Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby MrUnimport » Fri Jul 20, 2018 8:20 pm

Would it destroy the integrity of the project for there to be a set of subtitles for use with the Director's Cut? I understand this is a controversial issue here, but seeing as I still have some friends who haven't seen the show, I'd like them to see the Director's Cut episodes as well as what seems to be the superior set of subs.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby Mjolnir Mark IV » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:04 am

HARVEST wrote:How about VOBSUB subtitles for the already-processed AVI files?
I did encounter some DVDs with fade-in/out in the subtitles.

This contradicts what I know about SUP files. But if you can find a way to prove you're right, I would be extremely interested.

HARVEST wrote:However, I think you should add in options for low-quality DVD-5, high-quality DVD-5 and high-quality DVD-9, since not all people can burn dual layer discs.

Good point. I'll try to remember to keep this in mind if I ever make discs an option for this project.

HARVEST wrote:Also, AFAIK, the field blending isn't ADV's fault, since the Archives DVDs are the same thing, judging from the DVD rips I got.

That would surprise me because they typically don't screw that kind of thing up in Japan with Evangelion. Hopefully it's just a botched rip you're looking at. There's no telling with bootlegs, especially NTSC sources ripped in PAL regions.

HARVEST wrote:my uncles got delayed by about a week, so it's going to take me longer to rip their DTS bootleg Perfect Collection DVDs, which I presume is identical to the official DVDs quality-wise

Based on your screenshot, I can confirm that the quality is not identical. It's immediately noticeable to me that your bootleg looks worse, even before comparing them side by side.

HARVEST wrote:I don't know if they have the Director's Cuts or the Feature Film, though, but I think they most likely don't have them.
Which means I might have to hunt for those DVDs myself through other means like eBay or Amazon, though I have limited funds so I probably can't buy stuff like that.

Try your local library. I'm always surprised by what I'm able to find at mine.

HARVEST wrote:I know that The Feature Film is still on-print but it's still too damn expensive.

Doing a cursory search, I see one going for $26.19. While that's high for a used DVD, I think it's worth it if you can afford it, because the alternative Manga DVD isn't nearly as good. And the DTS release is $14.10, although I haven't yet confirmed if the video for the DTS release is identical to the Dolby Digital release (and thus whether or not it's compatible with the EoE subtitles I did).

But didn't you say the Blu-ray release of the movie is good? You know how to use Aegisub, so adjusting my subtitles for it should be a simple task for you. If not, hit me up.

HARVEST wrote:Can you give us a timeframe on when the update of the subtitles will come out?

I've got a lot on my plate at the moment so that's difficult to do. But I would be surprised (and disappointed) if it didn't happen before 2018 is over.

HARVEST wrote:Also, you said in a previous post with Sephirotic that you will update some of those shot restorations, particularly, you will fix a glitch with the sunrise in Episode 4.

The sunrise shot in episode 4 is fixed! (As you will see in the next release.) Same for the episode 4 preview at the end of episode 3.

HARVEST wrote:This is my first time watching the Perfect Collection, and I find that it has Yebisu in some scenes, indicating that it's the home video version, except for the last six episodes, which are the TV broadcast versions.
So, I guess the Second Impact Box is still a valid unaltered version even if it's slightly different.
The AoE box is the only 100% true to the TV broadcast version

Good to know!

HARVEST wrote:But still, this slightly crappy bootleg will do until I raise enough money to buy an actual Perfect Collection box, plus the Director's Cut DVDs and the Renewal Feature Film.

You know, I haven't actually seen the Archives Box DVDs, but if I were you, I would save up for that instead of the Perfect Collection—if you can. The two sets are closer in price now than they were a few years ago. I realize my project doesn't officially support the Archives Box, but it seems like the better investment, if you can get your hands on the official release (the Second Impact Box was outrageously expensive last time I saw it for sale—but now I can't even find it). Although it sounds like you're also interested in the English audio, so if that's the case, the Perfect Collection is the best choice for the original version of the series.

HARVEST wrote:The real bad news comes from the fact that I can't use your subs with this bootleg

Too bad, but the good news is that I think you'll notice a nice difference by upgrading to an official release, if you can afford it. The bootleg release you have looks pretty low quality. Check with your local library. The Perfect Collection is all over the ones near me.

HARVEST wrote:And if I study video editing and get the clean OP from the Platinum Edition (color-corrected to match the Perfect Collection) and add in new English credits more closely accurate to the Japanese placement, since I find the English credits placement weird, especially Director: Hideaki Anno appearing after the black screen fading into Eva Unit 01.

You're going to get much better results by using the clean opening from the special features of the DC DVDs, NGE: Resurrection and NGE: Reborn, which came out before the Platinum Edition. That way you won't have to do any color correcting, which I can almost guarantee is going to be impossible to get right with the Platinum Edition. The clean opening and closing are included in both of those older DC DVDs as extras, but I forget if it's the same on both discs.

HARVEST wrote:Also, there's some untranslated text in the Perfect Collection which are subbed in the Platinum Edition.
I would really love it if you put in some of the Platinum Edition text subtitles.

I'm really glad you mentioned this. I've actually already added a few to episode 12 that you will see in the next release. However, I only added ones I happened to notice when comparing specific subtitles. I haven't gone through the entire series looking for these, so if there's any you can think of off the top of your head, let me know.

HARVEST wrote:There are also some overlays which need to be restored in Episodes 05 and 06.

Which ones? There are some minor corrections that are impractical to make to subtitles embedded into the video, and other than that, I've already restored the title screens, so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

HARVEST wrote:P.S: I think the episode numbers should be in word form to replicate the Japanese titles which are in old Kanji (I think).
The Platinum Edition uses word form numbers for the numbers.

Thank you, you bring up an excellent point here, but I think an equally important question is:
How common is it in anime for an episode number to be written in old kanji?

In other words, adapting the effect the numbers in the titles have on the viewer is just as important as considering a literal counterpart to how the numbers are written. I can't consider changing it until someone is positive (or very nearly certain) of the following:
  1. Are the numbers in the TV episode titles of Neon Genesis Evangelion (1995–1996) written in old kanji?
  2. Is such a way of numbering Japanese TV episodes in general common or uncommon? What about anime episodes specifically?
  3. Is spelling the numbers out rather than using Arabic numerals an appropriate English equation to Japanese numbers written in old kanji?

HARVEST wrote:While the Director's Cut and EoE should be in Arabic numbers.
I know that the Director's Cut episode numbers are still in old Kanji but this is to connect the Director's Cut episodes better to EoE.
For example: Air should be Episode 25, and the Director's Cut of At Least, Be Humane should be Episode 22, while the Original Airing version if it will be Episode Twenty Two.

I'm starting to get confused, so let's start with the way things are before getting into how they should be:
Which episode titles use old kanji?
Which ones use Arabic numerals?
And are there any that use...I dunno, something else?

HARVEST wrote:Unaltered (Perfect Collection):
Image

Correction: Perfect Collection BOOTLEG.
I can tell right away it looks worse than it should.

And I'm not any happier about the changes made to the original version than you are, but it should be noted that ditching the widescreen is a change present in all releases of the edited version of the series (so that means Renewal, Platinum Edition, and Blu-ray all ditch the widescreen).

MrUnimport wrote:Would it destroy the integrity of the project for there to be a set of subtitles for use with the Director's Cut? I understand this is a controversial issue here, but seeing as I still have some friends who haven't seen the show, I'd like them to see the Director's Cut episodes as well as what seems to be the superior set of subs.

Thanks! And good question. Would it bother you if I released the DC subtitles as a separate project? It would be a companion project, so the format and look of the subtitles would be identical.

To answer your question directly, it probably wouldn't destroy the integrity of this project as long as I package it as a bonus and make it clear that the DC episodes never made it to the west on VHS. But I feel compelled to release it as a separate-but-connected project simply to prevent people from mistakenly believing that the DC episodes were officially released on VHS with English subtitles.

Bear in mind this is all hypothetical. Working on the DCs is lower priority because until I wrap up the pending corrections with the original episodes, starting work on the DCs could potentially mean doubling the workload for any corrections I make to episodes 21–24. But you're doing the right thing by expressing interest in the DC episodes. That encourages me to do them—although as I mentioned before, I also have something else up my sleeve for those...
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby ShonHam » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:34 am

This is really good stuff man!
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby HARVEST » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:56 am

Thanks for the updates, I have been waiting for a long time.
My bootlegs don't have DTS but at least the audio is apparently bit-perfect with the official DVDs (I compared the audio bitrates with the official bitrates in Svenge's Compendium, and it has a Dolby Surround flag).

I wish I can sync the Perfect Collection dubs with the Archives DVDs if I get my hands on them.

I think I saw some papers in episode 05 which were photoshopped to English, not sure about episode 06, however.
Just a hunch because they were packaged together in the VHS.

As for episode 03, the emergency broadcast interruption is still photoshopped in English, and if you go frame-by-frame, you can spot a glimpse of the un-photoshopped Japanese image.
This also happens at one point in episode 14, but I think you fixed it in your subtitles anyway.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby HARVEST » Thu Jun 27, 2019 6:54 am

Got any news on this project?
It's been almost one year since I got any new info.

I really hope you're making good progress on that update.

Also, I finally found legit copies of the Perfect Collection, and Vol. 1 is the fixed version with better video quality and Japanese text with forced English subs.
I really hope you update the subs for Episodes 01 - 04 to have versions for both the old and newer versions of Collection 0:1.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby TheMelonMan » Tue Jul 02, 2019 3:36 pm

View Original PostMjolnir Mark IV wrote:I'm starting to get confused, so let's start with the way things are before getting into how they should be:
Which episode titles use old kanji?
Which ones use Arabic numerals?
And are there any that use...I dunno, something else?

Since no one ever answered this (at least not here):
All of the original episode numbers are in kanji, with all instances of the numbers 1, 2, 3, 5, and 10 using archaic variants of the kanji. So, for example, episode 21 would be 第二十一話 using standard kanji but is displayed as 第弐拾壱話 in the episode numberings. As such, the only episodes that have no archaic kanji in them whatsoever are 4, 6, 7, 8, and 9. I did some cursory research on how other anime number their episodes and the standard appears to be Arabic numerals, so the use of archaic kanji is definitely distinctive.
Eva uses Arabic numerals in the Japanese episode titles for the Director's Cuts and the two parts of End; the episode 21 Director's Cut is 第21話, for example. It's functionally equivalent to the difference between 21 and 21' in the English titles.

Hope this helps. Cool project and I hope you're still finding time to work on it.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby robersora » Tue Jul 02, 2019 3:55 pm

I always liked the 21' designation. It's a derivative, after all.
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby Mjolnir Mark IV » Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:58 am

I've uploaded some screenshots of the fonts I'm trying to mimic in my subtitles. If anyone can find fonts that are a closer match than the ones I'm using, please let me know.
https://drive.google.com/open?id=19RT5d ... 9utgAxfmSX

Currently I'm using Helvetica Neue 75 Bold for the dialog subtitles, and Helvetica Neue 95 Black for larger text, like titles:
http://font2s.com/fonts/50691/helvetica ... UacRkdrwdU
http://font2s.com/fonts/50698/helvetica ... UacVEdrwdU

The screenshots are from the Perfect Collection, which as far as I can tell, uses the exact same fonts primarily used in the VHS tapes.

Some of these screenshots look like they were taken before fixing problems with the Perfect Collection video, but I don't think that makes a difference in matching the font.

TheMelonMan wrote:All of the original episode numbers are in kanji, with all instances of the numbers 1, 2, 3, 5, and 10 using archaic variants of the kanji. So, for example, episode 21 would be 第二十一話 using standard kanji but is displayed as 第弐拾壱話 in the episode numberings. As such, the only episodes that have no archaic kanji in them whatsoever are 4, 6, 7, 8, and 9. I did some cursory research on how other anime number their episodes and the standard appears to be Arabic numerals, so the use of archaic kanji is definitely distinctive.
Eva uses Arabic numerals in the Japanese episode titles for the Director's Cuts and the two parts of End; the episode 21 Director's Cut is 第21話, for example. It's functionally equivalent to the difference between 21 and 21' in the English titles.

This is extremely helpful, thank you very much! It seems this issue warrants further investigation.

HARVEST wrote:I think I saw some papers in episode 05 which were photoshopped to English, not sure about episode 06, however.

HARVEST wrote:As for episode 03, the emergency broadcast interruption is still photoshopped in English, and if you go frame-by-frame, you can spot a glimpse of the un-photoshopped Japanese image.
This also happens at one point in episode 14, but I think you fixed it in your subtitles anyway.

Are you talking about the real Perfect Collection or your bootleg? If you're talking about the Perfect Collection, please be more specific with which shots you're talking about. For most of them, I'm not sure which ones you mean, and for the shot in episode 3, I don't see the frame you mentioned. Timestamps would also help.

HARVEST wrote:Got any news on this project?
It's been almost one year since I got any new info.

The next release is still coming. Sorry, but you have to continue to be patient. I also have other projects besides Eva (and I took on two new ones last year, not long before my previous post, and another one a few months ago).

HARVEST wrote:Also, I finally found legit copies of the Perfect Collection, and Vol. 1 is the fixed version with better video quality and Japanese text with forced English subs.
I really hope you update the subs for Episodes 01 - 04 to have versions for both the old and newer versions of Collection 0:1.

Thank you for verifying this! I most definitely intend to address this.

ShonHam wrote:This is really good stuff man!

Thank you!
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby Mjolnir Mark IV » Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:08 am

View Original PostTheMelonMan wrote:I did some cursory research on how other anime number their episodes and the standard appears to be Arabic numerals, so the use of archaic kanji is definitely distinctive.

Is it distinctive for non-archaic kanji to be used for numbers in episode titles? Or was it distinctive, back in the mid 1990s?
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby AWinters » Tue Aug 18, 2020 5:54 am

Thank you for this!
I only ever watch the dubbed versions, but on the DVDs the subtitles are always phrased very differently to the dialogue which messes up my focus.
So glad this has been done!

Are episodes 21-24 the extended version? Do you have your subtitles in .ass format, please? I'm not sure what software works with the current format.

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby pwhodges » Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:52 pm

They're SSA subs. ASS is "Advanced SSA", so they're essentially the same.

As for the extended DC episodes, they weren't made at the time the original VHS subs were written.
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby AWinters » Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:13 pm

View Original Postpwhodges wrote:They're SSA subs. ASS is "Advanced SSA", so they're essentially the same.

As for the extended DC episodes, they weren't made at the time the original VHS subs were written.


Thank you. My laptop seems to be changing it into an odd format that's for DVD only. Sounds like it's a computer problem :facepalm:

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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby Mjolnir Mark IV » Tue Aug 25, 2020 8:28 am

View Original PostAWinters wrote:Thank you for this!
I only ever watch the dubbed versions, but on the DVDs the subtitles are always phrased very differently to the dialogue which messes up my focus.
So glad this has been done!

Are episodes 21-24 the extended version? Do you have your subtitles in .ass format, please? I'm not sure what software works with the current format.

I'm glad if these help you, but I was under the impression that none of the sub translations match the dub.

The subtitles are in the ASS format, but for the AutoGK set, I simply changed the file extension to SSA so they would work with AutoGK. You can open them in Aegisub and export them to a different format if you need to. But a typical video player should automatically display the subtitles when the subtitle file name is the same as the video (just don't change the file extension unless you know what you're doing). To get the episodes to display these subtitles, you'll have to get them into a video format that can display external subtitle files. Instructions on how to do this are included in the downnload.

There's a possibility I'll do the Director's Cut episodes at some point. More on that here:
View Original PostMjolnir Mark IV wrote:It would be a companion project, so the format and look of the subtitles would be identical.

To answer your question directly, it probably wouldn't destroy the integrity of this project as long as I package it as a bonus and make it clear that the DC episodes never made it to the west on VHS. But I feel compelled to release it as a separate-but-connected project simply to prevent people from mistakenly believing that the DC episodes were officially released on VHS with English subtitles.

Bear in mind this is all hypothetical. Working on the DCs is lower priority because until I wrap up the pending corrections with the original episodes, starting work on the DCs could potentially mean doubling the workload for any corrections I make to episodes 21–24. But you're doing the right thing by expressing interest in the DC episodes. That encourages me to do them—although as I mentioned before, I also have something else up my sleeve for those...
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Re: Neon Genesis Evangelion: Digitally Re-Created VHS Subtitles

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Postby Mjolnir Mark IV » Fri Jan 01, 2021 9:28 pm

The promised day has finally arrived. This project has been updated!

You can still use the same link in the initial post to download the new release, but here it is for convenience:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... lkzQlBMa28

Improved Overlay Functionality
You now have the option of watching the series with both graphical overlays such as episode titles permanently embedded into the video, and regular subtitles for dialog displayed as external overlays. You get the best of both worlds this way, with seamless transitions for the graphical overlays, and clear and crisp quality for both those overlays and the subtitles for dialog.

Translations of Writing
There are quite a few instances in the VHS and Perfect Collection where Japanese writing was never translated. I haven’t yet thoroughly combed through the entire series to find all of these, but I’ve found most of them, and I’m happy to say they’re now translated! You can easily identify these in the “Corrections” spreadsheet where they are listed under the “Status” column as “Added.”

Shot Restoration Improvements
  • The shot of the chore schedule in episode 2 now has motion (which ADV had edited out).
  • The part of my AVS script that caused the bouncing motion in the shot of the sunrise outside the theater in episode 4 has been fixed (as has the corresponding shot in the preview at the end of episode 3).
  • I made some contrast and color adjustments to the images used for shot restoration, primarily in episodes 1–4, to try and get them to match the video a little more closely.

New Shot Restoration
A new shot has been restored in episode 1! It's the one with the map that says “Projected Course” in the lower right corner. This is a quick and dirty fix, but at least it’s now higher quality than ADV’s edit of the shot was, and is also more faithful to the original now that the Japanese writing has been restored.

More Accurate Names
  • Lilim has been changed to Lilin.
  • Keel has been changed to Kiel.
  • Kaoru has been changed to Kaworu.
  • NERV has been changed to Nerv.
  • MAGI has been changed to Magi.
  • SEELE been changed to Seele.

Spelled Out Episode Numbers in Titles
Episode numbers in titles are now spelled out rather than being written in Arabic numerals. This is to represent the apparently unique choice to use archaic Kanji in the original Japanese titles. A consequential bonus is that this also helps to further differentiate the two episode titles in each episode.

Deinterlacing-Error Fixes
Deinterlacers aren’t perfect and do get confused every now and then. Sometimes the one implemented in these AviSynth scripts will mistake an intentional horizontal line in the art for interlacing, and attempt to deinterlace it, which ends up making part of the line wobble. I’m not sure fixing every little quirk is a practical endeavor, but I’ve gone through and manually fixed the deinterlacing errors that are the most noticeable.

Slight Video-Quality Improvement
I added a de-blocker to the AviSynth scripts that—for the most part—slightly improves the video quality of the Perfect Collection. As a small bonus, this de-blocker also results in slightly smaller file sizes for the videos. It’s my understanding that a higher quality de-blocker exists, but because its parameters would have to be fine-tuned for each episode, it doesn’t sound like a practical use of the time I have for this project for the difference we would see in quality.

Streamlined Audio-Process
Individual VirtualDub settings are now included for each episode, which makes adding audio to your video much easier. I’ve also changed the method for adding audio from AviDemux to VDub. So that’s one less program you have to deal with to process the videos. And because of this change, I re-timed any subtitles that I had manually timed to audio. I also re-timed any subtitles that I had timed to video, because the changes in the new AviSynth scripts sometimes changed which frame a shot cuts on (but only by one frame).

Episode 8 Process Fixed
Episode 8 can now be processed without having to use two scripts (this episode has an odd issue that was previously corrected by using two scripts).

Miscellaneous
Various other corrections have been made throughout the series—capitalization in particular—but I’ve also made corrections to spelling, punctuation, grammar, idioms, timing, and translation. Ellipses have been corrected from three separate characters (...) to the prefabricated ellipsis character (…), and the use of spaces before and after ellipses has also been corrected.

And if you really want to know about every little thing that’s changed, the best way is to compare what’s in the “Corrections” spreadsheet of each release.

Thank You
Thank you to Harvest and Reichu in particular for making several of these improvements possible by offering your insight, and thank you to everyone else who has participated in the discussion here and helped improve the quality of this project. I’m looking forward to more of it in the future.

P.S. I would have finished this update sooner, but man, 2020 has been something else, hasn’t it? Here’s to a better, brighter, and happier new year. Happy new year, everyone!

Edit:
If you downloaded this new release before Sunday, January 3, 2021 at 5:30pm Coordinated Universal Time, please re-download it. The core files are exactly the same, but I've fixed an error with the instructional files that could very well leave you confused if you intend on processing any video.
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