Nebuchadnezzar topic tangent

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment is scheduled to debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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Nebuchadnezzar topic tangent (SPOILERS)

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Postby JoeD80 » Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:46 pm

Split from everything below this post.


View Original Postrilocay wrote:Now this goes into the sequel theory again but i took it as... the "real" evangelion, unit 01, is inside the body/armour of unit (mark) 6 (so having the original series unit 01 from the moon or in space, wherever from EoE).
So to quicken the awakening of it, the events in 2.0 occur, bringing not only Mark/Unit-6 down (the true evangelion unit 01)

I think you're overcomplicating the implication of what Fuyutsuki and Gendo are talking about. The way I interpret that is that all they are saying is that SEELE is building Eva 06 as a true Evangelion, so NERV better hurry up and awaken Eva 01 so it can take its place as the true Evangelion instead. SEELE's got Eva 06; NERV has Eva 01. Showdown coming in Q.

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Postby cat42 » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:32 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:BUT IT ISN'T A DOUBLE HELIX. (...is it?)


Late reply is late, but does it HAVE to be a double helix in Rebuild?

And did we ever see and S2 engine anyway in NGE?

I'm pretty sure we never explicitly see one, or having one described as looking like a Double Helix. The closest I remember us coming to seeing one is shreds of Zeruel's flesh (particle wave matter?) sticking out of Unit-01's mouth as she chows down to take one into herself.

But I haven't re watched the show recently, so I could easily be wrong. :zer_sweatdrop:
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Postby Reichu » Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:59 am

Well, no, like many things, the state of the S2 Engine is not something the show explicitly told us, but somehow folks managed to extrapolate this before anything spelled it out for us. I posit that the name "super solenoid" had something to do with it. (And NGE's obsession with double helices couldn't have helped.) :tongue:

In any event, Neb's Key does not appear to bear much of any resemblance to a solenoid, let alone a super one.

Mercifully, S2 Engines have not been so much as alluded to in Wevangeliwon, so we don't have to worry about them now if ever. (Unless I'm forgetting something.) The "Fruit of Life" may be yet another item that is being "rebuilt".
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Postby Azathoth » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:13 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Mercifully, S2 Engines have not been so much as alluded to in Wevangeliwon, so we don't have to worry about them now if ever. (Unless I'm forgetting something.) The "Fruit of Life" may be yet another item that is being "rebuilt".


The Fruit of Life is definitely referred to in 1.11, but the fact that it wasn't in 1.0 suggests that it's not meant to be so important ultimately on a narrative level, and the S2 theory hasn't gotten so much as a mention.
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Postby carla » Tue May 11, 2010 10:57 am

just adding new info: 2.22 tells us that Kaji arrives at tokyo-3 via train-- or at least he's dropped off at a train station. Shinji and the stooges go pick him up, but they're around when Asuka gets to tokyo-3 so Kaji's arrival probably happens before/after that? (i'm going with before, since IIRC the scene where Kaji gives gendo the key happens almost right after Asuka's entrance).

not that it matters much, just pointing out if the key IS adam somehow, clockiel either had a ways to go until reaching it, or it wasn't even around yet. sucks for poor clockiel. :tongue: at least in the original series Kaji WAS traveling with the fleet so it didn't feel like a waste of time for the poor angel...
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Postby Legendary » Tue May 11, 2010 12:58 pm

Clockiel probably just had a ways to go, if it was aiming for Adam at all (either way, Sachiel through Ramiel clearly WEREN'T, or at least didn't know they'd been fooled). Our first shot of Shamshel shows it by the coast, Ramiel a mile or two away and Israfel (in-series, obviously) started a ways off. It was just luck that Asuka happened to be there to deal with the Angel before it kept going.

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Postby Lagann » Tue May 11, 2010 10:43 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Mercifully, S2 Engines have not been so much as alluded to in Wevangeliwon, so we don't have to worry about them now if ever. (Unless I'm forgetting something.)


Well They do mention that Eva 04 was a self contained testbed meant to test next generation developement. I assumed they were talking about S2 Engines.
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Postby Legendary » Tue May 11, 2010 11:56 pm

We'll have to see what special features Eva-08 has. Whatever it's got that makes it unique is probably what Eva-04 was supposed to do.

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Postby Azathoth » Wed May 12, 2010 2:09 pm

View Original PostLagann wrote:I assumed they were talking about S2 Engines.


And that raises the point yet again: if not an S2 Engine, why did Unit 04 blow up? Yet if there was an S2 Engine involved, why has the damn thing yet to get a mention by name?
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Postby SaltyJoe » Wed May 12, 2010 2:35 pm

View Original PostAzathoth wrote:And that raises the point yet again: if not an S2 Engine, why did Unit 04 blow up?

Sabotage, perhaps? Either an unknown third party wants to hinder the Eva project, or Seele wanted to destroy the next gen testbed that might have threatened the supremacy of their Eva-06.

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Postby Legendary » Wed May 12, 2010 4:59 pm

Or my suggestion that Eva-04 (and thus also a later model) has a non-S2 but still advanced feature. There's plenty of stuff that can be threatening, especially in the Rebuild-verse, where a particularly angry boy can make a hole in reality that can only be fixed by highly advanced alien technology.

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Postby JoeD80 » Thu May 13, 2010 9:48 pm

View Original PostLegendary wrote:It was just luck that Asuka happened to be there to deal with the Angel before it kept going.

She flew in on the Eva plane and dropped from the sky. It wasn't like her Eva was just standing there in the bushes or something.

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Postby Legendary » Thu May 13, 2010 10:15 pm

I meant that it was luck that she was arriving that day and happened to be easier to deploy than Shinji/Rei.

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Postby JKun76 » Thu May 13, 2010 10:57 pm

View Original PostLegendary wrote:I meant that it was luck that she was arriving that day and happened to be easier to deploy than Shinji/Rei.

Coulda been planned that way.

Like Shinji showing up the day that the first Angel came.

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Postby Legendary » Thu May 13, 2010 11:01 pm

Really? In Rebuild it's stated they deliberately timed it that way? Because I always got the impression from the TV show that it was just a REALLY bad accident it happened that way and they'd actually intended to train Shinji a little first.

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Postby JKun76 » Fri May 14, 2010 6:04 am

View Original PostLegendary wrote:Really? In Rebuild it's stated they deliberately timed it that way? Because I always got the impression from the TV show that it was just a REALLY bad accident it happened that way and they'd actually intended to train Shinji a little first.

Gendo pretty much says he planned it to happen that way near the end of the movie.

And also, Misato mentions the fact that is happens to be a super big coincidence that both Shinji and the angel show up on the same day but really, how many things in Eva happen just by coincidence? :tongue:

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Postby UrsusArctos » Fri May 14, 2010 7:50 am

I always had the impression that Gendo knew of Sachiel's arrival in advance (as useless as it may have proven, that huge welcome party proves that the Angel's arrival was known a fair deal ahead of time) and called Shinji over to deal with it. That Shinji should have gotten stuck within stomping distance of Sachiel was sheer bad luck.
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Postby SaltyJoe » Fri May 14, 2010 8:51 am

View Original PostJKun76 wrote:Gendo pretty much says he planned it to happen that way near the end of the movie.

Do you mean the end of 2.0? Cause Gendo had a "Keikaku doori" moment in 1.0, too, but that was at about the middle of the movie. But honestly, i think both of those instances are far too vague to allow for assumptions like they knew the exact day of Sachiel's arrival or whatever.

View Original PostUrsusArctos wrote:I always had the impression that Gendo knew of Sachiel's arrival in advance (as useless as it may have proven, that huge welcome party proves that the Angel's arrival was known a fair deal ahead of time)

Yeah, but Nerv has a fairly good network for detecting incoming Angels. Pretty much every conventional, hulking monster type Angel was spotted well before they arrived at Tokyo-III. And the city always has U.N. forces present (technically, both Nerv and Tokyo-III are under U.N. control). What i'm trying to say is, the tank battalions and whatnot might have been a part of Tokyo-III's standard defence forces, and they simply noticed the Angel a little before Shinji arrived.
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Postby JKun76 » Sat May 15, 2010 4:11 pm

View Original PostSaltyJoe wrote:Do you mean the end of 2.0? Cause Gendo had a "Keikaku doori" moment in 1.0, too, but that was at about the middle of the movie. But honestly, i think both of those instances are far too vague to allow for assumptions like they knew the exact day of Sachiel's arrival or whatever.

You're probably right, but I just made the assumption that he knew of the first Angel's arrival in advance (due to the smirk on his face when all the events leading up to Shinji piloting the Eva happen). And that he said it was in the script he wrote out of there lives. But you may be right.

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Postby ran1 » Sat May 15, 2010 6:30 pm

The whole atomsphere was kind of rushed, so I was under the impression that Nerv had forewarning of Sachiel's impending attack, just that He arrived a bit ahead of schedule. Hence Shinji's placement and unprepardness. Kind of goes nicely with Anno lolDEEPism as well considering that it fits in with Heidegger's/Fromm's conception of Dasein where humanity is "thrown into modes of existence and forced to simply be present" that I'm figuring Anno had finally gotten into considering all the psuedo-psychology/philosophy he must read.
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