Evangelion ANIMA (general)

For talking about all other entries in the Evangelion franchise: from the various manga and video games to merchandising and various video/audio releases.

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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Reichu » Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:55 pm

Problem is that Yamashita is a perv who didn't think his own ideas though completely, so the pilots aren't developing any Eva characteristics, just the other way around, even though sync goes in both directions. On top of that, the way sync works is that the higher it is, the more the pilot is overwhelmed by the Eva and just becomes part of the Eva. The relationship was never equal.

0% - no connection; Eva won't respond to pilot's mind at all
100% - ideal balance; pilot can exert precise control over the Eva body without the feedback from Eva threatening the pilot's sense of identity
400% - pilot's ego is dissolved by the Eva's

There is no "Eva turns into the pilot" aspect of this. Which makes sense, since sync has only ever been "put God-Mom in bondage and hope she loves you enough to let you borrow her body a bit". Yamashita is peak "using fancy words I don't understand the meaning of" -- he names his story after a Jungian concept, but I don't think he knows, or cares, about the actual psychoanalytical underpinnings of Eva and how it plays out in practice. Like, the Evas are a pretty blunt metaphor for things like the Devouring Mother, and the whole point is not to conquer this archetypal figure by devouring her instead, as Yamashita would have us think. It's to stop literally pouring your identity into your mom. Get out of the uterus and grow up.

On top of this, it only takes a quick look at Anima's illustrations to see that the bit about 00 and 02 getting girly figures because they have female pilots is not something he made any attempt to actually commit to. The "narrower shoulders, wider hips' altered proportions he uses in Anima? Pretty much all of the Evas are like that. (Maybe Wolfpac is the exception, because, I dunno, it's a dog or whatever.) Eva-01 has a girl ass. (The final form of 01 has such a girly ass that it looks like a female athlete in weird Eva-01 cosplay.) The zombie MP Evas have huge hips. The Torwarte have broad hips and narrow shoulders, and they're not even really Evas, they're just empty puppet-shells. Yamashita wanted to draw Evas with giant asses first and he inserted an excuse for it into the story later that doesn't withstand scrutiny at all.

On top of THAT, the Evas' souls are women. (Or at least Yamashita acknowledges that this was the case with pre-Super 01 and with 02.) Somehow this never turned the Evas into mechamusume. Eva-01 awakened and seized an infinite power supply for herself, but she didn't start sprouting tits. The Evas' own souls have -- putting Yamabullshit aside -- far, FAR more control over their bodies than the pilots' souls ever do. Asuka's big moment in EoE? Her mom is part-berserk the entire time; Asuka alone could never use Eva-02 like that. If the Evas' own souls, which lived as women, who gave birth and everything, don't make the Evas into tit-monsters, the pilots never would.
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby SEELE-01 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:03 pm

[sips a dangerous, electrolyte-imbalancing amount of unsee juice]

That is a biiiit out of my confort zone... I mean... I'm all for fanfiction (sanctioned or not) but that one... I dunno... Feels off... :uhh:
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby MarqFJA87 » Wed Aug 19, 2020 7:06 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Eva-01 has a girl ass. (The final form of 01 has such a girly ass that it looks like a female athlete in weird Eva-01 cosplay.)

You got a pic?

The zombie MP Evas have huge hips.

... The what now?

On top of THAT, the Evas' souls are women. (Or at least Yamashita acknowledges that this was the case with pre-Super 01 and with 02.) Somehow this never turned the Evas into mechamusume.

Technically, Eva 01 seemed to be turning into a "mechamusume" after Instrumentality was aborted. It sprouted a long, feminine-looking mane of hair.


That is a biiiit out of my confort zone... I mean... I'm all for fanfiction (sanctioned or not) but that one... I dunno... Feels off... :uhh:

Am I the only one here who has been thoroughly "desensitized" to such things by consuming a lot of bizarre/niche/non-mainstream hentai/ecchi/porn?
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Zusuchan » Wed Aug 19, 2020 7:50 pm

Am I the only one here who has been thoroughly ''desensitized'' to such things by consuming a lot of bizarre/niche/non-mainstream hentai/ecchi porn?

Well, I don't consume any kind of porn anyway, so there's that. But personally, the issue is less that the whole ''EVA's with breasts'' thing is bizarre and more that it's a decision that comes from a fundamental misunderstanding of the way Evangelions work (just one decision among dozens which come directly out of Yamashita never having seen any of Evangelion in the first place) and that it doesn't have any kind of a deeper meaning. It's just an empty, meaningless event, like basically ANIMA itself.

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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Reichu » Wed Aug 19, 2020 9:16 pm

Zusuchan: Technically Yamashita has watched at least as far as Magmadiver. (Source.) But yeah, I would be surprised if he ever got further than that...

MarqFJA87: Girl-ass Ultimate Eva-01 here: post/886376/Evangelion-ANIMA-general/#886376

Zombie MP Evas are the Angel Carriers.

I don't think the flaming hair on Eva-01 is meant to communicate that she grew boobs or anything. The head shape still looks like an Eva's (longer and narrower than a Lilin's -- vaguely raptorian), and the rest of the body is unchanged. Her foreshortened silhouette down to her feet is visible, and she still has the superficially "masculine" proportions. (I say superficially because the Evas are biologically non-Lilin -- human, yes, but not LILIN -- and secondary sexual characteristics are highly variable across species. From the POV of the FAR or something, Seeds/Evas could be their equivalent of the fertility goddess archetype.) The mane of fire seems to be a callback to the mysterious angelic being in the OP -- the flaming hair was the only feature of that entity which Eva-01 had yet to exhibit.
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby MarqFJA87 » Thu Aug 20, 2020 8:30 am

Well, that ass is definitely quite defined and rounded, that's for sure. Incidentally, is there a gallery that collects all of these images in one place?
"Our magic is not omnipotent. A little bit of courage is the true magic."
–Negi Springfield, Negima: Magister Negi Magi

"Where there is distress, therein lies a story. Where there is a story, therein lies a will. And wherever there is a will, therein lies a soul."
–Evangeline A.K. McDowell, Negima: Magister Negi Magi

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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Reichu » Thu Aug 20, 2020 9:04 am

I wouldn't be comfortable linking to such a source if there were -- as "qUaLiTy" as Anima is, the Japanese tankouban is still in print, and all five volumes can be purchased right now digitally, which will give you access to the illustrations in full color. Seven Seas also deserves a stipend for demystifying this stinker.

The true tragedy of Yamashita's compulsion to give Eva-01 such a big, shapely ass -- I seriously want to poke it -- is that he could have justified it simply by taking his story's title to its obvious conclusion. You're going to make Shinji merge with Eva-01 in a story called ANIMA? Seriously, Yamashita, this one's easy. Make the post-Super Eva version of Shinji a girl. Then you can draw Shinji with a giant, shapely ass, too! :devil:

last chapter  SPOILER: Show
The last chapter wastes this opportunity even more -- it has Eva's resident Giant Phallic Object the Spear of Longinus burrowing into Eva-01's abdomen, and Eva-01 is "reborn" in the same chapter, and yet somehow this does not involve Eva-01 giving birth to itself. Seriously, Yamashita, what the fuck? How do you screw up set-ups this obvious?
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Kendrix » Sun Nov 08, 2020 6:36 am

So I started reading it and my impression so far is that Yamashita was probably used to more visual mediums and should have hired or at least consulted a professional prose person.

There are actually a whole lot of thought-through cool concepts & potential for symbolism which could have the potential to be quite juicy if they were really dwellt upon, especially in the way the tech & 'functional magic' aspects of the battles are elaborated, but it reads a bit like "this happened and then that happened, oh look swaying hips" & we don't really get to stay in the places or to experience the events in detail.
You might describe it as a storyboard without the direction & voice acting, not uninteresting or without merit but it's not gonna vow anybody... and in the end ppl look at spinoffs etc cause they want to spend more time with the characters. This was something that for example Gakuen Datenroku did very well for all that the ending was kinda rushed, if you want to chill some more with Kaworu after you've all but memorized ep 24 or see the pilots not at each other's throats for a bit, it certainly does that.
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Blockio » Sun Nov 08, 2020 7:24 pm

I don't know how true this is, so take it with a grain of salt; I've been told that Anima started as Yamashita writing backstories for custom builds of other people in a modelling magazine, and the story tying them together was more or less an afterthought. Which, honestly, sounds pretty on point.
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Kendrix » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:40 pm

...great, now I've gotta wait for the last two volumes to be translated. -.-
They actually got in some nice moments towards the end there

The "hourglass planets" thing is probably not compatible with the canonverse FAR lore tho.
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Postby Blockio » Thu Nov 12, 2020 1:34 pm

There's a.... I don't want to say "prevailing" theory among the folks on the discord who did the deep dive into Anima before the English translation came out, that Yamashita didn't actually watch the last few episodes of the show, and just went off of cliffnotes instead, so lore not lining up is well and truly to be expected
I can see why Gendo hired Misato to do the actual commanding. He tried it once and did an appalling job. ~ AWinters
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Postby Kendrix » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:20 pm

I mean the FAR stuff can vaguely be deduced (from Fuyutsuki's comments about the White Moon in ep 21, for example, or Kaworu's talk with SEELE) but it's never stated outright, I don't think it would be obvious if you had seen the whole thing (and there's more than enough references to EoE), a lot is implied, vague etc.

In a way I feel reminded of the early days fanfiction where no one really knew what the deal was with Lillith & Adam (& would've had no access to translations of any supplemental materials), and FF authors were stuck having to make up the wildest stuff, which would vary greatly. That might be why they left the "cosmology" obscure in the first place, to stimulate ppls imagination.

I remember that one fanfic where it turned out that the angels were after Lillith cause she's their mom & they wanted to liberate her; Adam was basically the divorced dad who wouldn't follow the restraining order-
That one stuck in memory because there was posessed Zombie Gendo later in.
Also because the author clearly liked Asuka - they made their OCs be related to her, gave her over the top badass scenes etc. but then they actually gave her a super effed up ending. I barely remember what happened with the other pilots anymore.
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Postby Jäeger » Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:23 am

View Original PostBlockio wrote:There's a.... I don't want to say "prevailing" theory among the folks on the discord who did the deep dive into Anima before the English translation came out, that Yamashita didn't actually watch the last few episodes of the show, and just went off of cliffnotes instead, so lore not lining up is well and truly to be expected


And they really believe that shit?

About the guy whose hands have designed every mech in the whole franchise? Who started Anima YEARS after EOE?

People should stop overthinking
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Postby Blockio » Sun Dec 13, 2020 10:01 am

No, I'm inclined to agree. There are some plot points that very much do sound like he only got the broad story strokes from other people without actually having seen them himself
I can see why Gendo hired Misato to do the actual commanding. He tried it once and did an appalling job. ~ AWinters
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Postby Jäeger » Mon Dec 14, 2020 12:18 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:No, I'm inclined to agree. There are some plot points that very much do sound like he only got the broad story strokes from other people without actually having seen them himself


23 years after the closure of the original series? Hard to belive. There can only be one reason....

SPOILER: Show
In this continuity Asuka's mother is still alive. Catatonic, but alive


And it seems Yamashita at least watched EOE. This is from vol. 4, which arrived yesterday to my house.

SPOILER: Show
Image


And in this continuity never, absolutely never, let Shinji believe that

SPOILER: Show
Asuka has died

Screams of rage and blinded fury up to 11

In volume 2 almost engulfs himself, EVA 01 and Trois in flames

In, volume 4, he triggers the 3rd impact
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Blockio » Mon Dec 14, 2020 3:25 pm

I am well aware of the things that happen in Anima. I have not read them in full yet, but been given a detailed description months ago and am currently in the process of going through it firsthand myself.

the reason I say I believe that Yamashita has not watched Eva in full, or at least did not pay attention is because of this little passage here, among other htings
More had gathered than just the cage's crew. No one had believed that a living human could be reconstituted inside an Eva, and the news had spread quickly. Naturally people were curious to see

"No one had believed that a living human could be reconstituted inside an Eva"
As in, the thing that happens after Zeruel. An event that still is canon to Anima.

There's a few more headscratchers like this, but this is the best example in my opinion

EDIT: I found an old interview with him, from after he started writing Anima. He himself admits that he had not watched Eva in full at the point of starting to write the show.
EDIT 2: Correction - interview is from 2003, so before Anima, but still rather telling
Image
I can see why Gendo hired Misato to do the actual commanding. He tried it once and did an appalling job. ~ AWinters
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby MarqFJA87 » Mon Dec 14, 2020 8:06 pm

Oh wow, he actually admitted it.
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Postby cyharding » Mon Dec 14, 2020 8:24 pm

But you would think that the four years between that interview and when he started the series in 2007, he would have watched the show. I mean, he couldn't have been that busy.
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Re: Evangelion ANIMA (general)

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Postby Blockio » Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:21 pm

I mean, you would also think that the guy who designed all of the Evas would have seen the entire show, so I'm not sure that can be said for certain here :P
I can see why Gendo hired Misato to do the actual commanding. He tried it once and did an appalling job. ~ AWinters
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Postby Jäeger » Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:31 am

View Original PostBlockio wrote:I mean, you would also think that the guy who designed all of the Evas would have seen the entire show, so I'm not sure that can be said for certain here :P


MP Evas included. So, yeah, It`s weird. And as I've posted at least he knows what EOE is about.

It could be worse. Anima is a wacky "do as you whish" sequel.....Sadamoto's manga was an adaptation and never understood neither the characters (my god, Asuka & Kaworu), neither their relationships o even the story (that awful 3I or Gendo's destiny). Come on, last volumes were shameful. I know it's not gonna be a popular opinion, but I don't regret it

About Anima vol.4, quite enjoyable if your deep in this shit. And a tender conclusión for this book. Now it takes 7 months to get the conclusion....

Ahh, and it's pretty obvious which girl Yamashita likes the most.....
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