End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Fri Jul 10, 2020 12:19 am

View Original PostIgRAzm wrote:You are saying what nobody could possibly see meaning in life if they think everyone should just die. Well, that implies what nobody has real breakdowns and low points. Saying things like that is, in a way, childish. That's intentional, people do get less mature, the closer to the heart you hit them in these moments. It doesn't mean they can't possibly improve afterwards.


That’s not what I am implying. I’m saying that in the real world, once you die, you die, there’s no coming back from that. You cannot just die and then realize your life has meaning, that never happens. That’s not the lesson I want to take from this movie.

But I am willing to accept the fact that I may have interpreted the movie too harshly. At first it was a defensive response for the sake of regaining my composure after I was triggered. But as I developed an obsession for solving this conundrum, it became a train of thought.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Derantor » Fri Jul 10, 2020 7:07 am

Shinji is clearly aware and present all the time. He never dies. He just comes close. For that matter, nobody else dies, either. They continue to live on as disembodied souls, because of GNR gathering them all. Even the people who got get tanged, so they are part of it. Think of it like going asleep without dreaming. You are not aware that you exist until you wake up again. Something like that.

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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:21 am

View Original PostDerantor wrote:Shinji is clearly aware and present all the time. He never dies. He just comes close. For that matter, nobody else dies, either. They continue to live on as disembodied souls, because of GNR gathering them all. Even the people who got get tanged, so they are part of it. Think of it like going asleep without dreaming. You are not aware that you exist until you wake up again. Something like that.


When I say die, I mean they no longer continue to exist in a physical human form, which is terrifying because in the real world, that’s what happens when you die. There are no safety nets. I view it as a sentient primordial soup, with a human like consciousness. Admittedly, the whole LCL thing is still confusing to me even though I’ve lost count on how much I’ve read about it.

As I’ve stated before: Maybe this mental stress is a result of the combination of all these; little to no knowledge, PTSD, quarantine.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Shun » Fri Jul 10, 2020 12:47 pm

In Dragon Ball, that is a manga / anime for children, Goku die some times and the planets are destroyed. In DB Super various universes are erased. But then thanks to the dragon balls, things are restored.
In manga / anime exaggerated things often happen, but you must not consider them exclusively in a narrative and realistic sense, especially when the author himself doesn't consider them seriously, or explicitly declares that events must also be interpreted in a metaphorical sense.
See here this Anno's interview: https://youtu.be/4CdNJqgCRLU
(Sub ENG in the comments)

An artwork is not reality, but it is a "what if". The killing of all humanity takes place on a logical-imaginary level, not on the ontological-real level. You do not have to use only the categories of thought of the real level on the events of the imaginary level, otherwise you make a mistake.
Don't worry, you don't have the power to destroy all humanity.

If you don't see the 26 episodes of NGE directly, you won't be able to get out of this vicious traumatic circle you ended up in. The best thing to do is to acknowledge that you made a mistake (watching EoE without seeing NGE), and start watching NGE from the beginning.
The first 7 episodes are introductory, then there are 6 nice episodes, then 1 summary episode that opens to the second part, then 7 episodes in which events become difficult, 3 dramatic episodes, 2 final episodes in which the problems of the relationship of the individual with himself and with the world are analized, and solutions are proposed, points of reference from which to start to live. Obviously it's Anno's answer. NGE end in a good mode, Shinji smile, EoE end in a ambiguous mode, Shinji cry, and this endings are complementary like yin and yang.
Other than these things I wrote to you I wouldn't know how to help you. Think if you write a book, a your friend reads only one chapter and doesn't like it. What would you say to him? He should read the whole book in order to understand the story and make a judgment. So, don't worry, give Evangelion some possibilities, but also take care of yourself and the people you love, and when you have a difficulty, say: "I can't understand this thing, can you explain it to me?"

Btw, this is the Shinji smile in the last episode:
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/eva ... 0727131516

Good luck!
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Fri Jul 10, 2020 3:17 pm

View Original PostShun wrote:If you don't see the 26 episodes of NGE directly, you won't be able to get out of this vicious traumatic circle you ended up in. The best thing to do is to acknowledge that you made a mistake (watching EoE without seeing NGE), and start watching NGE from the beginning.
Btw, this is the Shinji smile in the last episode:
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/eva ... 0727131516

Good luck!


I saw that smile in one of the clips I viewed before watching EoE. I understand that I made a mistake by viewing that movie with little to no insightful knowledge of the series.

I’m still trying to figure out how it was able to trigger my PTSD. Unless you’re saying it triggered my PTSD because I had little to no insightful knowledge of it. To be honest, that doesnt make sense to me, because I feel that even if I did watch the series then the movie, I’d still be triggered nonetheless, especially when Shinji is supposed to represent the audience, in this case; me.

Nevertheless, I could be still be mistaken. But does that mean me being triggered was a mistake too? I don’t think so. I think it’s normal to feel this way when a movie like this reminded me of some of the worst parts of my life. In my personal opinion, mental health should be counted when a movie is rated. https://www.artwithimpact.org/asib-content/
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Shun » Fri Jul 10, 2020 5:46 pm

One thing doesn't exclude the other. As you say, seeing EoE you remembered traumatic events from your past. But your experience is highly subjective, since not knowing NGE you haven't seen the events objectively, following the characters, the plot and the intentions of the authors, but you have projected yourself and your past experiences in EoE to cover these gaps of not-knowledge. This is a mistake.
You can't know how you would feel seeing EoE after seeing all NGE and reading the interviews on the Gwern website. Or, if you don't feel like it now, move away from Evangelion and to do other things. But if you keep thinking about it, you won't solve anything. I repeat: stop reading articles and watch NGE. You don't have to see NGE with other people's reviews, watch it with your eyes, your mind and your heart. It might remind you of other moments in your life, ok, but at the same time you will know Shinji's story, and Anno's point of view.
In this way the subjectivity will be balanced by the objectivity of the story, a story that speaks to us, but at the same time doesn't speak about us.

In this Evageeks page there are the letters that appearing in EoE:
https://wiki.evageeks.org/End_of_Evange ... th_Threats
In the first letter a guy thanks Anno for the NGE finale, I think it's a good thing.

And remember: any emotion you will feel, the most important thing you must try to do it outside of Evangelion, cultivate your garden of skills, interests, passions, friendships, relationships etc. with patience and commitment, slowly, day by day, year by year, you will discover what you like, what is important and what you can do.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Fri Jul 10, 2020 6:41 pm

View Original PostShun wrote:One thing doesn't exclude the other. As you say, seeing EoE you remembered traumatic events from your past. But your experience is highly subjective, since not knowing NGE you haven't seen the events objectively, following the characters, the plot and the intentions of the authors, but you have projected yourself and your past experiences in EoE to cover these gaps of not-knowledge. This is a mistake.


As I’ve said before, I could be very well mistaken about my reaction. I’ve accepted the fact that I most likely have. What I don’t understand is how I’ve supposedly “projected myself and my past experiences to cover these gaps.” Or are you trying to say that upon having little knowledge and experience of the story, the instinctive and emotional synapses of my mind have tried to make sense of the plot and the morales it was trying to project only to end up triggering my PTSD?
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:40 pm

Another thing that lingers upon my mind, is the fact that because Shinji is said to resonate with the audience so well, we want to see him succeed. In a way, he has. He recognized that his life has meaning despite all the incredible hardships that he went thought and rejects instrumentation.

Still, one thing that would’ve put a smile on my face is a triumphant ending. It would’ve been cool to see Shinji kick the everliving shit out of the Eva series like a boss.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Shun » Sat Jul 11, 2020 2:09 am

The mistake I'm talking about is not your psychological reaction. The mistake is that you didn't must to see EoE before seeing NGE.
You have identified yourself with Shinji so much that you are now having nightmares.You have projected yourself in the pains of the film and introjected them inside you, at the same time these pains in the film reminded you of your personal pains.
As we all told you, your reaction is legitimate (because EoE is painful) but at the same time it depends on the fact that you don't know NGE. I try to give you a metaphorical example: it's like diving into cold water, you can do it slowly or you can do it quickly, your reactions will be different. You dived quickly into EoE and it hurt you because it reminded you of your painful experiences, conversely getting in Evangelion slowly, seeing first the 26 episodes of NGE and then EoE, your reaction would have been different.

The best advice I can give you is: stop thinking about "how" PTSD activated. Simply, seeing Shinji's pains you remembered your personal pains.
Now try to see NGE.
You read Evangelion Re-Take who is a doujinshi and you said that it helped you to not see EoE as the only possible ending, we are telling you to see NGE, because it could help you react in a less painful way when you watch EoE.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Melkor » Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:32 am

View Original PostHopelessromantic wrote:Another thing that lingers upon my mind, is the fact that because Shinji is said to resonate with the audience so well, we want to see him succeed. In a way, he has. He recognized that his life has meaning despite all the incredible hardships that he went thought and rejects instrumentation.

Still, one thing that would’ve put a smile on my face is a triumphant ending. It would’ve been cool to see Shinji kick the everliving shit out of the Eva series like a boss.


That's one of the reasons why we're so invested in the Rebuilds right now and looking forward to seeing 3.0 + 1.0, because we want to see how Shinji ends up.

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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:40 am

I want to let you all know that I am grateful for the support you have given me thus far. I understand that I can be stubborn and defensive whenever I bring up a debate involving a personal topic. I recognize the mistake I have made. I know now that my mental disability is nothing to be ashamed of. I hope this Quarantine comes to a close soon so I can connect with people once more.

Thank you.
Throughout my life, I’ve tried to fit in with the norm. Now I’m embracing the fact that I am a full fledged bohemian. Who said standing out has to remain a bad thing?

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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Sun Jul 12, 2020 6:40 pm

View Original PostShun wrote:You have identified yourself with Shinji so much that you are now having nightmares.You have projected yourself in the pains of the film and introjected them inside you, at the same time these pains in the film reminded you of your personal pains.


You’re right. All while I thought about this, I had an epiphany. Upon reading that Shinji has resonated with the audience, I made the choice to identity myself with him without watching NGE before watching End of Evangelion. When I watched the movie, it resulted in an emotional chain reaction. And that was the mistake I made.

It’s all starting to make sense now!
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Mon Jul 13, 2020 12:10 pm

I had another dream about Evangelion. But this time was different. I wasn’t Shinji this time around, I was Kaworu.

I saw myself as Kaworu, and above me was Shinji, piloting Eva 01 in Dogma Terminal. At the same time, I saw myself as Kaworu wearing the kill collar witnessing the Fourth Impact with Shinji in Unit 13 in Evangelion 3.33, even though I hadn’t fully seen the movie yet. I felt myself existing in both scenarios simultaneously, both Kaworu’s aware of each other’s existence, the same person in two different worlds.

I felt I knew what I must do, in both scenarios. Rather than sugarcoating the truth, I warned both Shinji’s about the future in detail, and the consequences that would follow of he chose this path or the other. I warned both of them about the Third Impact, instrumentation and the dissolution, NERV being SEELE’s puppet, Gendo’s true motives, Asuka’s death, everything. Both Shinji’s wept hysterically upon hearing those words and begged me not die. It was then I hold him, “The destiny of the human race lies in your hands Shinji.”

“I don’t want to this!” He said.

“You have to. You need to make this decision not just for them, but for yourself.” I replied, smiling. “There is no greater love than the willingness to lay down your life for another. I love you Shinji.” It was then, in both scenarios my life ended, and I awoke from my dream.
Last edited by Hopelessromantic on Mon Jul 13, 2020 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Mon Jul 13, 2020 7:21 pm

View Original PostIgRAzm wrote:Many say what he made a commentary on the world, but the way I see it, he most likely just wanted to finish his story in a way what would be the most honest to himself, to his hidden inner self. It is the most emotionally traumatizing work he's done, as a result.


I am confused on what you’re attempting to say. If it was the most emotionally traumatizing work he’s done, why was he willing to do it? To vent his emotions and his hidden inner self during the relapse of his depression?
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Mon Jul 13, 2020 7:33 pm

View Original PostShun wrote:In manga / anime exaggerated things often happen, but you must not consider them exclusively in a narrative and realistic sense, especially when the author himself doesn't consider them seriously, or explicitly declares that events must also be interpreted in a metaphorical sense.
An artwork is not reality, but it is a "what if". The killing of all humanity takes place on a logical-imaginary level, not on the ontological-real level. You do not have to use only the categories of thought of the real level on the events of the imaginary level, otherwise you make a mistake. Don't worry, you don't have the power to destroy all humanity.


I am well aware that things in anime are often exaggerated, and some things that happened are intended to have a metaphorical meaning. My mistake was that because I’ve read that Shinji is supposed to represent the audience, I made the decision identify himself strongly and see EoE without watching the series. This made me feel as if I was forced to take the overwhelming journey through EoE with him, even though I hadn’t taken the entire journey through Evangelion. This in turn worsened my emotional aftermath.

By the way, I thank you for sticking with me this far. I know that I can be redundant and difficult to understand.
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Shun » Tue Jul 14, 2020 3:28 am

I'm glad you're better. There is nothing to be ashamed of having been hurt by EoE, don't worry. The important thing is that day by day you feel better. :wink:
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby IgRAzm » Tue Jul 14, 2020 4:21 am

View Original PostHopelessromantic wrote:I am confused on what you’re attempting to say. If it was the most emotionally traumatizing work he’s done, why was he willing to do it? To vent his emotions and his hidden inner self during the relapse of his depression?

I guess that is correct, but also he was being critical of himself. If there was something for him to say on the matter at the moment, he wanted to express it in a way so he wouldn't leave him having any regrets. Partly, it was a therapy on himself. Did that film answer the questions he himself was asking at the time? Maybe, or maybe not. I also have to add what it being so traumatizing is more of a side effect. It's definitely not the reason why he made it, just to be shocking. Evangelion has much more substance than that. It was likely a part of the intention, more like a way of delivering the messages he wanted to deliver.

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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Tue Jul 14, 2020 11:03 am

View Original PostHopelessromantic wrote:I had another dream about Evangelion. But this time was different. I wasn’t Shinji this time around, I was Kaworu.

I saw myself as Kaworu, and above me was Shinji, piloting Eva 01 in Dogma Terminal. At the same time, I saw myself as Kaworu wearing the kill collar witnessing the Fourth Impact with Shinji in Unit 13 in Evangelion 3.33, even though I hadn’t fully seen the movie yet. I felt myself existing in both scenarios simultaneously, both Kaworu’s aware of each other’s existence, the same person in two different worlds.

I felt I knew what I must do, in both scenarios. Rather than sugarcoating the truth, I warned both Shinji’s about the future in detail, and the consequences that would follow of he chose this path or the other. I warned both of them about the Third Impact, instrumentation and the dissolution, NERV being SEELE’s puppet, Gendo’s true motives, Asuka’s death, everything. Both Shinji’s wept hysterically upon hearing those words and begged me not die. It was then I hold him, “The destiny of the human race lies in your hands Shinji.”

“I don’t want to this!” He said.

“You have to. Don’t make the same mistakes I once made.” I replied, smiling. “There is no greater love than the willingness to lay down your life for another. I love you Shinji.” It was then, in both scenarios my life ended, and I awoke from my dream.


I’m curious about what my newest one means. Did I step out of Shinji’s shoes and into Kaworu’s? Has my psyche taken a large step forward towards emotional recovery?

What if Kaworu at one point in time was exactly like Shinji?
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:33 pm

Seven months now, and I can still feel them talking to me. I usually pay them no mind, but they’re still there.

“You are me. And I am you.” Shinji says. “You should be ashamed for who you are you retard.” Asuka says. “Your mental illness will destroy your world.” Rei says.

I don’t want to bury the memory, because I’m afraid of letting it fester. I don’t want to be like Shinji and run away from my problems. I want to understand it. But right now I’m still having a hard time understanding why I can still feel these three talking in the back of my mind. I wonder how long it’ll be before they just...fade. Or if they ever will
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Re: End of Evangelion Traumatized Me

Postby Hopelessromantic » Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:45 pm

View Original PostDerantor wrote:Shinji is clearly aware and present all the time. He never dies. He just comes close. For that matter, nobody else dies, either. They continue to live on as disembodied souls, because of GNR gathering them all. Even the people who got get tanged, so they are part of it. Think of it like going asleep without dreaming. You are not aware that you exist until you wake up again. Something like that.


The thing is, I see dying as sleeping without dreaming. Because you have no sense of time or consciousness. How will you know to wake up if you’re not even aware that you’re asleep?
Throughout my life, I’ve tried to fit in with the norm. Now I’m embracing the fact that I am a full fledged bohemian. Who said standing out has to remain a bad thing?


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