Original Asuka

[BernardoCairo]

Again, I decided to merge these threads (Original Asuka + So why was Asuka a clone? What happened to the original?), as they were very similar to each other. Don't worry, I reworked both topics to work together.

[Konja7]

We've never what happened with Original Shikinami, right?

In the Instrumentality, we could see all the other people inside the Evas, but Original Shikiniami doesn't appear again. We don't even see her dissapear.


A theory: Could Original Shikinami be the Asuka in the Epilogue?

Shinji never focuses his eyes on her during the Epilogue.

[Archer]

In the train station thread, I do bring up the possibility that if “our” Asuka was explicitly shown to be returned to the main universe, perhaps the “original” Asuka (who is presumably still inside Unit-2, which is how she was able to manifest to “our” Asuka) was left in the new universe. That would also be a good justification for why she’s in the scene but is the only one he doesn’t carefully look at.

[Raikyu]

I think that "Original Shikinami" is inside Eva-13, not Unit-02.

[BernardoCairo]

Once again, I decided to merge these threads (Original Asuka + What happened with original Shikinami?), as they were very similar to each other. From now on, if you have any questions about "Original Asuka" and how she relates to Shikinami being a clone, please use this general thread

[Ah Q]

Wrong. Watch the plugsuits... In the final scenes when Shinji confronts Asuka on the beach, she wears the original NGE plugsuit. One she wore only in the TV show. Ever since she appeared in rebuilds, she wore the suit with two diamonds on the collar. The Asuka on the beach is Soryu. The connection to of rebuilds to the original is there, but I can't make heads or tails of it. This movie is one hot mess, and I doubt that anyone but Anno will be able to make heads or tails of it.

I don't think that's Soryu. It's Shikinami. More specifically, I believe, it's the Shikinami clone who has served as "our" Asuka throughout NTE.

During this part of the movie, we're still in the Anti-Universe, where (per Gendo's explanation) "the LCL has created a virtual environment" based on Shinji's "memories." But Shinji seems to be picking up "memories" from other continuities / loops. For example, at one point we see Shinji and Kaworu at the angel statue from NGE Episode 24, and Shinji says he "now remember[s]" having met Kaworu there "many times before." That never happened in the NTE continuity.

Shinji seems to have gained a memory of the EoE beach, and the LCL uses that memory to create a "virtual environment" of that beach to host this conversation between Shinji and Asuka. The fact that Asuka appears in the NGE plugsuit does not, in my opinion, mean we are encountering Soryu. The Asuka we see is grown -- reflecting the mental age of Shikinami. Notably, in the very next scene, we see that Shikinami's physical body has been "aged up" in the Eva-13 plug.

(Another possible indication that memories from EoE are bleeding over into the NTE continuity in the Anti-Universe: Gendo tells Shinji, "I chose a world that you refused. A world where there are no A.T. fields, where humanity shares one heart and mind equally." But when did Shinji "refuse" that world? It doesn't seem to describe anything Shinji did in NTE. But we know he rejected that version of Instrumentality in EoE.)

[aboose]

Shinji implies he has become able to perceive memories of every timeline and loop when he talks to Kaworu. Scenes from NGE also play in the background when he's talking to Rei.

When he encounters Shikinami on the EoE beach, he's projecting his own memories to create a landscape, but Shikinami there herself likely doesn't know the reference to Soryu at that moment. I don't think Soryu has any bearing on the actual plot happenings of NTE aside from Shinji being aware of this beach reference at the very end.

As far as "Original Asuka" (as in original Shikinami), she is one of the pilots of Unit 13 which requires two angel pilots. She is essentially a dummy plug pilot for unit 13 along with Kaworu, who is an angel. When new Shikinami goes angel berserk mode, she absorbs her into the plug to satisfy the requirement of an angel in each entry plug in the dual entry plug Unit 13 system.

[T. K. Simon]

The fact that only Rei, Gendo, Kaworu, and Shinji seem to be aware of loops (and realities) is because their soul is always the same in every story, thanks to the book of life, written by kaworu (at least Shinji). This could also explain why no one else seems to be aware of this, the beach scene eoe, it is a meta reference, Shinji might be aware of other realities and loops at the time, but Asuka seems not, original Shikinami might being like a Rei 1, not Soryu, the asukas could be different as they do not share the same soul in the Book of Life (they are not written the same way).

[RussianRiz]

I really didn't get that "Book of Life" thing. It's just too disruptive to me. I get that Kaworu talked about it and implied he wrote Shinji's name, but why do it matters to the other characters? They aren't aware of any of this.

My thoughts about the Sohryu x Shikinami problem are still a little broken, I'm thinking a lot about the topic, so... we see that there's not difference inside the anti-universe, so could this mean that a world created from there wouldn't also carry these differentiations? The new, adult Asuka, who is in the new world may very well be the representation of all Asuka, but following the continuity established in this film, that is, living with Kensuke (at least temporarily) and in Village 3. The scene in the station doesn't negate this continuity nor does it establish the creation of parallel worlds as it is a meta representation, the characters are not actually there, it just represents the continuity of life in a new way. The world we saw could easily exist by being only preserved from the destruction caused by the impacts and the curse of Eva.

[Konja7]

The fact that only Rei, Gendo, Kaworu, and Shinji seem to be aware of loops (and realities) is because their soul is always the same in every story, thanks to the book of life, written by kaworu (at least Shinji). This could also explain why no one else seems to be aware of this, the beach scene eoe, it is a meta reference, Shinji might be aware of other realities and loops at the time, but Asuka seems not, original Shikinami might being like a Rei 1, not Soryu, the asukas could be different as they do not share the same soul in the Book of Life (they are not written the same way).

I agree the names of Shinji being on thr Book of the Life is the reason why Shinji's soul is the same in every story of the loop.

Kaworu is trapped in a loop, so he shouldn't need to write Shinji's name in the Book of Life to find a Shinji. However, Kaworu would want to make the Shinji he knows happy.

That said, it's only mentioned that Kaworu wrote Shinji's name in the Book of Life. There isn't reason to think that he wrote other names or his own.

I really didn't get that "Book of Life" thing. It's just too disruptive to me. I get that Kaworu talked about it and implied he wrote Shinji's name, but why do it matters to the other characters? They aren't aware of any of this.

It isn't really important to other characters. It's only important for Shinji and Kaworu (maybe Rei too), because they were on a loop (Kaworu was always aware and Shinji become aware in the Instrumentality).

In fact, it would only affect the Soryu/Shikinami debate if you consider NGE as part of the loop.

[T. K. Simon]

SPOILER: Show

The fact that only Rei, Gendo, Kaworu, and Shinji seem to be aware of loops (and realities) is because their soul is always the same in every story, thanks to the book of life, written by kaworu (at least Shinji). This could also explain why no one else seems to be aware of this, the beach scene eoe, it is a meta reference, Shinji might be aware of other realities and loops at the time, but Asuka seems not, original Shikinami might being like a Rei 1, not Soryu, the asukas could be different as they do not share the same soul in the Book of Life (they are not written the same way).

I agree the names of Shinji being on thr Book of the Life is the reason why Shinji's soul is the same in every story of the loop.

Kaworu is trapped in a loop, so he shouldn't need to write Shinji's name in the Book of Life to find a Shinji. However, Kaworu would want to make the Shinji he knows happy.

That said, it's only mentioned that Kaworu wrote Shinji's name in the Book of Life. There isn't reason to think that he wrote other names or his own.

I really didn't get that "Book of Life" thing. It's just too disruptive to me. I get that Kaworu talked about it and implied he wrote Shinji's name, but why do it matters to the other characters? They aren't aware of any of this.

It isn't really important to other characters. It's only important for Shinji and Kaworu (maybe Rei too), because they were on a loop (Kaworu was always conscious and Shinji become conscious in the Instrumentality).

In fact, it would only affect the Soryu/Shikinami debate if you consider NGE as part of the loop.

Why do I say gendo? There is a line where he tells Shinji that he chose something that he rejected himself, which would be implying nge / eoe, it could be that he saw other people and Shinji through the golgota, or his soul is the same in the book of life

Again, do not quote a entire post. Trim down on the relevante bit you want to adress. Quote put on inside a spoiler tag - JoelcrNeto

[x7x7x7]

Does anyone know why Asuka was shown to be aged during the Beach/Entry Plug scene?

[Konja7]

Does anyone know why Asuka was shown to be aged during the Beach/Entry Plug scene?

It's because Shinji has free Asuka from the Eva's curse. Also, Asuka gets an adult body, because that's the age she should have.

The scene in the Entry Plug happens in the reality.

[x7x7x7]

It's because Shinji has free Asuka from the Eva's curse. Also, Asuka gets an adult body, because that's the age she should have.

The scene in the Entry Plug happens in the reality.

The thing is that Mari isn't shown that she aged like Asuka during her beach scene, and both beach scenes play in the Anti-Universe to my knowledge.

[Kendrix]

Asuka was turned to LCL when she lost her battle (her suit and DSS choker are left behind)

Then she reconstituted herself from the LCL in EVA 13's entry plug, like when Shinji returned in episode 21 or at the beginning of Q.

I'm not even sure he did much more at this point than just give her consciousness a slight poke so she'd awake and go through her complementation journey.

To return from LCL you have to envision yourself, so, I'd expect that she returns as she is in her mind and heart (despite all the effed up stuff that happened to her body): Still very much quintessentially human and 28 years old.


In any case, the "neon genesis" should have overwritten the consequences of any evangelion-related fuckery, making all the artificial pilots into normal humans.

Mari never got tanged, nor does the transformation seem to have bothered as much. She even found some upsides to it, having more time to read books and learn languages etc. (though having Asuksa as a friend probably helped a lot with bearing the bad parts of it, judging by how she flips out when Asuka gets eaten)

[Heaven Piercing Man]

People who say "Shikinami is a clone of Soryu" are the same sequelists grasping at straws after their "3.0 Asuka is Soryu because the old plugsuit looks like a single cherrypicked frame of an Unit 02 diagram in Maya's laptop during EOE" theory didn't pan out.

[Akko]

What I wonder is if Original Asuka was the first clone or a genetically engineered baby and was programmed to follow Gendo's plan from the start or if she was just a normal girl that was groomed into this like a kid raised in a cult...

[Archer]

I was given the impression that the original Asuka was just a normal girl who the others were cloned from. After all, if they’re all clones who existed at the same time (unlike the Rei’s who for the most part there was only one of at any given time, barring the “advanced Ayanami series” who arguably aren’t even Rei’s but barely-human things inhabiting Rei bodies) then there isn’t much distinction to being the “original” clone.

[pathstrider]

Asuka was turned to LCL when she lost her battle (her suit and DSS choker are left behind)

Then she reconstituted herself from the LCL in EVA 13's entry plug, like when Shinji returned in episode 21 or at the beginning of Q.

I'm not even sure he did much more at this point than just give her consciousness a slight poke so she'd awake and go through her complementation journey.

Lurked for a while, made an account to say this makes a lot of sense to me.

In fact, you could sort of see it as Shinji returning the favour- it's possible that Asuka calling out to/berating him at the start of Q gave him the kick to reconstitute himself.

[Konja7]

Asuka was turned to LCL when she lost her battle (her suit and DSS choker are left behind)

Curiously, some people aren't sure if Asuka was really turned to LCL. We saw Asuka left her clothes, but someone say Original Shikinami takes Asuka's body intact (without clothes).