Postby Kendrix » Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:35 pm
What Kaworu does amounts to saying "You were the catalyst, there's a causal relationship there" which
a) Shinji needs to know to understand the world he found himself in and the motivations of the people in it
b) a fact he will have to come to terms with and making sure he properly understands that and doesn't slip into denial (as a defense mechanism, not because he's an asshole without basic human empathy) is the first step of the healing process.
Yes, something he did ended badly. Consequences happened. The talk is about the consequences that are a physical reality, but there isn't a single line criticising his actions in that moment itself, kaworu notably does aknowledge his good intentions without further discussions.
That conversation was not "This is why what you tried to do was sick and wrong and this is why this was the result" but "Look, this is what happened because of something you did, (without further discribing that something) you must aknowledge that this is the reality and deal with it somehow".
his initial reaction of "WTF i had nothing to do with this shit!" when he only first hears it (the subsequent curl-into-a-ball exercises suggest that this is not the perception of the event that got "saved to the hard drive" once Kaworu was done explaining, judging from their later conversation ("You showed me that!") what Shinji took away from this was "I just can't do anything right" ) is fairly understandable in that one immediate moment since he had no bloody clue it could happen.
Its a complete non sequitur to him at first.
How the hell does "save the girl" equal "poof, end of the world", basically.
("But wait, I went to save a comerade? Isn't that the good thing? If that was bad, what was I supposed to do?")
But see, even though he thinks different about it, his initial reaction is like yours, dear anti faction: He tries to look for an explanation in his initial motivations.
Yeah he thinks "but those were good" and can't get the outcome make sense in his head.
He's thinking "But if my intentions were good, how can I possibly get a bad result?"
You're thinking "Well, your results sucked, so your intentions must obviously have been vile enough to justify them."
Under the line, it's the same thing: "Bad things only happen to those who deserve them, right?"
Well, no.
No, Shinji, good intentions don't mean you can't screw up
No, Anti-faction, screwing up doesn't mean your intentions can't have been good.
That's what that scene is about, good intentions don't make you infallible, or, and that's where the actual emphasis is, exempt from dealing with the consequences of unintentional screwups. Because, don't we all have to deal with the consequences of our screwups? And do we ever intend them?
We all had that conversation with our parents.
"But Mommy, I didn't mean to knock the milk jug over!"
"Well, you're still cleaning this up!"
You see, you're having the same problem as him, as it is so very often the case with people who bitch about Shinji: He is that stage in his life that commonly occurs in the age he's in, the moment where you realize that the simple principles you were told as young children aren't universal, that life isn't fair, that there's no "equivalent exchange", that you can't always earn something if you only put in enough effort, that sometimes, good people with good intentions still screw up for reasons like misinformation, intense emotional states, stupidity or plain bad luck, and that you didn't mean to do something doesn't mean it won't have consequences you'll have to deal with.
It's a painful, frustrating thing to learn, both in regards to your own actions ("But it ain't fair!" complain teenagers all throughout the planet) and those of other people, (Like when you don't want to believe that your kind, intelligent grandma is racist... but she is, because of her upbringing, and racism is still wrong) but simply how reality works.
Look at Shinji and say hello to the mirror, this loser is you.
Conversely, that means that you can get good things even if you didn't deserve them, and another corrolary is that there are times where you really couldn't have known any better. This is probably what Kaji would say if he were here. RIP, adult guidance figure that Shinji really would have needed in this damn movie.
Because, you see, being left on his own with this realization, that no, good intentions and effort (and he certainly put some effort in, he was willing to give his whole damn life) don't always equal/guarantee that this will end with you happily riding into the sunset with your girlfriend, Shinji draws the wrong conclusion - the same as you, actually.
That he's no good, period.
Especially when he learns that he didn't even save Rei, that, in addition to all the bad that happened and was already troubling him sufficiently, he didn't even do one single good thing. (That he didn't suceed doesn't change the validity of his intentions and that fading away in his arms was probably preferable to dying with Zeruel, thinking she was utterly insignificant and trapped, but he doesn't have the streght to see that beyond his pain)
At this point, Shinji has pretty much lost all belief in his fundamental ability to do anything good for anyone at all. ("Nothing good ever came out of me piloting EVA!" )
His logic is probably: "So, even if I try my best, even if I'm willing to give my life, the result is bad? So then what I am capable of giving must be too little to reach the threshold required for a good result." He isn't capable of a differentiated view that includes the possibility of a shade of grey, that includes the possibility of "I've been had by third parties.", or any other consideration of context or that he aimed that effort at the wrong target/ poured it down the wrong tube.
And he's making the typical children's mistake of giving up after the first proper try.
And episode 26 all over again, confidence, value and what no having it can make you do. Not that he can be blamed for not feeling particularly confident after he just leveled the planet.
Kaworu convinces him to give it one last try and, in many ways, that's a good thing. He wants to subvert those plotting factions, he wants to DO something about the shit he caused, he wants to make sure no more suffering comes from his mistake, and yes, part of what he wanted was also to try to prove himself to others. I don't see why that's so vile, to want to actively do something to get his life back in order.
As Ogata said, there's also the message of "Even if your life sux, you can find hope in your connections to others."
But the thing is, deep down, he had trouble convincing himself of what Kaworu said. He didn't have the confidence, he still doubted his ability of doing something positive at all. So, he was a bit too desperate to prove that to both himself and the world. That doesn't make him a selfish monster, we're talking about finding a reason to go on living here, and why would he care about doing good things in the first place if he's only interested in his own ass?
Kaworu had more confidence, so he could think "Okay, we've been fooled, these are the wrong spears, but even if there's enemy EVAs out for our asses and we have no idea where the fucking cassius spear went, there is always hope, we can retreat and wait for another opportunity."
Shinji didn't have that inner confidence, didn't have the streght to believe in a vague "next oportunity", so, with only one last opportunity to fix it and nothing more to lose, he chose to take a chance there.
And it blew up in his face again and damned his only friend to a senseless death, shattering whatever was left of his self-worth and will to live...
Sure, we're supposed to learn from his mistakes, but that doesn't change that we should feel SORRY for that kid.
People, Shinji is very, very unsuited for this, and he knows it. It's not like doesn't see it. He kept repeating it throughout 1.0, he's not cut out for this, he's bound to do it wrong. He has learned that he still has to do it, that he can't let his fear of screwing up make him do nothing at all.
But none of that changes the initial problem: He's very, very unsuited for all of this and knows it. Yes, the latter part is part of the problem.
But so far, this Person has always been characterized as someone who, yes, desperately fears getting hurt, but also fears hurting other even more. Not exactly closet misanthrope material. The original series outright states it several time, by Rebuild, Anno is minding "show, don't tell", but I don't think the fundamental idea of this character has changed in such a fundamental part, because it's still the same author he's an avatar of (Anno, in a recent interview that was posted in the main Rebuild forum: "...I don't think Shinji's that different, he just gets percieved a bit differently but you can't change your fundamental nature.")
I wanted to try harvesting the rice
I wanted to hold Tsubame more
I wanted to stay together forever with the boy I like
Reichu wrote:Don't say "all" and then clarify "all" as "everybody outside this forum". :p
), but, like Jesus, he advocates forgiveness over condemnation. 
