Netflix English Dub Discussion

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Postby Tumbling Down » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:21 am

The new Rei voice is really something. I'm used to Rei being emotionless, but I saw an official quote (maybe it was from Anno? This was years ago) that said something like Rei isn't emotionless, but she doesn't recognize that she has emotions. That's the exact feeling I'm getting from this performance. It's great.

Chuckman wrote:Can I just say I’m glad that Asuka actually sounds like a fourteen year old now?

Yeah, that makes sense. It makes me feel a bit uncomfortable, personally.

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Postby UrsusArctos » Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:05 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:I felt, to its credit, it didn't make me want to run away screaming until episode 21, at which point the endless barrage of bad "Seele" and "Fuyutsuki" mispronunciations tested my patience to the breaking point. That's far as we got.


Interesting. I never thought that the pronunciations would get worse over time.
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Re: Netflix English Dub Discussion

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Postby Reichu » Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:18 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:I may disagree with Reichu over the primacy of accuracy to the original translation

:???:

it’s wrong to try to silence her on the grounds that she doesn’t like dubs or whatever.

I specifically said "I have no affection for the old one" so if ShinKi's outburst was prompted by my post then my response can only be :uhh:.

But indeed, the gatekeeping is unnecessary.

@BlueBasilisk: The ghastly pronunciation of "Longinus" is in accordance with the standard anglicization. Put on the original "Hellboy", for instance, and John Hurt will pronounce it the exact same way.

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Postby kuribo-04 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:47 am

In this dub:
Eva-00 throws the Lance in episode 22 and doesn't scream.
:I
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Postby pearisdriving » Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:03 am

View Original Postkuribo-04 wrote:In this dub:
Eva-00 throws the Lance in episode 22 and doesn't scream.
:I

Yes. Evas and pepen are redubbed so i guess they just forgot this one. Eva01's scream is also noticably different. Another blooper is Ritsuko saying there is 0.000000% chance to activate eva01 in ep1

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Postby Reichu » Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:27 am

Based on episodes 18 and 19, anyway, a lot of the Eva sounds were left intact. It seems like they were only redone when characters were talking at the same time.

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:59 am

View Original PostSailor Star Dust wrote:I've been only checking out certain scenes with the new dub (DC 22 for instance) but this especially makes me happy.

Yeah, that was a really nice surprise for me too! Can't remember if I mentioned this here (been talking about the dub in a couple different places :p), but while I generally like Grant's work as Asuka I feel like she's missing something that Miyamura's Asuka has. I call it 'impishness' but I'm not really sure what the proper term would be. Maybe it's because Miyamura has a higher, softer voice compared to Grant's deeper, scratchier one, but I feel like the former brings a more playful quality to the character while the latter comes off more hostile even when she's not supposed to. It's perfect for jaded 3.0 Asuka but not so much the normal one.

The new VA's take doesn't come off so angry, but she can't quite match the quality of Grant's gut-wrenching, agonized wails. Feel much the same about Shinji's VA, come to think of it. Great much of the time but just doesn't quite hit the mark in the painful moments. I really like both of them and appreciate having the opportunity to compare ^_^
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Postby shinryujimikihiko » Sat Jun 22, 2019 12:57 pm

View Original PostKenno! wrote:Hello all,

Then again I have no idea where this "balls to the wall" line come from





That's aviator-speak for "make the vechicle move as fast as possible". Given who Asuka is it is not implausible.

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Postby ShinKikoho96 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:16 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote::???:


I specifically said "I have no affection for the old one" so if ShinKi's outburst was prompted by my post then my response can only be :uhh:.

But indeed, the gatekeeping is unnecessary.

@BlueBasilisk: The ghastly pronunciation of "Longinus" is in accordance with the standard anglicization. Put on the original "Hellboy", for instance, and John Hurt will pronounce it the exact same way.


I wasn't referring to you specifically, but other people who claimed, "I'm not a fan of dubs" and others who said 90% of dubs have bad voice acting. Which is of course ludicrous, but this is how people act.

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Postby fnikhall » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:07 pm

yeah I just felt like the new dub was meh. None of it was awful but I didn't think anyone of the VAs knocked it out of the park. I don't know if that was due to casting or directing or what but it just seemed uninspired. Asuka's voice especially seemed to be less energetic which bothered me. I don't know. I would say this dub is not as awful as the worst parts of the ADV dub, for example, the background and side characters are voiced much better, but the dub isn't as good as the best parts of the old dub. just seems average all around and maybe it's just me but I thought a lot of the voices sounded similar. I don't know, I just thought "meh."
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Postby fnikhall » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:08 pm

View Original PostBlueBasilisk wrote:Yeah, that was a really nice surprise for me too! Can't remember if I mentioned this here (been talking about the dub in a couple different places :p), but while I generally like Grant's work as Asuka I feel like she's missing something that Miyamura's Asuka has. I call it 'impishness' but I'm not really sure what the proper term would be. Maybe it's because Miyamura has a higher, softer voice compared to Grant's deeper, scratchier one, but I feel like the former brings a more playful quality to the character while the latter comes off more hostile even when she's not supposed to. It's perfect for jaded 3.0 Asuka but not so much the normal one.

The new VA's take doesn't come off so angry, but she can't quite match the quality of Grant's gut-wrenching, agonized wails. Feel much the same about Shinji's VA, come to think of it. Great much of the time but just doesn't quite hit the mark in the painful moments. I really like both of them and appreciate having the opportunity to compare ^_^


pretty much agree with this. the more emotional or impassioned moments of dialogue in the new dub seem to fall more flat even though for the most part its an improvement
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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Sat Jun 22, 2019 7:47 pm

Wow, I forgot how shity dialogue was.

So far no one can scream worth shit. I like the new voice actress for Asuka but she sounds way too young sometimes, like below 13 years old. I also like the new voice actor for Shinji but my God sometimes the dialogue just destroys everything.

I never appreciated how intense the kitchen scene in instrumentality was until I watched it here, this feels like what should have been spoken when I watched it the first time all those years ago.
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Postby Chuckman » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:26 pm

I don’t think she sounds younger than 13. We’re just used to hearing adults play all the roles. For me, the much more youthful voice brings the dubbed version closer to the character. She sounds like she’s faking confidence. Did a great job with EOE too.
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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:46 pm

I like the new dub Asuka more. I might be in the minority here but I never was a fan of Tiffany Grant's version of the character. The new Asuka does genuinely feel like a child who is trying to present herself as more mature than she is while Grant's always felt like an older woman putting on a child voice.

I flipped back and forth between the Japanese and English dub while revisiting the series these past two days. I don't watch dubs - since the original filmmakers are not involved with directing the performers I always feel there's a remove from the story because the new performers are mostly trying to imitate what someone else has done but that's just me - BUT the Netflix one seemed alright. I wasn't a fan of some voices and liked others. The new Asuka was the best change of the bunch and the new Misato was the worst - I haven't heard the new Hyuga everyone has talked about, will have to take a listen sometime - mainly because I think Allison Keith was the one member of the NGE and Rebuild dubs who actually did some pretty great performance work. The consistent thing I felt in the roughly four episodes worth of dubbed material I watched was that the performers were pretty good in casual conversation sequences but struggled in scenes were they had to really emote. Some readings came off very flat.

I know the Internet is binary now but from what little I listened to the new Eva Dub is definitely not "trash" nor is it likely "amazing". It sounds okay.

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Postby cyharding » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:49 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:"Grace" is a perfectly valid translation of koui. (Scroll down to the Wordnet entries here.) Considering who and what Kaworu is, evoking God is not exactly inappropriate. :p

As I have only indirect access to Netflix, I haven't seen anything from the show, but from what I've read on this thread about this line, I would have to agree. In fact, I looked into my old copy of of the Cathechism of the Catholic Church to see if that's what they meant. There was a lot of stuff in there to unpack, so I'll put down the most revelvent pieces:

1996...Grace is favor, the free and undeserved help that God gives us to respond to his call to become children of God, adoptive sons, partakers of the divine nature and of eternal life.

I'll add one more citation. It was written during the Council of Trent, as a supporting piece to an entry irelevent to this discussion, but I found it fitting to the subject at hand:

When God touches man's heart through the illumination of the Holy Spirit, man himself is not inactive while receiving that inspiration, since he could reject it; and yet, without God's grace, he cannot by his own free will move himself towards justice on God's sight.

To me, this suggests that by being with Kawrou, Shinji felt that he could be a better person, that he could get past his problems and have a future. So perhaps he saw him as a sort of quasi-messiah figure.

The uproar over suki and cries over -- lmfao -- "censorship" makes me just shake my head. You're correct that "like" perfectly captures the ambiguity of the word, but even more than that, the way Kaworu says it is somewhat indirect in the first place (in a way that does not really translate at all)! It was never meant to be some straightforward declaration of gay love or whatever.

I would really like to see how the line was translated into Greek. The reason is that there are four words in Greek for "love". If they use Phillia or Agape for love (which I think is the likely case), that would settle the issue.

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Postby ChaddyManPrime » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:54 pm

^
His own Personal Jesus you say?
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Postby cyharding » Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:00 pm

^Now that song is in my head. Well played.
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Postby BlueBasilisk » Sun Jun 23, 2019 3:41 am

So this is interesting:
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Postby ShinKikoho96 » Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:35 am

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:I like the new dub Asuka more. I might be in the minority here but I never was a fan of Tiffany Grant's version of the character. The new Asuka does genuinely feel like a child who is trying to present herself as more mature than she is while Grant's always felt like an older woman putting on a child voice.

I flipped back and forth between the Japanese and English dub while revisiting the series these past two days. I don't watch dubs - since the original filmmakers are not involved with directing the performers I always feel there's a remove from the story because the new performers are mostly trying to imitate what someone else has done but that's just me - BUT the Netflix one seemed alright. I wasn't a fan of some voices and liked others. The new Asuka was the best change of the bunch and the new Misato was the worst - I haven't heard the new Hyuga everyone has talked about, will have to take a listen sometime - mainly because I think Allison Keith was the one member of the NGE and Rebuild dubs who actually did some pretty great performance work. The consistent thing I felt in the roughly four episodes worth of dubbed material I watched was that the performers were pretty good in casual conversation sequences but struggled in scenes were they had to really emote. Some readings came off very flat.

I know the Internet is binary now but from what little I listened to the new Eva Dub is definitely not "trash" nor is it likely "amazing". It sounds okay.


Firstly, if you don't watch dubs, why are you giving an opinion? Secondly, Carrie Keranen refuted your odd argument about "original creators" so even your attempt at purism is unfounded. Also, most anime even in Japanese doesn't have the original director directing the performances. That's USUALLY the job of the SOUND director. Fourthly, what does being "original" or "having the original creator" have to do with quality? By your stance, Hayden Christensen was stellar in the Star Wars films. It's not a complete like for like, but this is similar. The Japanese was not perfect. It was very good, but not perfect. This is a fallacious argument.

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Postby pearisdriving » Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:58 am

People give their opinion because that's kind of the point of this thread. There is no requirement for how rigorously researched their thesis should be. It's not like we are deliberating what should we post as the official stance of the community about the dub or anything, we're just sharing impressions.
Their argument doesn't even seem to be that all dubs are of worse quality but that they are removed further away from the original staff's vision even if it's just a little bit. Even if the dub is superior to the original with better acting and direction and anything else it's still different and a 3rd/4th party's interpretation. Some people value authenticity over quality and they tend to be on the 'no dub' policy not because they think all dubs are low quality trash or anything. Of course there are people that are the latter but it does not really seem to be the case in this thread.


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