Thoughts about "Hentai"

[trueno_twentyone]

I was wondering how people react to this one. I bet somebody somewhere in this community was curious, enjoyed watching, enjoyed jerking while watchingor never watched one.

I feel that H-anime and H-manga specially dōjinshi degrades the image of anime in general. I always ask myself why people create such type of anime and manga.

Now, the question is, how 'bout you?

[ZapX]

...and reopened.

[Sailor Star Dust]

Keep this as clean as can be given the topic or it gets locked.

While I'm not big on H-anime, I highly enjoy H-doujin that has humor (like the circle Tengu no Tsuzura) because not all of it needs to be serious (tho romantic hentai is nice but usually tacky) or depressing (like stories featuring rape, which I avoid). With H-VNs, I've only played Kanon, which is EPIC.


And Re-Take is the best serious Eva doujin evar!

[NAveryW]

I feel that H-anime and H-manga specially dōjinshi degrades the image of anime in general. I always ask myself why people create such type of anime and manga.

I feel that erotic film and literature, specifically fanfic, degrades the image of media in general. I always ask myself why people create such type of film and literature.

[Merridian]

I feel that H-anime and H-manga specially dōjinshi degrades the image of anime in general. I always ask myself why people create such type of anime and manga.

Because we are fascinated by the meaningless and the depraved. Also, sex is awesome, and the more over-the-top, ludicrously fake, and obnoxiously staged it is, the more it sells. Just look at 300. It might not qualify as porno, but all the same techniques are there.

As far as H goes... well, same deal applies. You can't get any more fake, staged, and over-the-top than cartoons, and animation by default opens the door for all kinds of debauchery that isn't even physically possible in real life. Saying that H degrades anime is like saying sci-fi/horror degrades anime. It’s just another genre that people watch to get their kicks. In H’s case, the kicks are just more controversial and niche. Heck, in some circles, admitting to watching anime is worse than admitting to watching porn anyway.

[trueno_twentyone]

Ok kids, just to remind you that this thread doesn't promote nor advertise H-anime and manga and whatnot. The objective of this thread is to collect peoples thoughts and reactions concerning the subject.

now back to topic...

@Merridian: 300 is very over the top. And yeah, I find it very hard to admit that I am watching anime.

Since I live in the Philippines, we consider porn and whatnot as taboo. We can only speak about it when we are with perverted friends. If ever people find out that you watch one, the worst thing you'll get is being treated as a pervert, an enemy of all "womanhood".

[NAveryW]

I find it very hard to admit that I am watching anime.

That either means you feel some shame in it or that others feel you should feel shame in it. Do you mean admit to yourself or others? Anime is no greater or less an artistic medium as any other, despite what trends may make you think. If you're ashamed of watching it because it's animated even though you like it, you're a hypocrite. Stop being a hypocrite, hypocrite.

[trueno_twentyone]

@NAveryW: Thank you for awakening the otaku spirit in me. Actually, some people find it childish when I tell them I like watching and reading manga and anime. But this time around, thanks to you my friend, I shall defend the otaku faith! ahaha!

@Topic: Since it was brought up, anime as an artistic medium, will pervs have the excuse of doing H-anime and H-manga just for "art for arts sake"?

[MatrixRefugee]

I find it an irritant, since it seems to cause some people who aren't familiar with anime as a medium to think that all anime is pr0ny by nature, particularly if somehow, their initial exposure to anime was by way of brushes with H-anime. I can say this without impunity because, well, I was that person myself. :: Sad smirk::

[Mr. Tines]

In the UK, anime had a bad public exposure through titles like Urutsokidoji, which left the public perception of anime as cartoon tentacle porn. While watching porn may be prevalent, you rarely advertise that you watch something that is niche even for that.

The Japanese fascination with rape and dicks (futanari? why?) means that H stuff really leaves me cold.

Porno fanfics are not a purely or even originally Japanese phenomenon (the original slash fics -- as much elaborated upon in the heyday of Usenet, and going further back the doujin-equivalent Tijuana Bibles).

Answering the original "Why?" the answer is of course "Because sex".

[Eva Yojimbo]

I genuinely like eroticism in the arts (including H) but I think it's so painfully difficult to find any that's genuinely done well. There's obviously a fine (and subjective) line between eroticism and porn and while I don't have anything against porn (quite the contrary; I use it quite often) I think there's a real artistry to good eroticism in all the mediums that's difficult to achieve. I especially like erotic photography because I think it's a medium well suited to distinguishing between eroticism and porn and there's so much that can be done with the beauty of the subject and the plays with light, shadows, form, shapes, shade, texture, and color; such as the works of Pascal Baetens, Helmut Newton, Andreas Bitesnich, Dahmane, Howard Schatz or Thomas Karsten.

As far as H, I used to love it when I was younger, but now it just generally doesn't do it for me. I do think there were a few really good H comics with my favorite undoubtedly being Slut Girl. I was genuinely surprised at the sharp characterizations and general good-natured hilarity and how much I came to care for its characters by the end. The sex almost became a kind of slapstick comedy act while it was really the characters and situations that was the real focus. That kind of quality is REALLY hard to find in H in general.

I feel that erotic film and literature, specifically fanfic, degrades the image of media in general. I always ask myself why people create such type of film and literature.

I seriously hope you're joking.

[THE Hal E. Burton 9000]

art is art as long as no one is doing anything that hurts or coerces someone else

H is no exception, though IMO most of it is of poor quality unfortunately, erotic photography, paintings and novels are better

[trueno_twentyone]

Let's not leap out of our backyard, take Re-take of Evangelion as an example.

SPOILER: Show

The story is good, the drawing is a bit crude but close to the likes of the original design of the character, at some point in the story, the erotic part seems acceptable. If you have seen it, the first "sex scene" is acceptable. It is a plot device, I think. The second, third, and so on, seem too excessive. I have no problem with this particular dōjinshi except the excessive sexual content which seem very unnecessary to the story.

NOTE: I've placed "Spoiler" tag to be safe. I assume that some have not seen nor seen the dōjinshi.

[Eva Yojimbo]

If you have seen it, the first "sex scene" is acceptable. It is a plot device, I think. The second, third, and so on, seem too excessive. I have no problem with this particular dōjinshi except the excessive sexual content which seem very unnecessary to the story.

And I think this is actually the crux (or dilemma, if you will) if all narrative eroticism. I'm reminded of (two quote an essay on an art-house erotic musical film) "the analogy that Paul Willemen once suggested between sex scenes in porno flicks and the song-and-dance numbers in musicals: both offer the spectacle of a fantasised abundance in place of a real, material scarcity." I think what happens is that it becomes impossible to maintain the illusion of a fictional reality when too much emphasis and focus is placed on an event which only occurs in a small portion of everyday life. The advantage that musicals have is that the music becomes part of the accepted break from reality and part of the fantasy, but in erotic narratives that transition doesn't work as well.

I think the trick then becomes on how to integrate it as part of a narrative whose primary interest is on character, story, and themes. Last Tango in Paris works because it is a provocative and incredibly well-crafted (and acted) character study first that uses sex as a means to explore its characters. It works in Slut Girl because the characters, plots, and humor are the main focus to which the sex-scenes act to enhance and accompany (rather than dominate) these elements. I think most H fails because the focus is too much on the sex and not enough on the craft.

[trueno_twentyone]

...most H fails because the focus is too much on the sex and not enough on the craft.

I'd definitely have to agree. The focus becomes unclear and the whole work tends to be very erotic because of the craft or the way it is made.

Last Tango in Paris works because it is a provocative and incredibly well-crafted (and acted) character study first that uses sex as a means to explore its characters.

Please elaborate more. I see that there is something good with this statement.

[NAveryW]

I feel that erotic film and literature, specifically fanfic, degrades the image of media in general. I always ask myself why people create such type of film and literature.

I seriously hope you're joking.

I was making a facetious analogy, yes. I don't feel that erotic anime degrades anime as a medium any more than erotic film degrades cinema as a medium.

Of course, the "H" label is used much more widely than the "porn" label is used here. Something labeled hentai could be more like Mulholland Dr. or Eyes Wide Shut in terms of content (Re-Take, for example) or it could be Backdoor Sluts 5.

[Xard]

I've played with the idea that sexual fetishism is about as "deepest" and primal expression as one can make. Not to mention "themes" connect automatically all viewers.

in other words hentai is most artistically worthy genre of anime


QED

[trueno_twentyone]

WTF?! How come it is the most artistically worthy genre? I'd rather watch porn rather than hentai...wait, at lease I can go with the decent type - aka normal type of hentai where no 20 inch dick is involved.

I'm just saying...

[FreakyFilmFan4ever]

I'm sorry, but I don't find a whole lot good in hentai. It's one of those things that reminds me why I don't like a TON of anime. I mainly don't want to be associated with a group of people who are thought to be sex-depraved, lonely virgins who'd rather live in Japan.

I mean, I see nothing wrong with nude art. I don't pin it up on the wall, but there's some good in it and it has some admirable, non-sexual elements to it. There's beauty in the shape human body. But hentai almost always takes it to to such and extreme sexual level that it almost excuses shy introverts for not going outside of the house at all and getting to know real people. It creates fantasies in the mind that are unobtainable in the real world, therefore further separating shy folks from becoming somewhat social in the real world. I've seen it paint those types into a corner that they can't get out of (at least not without a lot of pain).

And just for that, I can't really take any form of it (sexual/non-sexual) in good conscience.

[trueno_twentyone]

@FFF4e: Please don't think that I enjoy watching hentai or whatnot.