What anime are you watching right now? May 2012

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Kenshin Sephiroth
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Postby Kenshin Sephiroth » Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:59 am

View Original PostXard wrote:Questions of why there are portals and how do they work are also completely irrelevant for telling the story and as such should be excised. Why, should've Obi-Wan Kenobi given detailed explanation how lightsaber work or Gandalf why One Ring turns its bearer invisible?

I understand that such lengthy explanations probably wouldn't be viable due to time constraints and the baddies that need ass-kicking, but I can't say I wouldn't have welcomed at least some explanation in the movie, as the wonder of discovery is also supposed to be a selling point in fantasy. It's called "worldbuilding" for a reason, and we get buttloads of that in Star Wars and Lord of the Rings.


View Original PostXard wrote:You don't waste time on explaining meaningless things that just take attention away from the storyline.

The unexplained disembodied voice that announces a time and place for Haru to be present is what spurs her toward the cat kingdom, and is thus the whole catalyst for the storyline. Anyone pointing this out, be it an adult or a six-year-old child, is drawing attention to the plot and would be right in doing so. This isn't nitpicking that should be left ignored, it is an issue by which the plot stands or falls, and it should be questioned.


View Original PostXard wrote:As for things like crow knowing Baron was going to jump it's reasonable to assume the crow hung around in case that happens or it was the plan to begin with. There's no reason to have scene where the two meticulously plan their actions though. It's been too long time for me to remember details so I don't even remember any disembodied voice but really, I don't see it all that implausible in setting where people can turn into cats.

Unless they shared some psychic connection, the Baron should have ended up squashed on the sidewalk like a wet pancake.

But really, the all-too-convenient voice was what really pissed me off. Humans metamorphosing into cats was at least firmly established as physically possible and used consistently throughout, but that voice (which I couldn't identify as belonging to any of the off-screen characters) is a case of the writers going "We need to get Haru from point A to B, but how? I know! We'll have some floating ghostly utterance deliver the information, genius! Huh, what's that, how is this possible and what purpose does it serve other than being a cheap mechanical plot spin? Look, a squirrel!!!! *runs away*" Imagine if Luke and Frodo throughout their quests were haphazardly pulled toward their goals by invisible strings the writers conjured up due to lack of motivation or proper writing skills; I wouldn't accept the excuse that it's simply "to get the ball rolling along" or whatever: these iconic characters would be reduced to flopping fishes thrown maniacally about by creative forces they have no chances of ever comprehending. I've only seen The Cat Returns once, but I can't picture how lazy (or brilliantly fatalistic) this plot would appear on a second viewing.


View Original PostXard wrote:I agree with your take on the film overall but stuff like above is little more than silly nitpicking you could do with most titles.

I really don't think it's silly for me to apply logic to an anime aimed primarily at children. It's not nitpicking, it's discovering whether or not, despite its fairy tale focus, it establishes rules and follows them through; all excellent fairy tales do this so as to keep the audience invested, involved and inspired to guess what's coming up next. A fantastical tale can be weird, silly, rambunctious, and supernatural, but it also has to be consistent. Should we dissolve all standards and let it all up in the air, the filmmakers would be given carte blanche to do anything they wish without any repercussions; this isn't difficult, because you don't even have to actually write the film, and that'll make anyone a writer. Because anyone can not write, and in this regard anyone can write The Cat Returns.


View Original PostXard wrote:Meaningless questions either due to genre conventions or them being irrelevant for the narrative. Same goes for things like "cat portals" in The Cat Returns.

There were plenty of inconsequencial oddities in The Cat Returns that aren't worth addressing, but the few ones I've pointed out (which hasn't exhausted the list) are not arbitrary; they are integral to and dependent on the plot, and certainly not part of any genre convention I'm familiar with.


View Original PostXard wrote:Why don't they ever explain how Evas manage to work in the first place despite giants of their size being implausible in light of physics? Why do they change height? What exactly are these "souls" and how are they born? Just how exactly AT Field is supposed to keep the body together? etc. etc.

Eva is an interesting example to use, as that's a series that actually explains a lot of its ideas, and doesn't simply use the assumed workings of its world to tell an entertaining story. If you take robot physics out of Evangelion you still have a compelling drama rich in character and themes; do the same with The Cat Returns, i.e. remove the conveniently mysterious voice, the portals, the brash happenings and reckless character decisions, and you have nothing but noise signifying nothing. You also have Haru stranded at the beginning of the plot with nowhere to go, and no way for the cats to enter our realm. Had the story of TCR actually been good, I wouldn't have minded its disregard for logic as much (after all, Terminator 2 has some serious logical fallacies, but it makes up for that in being a tremendous movie), but as its flaws were compounded by boring stuff happening to a bland protagonist I see little reason for letting it off the hook, and I just think the flick needs to be called out on its bullshit.

This is also the reason I dislike a lot of Miyazaki's films, and agree with ANN's Justin Sevakis when he says that Prinsesse Mononoke was the last of his films that was "about something". Anyone can pull weird shit out of their hats, but it takes true talent, true craftsmanship, to actually design a story from scatch. The Cat Returns failed at this, in my opinion.

For a film which accomplishes both of these things, see Masaaki Yuasa's Mind Game.

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Postby Azathoth » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:13 am

also, implying lotr doesn't explain (albeit never very straightforwardly) why the one ring makes you invisible

you should have used one of the old great questions. such as, if Frodo hung the ring on a chain, why didn't the chain turn invisible?
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Postby Oz » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:54 am

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:Anyone can pull weird shit out of their hats, but it takes true talent, true craftsmanship, to actually design a story from scatch.

:facepalm:
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Postby Kenshin Sephiroth » Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:40 am

@Oz: Dunno if you're mocking my line of thought or the "scatch" error, but given that I rarely recheck spelling on forum posts (probably due to tiredness from work), I don't give much of a damn unless it's the former. Even if so, I'm not a Dadaist. Sue me.
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Postby Xard » Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:53 am

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:I understand that such lengthy explanations probably wouldn't be viable due to time constraints and the baddies that need ass-kicking, but I can't say I wouldn't have welcomed at least some explanation in the movie, as the wonder of discovery is also supposed to be a selling point in fantasy. It's called "worldbuilding" for a reason, and we get buttloads of that in Star Wars and Lord of the Rings.


But there really is nothing about portals in need of explanation anymore than original Star Wars film had need for precise technological breakdown of how exactly the lightsabers work. What we know is enough for the story. Worldbuilding is all about meaningful direction of reader's/viewer's attention. You always make omissions on expense of what you do focus on. Going into precise detail about portals summons forth more irrelevant questions that suddenly seem relevant.


View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:The unexplained disembodied voice that announces a time and place for Haru to be present is what spurs her toward the cat kingdom, and is thus the whole catalyst for the storyline. Anyone pointing this out, be it an adult or a six-year-old child, is drawing attention to the plot and would be right in doing so. This isn't nitpicking that should be left ignored, it is an issue by which the plot stands or falls, and it should be questioned.

*****

But really, the all-too-convenient voice was what really pissed me off. Humans metamorphosing into cats was at least firmly established as physically possible and used consistently throughout, but that voice (which I couldn't identify as belonging to any of the off-screen characters) is a case of the writers going "We need to get Haru from point A to B, but how? I know! We'll have some floating ghostly utterance deliver the information, genius! Huh, what's that, how is this possible and what purpose does it serve other than being a cheap mechanical plot spin? Look, a squirrel!!!! *runs away*" Imagine if Luke and Frodo throughout their quests were haphazardly pulled toward their goals by invisible strings the writers conjured up due to lack of motivation or proper writing skills; I wouldn't accept the excuse that it's simply "to get the ball rolling along" or whatever: these iconic characters would be reduced to flopping fishes thrown maniacally about by creative forces they have no chances of ever comprehending. I've only seen The Cat Returns once, but I can't picture how lazy (or brilliantly fatalistic) this plot would appear on a second viewing.


Fair enough. Based on this the "voice issue" is legitimate complaint. Keep in mind it's something between 1½-2 years since I saw The Cat Returns so I don't remember the details of it all that well. It's just that when you mix legitimate concerns like this with silly ones (portals, more on that later) it is not all that clear which is which.


View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:I really don't think it's silly for me to apply logic to an anime aimed primarily at children. It's not nitpicking, it's discovering whether or not, despite its fairy tale focus, it establishes rules and follows them through; all excellent fairy tales do this so as to keep the audience invested, involved and inspired to guess what's coming up next.


Applying logic is fine and with the disembodied voice deal (assuming your account on it is correct, I have no motivation to go and rewatch the film just because of this) I acknowledge the validity of criticism. The crow thing I remain agnostic on because too many details of it are blurry in my memory (based on what little I do remember of it it didn't fundamentally differ from thousands of other daring escape scenes like that in common in adventure fiction).

As for the portal criticism it's so petty and inconsequential calling it "nitpicking" is too generous on my part.

Considering how close The Cat Returns generally sticks to ancient and tried storytelling formulas I find it pretty amusing you could blame it for not establishing and following the rules. Possible plot holes like the disembodied voice are legit issues on the superficial level of the storyline - in abstract the way how character drama is build and resolved and the distinct parts the narrative moves through and how it resolves itself are all by the book. Whether or not the execution is good is another thing (and in this evaluation plot holes and such matter) but regardless of quality The Cat Returns does follow the usual storystelling forms downright slavishly. Criticizing it for lack of originality would be more sensible than claiming it doesn't follow the rules.


View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote: A fantastical tale can be weird, silly, rambunctious, and supernatural, but it also has to be consistent. Should we dissolve all standards and let it all up in the air, the filmmakers would be given carte blanche to do anything they wish without any repercussions; this isn't difficult, because you don't even have to actually write the film, and that'll make anyone a writer. Because anyone can not write, and in this regard anyone can write The Cat Returns.


not really related to topic but since you brought it up: yeah, welcome to the 20th century. It happened already. Also implying Inland Empire wasn't best film of last decade. "Consistent" can mean many things.

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:There were plenty of inconsequencial oddities in The Cat Returns that aren't worth addressing, but the few ones I've pointed out (which hasn't exhausted the list) are not arbitrary; they are integral to and dependent on the plot, and certainly not part of any genre convention I'm familiar with.


Voice criticism acknowledged, psychic Baron ignored due to too hazy memories on my part what's left is the magical portal issue. If for you the voice thing was what pissed you off then for me it was this criticism that made your review come off silly. As said Cat Returns is just ok in my books and I don't really mind one way or another if you like the film itself: what irks me are if reasons given come off unjustified.

Thus I'll go through what you wrote about it and why it is ridiculous from my perspective:

I understand that this is a fairy tale for kids and is meant to be enjoyed as such, but when you set up a scenario in the real world, and then continuously defy the scientific laws that bind it, it makes for a confusing and frustrating watch.

This comes first and really negatively impacted anything you wrote afterwards because this is unambiguously wrong. Unless you have some interesting theories on nature of reality and its parts (particularly cats) it's from the very beginning clear the setting is NOT ment to be the "real world" but rather a fantasy world where we get to travel between magical dimension and seemingly mundane "real world". A magical fairy tale in setting full of magic and anthropomorphic animals defying reality? Jesus Christ how horrifying.


Why are there portals around town that lead to and from the cat kingdom?


The story establishes this clearly through action: they're a way for cats to travel between their kingdom and the city and that is the purpose they serve.

Who put them there and how do they work?

They work through magic and unless you want the film be cluttered by (meaningless and irrelevant for the storyline) time consuming history where did the cats come from, were they intelligent to begin with, just what exactly is the relationship between cat kingdom and Earth, how does the magic work etc. responsible storytelling choice is to leave it at that and stop short of conjuring up ridiculous Dungeon & Dragon knockoff magic rule sets. All of these are as arbitrary questions and if one of them demands answer for story to work so do they all.


Their purpose is evident and in a magical fantasy world their working principle being magic is implicit. As for such portals not being part of any "genre convention" all I can do is laugh. A magical gate, boundary or downright teleportation location between the realm of normal and the realm of fantasy is one of the most common genre conventions imaginable. The closet from Narnia is other good, downright classic example of essentially similar function in storytelling.

It's beyond me why you didn't recognize the trope immeaditly as it's all over books, films and games.

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:Eva is an interesting example to use, as that's a series that actually explains a lot of its ideas, and doesn't simply use the assumed workings of its world to tell an entertaining story. If you take robot physics out of Evangelion you still have a compelling drama rich in character and themes; do the same with The Cat Returns, i.e. remove the conveniently mysterious voice, the portals, the brash happenings and reckless character decisions, and you have nothing but noise signifying nothing. You also have Haru stranded at the beginning of the plot with nowhere to go, and no way for the cats to enter our realm. Had the story of TCR actually been good, I wouldn't have minded its disregard for logic as much (after all, Terminator 2 has some serious logical fallacies, but it makes up for that in being a tremendous movie), but as its flaws were compounded by boring stuff happening to a bland protagonist I see little reason for letting it off the hook, and I just think the flick needs to be called out on its bullshit.


Quality of the story or compellingness of its characters are separate issue when it comes to how much the setting strictly speaking "makes sense" (in other news I don't consider rationally constructed setting necessary or always even preferrable, ambiguous and arbitrary dream can be fantastic) and Eva is very guilty of being full of bullshit and then never properly explaining it. Which is perfectly fine and not flaw at all in my eyes but then again, I don't demand minute explanations for things that don't really matter.


View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:This is also the reason I dislike a lot of Miyazaki's films, and agree with ANN's Justin Sevakis when he says that Prinsesse Mononoke was the last of his films that was "about something".


Sevakis said that? >ANN beside, Justin says the darnest things - and that is incredibly stupid thing to say in light of Spirited Away being the most honest and clearly written x in Wonderland narrative of his whole career that has more than a few themes it touches in somewhat traditional manner. Howl is Miyazaki's weakest and slightly incoherent in structure in its final third but it too is explicitly "about something". Even the genuinely creative in style/"original" (loloriginality) Ponyo in all of its pure whimsy is about quite few things.

There's being full of shit and then this as Miyazaki's style didn't change much between Mononoke-Howl period. Ponyo is the first clear break from what came before both stylistically and storywise

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:For a film which accomplishes both of these things, see Masaaki Yuasa's Mind Game.


Mind Game is phenomenal and one of my favourites but it's hardly a coherent, tightly focused film. It's zany, jerky creative explosion that is all over the place in terms of focus and story which is one reason why it is so fantastic and vivid film. It's not kind of film I'd use when arguing about consistency with its regular self-absorbed fantasy vignettes, crazy story twists out of nowhere and animation style that is as hectic and jumpy as the story and its characters.

View Original PostAzathoth wrote:also, implying lotr doesn't explain (albeit never very straightforwardly) why the one ring makes you invisible


It di? I read the book about...what, 10-20 times as teenager but it's been long time since I last read it. Can't really remember this getting explained

View Original PostAzathoth wrote:you should have used one of the old great questions. such as, if Frodo hung the ring on a chain, why didn't the chain turn invisible?


heh, yeah. For that particular issue I'd presume it works only with living creatures or then even more specifically if used like a ring but clearly because Tolkien never properly explained this the story sucks and is full of holes as relevant information is kept from the reader. :P

even more horrifyingly Tolkien never sets any clear rules for magic or carefully define its nature* which is unforgivably ambiguous storytelling


*and thank god for that, for me air of mystery and certain degree of incomprehensibility is important for the magic to actually come off as magic. Le Guin's true name system is good, all the p&p game stat and later computer game influenced magical systems feel lackluster to me.

Nasuverse is quite interesting for me in its attempt to get it all by separating magic (gamelike system of abilities and effects) and sorcery (reason transcending ability to create downright miracles) from each other

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Postby bobbyfischer's ghost » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:15 pm

I finished my run of Monster..... oh Johan you so crazy. :)
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Postby Kenshin Sephiroth » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:32 pm

Xardie, I do wish the writers of The Cat Returns'd been as observant as you when conceiving their project. xD It's funny how this argument was spawned when we both hold the same basic opinion of the movie overall. While definitely one of Ghibli's poorer works, it isn't exactly "bad"; like I said, it's fun and playful and I suppose shouldn't be taken too seriously (as it doesn't attempt to do this itself, which might be the best argument against my previous posts). Coming straight from "Whisper of the Heart", which had the concept of youthful imagination as such an important theme, I just got inquisitive as to the universe and potential expansion of that theme in TCR (while it from the get-go seems to set a clear demarcation between the magic world and the "real world", only to then dismiss it for supernatural slapstick chase scenes across worlds). I admit some of my criticisms might be unwarranted given the nature of the beast, although I was just trying to make sense of the movie. Even so, as I said in my little review, the movie is ultimately pretty forgettable, and really the only memorable stuff happening throughout the thing (for me) was of a dubious and headshake-inducing nature.

In retrospect... how is there even such a thing as a cat kingdom? Riddle me that! How can this colossal castle, these magnificent gardens and towering spires be constructed by creatures who don't even have OPPOSABLE THUMBS?!?!

NERD RAAAGE!!! :fistshake:

Although I think I'm kinda done discussing The Cat Returns, I hope you'll allow me, in respect to a passing comment you made above, to defend Yuasa's Mind Game as more than a "zany, jerky creative explosion that is all over the place in terms of focus and story which is one reason why it is so fantastic and vivid film." It has all that zany stuff, sure, but mainly in regard to style. Remove any pyrotechnical fat from Mind Game and you would still have oceans of meat, waves of substance. Its style is simply so pervasive and inescapable that it's difficult to separate it from the story, which I would argue is focused, determined, and even quite subtle (yeah, I know, but I believe this!). It goes a lot of places, but by the end, in that brilliant life-affirming finale, it's also all tied together in a neat bow. You look at the first scene and the last with everything in between, and you will see consistency. Just had to throw that opinion out there, it being my favorite anime film of all time.

View Original Postbobbyfischer's ghost wrote:I finished my run of Monster..... oh Johan you so crazy. :)

Been meaning to get into that for a looong time. Is it able to sustain its tension despite that 74 episode count?
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Postby Twin Drive Sigma Aquarion » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:40 pm

Up to episode 42 in Dagwon. Why is this anime so awesome? I mean for pete sake the music isn't that good and yet everything else works so well (mostly)! I mean most mecha series have good villains, be it individuals or cast, and individual heroes, but this is a rare case of a good protagonist cast. Not individuals, CAST! Ep 39's final showdown between Lian and Arch Seijin was surprisingly well done and the latter has grown on me since he kind of reminds me of Muge Zorbados from Dancouga. DagThunder/Thunder Dagwon were pretty neat with the latter being a bit of a Zambot 3 homage. Super Fire Dagwon had a nice first appearance in ep 41 (he OWNed a Ramiel parody for pete sake!), although apparently this is one of those "you can't use it too long or you'll run out of power/die" situations. To top it all off, Brave Seijin bothered doing jack squat in combat! And he killed the annoying one of the three warugaia brothers (specifically Hido)! Now that one of the three warugaia brothers is dead, it'll be interesting to see where these final six episodes go. :cool:

At this point the only thing I can say is that unless the ending is ultra-mundane, anti-climactic, or has one of those pointless epilogue episodes then I can safely say that this will make my top ten favorite anime, possibly top five.
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Postby bobbyfischer's ghost » Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:48 pm

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:

Been meaning to get into that for a looong time. Is it able to sustain its tension despite that 74 episode count?

Yes it can, despite the run time the show did keep me at the edge of my seat eagerly awaiting Johan's next move.
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Postby Azathoth » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:41 pm

View Original PostXard wrote:It di? I read the book about...what, 10-20 times as teenager but it's been long time since I last read it. Can't really remember this getting explained


Shifts you bodily into Sauron's creepy wraith world or spiritual plane or whatever, leaving behind only a wraithlike impression of yourself in the real world (your shadow can be faintly seen in bright light while wearing the One, body and soul take on permanently wraithlike character the more you use it, etc). Of course the argument about the details is as old as the hills and at least as stupid, but this is the reading that both attempts to adapt the story to film used and it's difficult to find much fault with their interpretation of this point.

which makes some degree of sense with the joke since a chain would presumably not possess a spirit capable of entering Sauron's uh...reality marble

Tolkien does lay foundations for how magic works but again (wisely, no doubt) leaves most of it up to implication and subtle wordings and so on since frankly the story isn't about magic and magic is broadly irrelevant to its point.
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Postby Xard » Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:30 pm

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:Coming straight from "Whisper of the Heart", which had the concept of youthful imagination as such an important theme, I just got inquisitive as to the universe and potential expansion of that theme in TCR (while it from the get-go seems to set a clear demarcation between the magic world and the "real world", only to then dismiss it for supernatural slapstick chase scenes across worlds).


Ahhh, I understand much better why you reacted like you did then. I absolutely love Whisper of the Heart and yeah, The Cat Returns is nothing like it.

To be specific the audiences were begging Ghibli pretty much non-stop since 1995 to anime that fantasy world and Baron's story which eventually lead to Ghibli do The Cat Returns. The spinoff was based on the in-story fantasy story to begin with which explains why there's such a big difference.

I would've preferred the story as told in WoT itself to be animated without any human involvement whatsoever but I can live with what we got.

View Original PostKenshin Sephiroth wrote:Although I think I'm kinda done discussing The Cat Returns, I hope you'll allow me, in respect to a passing comment you made above, to defend Yuasa's Mind Game as more than a "zany, jerky creative explosion that is all over the place in terms of focus and story which is one reason why it is so fantastic and vivid film." It has all that zany stuff, sure, but mainly in regard to style. Remove any pyrotechnical fat from Mind Game and you would still have oceans of meat, waves of substance. Its style is simply so pervasive and inescapable that it's difficult to separate it from the story, which I would argue is focused, determined, and even quite subtle (yeah, I know, but I believe this!). It goes a lot of places, but by the end, in that brilliant life-affirming finale, it's also all tied together in a neat bow. You look at the first scene and the last with everything in between, and you will see consistency. Just had to throw that opinion out there, it being my favorite anime film of all time.


Sure, there's a real theme and "substance" to Mind Game and thus clear focal point which really becomes apparent in the final, superb montage. It's not particularly intellectual theme but probably all the better for it.

However that does not make the way story is written and executed particularly consistent in tone and feel either and it's hard to separate the style of the film from its content (like it should be, tbh). I don't see this "lack of consistency" as negative trait at all. Certainly on thematic level it's focused work but most films tend to be, whether good or bad otherwise. When I say Mind Game isn't "consistent" I don't mean that it sends mixed messages or it's themes are muddled, I'm just commenting on the story and style that have more in common with FLCL than Oshii.


FLCL would be good, somewhat similar case. It's zany and has tons of random bullshit heaped on top of each episode but there's very focused core themes and growth story in centre of it. Thus like Mind Game I think you could call it consistent or inconsistent dependant on what level you focus on.

View Original PostAzathoth wrote:Shifts you bodily into Sauron's creepy wraith world or spiritual plane or whatever, leaving behind only a wraithlike impression of yourself in the real world (your shadow can be faintly seen in bright light while wearing the One, body and soul take on permanently wraithlike character the more you use it, etc). Of course the argument about the details is as old as the hills and at least as stupid, but this is the reading that both attempts to adapt the story to film used and it's difficult to find much fault with their interpretation of this point.


I figured it would be something like this. Yes, this interpretation makes sense the most.

View Original PostAzathoth wrote:which makes some degree of sense with the joke since a chain would presumably not possess a spirit capable of entering Sauron's uh...reality marble


how lewd

View Original PostAzathoth wrote:Tolkien does lay foundations for how magic works but again (wisely, no doubt) leaves most of it up to implication and subtle wordings and so on since frankly the story isn't about magic and magic is broadly irrelevant to its point.


Yeah he did and it's more apparent in Silmarillion and the like but it all still feels like "magic". No sound of rolling dices and damage hit points getting counted comes through the paper like in so much shoddy B-fantasy.

I don't really have anything against clear magic system (Earthsea has one too) and I tolerate even the more RPGsque ones but I prefer the ones that keep it somewhat dignified. Gandalf feels both as Grey and White more like a genuine wizard to me than many of the shoddy fireball tossers all over the place.


***********'

Finished Fujiko Mine. Quite all over the place in terms of focus with somewhat crazy twists. As a positive it had better animation than most episodes and fun fight scene.

Most twists felt pretty silly but I'm actually happy they ment this work didn't rape Fujiko's character after all. This made me happy - at the same time though these twists destroyed whatever "deep" feminist subtext they might've been building once and for all but hey, who cares? :lol:

Passable if not good ending for passable if not good show. Extra points for trying to do something different.

6/10

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Postby Alastor » Thu Jun 28, 2012 6:33 pm

Twin Drive Sigma Aquarion wrote: (who knew Satan was a dick girl?)

...everyone who read the manga. That's one of the more notable things about it.

Anyway, found a batch torrent for L-Gaim that WASN'T the HK subs. Since I loved The Five-Star Stories movie (and the sole chapter of the manga I've read), and the fact I've been playing the hell out of SRW F and SRW 4 (the latter for the LED Mirage cameo as the Blood Temple, since it's the closest FSS will ever be in SRW), I figured I should pick this back up and see what FSS is apparently remaking in some aspects (such as the Colus vs. Amaterasu storyline).

In other words...
SPOILER: Show

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"Are you suggesting Toji was nearly killed because his eva had a yeast infection?" - NemZ
"You know...pretty much everybody has a motive to kill Kaji. So let's just take this to it's logical conclusion and say Pen-Pen killed Kaji in a jealous fit of rage over Misato." - Trajan

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Postby Xard » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:41 pm

Sakamichi no Apollon END
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'twas gooooooooooood ;____;

The moment the episode started I knew it was storyboarded by Watanabe (and he even acted as episode director for it).

This was just beautiful, perfect ending. 10+ material, had the whole show been this good it would've been the best drama series in ages. Very emotional and unlike many of its predecessors managed to compress large amount of events into one episode without feeling at all rushed or jerky.

The directing was just beautiful and straight from delicately handled quality drama film. Perfect pacing, perfect understated style. This was how I expected the whole show to be like when it started.

I'm impressed with the maturity and realism they ended this youth love story full of misunderstandings and bouts of stupidity. It would've been great end on its own but the timeskip material was a perfect coda for the series.

I want and don't want a sequel for this. Damn.

8/10 for the whole show, 10+ for this episode.

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Postby Ornette » Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:16 pm

Watanabe sure likes the chasing the train thing, he did the same thing in Baby Blue.

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Postby Xard » Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:44 pm

View Original PostOrnette wrote:Watanabe sure likes the chasing the train thing, he did the same thing in Baby Blue.


It's one trope that pretty much always works so it's no wonder.

I didn't mention it by name but this was on Baby Blue level for me (the level I was hoping for any "youth drama" by Watanabe to have through and through)

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Postby Twin Drive Sigma Aquarion » Thu Jun 28, 2012 8:50 pm

...everyone who read the manga. That's one of the more notable things about it.

I don't read manga so I wouldn't know that.

In other news, someone uploaded Dancouga Blazing Epilogue on Dailymotion! :w00: Sadly the first episode isn't the fan subbed version. :( I wonder if /m/ subs will ever do the second episode....
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Postby Alastor » Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:32 pm

View Original PostTwin Drive Sigma Aquarion wrote:I don't read manga so I wouldn't know that.
I personally suggest fixing that, at least for the works of Go Nagai and Ken Ishikawa.

View Original PostTwin Drive Sigma Aquarion wrote:I wonder if /m/ subs will ever do the second episode....

I don't think /m/subs ever plans on finishing that.

I mean look at Layzner. And Brave Raideen. ....Those bastards.

Oh, and if you didn't know, /m/ subs released the Layzner OVAs. And as for Raideen, I assume you finished it by watching HK subs or raws?
"Are you suggesting Toji was nearly killed because his eva had a yeast infection?" - NemZ
"You know...pretty much everybody has a motive to kill Kaji. So let's just take this to it's logical conclusion and say Pen-Pen killed Kaji in a jealous fit of rage over Misato." - Trajan

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Postby InstrumentalityOne » Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:06 am

So Eureka Seven AO 11.
Trappar apparently makes children hallucinate weird things, even more cryptic things happen, the Red Sea of Rebuild makes an appearance and everything just got a little more manhandled than before.

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Postby Twin Drive Sigma Aquarion » Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:38 am

Oh, and if you didn't know, /m/ subs released the Layzner OVAs.

I check there and the Skaro Hunting Society every other day.
And as for Raideen, I assume you finished it by watching HK subs or raws?

Raws because HK subs don't exist and amazingly no Italian dubs either.
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Postby Fireball » Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:07 am

Lupin the Third: Mine Fujiko to Iu Onna

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Wow they somehow managed to make that thing even more contrived and idiotic while shitting on every previous build up by telling us "Joke is on you! I was a slut all along!"
Considering they played the rape victim card for Fujiko's backstory as an explanation so long, that was probably not the worst choice though. Might as well go full retard and stop pretending. And what happened to Oscar at the end? Why revive him when you don't give him any closure? Wish this episode would have rather been 20 minutes Goemon vs Jigen.

also, CUNT OF THE CENTURY goes to Fujiko for kidnapping a dying tetraplegic and mockingly dance infront "LA LA LA you can't do that!" :lol:


Anyway, series was a often a directional mess but cool style and different from the usual Lupin, for better or worse.


Verdict: remember when this show was trying to explain how Fujiko became Fujiko?...me neither.



Sakamichi no Apollon

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Underwhelming ending to say the least. I mean, it makes sense in the context, it was actually a pretty good episode itself. I couldn't help but smile when they started jamming in the church but the sudden rush and timeskip put me off mood. There was at least one episode missing to give the whole series a bigger meaning of completion.

This becomes even more apparent when I read the ending in the manga and what they skipped.

SPOILER: Show
Kaoru's mother sings to him the song "Lullaby of Birdland" (it's on the soundtrack) the one he gave her the record for and she learned the lyrics now and it's an absolute tearjerker.
Kaoru starts playing in a jazz club in college again and has regularly gigs in clubs.
Brother Jun meets Kaoru at the bar and they have a nice session.
Ritsuko and Kaoru exchange letters througout college.
Kaoru and Rits get together at the end
Kaoru switches hospitals and works now near Sentarou's church, climbing daily a slope and complaining about it. (full circle)

Can't say this doesn't leave a bitter taste in my mouth when I think about how much better this could have even been. However, all in all it was a great series with plenty of good feelings. The characters felt surprisingly mature and I loved the music bits to death.


Verdict: came for the jazz, stayed for the bromance.
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