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Re: Star Wars

Postby Bagheera » Tue May 31, 2016 9:04 pm

Like I said, I'm not suggesting the news is legit. Just that it's not talking about the same stuff that always happens, and that it said as much explicitly. Whether it's correct or is just so much alarmist bullshit is a separate matter (and to be clear I lean toward the latter notion).
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Re: Star Wars

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Tue May 31, 2016 10:07 pm

Film was only screened for Disney executives, I.E. the guys who get massive bonuses if the film cracks a minimum of $500 million domestic & not for an actual audience.

If I was to take a bet, Rogue One is undergoing reshoots because the Disney executives saw a film that fulfilled the promise of everything Gareth Edwards & the creative team has promised for years - a heist/war film that feels down to Earth & real like Saving Private Ryan and just happens to be set in the Star Wars Universe. Thing is a movie like that could very well alienate certain viewers if it plays by it's own rules and doesn't adhere to a classic story structure. And making a down to Earth mercenary movie in the never-ending franchise that is Star Wars goes a long way against that series classic story structure. Fucking with that "classic Star Wars feel" could spell disaster for Disney in that Rogue One might ONLY make $1.5 billion at the worldwide box office instead of $2 billion! That's a lot of Bonus Money!

Star Wars is a juggernaut that despite the promise of a rich universe with all types of stories to tell is too much of a sure-thing moneymaker for anyone who has to respond to stockholders would want to take much of a risk on. There's a reason Episode VII was able to make almost a billion at the box office in the US alone even though it's just a slightly better than average movie. Episode VII panders to the series, risks little and plays by the set rules that have been part of Star Wars since 1977. I don't think Disney intends to change that.

I'm sure Rogue One will be fun. I like Gareth Edwards. I LOVED the feel of that first trailer. I doubt Disney - who from this point on intends to release a Star Wars movie every year UNTIL WE ARE ALL DEAD - will want to risk future business by mucking with the Star Wars Formula. The goal is to HOMOGENIZE. Most of the things I've heard about Rogue One's production history online & from fellow colleagues is this is a film that has had a strange life because it started out as one thing - Zero Dark Thirty but in the Star Wars universe - that has to continually bow down to the greater need of the ongoing Brand than be it's own thing.

Would not be surprised if Rogue One is going into reshoots to add quips, comic relief, goofy monsters, cameos of characters from other films and is just having the edges that made the film appealing smoothed out so it's more a traditional blockbuster.

That's the thing with these ongoing Cinematic Universes, a film can play around a little bit in a specific type of genre - Ant-Man isn't a heist movie but it dabbles in the idea, The Winter Soldier sure as shit isn't anything like a 70s conspiracy thriller but it can play around with the iconography, this November's Doctor Strange is pushing hard on it being a psychedelic out-there experience but in the end it's all going to come down to a cliché slugfest with powers between Benedict Cumberbund and his evil counterpart as a sidekick cracks wise on the side of the action - but in the end it has to feel like everything else that came before it. Rogue One started out as an adult, serious, dirty movie about mercenaries in the Star Wars universe film. I'm betting the film will lose a bit of the adult, the serious and the dirt. And based on Gareth Edwards two previous features - Monsters and Godzilla 2014 - he really likes things to be serious and isn't big on quips or jokes.

I think Rogue One will be a good movie. But, I don't think Rogue One is going to be anything like the movie we were promised.

On the upside I think catering to an ongoing tone that is upbeat, joke heavy and fun for the whole family is exactly what Phil Lord & Chris Miller excel at so that Young Han Solo movie is probably going to rule and be an easy shoot.

P.S. I don't think we're going to get tonally interesting Star Wars stories like what Rogue One promised until Disney starts to dip into the much lower budget TV & Netflix arena with the universe. So about 2020 after they've finished this first "New Trilogy".

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Re: Star Wars

Postby Chuckman » Wed Jun 01, 2016 5:07 pm

If somebody wants a movie like that they should make one in a universe where it fits, not in swash buckling space magic land.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Wed Jun 01, 2016 9:23 pm

It's not that simple.

It's very difficult to get original projects made in the industry now. Especially those that require special effects & world building.

When Disney bought Star Wars a promise they made to shareholders & fans was that they'd make spin-off films that took place in the familiar Star Wars universe but were drastically different stories in tone & style then what had come before. The promise was 'Every genre & tone can work in the Star Wars universe' & funnily enough this is probably the one Cinematic Universe that could easily support every genre. When Disney reached out to several writers & filmmakers throughout the industry they asked them to come up with original stories in the Star Wars universe. A Zero Dark Thirty like mercenary movie was the one Disney fell in love with & was the film they hired Gareth Edwards to make.

From what I've heard he made that film. Now they want to change it.

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Re: Star Wars

Postby El Squibbonator » Wed Jun 01, 2016 10:38 pm

Part of the beauty of Star Wars, at least the way I see it, is the fact that you can tell just about any sort of story in it. The fact that Disney seems to be trying to force its Star Wars to follow a repetitive formula instead goes against their nature. It also makes me doubtful about what we can expect out of further Star Wars movies. Look at it this way: if one thing can be said about the Star Wars expanded universe, it is that it comprised various genres. There were stories that felt like regular continuations of the movies, horror stories like Death Troopers, and even political thrillers like the Thrawn trilogy. But since the expanded universe is no longer canon, Disney can't draw from it for their movies, and is instead reinventing Star Wars their way.
Star Wars, like Marvel, is a setting and not a single story to be retold over and over again, and if Disney knew what was good for them in the long run they would treat it as such. Eventually audiences are going to get sick of this whole Marvel-and-Star Wars shtick, just like they got tired of animated fairy tale musicals back in the 1990s. It might be a good idea in the short run to keep the stories familiar, but in the long run Disney is going to need to branch out.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby movieartman » Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:12 pm

Edit - Re Shoots are to add a cameo of sorts and this was no test screens that scared Disney into this.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Wed Jun 01, 2016 11:26 pm

Reshoots are just a natural part of a film going up. It's nothing to be afraid about.

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Re: Star Wars

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Thu Jun 02, 2016 1:18 am

Reshoots are a natural element of the filmmaking process. These aren't normal reshoots.


Also, I'm looking forward to fans trying to explain how a film that takes place just before the start of A NEW HOPE will feature Alden Ehrenreich as Han Solo because Disney is most likely going to shoehorn him into the movie. Pull a Marvel and have a trailer for the Young Han Solo movie in a completely separate film.

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Re: Star Wars

Postby Bagheera » Thu Jun 02, 2016 4:12 am

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:Also, I'm looking forward to fans trying to explain how a film that takes place just before the start of A NEW HOPE will feature Alden Ehrenreich as Han Solo because Disney is most likely going to shoehorn him into the movie. Pull a Marvel and have a trailer for the Young Han Solo movie in a completely separate film.


Yeah, that would suck. If they wanna work Vader in there, go for it. If they wanna do a post-credits teaser with Solo, I guess that would be fine. But actually working him into the movie? No. Ugh. Do not want.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby BrikHaus » Thu Jun 02, 2016 5:37 pm

I hope someday we get both cuts of Rogue One: the original director's cut and the theatrical cut, which should be tonally different. I realize this is a pipe dream that will never be fulfilled, but it would be really cool all the same.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby Gendo'sPapa » Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:38 am

The reshoot is going to last eight weeks & will alter at least 40% of the film.

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Re: Star Wars

Postby Reichu » Fri Jun 03, 2016 2:11 pm

Disney should have just said they wanted formulaic mediocrity in the first place. This whole thing is pretty stupid.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:36 pm


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Re: Star Wars

Postby Chuckman » Sat Jun 04, 2016 4:36 pm

I want this movie to be good but if it does well they'll keep doing that "classic theme music in minor key" shit in trailers and it's the new bwoooooommmmmmm

Addendum: I will be okay with this if they do it with a Gremlins remake.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:27 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:I want this movie to be good but if it does well they'll keep doing that "classic theme music in minor key" shit in trailers and it's the new bwoooooommmmmmm

They did more than that. They mixed the classic theme in with the imperial March theme. That's actual uniqueness and musical talent that wouldn't be as easy to copy elsewhere, since it requires two equally as recognizable themes from the same franchise in order for it to work.

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Re: Star Wars

Postby Chuckman » Tue Jun 07, 2016 11:04 am

I should note that I like the way that the Force Awakens, Rogue One, and Jurassic world trailers did it. It's the inevitable slew of imitators that's going to be annoying.

I was going to list the Ghostbusters one too, but I think that the use of the old theme music is why so many people hate the trailers.

If you think it's because the cast is all female I don't care and you don't need to tell me, thanks in advance.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby Reichu » Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:03 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:I was going to list the Ghostbusters one too, but I think that the use of the old theme music is why so many people hate the trailers.

Yep, the theme music shows up in so many of the thousands of disparaging comments, front and center. It was the true culprit all along. How did we not see it before?!

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Re: Star Wars

Postby Chuckman » Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:41 pm

I'm talking about filmic reasons why the trailer wasn't well received. I refuse to acknowledge any other matters concerning the trailer's reception.

The trailer for GB has all the hallmarks of a sequel. It starts off with a thirty years ago thing, referencing the first movie, and references the first movie with the score. You will not that the JW trailer, Force Awakens, and Rogue One also do this, but they are sequels (and an interquel) and are not reboots with no connection to the original. That matters to people. It may not be the first reason why they disliked it that they themselves cite, but the disjunction between the implicit connection to the first movie followed by a complete disjunction between the two stories set the trailer up to be received poorly, it was a bad choice from an artistic perspective.

It's a dissonance, a sense of the uncanny. "This is like the thing you remember but it is not the thing you remember" engenders a deep seated negative reaction to things.
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Re: Star Wars

Postby Sachi » Tue Jun 07, 2016 9:22 pm

Entertainment Weekly recently cleared up some rumors involving the reshoots: http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/03/rogue-one-reshoots

Basically, the reshoots were planned since before initial shooting even began. They're gonna be long and expensive because they involve multiple character interactions. The reshoots will NOT be altering 40% of the movie (because, like I said before, that would delay the film's release). Also, when asked about the grittier tone, they assured fans that this will indeed be a "war film".
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Re: Star Wars

Postby Bagheera » Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:33 am

View Original PostSachi wrote:Entertainment Weekly recently cleared up some rumors involving the reshoots: http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/03/rogue-one-reshoots


Nice! That's very reassuring.
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The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.


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