Eva Piloting as Job/Art metaphor

[Kendrix]

A lot of the show focuses not only on the character's relationships with each other, but also on those they have with their roles/places in the world- For the younger characters, that role is one of an EVA pilot.
Shinji, in particular, is oftem contemplating why the fuck he is doing this.
EVA's creator has once stated that EVA is the story of his life, but told as a metaphor, noting that he wasn't thrown away by his father or anything.
He obviously wasn't a mecha pilot, either.
In-universe, the Mechs can sometimes be seen as extensions of the pilots, or as stand ins for their mothers, but there's also another element about them, one that becomes most evident if one watched EoTV - it focuses a lot on the Children's, particulary Shinji's motivations for piloting and their relationships to it. If you substitute "EVA" with school/job/whatever, you get the types of persons our society produces, for example, Asuka being one of these people who want to be popular and aren't satified with anything but excellence - they are very common.
Shinji in particular always wonders about his reasons and asks others for theirs, so this must be an important point, right? It can't be related to actual giant robots, but it is something he has to do - sure, no one forces him, he can leave, but that means he loses everything he has built for himself... And Shinji's catchphrase (Instilled into him by Gendo, as seen in ep 16) "I must'n run away"?
If you've read "What are we trying to make here", you know that this was the very thought that motivated Anno to step forwards and try to make a new Anime after other projects had failed and he spent a few years brooding. The thought "I must'n run away" - run away from what? His job of course, his work... NGE itself.
A person's school/work, where harsh, unfair things can happen (like in the EVa battles) and where one is forced to work together with certain others, which can be both a chance and a hardship.
i think Anno himself once discribed his Art as a means of communication (The documentary with em kids)

I think the various pilot characters represent different reasons why people go foward in their roles in society And the story, especially EoTV, but really all of the story offers answers to ppl with that motivations/ to the problems they might have... - because few ppl in RL actually do their job "for the good of everyone"... Let's take a look at the different motivations for filling one's space as productive member of society/working/producing Art that we are presented:

- For Praise/To be accepted by oneself and others/ feel like you're useful/needed (Shinji)
- To stay with the people/social circle one has established for oneself (Shinji)
- To prove oneself before oneself and others/draw worth from it (Asuka)
- To differenciate yourself from the mass/be special/prove you exist (Asuka)
- To connect with others (Rei)
- Because your connections/the circumstances of your life force you to/make it necessary (Rei)
- Because you think it's all you have/the one thing you can do right (All three)
- Because it is your Duty/others depend on you (Touji) - He's doing it for his sister. In normal real life, this would be someone who has to feed a family
- As means to an End (Kaworu) - He enters NERV to get close to Adam/the EVA Pilots. In real life, this would be someone doing a job so he can spend his money on their quality time/free time.
- Because of intellectual fascination/personal interests (Kaworu) - He's inrested in the PPL at Nerv and asks himself philosophical questions about the EVAs. This would be someone becomming a biologist because they're interested in biology and/or admires a famous biologist
- Because one enjoys their job/art/etc. (Mari)
- To feel liberated/be oneself/live out certain sides of oneself (Mari) - She is notably different inside of an entryplug, being away from the "domestic" life allows her to do weird stuff like walking up to ppl to sniff at them - this aspect may become even more evident/important if they use the once intended idea of her having had a strict upbringing where she had to hide her ideosyncracies/live them out at home.

What do you guys think?

[C.A.P.]

Good theory, but I don't think Anno and the guys had this idea at all while they were making the show (they were too busy making the best dang giant mecha anime that stood out of the crowd after all). Sure, it might of been in their subconscious, but if they were aware of this, they would of probably hammer that point much more directly than they actually did.

[Sachi]

I can definitely see where you draw the parallels, but I disagree with your implications. The interpretation is valid, but that's about as far as it goes; it's a stretch to say the creators had this in mind.

However, I really like this, and it's probably the most valid thing you said:

Shinji in particular always wonders about his reasons and asks others for theirs, so this must be an important point, right? It can't be related to actual giant robots, but it is something he has to do - sure, no one forces him, he can leave, but that means he loses everything he has built for himself... And Shinji's catchphrase (Instilled into him by Gendo, as seen in ep 16) "I must'n run away"?
If you've read "What are we trying to make here", you know that this was the very thought that motivated Anno to step forwards and try to make a new Anime after other projects had failed and he spent a few years brooding. The thought "I must'n run away" - run away from what? His job of course, his work... NGE itself.

[katastroff]

Piloting Evangelion isn't really a metaphor for a job. It IS a job and associated with everything around a job (work, professionalism, pride, success/failure, praise, balance, etc.). This isn't really much of an argument. Not to say your ideas aren't valuable or significant to the work. But they should be apparent pretty quickly for anyone watching the series.

I'd ignore bringing points in like "Anno was/said this/that..." and rather, interpret using support from the piece itself. Same goes for points used against a theory. I don't view perceptions of who the creators are as holding major significance over what the piece itself provides. The meaning of any piece of art or literature doesn't belong to the creators once it gets published; the meaning is public.

[C.A.P.]

I'd ignore bringing points in like "Anno was/said this/that..." and rather, interpret using support from the piece itself. Same goes for points used against a theory. I don't view perceptions of who the creators are as holding major significance over what the piece itself provides. The meaning of any piece of art or literature doesn't belong to the creators once it gets published; the meaning is public.

So by that logic, we should ignore comments from the people that made the product itself, that can help us clarify moments of the series, and instead bring in that "Death of an Author" theory, instead of mixing a right balance of both?

Fine by me. Expect my theory that Misato killed Kaji pretty soon then.

[Eva Yojimbo]

I'm rather surprised by the lack of support for this since this is one of the oldest and most widely accepted interpretations (granted, it hasn't been brought up in a long time, so it's fine to revisit it). I always thought it was quite clear that Anno's apprehension about making anime, about using the very medium he used to escape from reality to create another escapist fantasy that would then become a piece about not using fantasy to escape reality, created a very obvious parallel between the pilots who both wanted to run away from their reality, from their "job" of piloting mechas, while also using the Evas as a means of escape and self-worth. It's a bit of a catch-22 paradox. A pilot can face reality by piloting the Eva for the good for the good of humanity, or they can pilot to escape reality by returning to the womb and constructing their entire sense of self-worth from it. They can face reality by rejecting to pilot for righteous reasons (Shinji in ep. 19), or they can escape from reality by refusing to pilot for selfish reasons (Shinji in ep. 4).

It's an utterly circular relationship, and I can't help but think Anno didn't conscious realize this when he was dealing with his depression and disillusionment with anime and the Otaku culture. He had already created a reality for himself that involved working in the very medium he had begun to see the--for lack of a better word--dark side of. He saw the disconnect that such a thing created between a person and reality, or even between a person and themselves. He saw the, as he put it, self-imposed autism it engendered. But he couldn't no more completely give it up as he could indulge in it, because both were just differing forms of escape. So it seemed that the best solution was to become aware of this paradox, to create a kind of conscious balance that prevented you from going too far one way or the other. Throughout the series, Shinji can't seem to find a balance between running away and using his status as a pilot for the sole source of his sense of self-worth.

I'd ignore bringing points in like "Anno was/said this/that..." and rather, interpret using support from the piece itself. Same goes for points used against a theory. I don't view perceptions of who the creators are as holding major significance over what the piece itself provides. The meaning of any piece of art or literature doesn't belong to the creators once it gets published; the meaning is public.

I've said this a billion times around here, but it's as true now as ever: Artists have a right to define what they intended, but not what they created. In light of that, I think it's fine to listen to what they say and consider it, but doing so doesn't ipso-facto mean that they're correct. They're only correct if what they say actually matches what they see in the series. It just becomes another piece of evidence to consider, but not the be-all, end-all. I don't think the answer is to ignore it all together, but accepting it uncritically is just as bad, if not worse, because it gives artists free reign to say all kinds of crap that isn't true.

[Xard]

.....guys, I thought this had been long established thing.

Piloting Evangelion = directing anime is one of THE keys in understanding eva and it puts all of Shinji's bitching and moaning in his important job in perspective when one treats it as being humble anime director.

I remember some GAINAX vet making direct comparison: just like Gendo called Shinji to come to Tokyo-3 and pilot Eva GAINAX called on depressed Anno to direct new series while he was uncertain if he wanted to be a director/eva pilot in the first place. And just like Anno had natural talent in his job Shinji is noted as talented eva pilot, even though he doesn't particularly like it.

If we look at Anno's personal history and statements it's clear he never truly planned to end up in anime industry. He just drifted along and found himself there, never sure if this really was the thing he wanted to do. Just like Shinji.

In parallel however making anime WAS his one and only bond to other people and also source of self-worth as famous animator (there're some stories about Anno trying to hit on women in 80s by bringing up the fact he animated the God Warriro scene in Nausicaä, lol).

The episode 6 scene when Rei answers Shinji's question why does she pilot eva with that "It's a bond" with others the correct way to read the scene is Anno asking Anno why he directs anime. And the answer was that it was his bond to his friends in work and people at large. He didn't have anything else than his status as anime director during that part of his life.

Thus it isn't all that surprising that as Shinji learned to live without being eva pilot in the end Anno similarly tuned out of anime scene (and eventually from films too) to focus on other things.


I thought this was common apocrypha at this point. Apparently not.

[symbv]

(there're some stories about Anno trying to hit on women in 80s by bringing up the fact he animated the God Warriro scene in Nausicaä, lol).

I can see that could work, particularly if he was trying to hit on a little girl

There are multiple levels one can interpret the piloting part, and this one is a less obscure one, although I do not necessarily agree that Shinji deciding to shift out of instrumentality (and piloting eva) is a clear indication that Anno had decided to not directing any anime. I think Anno had not made up his mind then, and clearly he has not made up his mind now either.

[Eva Yojimbo]

.....guys, I thought this had been long established thing.

Piloting Evangelion = directing anime is one of THE keys in understanding eva and it puts all of Shinji's bitching and moaning in his important job in perspective when one treats it as being humble anime director.

I thought this was common apocrypha at this point. Apparently not.

QFT.

[Xard]

I can see that could work, particularly if he was trying to hit on a little girl

well Anno may be many things but I don't think he's a pedo at least....

I doubt that was very succesful tidbit when it came to getting wimminz though... but man gotta try

There are multiple levels one can interpret the piloting part, and this one is a less obscure one, although I do not necessarily agree that Shinji deciding to shift out of instrumentality (and piloting eva) is a clear indication that Anno had decided to not directing any anime. I think Anno had not made up his mind then, and clearly he has not made up his mind now either.

Ahh no, the instrumentality part is not about his job per se. But being eva pilot certainly is. And obviously the conclusion is not that he should stop once and for all but rather that the job shouldn't be his source for self-identity and value and that he as individual will be able to live on even without identity as director/eva pilot.

I think it's in tv series finale when Shinji reaches the point where he answers the question why he pilots Eva as "because it's all I am". Likewise Anno's whole being went to his work on eva (thus causing the nervous breakdown as series ended).

It's about realizing one is more than his "work identity", so to speak. When the anime is over he still needs to wake up the next day, after all.

[Someone]

I wonder....how much salary does an EVA pilot receive?

[symbv]

I wonder....how much salary does an EVA pilot receive?

Nothing, probably. Anyway, as they are all legally adolescents any money would go to their guardian, who would be Gendou for Shinji and probably Rei too :)

[NemZ]

ZOMG, these characters have motivations!

Well, yeah, they pretty much have to. Without them they'd do nothing and the story wouldn't be a story at all, but rather an animated sill life. I'm not seeing anything even remotely new here, Kendrix.

Death to (of) the author! (?)

Yes Xard, that's probably exactly what it meant to Anno. That's all these sorts of creator side-notes on a work can really tell us though... what it means to them. That's interesting of course, however you should keep in mind that this is not the same thing as stating a definitive meaning for everyone. Every viewer is still empowered merely by being a viewer to form their own interpretation of the work, and even knowing what the creators intended doesn't in any way invalidate these alternative interpretations.

[Eva Yojimbo]

It's about realizing one is more than his "work identity", so to speak. When the anime is over he still needs to wake up the next day, after all.

I also always felt the whole "Then... where is my dream? - It is the continuation of reality. - Where is... my reality? - It is at the end of your dream." was Anno's recognition of the cyclical and co-existing nature of that work/reality/fantasy relationship. Especially for him there was no clean split. All he could do was become conscious of this and not sink too deeply into any extreme, and part of that was certainly recognizing that one is more than their "work identity".

however you should keep in mind that this is not the same thing as stating a definitive meaning for everyone. Every viewer is still empowered merely by being a viewer to form their own interpretation of the work, and even knowing what the creators intended doesn't in any way invalidate these alternative interpretations.

I'd like to know where this notion of a single definitive interpretation even came from. For as long as art's been around differing interpretations on the same element have co-existed and they always will co-exist. In fact, the mark of great art is that it engenders so many different interpretations of the same elements. The whole Eva Pilots/Anno's job metaphor is one particularly strong interpretation that seems to be "true" insofar as it corresponds to what we know about Anno's intentions and what we know about how piloting is presented in the series. This doesn't rule out other equally true interpretations like "piloting is a return to the womb" or "piloting is a metafictional commentary on mecha anime" or "piloting is a metaphor for the formation of identity and self-worth". Actually, all of these interpretations gain strength when one considers them in relationship with the others, just like Anno's over-arching dualism motif.

That said, I don't think Xard stated/suggested that this one interpretation ruled out others or was "definitive", merely that it's one that had long been accepted as legitimate and valid.

[katastroff]

I also always felt the whole "Then... where is my dream? - It is the continuation of reality. - Where is... my reality? - It is at the end of your dream." was Anno's recognition of the cyclical and co-existing nature of that work/reality/fantasy relationship. Especially for him there was no clean split. All he could do was become conscious of this and not sink too deeply into any extreme, and part of that was certainly recognizing that one is more than their "work identity".

I remember this "Identity between reality and dreams" theme also in Anno's film Shiki-Jitsu, in which he himself wanted to play as the main character. This is my own opinion, but Anno never truly expressed this idea (though he does a very good job at expressing what it feels like) clearly because he himself doesn't know the answer. I say this confidently because it is an age old philosophical question: "Where do I find meaning in life?". People live many separate lives, struggling to find cohesiveness and meaning within all his roles, as painful and ambiguous as it may be. The ones Anno seems to portray the most are his personal, interpersonal, and work (director) life.

The reason why we never truly get an easy solution in NGE is because it starts even BEFORE the search for meaning. Nobody has the best answer yet for meaning. However, there is one thing he knows for sure, and that is we must try and live anyway. Before Shinji can even begin to find happiness and meaning, he must face himself, reality, and pilot the Eva. Shinji finally decides to do that at the end of EoTV and EoE. Will he find happiness or meaning? Who knows; that is where we all should begin.

[NemZ]

I wasn't trying to say anything about Xard beyond just agreeing with him in that single sentence. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

I'd like to know where this notion of a single definitive interpretation even came from.

It's basically just fascism as applied to critique. The idiot masses are all too susceptible to such ideas from anyone they recognize as an authority, being uncomfortable with anything less than a definitive answer for any given question. Once they adopt this received truth and see their fellows do likewise it becomes a defining feature of what it means to be within the group, thus any differing opinion is percieved as a threat to the unity of the group as a whole.

[Kendrix]

With Anno always going how EVA is his life and stuff, I'm pretty sure at least the part with the NERV-Trio is fully intentional - And I'm not saying the EVAs have to be seen as such in all contexts, as I said relatively early in my initial post.


@Jimbo: I wouldn't see everything as dark as you this "two-bladed-sword-relation" thought here is really interesting. It hadn't occured to me before, but I think you're right.
On the one hand, one needs to do one's job to have what you need to live/stay with the ppl you know. PPl will tell you to, expecially if you're good at it. On the other hand, completely depending on it doesn't do you any good either, because you are more than just your job/role in society, you can be more or less replaced in a job, your individuality is somewhere else. - It's a thin line that the characters struggle to find.


...And spare me with that Death of the Author nonsense.
How can anything be in there that no one PUT there?
(It is, of course, something else if stuff was deliberately left open for interpretation or has various motifs attached to it. One problem I often see here is ppl starting to talk in metaphors/thinking that stuff must always "mean" the same thing in all contexts. For example, the SDAT Player - Can be a symbol of isolation, but also an idicator of Shinji's status (tough the former could arguably seen as an aspect of the latter) or simply stand for Shinji himself in certain contexts.)
Also, I just used the quotes to furtherly cement something seen in the show itself. I had this association the first time I saw it, before I read any single interview.

[Sailor Star Dust]

In parallel however making anime WAS his one and only bond to other people and also source of self-worth as famous animator (there're some stories about Anno trying to hit on women in 80s by bringing up the fact he animated the God Warriro scene in Nausicaä, lol).

Anno hitting on Yuko Miyamura during NGE, at least, was debunked by Carl Horn several years ago. (I think he was asking Hiroyuki Yamaga or another Gainax member.) Not sure about the rest.

Nothing, probably. Anyway, as they are all legally adolescents any money would go to their guardian, who would be Gendou for Shinji and probably Rei too :)

In the Eva2 video game, Shinji and Asuka can ask Misato for an allowance while Rei gets money directly from Nerv (she has TONS of money because she doesn't have access to the convenience store). Not exactly the same as an allowance from Nerv, but Misato probably looks after Shinji and Asuka (with her own money from work and/or a certain amount from Gendo) while Rei gets her money from Gendo.

And yes, death of the author is stupid when you're trying to understand the themes/characters of a story. You HAVE to take into account what the creator was trying to communicate, whether or not you personally agree with it. It's still THEIR work and has to be treated as such, even when people will have their own interpretation of what things (themes, plot, symbols, whatever really) in the work mean.

[Kendrix]

Rei is probably regularly handed large bundles of money by Gendo for clothes/food/etc, since he's mosr likely her legal guardian. The ppl in the stores near the ghetho probably occassionally shoot her mistified looks when she tries to pay her little energy drink cans in huge bills.
She probably rarely uses it for anything but food and underwear, tough.
Perhaps books, but since many of those look like complex scientific and/or metaphisical stuff, they may as well be borrowed from Gendo.

As for Shinji and Asuka, duh... Misato may or may not get money to spend it on them. I dun think they get salaries, tough.
Not like Shinji would ever go and ask for one, since he's, uh, Shinji.

[Mr. Tines]

We have this thread -- http://forum.evageeks.org/viewtopic.php?t=2742 -- for the pay-scale discussion.