Are you referring to this one, from the commentary OP? Was this from an Orthodox church?

ObsessiveMathsFreak wrote:Are you referring to this one, from the commentary OP? Was this from an Orthodox church?

That's the one. I dunno where I got the idea that Zuggy had anything to do with that, except that he's aways posting weird old esoteric images...

The face on the Hagia Sophia Sammael looks more like some sort of Starfish than an owl face. And there ain't no core there either.

Speaking of which...did they really get the idea of a core from the tetramorph or did they just concoct it on the fly? Koukyuu or photosphere brings to mind a star, one of those 'inner universe' themes Anno is fond of.

I don't really see a "core" in the Tetramorph image.

UrsusArctos wrote:Are you saying that cute little Pen-Pen is an Angel?????? :Shock:

Don't you know your proper Eva Angel order and name-pronunciations? "The 19th Angel is...Pen-pen???" Just to quote this silly thing Reichu (I think it was??) had on her site.

NAveryW wrote:Does this mean that we're still going to call it Sammael, though? I've always thought it was kind of a jump to decide that it's Sammael simply because of the number of wings.

He's the only angel I'm aware of with twelve wings, and they probably added the six extra ones on purpose. I've also seen the figure referred to as "Lucifer" (ahem), without providing the "12 wings" justification.

OMF wrote:Whether the creature known as the Tetramorph itself was the actual base image is I think a matter needed further confirmation.

I don't think we're going to get it.

Ursus wrote:Speaking of which...did they really get the idea of a core from the tetramorph or did they just concoct it on the fly?

The core is just an established feature of the Angels, one decided early on. The basic concept, of the spherical or jewel-like object housing a being's life force, isn't a new one, but it isn't Judeo-Christian.

I have no convenient source links, but I have seen many medieval images of angels with multiple wings drawn in that manner, so it may just be a particular epoch's way of drawing angel wings instead of a reference to any particular angel.

Also, I thought that the number of wings corresponded to the "rank" of that particular angel, in which case Sammael/Lucifer having an inordinately large number (12) would make sense.

Reichu wrote:

Alaska Slim wrote:I thought it was Satan...

It is.

Oh... then I was obviously reading something wrong... 8)

ORAMI!? wrote:Also, I thought that the number of wings corresponded to the "rank" of that particular angel, in which case Sammael/Lucifer having an inordinately large number (12) would make sense.

Looking further, 12 isn't characteristic to Sammael/Satan* ("Lucifer" as a synonym is debatable), but the reference is made (beyond the Legends of the Jews one I mention in FGC) in the rather high-profile Revelation: he is “that great serpent with 12 wings that draws after him, in his fall, the solar system.”

Then, in the Standard Revised Edition lying around on the family bookshelf, the nearest thing resembling that quote goes, "that ancient serpent, who is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world -- he was thrown down to Earth, and his angels were thrown down with him", so I have no idea what is going on here. I'm about as far-removed from a Bible scholar as you can get, so I have no idea how the original Greek reads...

* I.e., the Chalkydri/Kalkydra.

Which other angels have 12 wings?

Okay, maybe I'm just being a little too sleepy, but I counted out the eyes of the angel in the OP, and there are exactly 25 eyes. idano if that does anything for anybody. 25....hmm, lol.

OOH! I found a picture of Sammael....drawn by Reichu..among other interesting pictures. wonderful gallery, had no idea you were an artist but -_- never mind!

wait...what was I trying to say...

why does sammael appear in the OP? I think I need to go to bed.

TheAyanamiOtaku wrote:why does sammael appear in the OP? I think I need to go to bed.

http://evacommentary.org/op/op_1.html#cut001b might be useful

I doubt it's the "tetramorph" -

1. There are ALWAYS four of them.
2. Each has four faces.
3. Each has four wings.
4. Each has a human body with brazen hoofs.
5. They are one part of the greater structure of the throne of God, none of which is shown in the opening credits.

Sometimes they show up in other forms tho'.

Shin-seiki wrote:Does anyone have that pic of Sammael from a church ceiling in eastern Europe that Zuggy (IIRC) posted a while back?

The only pic from a church I've posted is this one -

TheAyanamiOtaku wrote:Okay, maybe I'm just being a little too sleepy, but I counted out the eyes of the angel in the OP, and there are exactly 25 eyes. idano if that does anything for anybody. 25....hmm, lol.

There are 25 visible eyes, but one of them is covered up in the image, there are 26 eyes on it's wings in total!

25 and 26 have a few interesting numeric correspondences, none of them seem to go anywhere tho', except maybe 26 being the value KaBD, the husband of Lilith.

Zugzwang wrote:The only pic from a church I've posted is this one -

KILL IT! KILL IT WITH FIRE!

Zugzwang wrote:25 and 26 have a few interesting numeric correspondences, none of them seem to go anywhere tho

No, but 25' and 26' do.

Nice one, don't know why I didn't see that connection meself - problem is I can't see how else it connects to the last episodes other than like Shinji's SDAT player, as being a form of foreshadowing -

If you take the central pillar of Numbers on the Tree of Emanations, 1, 6, 9, 10 and add them up, it comes to 26!