going on than "... and then he changed his mind" ? I'd really like to hear answers here, as that also seems to be the thread topic.

Edit: "In 3.0, the idea of using magic powers (and even an Impact) to repair the World wasn't a bad thing."
If 3.0 made one thing clear, it's that "Impact = Bad". The whole conflict of the movie boils down to: "shall Shinji pilot an eva, or shan't he?" The "Good guys" don't want him to pilot; the bad guys want him to. There's no functional difference between Shinji piloting, Shinji pulling spears out of things or Shinji causing an Impact. That even holds true in Shin: blatant wish-fulfillment magic akin to what Gendo & Kaworu like to do finds its contrapoint in Misato's idea that it's human will which can bring about lasting and positive change. Her spear embodies the will of humanity. Contrast to Cassius and Longinus, the spears of "Hope and Despair." Misato says "forget hope and despair, change things through your will." So, not vague emotional reasons like hope&despair, but reasoned, determined effort. Willpower. Mental strength instead of desperation. Hope and despair aren't exactly opposites: both things mean you resign yourself to your fate. "I hope things will be better. I can't change anything, so I'll just hope for the best" is a statement of faith, just as "Everything is hopeless, there's no point anyway!" is an emotional reaction, not a reasoned attitude. It's the negative counterpart of hope. "I can't change anything, so I'll just accept whatever is coming."
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Konja7 » Sat Dec 11, 2021 8:53 am

View Original PostDerantor wrote:Edit: "In 3.0, the idea of using magic powers (and even an Impact) to repair the World wasn't a bad thing."
If 3.0 made one thing clear, it's that "Impact = Bad". The whole conflict of the movie boils down to: "shall Shinji pilot an eva, or shan't he?" The "Good guys" don't want him to pilot; the bad guys want him to. There's no functional difference between Shinji piloting, Shinji pulling spears out of things or Shinji causing an Impact. That even holds true in Shin: blatant wish-fulfillment magic akin to what Gendo & Kaworu like to do finds its contrapoint in Misato's idea that it's human will which can bring about lasting and positive change. Her spear embodies the will of humanity. Contrast to Cassius and Longinus, the spears of "Hope and Despair." Misato says "forget hope and despair, change things through your will." So, not vague emotional reasons like hope&despair, but reasoned, determined effort. Willpower. Mental strength instead of desperation. Hope and despair aren't exactly opposites: both things mean you resign yourself to your fate. "I hope things will be better. I can't change anything, so I'll just hope for the best" is a statement of faith, just as "Everything is hopeless, there's no point anyway!" is an emotional reaction, not a reasoned attitude. It's the negative counterpart of hope. "I can't change anything, so I'll just accept whatever is coming."


In 3.0+1.0, Shinji still uses the power of an Impact to repair the World. I think this implies the interpretation "Impact = Bad" isn't really correct in Rebuild movies.

The "good guys" are pretty scared, because they fear the consequences. They don't even know what will happen when Shinji takes the Spears (Asuka fears the Third Impact will start again). At the end, they're right about the dangerous situation, because Gendo has changed the Spears.

That said, "Willpower" is really important in this story. The lack of "Willpower" is one of the reasons why Shinji's goal of repair the World in 3.0 was doomed, since he wants to depends on others and tries to escape the guilt (the reason why Shinji took the Spears even in the face of Kaworu's refusal).

That's why I said 3.0 and 3.0+1.0 focus so much on Shinji's emotions and grow. Shinji's emotional state is decisive for the story.


PS: Curiously, a Shinji with mental strength could even turn a Spear of Longinus in a Spear of Cassius in 3.0+1.0.

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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby kuribo-04 » Sat Dec 11, 2021 11:18 am

The entire first half of the film is about how life goes on, people persevere, and will lend you a hand when you are down. Shinji regains hope, and the actual will to protect those he cares for. It isn't about himself, and I think that's where his sense of calmness comes from.

I like that it is all more subtle than we're used to with Shinji. Almost the opposite of the inner monologues in NGE.

Also I think Asuka's confession probably played a role too.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Derantor » Sat Dec 11, 2021 4:26 pm

@kuribo-04: Could you make that concrete? How exactly does Shinji regain hope? When was he actually lent a hand, beyond food? Sure, Kensuke goes fishing with him, and he catches nothing. Where exactly is his confidence coming from?

I think this implies the interpretation "Impact = Bad" isn't really correct in Rebuild movies.

Yeah, you're right - "Impacts = good if we are the ones doing them" would probably be more accurate. I guess we can go on from here to debate whether or not Misato & Shinji thought they were stopping the Impact or were aware that they were highjacking it, but I really want to hear about Shinji's journey first.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby pwhodges » Sat Dec 11, 2021 6:02 pm

View Original PostDerantor wrote:Where exactly is his confidence coming from?

Observation, reflection, and understanding. These things can happen slowly and quietly, and there's no need to exaggerate them in the film to help the viewers.
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Re: Shinji's personal development in Rebuild: zero to hero?

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Postby Derantor » Sat Dec 11, 2021 6:11 pm

Then please take over the role of the movie and help me; explain to me how it happened in Shinji's case. If these things aren't exaggerated, I guess they're still there in non-exaggerated form? I literally don't see it, that's why I keep asking for specifics. I really want an answer here. :uhh:

(And as an aside, speaking from personal experience: sitting around and doing nothing does not boost your confidence, no matter how long you're at it. Edit: You wrote a whole post-Q story about that, where his development made sense. Part of that was actually doing something which builds his confidence, to get him out of the hole he couldn't climb out of on his own. And that wasn't exaggerated, either.)
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