"Reticence" discussion [spoilers]

Everything Evangelion Fanfiction related.

Moderator: Board Staff

Stillborn
Banned
User avatar
Posts: 2466
Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Location: Huge wastebin
Gender: Male

"Reticence" discussion [spoilers]

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Stillborn » Thu Jun 13, 2013 6:58 am

Split from main fanfic discussion page.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/9382989/1/Reticence


Nothing exceptional, but it is the first fanfic after 3.0 I've seen, so someone might be interested.

Starts where 3.0 ended. On the desert. And aside from Shinji getting to talkative to fast it seems to show both sides mentality pretty accurate.
Another jaded man.
Wciąż stoję nieruchomo, w nieżywym już szeregu. Umieram na stojąco, niech inni giną w biegu.

Kendrix
Defender of Puppy Boy
Defender of Puppy Boy
User avatar
Age: 27
Posts: 6023
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Location: Germany
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Kendrix » Thu Jun 13, 2013 9:46 am

^Agreed. Finally a fic that doesn't sugarcoat or explain away the factual uglyness of what the characters have become.
Q!Asuka is appropiately pityless/ soldier-like.

My little heart constricted each time poor ReiQ was called "it"...

My only complaint would be Shinji - While the rationale they have him use for defending himself is one I would agree with, in his current mindset, he probably wouldn't think he has any right to defend himself in any way/believe anything that gets yelled in his direction and just retreat deeper into his shell...

That said, I don't think Asuka would that readily admit the whole "You had no clue but I blame you anyway because my life now sucks" aspect. It's not a partcularly rational PoV someone would hold without other justifications on top of it.

This is a common mistake, I guess, not to differentiate between the truth of the characters and their own view of it; If they did understand those things, half their problems would already be solved.

For example, Shinji's thought process in a situation that has him hiding away under his blanket with his SDAT player set to maximum volume after he screwed up something wouldn't involve anything like "Ah, me and my inability to handle teh RL!" but, depending on the exact situation of more something like "All of this is so unfair and I can't do anything about it! It's not as if I asked for this clusterfuck!" or "All I can do is screw up, I don't feel like ever leaving this hole again, what's the point?"
Alas poor Kaworu, I knew him well...

driftking18594
Bridge Bunny
Bridge Bunny
User avatar
Age: 26
Posts: 1656
Joined: Sep 26, 2011
Location: NERV Irish Branch
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby driftking18594 » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:09 am

View Original PostStillborn wrote:http://www.fanfiction.net/s/9382989/1/Reticence


Nothing exceptional, but it is the first fanfic after 3.0 I've seen, so someone might be interested.

Starts where 3.0 ended. On the desert. And aside from Shinji getting to talkative to fast it seems to show both sides mentality pretty accurate.


Now that I think of it, I'm rather dismayed at Asuka's portrayal at the end of 3.0. Surely she has suffered trauma on-par with watching Kaworu's head go pop, and surely she would understand Shinji's pain?

Stillborn
Banned
User avatar
Posts: 2466
Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Location: Huge wastebin
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Stillborn » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:41 am

View Original Postdriftking18594 wrote:Now that I think of it, I'm rather dismayed at Asuka's portrayal at the end of 3.0. Surely she has suffered trauma on-par with watching Kaworu's head go pop, and surely she would understand Shinji's pain?


But as Shinji stated. She is soldier. She had time to harden herself and strangle most of empathy. He is just a kid whose world changed like nightmarish kaleidoscope, in a single day of his perception.
Another jaded man.
Wciąż stoję nieruchomo, w nieżywym już szeregu. Umieram na stojąco, niech inni giną w biegu.

Blue Monday
Angel
Angel
User avatar
Age: 31
Posts: 3363
Joined: Jun 17, 2012
Location: Earth-33

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Blue Monday » Thu Jun 13, 2013 7:31 pm

View Original Postdriftking18594 wrote:Now that I think of it, I'm rather dismayed at Asuka's portrayal at the end of 3.0. Surely she has suffered trauma on-par with watching Kaworu's head go pop, and surely she would understand Shinji's pain?

But here's the thing - She wouldn't know anything about the Kaworu drama and all that.
From her POV (One outside of Eva-13) it just comes across as another of Impact Boy's tantrums that, you know, tend to mess the world up a bit.

The reason she goes back for him though is that she still cares, same reason why Misato didn't pull the trigger on the choker. She still has compassion for a fellow human being. And she would have the insight to understand there would've been more going on to what met her and Wille's eyes, etcetera.


Oh, up to chapter seven of Genocide: Extended too.
Enjoying it immensely so far.
"Eva(Geeks) is a story that repeats."
Warren Peace, #643919

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:11 am

View Original PostBlue Monday wrote:But here's the thing - She wouldn't know anything about the Kaworu drama and all that.
From her POV (One outside of Eva-13) it just comes across as another of Impact Boy's tantrums that, you know, tend to mess the world up a bit.

The reason she goes back for him though is that she still cares, same reason why Misato didn't pull the trigger on the choker. She still has compassion for a fellow human being. And she would have the insight to understand there would've been more going on to what met her and Wille's eyes, etcetera.

Yeah, that's my main grip with this story so far : I can perfectly understand that Asuka is angry, frustrated and don't know the details of what happened to Shinji during his stays in neo-NERV, explaining her rudeness, but here the author seems to make her cross the line between rude and outright cruel :
- first her though that the only thing that made her brought Shinji with her is her duty as a Captain and pilot for WILLE, and that without that she would gladly let him rot and die in the middle of the desert like the "waste of air" that she thinks she is.
- secondly her reaction to Shinji's arguments : she acknowledges his arguments that he wasn't pilot material and wasn't informed on almost anything an Evangelion can do if pushed too hard, she even agree with them... and told him that she don't give a shit and that since WILLE at least managed to got their hands on him, he's the one that's gonna pay for everyone : Gendo, Fuyutsuki and SEELE. Worst, she promised him that WILLE are gonna make his life hell until there is nothing more left of him than his cold cadaver!

As Shinji noted, that's not sternness at this level, it's outright malice! And that's go against everything we saw of Asuka in Q. Yes she has pent-up anger and grief, is extremely frustrated by him, but she's don't hate him, hell she called for his help during Operation US, she would have never do that if she hated him, instead she more likely would have just cursed the fact that she's gonna to die by the hands of Code 04B to retrieve that piece of shit of Shinji!

From now I'm withholding a definitive judgment, since it's possible that what she said is actually born from her anger and tiredness, that her comment about how it's just duty that make her help Shinji is just her trying to convince herself that there is not any emotion tied to her decision, and that she get better later.
But so far all of the three multi-chapter stories taking place post-3.0 fell on the trap to transform one of the characters into a class-A bitch : Misato in You will (not) fail, and Asuka in both The earth is (not) a cold dead place and this one.
Looks like it's really hard to capt all the ambiguity of the post time-skip characters, or the authors don't bother.
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

Stillborn
Banned
User avatar
Posts: 2466
Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Location: Huge wastebin
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Stillborn » Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:50 am

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:Yeah, that's my main grip with this story so far : I can perfectly understand that Asuka is angry, frustrated and don't know the details of what happened to Shinji during his stays in neo-NERV, explaining her rudeness, but here the author seems to make her cross the line between rude and outright cruel :
- first her though that the only thing that made her brought Shinji with her is her duty as a Captain and pilot for WILLE, and that without that she would gladly let him rot and die in the middle of the desert like the "waste of air" that she thinks she is.


Well it's open for discussion as nearly all in Eva. Her coming back can be seen as care, or as anecessity: She returned for the same reason WILLE wanted to hold him even if he is useless - Because he's impact trigger. So leaving him where NERV may retrieve him in case he still have any value would be foolish, so better safe than sorry.

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:- secondly her reaction to Shinji's arguments : she acknowledges his arguments that he wasn't pilot material and wasn't informed on almost anything an Evangelion can do if pushed too hard, she even agree with them... and told him that she don't give a shit and that since WILLE at least managed to got their hands on him, he's the one that's gonna pay for everyone : Gendo, Fuyutsuki and SEELE. Worst, she promised him that WILLE are gonna make his life hell until there is nothing more left of him than his cold cadaver!


That's pretty often, real life human reaction.

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:As Shinji noted, that's not sternness at this level, it's outright malice!


Actually I can expect that from someone in her position.

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:And that's go against everything we saw of Asuka in Q. Yes she has pent-up anger and grief, is extremely frustrated by him, but she's don't hate him, hell she called for his help during Operation US, she would have never do that if she hated him, instead she more likely would have just cursed the fact that she's gonna to die by the hands of Code 04B to retrieve that piece of shit of Shinji!


Could have been a spur of a moment. Also hypocrysy is a common thing, especially in Eva. Probably from everyone aside from PenPen.

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:From now I'm withholding a definitive judgment, since it's possible that what she said is actually born from her anger and tiredness, that her comment about how it's just duty that make her help Shinji is just her trying to convince herself that there is not any emotion tied to her decision, and that she get better later.


For me, I neither praise nor criticise it to hard. It has some mistakes but it just shows another persons opinion and POV on Evas characters.

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:But so far all of the three multi-chapter stories taking place post-3.0 fell on the trap to transform one of the characters into a class-A bitch : Misato in You will (not) fail, and Asuka in both The earth is (not) a cold dead place and this one.
Looks like it's really hard to capt all the ambiguity of the post time-skip characters, or the authors don't bother.


I'm thinking it's the ambiguity. We don't have mutch to work on, and what we saw is rather harsh, so bias is natural. I doubt anyone aside from character haters or someone like Issei, would purposfuly botcher characterisation.
Another jaded man.
Wciąż stoję nieruchomo, w nieżywym już szeregu. Umieram na stojąco, niech inni giną w biegu.

Kendrix
Defender of Puppy Boy
Defender of Puppy Boy
User avatar
Age: 27
Posts: 6023
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Location: Germany
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Kendrix » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:07 pm

View Original Postdriftking18594 wrote:Now that I think of it, I'm rather dismayed at Asuka's portrayal at the end of 3.0. Surely she has suffered trauma on-par with watching Kaworu's head go pop, and surely she would understand Shinji's pain?


...as if her anime counterpart didn't hate his guts/ever showed him any mercy.

But yeah, I guess anime!Asuka hated him more or less by default, because she hates the whole world, because he's an eva pilot, because he reminds her of her unfaithful father.
Q!Asuka loathes Shinji specifically...

It is *because* she experienced such trauma herself that she has no shred of empathy left for Shinji. Because she was on the way to become a better human being by 2.0/showing kindness to *Rei* of all people - So what turned her into this?
The horrors of the post impact world.
She knew him as a mildly annoying kid for two weeks or so (not the months of the original series), and as "the thing that took her future away" for 14 years.
Frankly, Asuka would have to be extraoirdinarily strong(Like Mari) or messiaic levels of pure hearted (Like Sakura or Kaworu) to NOT succumb to what is, sadly, human nature. This is authentic realistic behavior for humans stuck in hellholes: Burn the witch!
Sadly, many people would react that way if they were in Asuka's shoes - She has been under constant combat for over a decade, TI probably killed her father and stepmother, assuming they still exist in Rebuild verse, and the same goes for Hikari.

This is the horror factor of the movie.
(Aside from the fact that they were all, without exception, cheated out of their future. )
What people can do when they're pushed beyond all reason; See also Shinji vs Asuka and the unsuing spears fiasco. I don't think Shinji ever sunk as low as WILLE, but he certainly threw all rationality overboard, because that's what 99% of all people would do if they were thrust into his situation.



View Original PostStillborn wrote:Well it's open for discussion as nearly all in Eva. Her coming back can be seen as care, or as anecessity: She returned for the same reason WILLE wanted to hold him even if he is useless - Because he's impact trigger. So leaving him where NERV may retrieve him in case he still have any value would be foolish, so better safe than sorry.


That definitely was NOT a merciful sparing of his life; She's handling him like an object, lifting him up by his hair etc.
Normally you would have at least some reaction if you saw someone reduced to such a state, even your enemies - just those gaunt cheeks...
She was gonna leave him at first, she sighs in frustration before turning back, like you do when you have to force yourself to be an adult and do something you don't want to...
At best, she merely wants to recapture the dangerous prisoner as much as she wants him to rot, at worst, she thinks death is too merciful for him and wants him to actualy see/live in the hellhole he threw her into (in her perception)

View Original PostStillborn wrote:
Could have been a spur of a moment. Also hypocrysy is a common thing, especially in Eva. Probably from everyone aside from PenPen.


Exactly. Note that there were no thanks. Her expression afterwards reveals that she must have understood who saved her, but her opinion was, as that of an adult often is, already very much fixed and not easily influenced by one event.
What is one laser resque against years of living hell?
And what is so touching/romantic about "Do something you idiot?" - It's an expression of her being pissed/frustrated at the reason she's in this fucked up situation in the first place, the same "useless kid makes me clean up his messes for him instead of dealing with it himself" sentiment she held throughout the movie.

While the sentiment may not be 100% without justication, it is different from secretely wuving him.
Alas poor Kaworu, I knew him well...

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:56 pm

View Original PostKendrix wrote:She knew him as a mildly annoying kid for two weeks or so (not the months of the original series), and as "the thing that took her future away" for 14 years.

Did we have any hints of the time that passed between Asuka's arrival and N3I?
From a calendar on the wall of Misato's apartment, we know that she arrived on February 2018, but that's all.
And in NGE by the time EoE happened, Asuka and Shinji only knew each other for four months, three if you take out the month he spent absorbed inside EVA-01.
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

Kendrix
Defender of Puppy Boy
Defender of Puppy Boy
User avatar
Age: 27
Posts: 6023
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Location: Germany
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Kendrix » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:01 pm

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:Did we have any hints of the time that passed between Asuka's arrival and N3I?
From a calendar on the wall of Misato's apartment, we know that she arrived on February 2018, but that's all.
And in NGE by the time EoE happened, Asuka and Shinji only knew each other for four months, three if you take out the month he spent absorbed inside EVA-01.


Not any literal time statements, but if you consider that the katsuragi apparment was still filled with those not-yet unpacked boxes for half the movie, it can't have been that long.

---

On the earlier discussed subject of quality Rei fanfiction, I have, in fact, really enjoyed the material from this Ikarus-Onesun-guy you recomended.

In one of his ANs, he recomends this one, a short Rei (if not R/S) fic that mainly concerns itself with spelling out the horrors of her day to day life.
It's not perfect, but you can tell the author tried hard to depict her thinking patterns etc. as we see them in her inner monologues.
Alas poor Kaworu, I knew him well...

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Sun Jun 16, 2013 11:41 am

The second chapter of the post-3.33 story Stillborn talked about was just released today.

And I must say that this chapter managed to ease many of my concerns : it confirms that Asuka's malice in the first chapter came more from her anger and frustration than outright hate and malice, in this chapter she's slightly softer toward Shinji and tries to rouse him instead of putting him down.
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

Chuckman
Chuckman
Chuckman
User avatar
Age: 38
Posts: 8902
Joined: Nov 11, 2011
Location: Chuckman
Gender: Female

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Chuckman » Sun Jun 16, 2013 12:45 pm

2.22 takes place over a few weeks, maybe a month tops.
the prophecy is true

Statistical fact: Cops will never pull over a man with a huge bong in his car. Why? They fear this man. They know he sees further than they and he will bind them with ancient logics. —Marty Mikalski

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Sun Jun 16, 2013 1:24 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:2.22 takes place over a few weeks, maybe a month tops.

Well that's really hard to affirm that, if we compare with NGE according to an unofficial timeline created from all the details and dialogs in the series, seen here, between the anniversary of Yui's death(which in NTE was the moment Asuka appeared) and Zeruel's attack, approximatively two weeks and half passed(and barely less than two weeks before Bardiel's attack), which tends to confirm that 2.0 happened during the span of two weeks...
BUT, in the CRC the staff admitted that the reason Clockiel was created was because they lost the storyboards for the scenes of Asuka's appearance, which was supposed to be similar of NGE with Misato, Shinji and friends meeting Asuka in the aircraft carrier and Gahgiel attacking them... and that attack happened two months before Bardiel, worst, in 2.0 appears Sahaquiel which in NGE attacked before the anniversary of Yui's death.

View Original PostKendrix wrote:Not any literal time statements, but if you consider that the katsuragi apparment was still filled with those not-yet unpacked boxes for half the movie, it can't have been that long.

The boxes we saw in the hall when Shinji resigned after the Bardiel fight has "Kuroshio Logistics" on it, and in the scene were Asuka moved in, it was shown that these boxes were actually containing Shinji's stuff. The boxes with Asuka's stuff have "Japan" written on them as well as a NERV's logo and a yellow adhesive with "Deutsche Post" on them, so the most plausible explanation is that when we saw these unopened boxes in the apartment hall, they were actually Shinji's(besides these boxes looks slightly crumpled, as if they already have been used), you see again the boxes with NERV logo and the yellow adhesive in Asuka's room, there is only five left and are already opened(it's probably the stuff she couldn't found a place to store it, there was a lot of boxes after all)

So... yeah, actually I don't have any idea of how much time 2.0 covered...
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

Stillborn
Banned
User avatar
Posts: 2466
Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Location: Huge wastebin
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Stillborn » Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:13 pm

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:The second chapter of the post-3.33 story Stillborn talked about was just released today.

And I must say that this chapter managed to ease many of my concerns : it confirms that Asuka's malice in the first chapter came more from her anger and frustration than outright hate and malice, in this chapter she's slightly softer toward Shinji and tries to rouse him instead of putting him down.


What are your remaining concerns?
Another jaded man.
Wciąż stoję nieruchomo, w nieżywym już szeregu. Umieram na stojąco, niech inni giną w biegu.

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:18 pm

View Original PostStillborn wrote:What are your remaining concerns?

Well my main concern was that this story would be a dark fic with Shinji getting continually mentally(and maybe physically) tortured by the WILLE members transformed into enraged torturers, until the very end where he will die in a corner alone and miserable with no one giving a shit about it, or a situation which could have been avoided if Shinji was in a better state which ends by the remains of mankind being annihilated.

I'm sure that Shinji's return with WILLE will not be a heartwarming reunion and that everyone will be angry with him, not only for N3I but also for N4I, and that it will a very long and hard road before he can earn a slight piece of their trust.
My remaining concern is how his life at WILLE will go : that will be a fine line between rightfully chewing on the brat who almost doomed them all again and make their huge assholes bordering on a bunch of Nazis... what I mean is that if Shinji wants to grow as a person he will have to help WILLE not only by guilt, but also because he understand what they lived these past 14 years, that he shared that wretched life with them and because he will grown to genuinely care about them, if not then the story only have to kill off Misato and Asuka(and maybe Sakura too) and he will regress to the exact same state of mind that in EoE when he lost all hope and thrown the whole world into tangificaiton by pure spite.

Also I'm very surprised by the author's choice to make Shinji fall into catatonia again right in the middle of Asuka's rousing speech, especially since this time, unlike her speech in chapter 1 were she was talking out of pure anger, she was softer and really tried to rouse him... and then BAM! Catatonia! That makes me wonder if Shinji's spacing outs are really from his mental state, and if they actually don't have another source, maybe a side effect of being speared by the two LoL?
Last edited by ElMariachi on Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

Stillborn
Banned
User avatar
Posts: 2466
Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Location: Huge wastebin
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Stillborn » Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:29 pm

I imagined something yet different. Everyone assumes that Shinji should mature after seeing how WILLE and other people lives in the world he created... But 14 years of this world has really turned everyone into bitter assholes. And they are either adamant too keep Shinji in cell as to dangerous to let out... Or make him experience the same shithole, that turned them into they current states... Then my question would be... What will Shinji turn into if exposed to this world? What grow up would mean for him? I can imagine him becoming "good" Gendo. While not trying to end the world, he will become focused but at the same time distant and unapproachable. Either out of guilt or through heart hardning like everyone else, he will become unpleasant person to be around, like his father.
Another jaded man.
Wciąż stoję nieruchomo, w nieżywym już szeregu. Umieram na stojąco, niech inni giną w biegu.

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:03 am

Well a Gendo-like Shinji would be interesting to see if handled well, what makes Gendo truly dangerous is all the power he have.
Actually the Shinji you depict would be extremely similar to the young Gendo we saw in episode 21 of NGE, before he met Yui : an "asshole" accustomed to being hated and who involve himself in a lot of fights, the big difference being that Gendo is a tall man while Shinji is rather short for his age and is probably touched by the curse of Eva trapping him into a 14 years old body!(ouch!)
Now if he actually become something like that we will have to see if he stays that way or if someone manages to bring out a better side of him...
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger

Stillborn
Banned
User avatar
Posts: 2466
Joined: Apr 28, 2013
Location: Huge wastebin
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Stillborn » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:24 am

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:Well a Gendo-like Shinji would be interesting to see if handled well, what makes Gendo truly dangerous is all the power he have.
Actually the Shinji you depict would be extremely similar to the young Gendo we saw in episode 21 of NGE, before he met Yui : an "asshole" accustomed to being hated and who involve himself in a lot of fights, the big difference being that Gendo is a tall man while Shinji is rather short for his age and is probably touched by the curse of Eva trapping him into a 14 years old body!(ouch!)
Now if he actually become something like that we will have to see if he stays that way or if someone manages to bring out a better side of him...


Yeah, that would be another painfull and disgracefull stage for him. As unpleasant as Gendo, and nowhere near as sucessfull. All the faults and no strenghts.

I maybe repeat myself, but none of known characters evolved into someone better, during those 14 years. So I can't see how Shinji recieving "14 years of shitworld", just in sped up and condensed form, will help him become a better person. Shinji may grow up, but with this circumstances, it may not be becoming better.

And I'm afraid it will be downplayed, as if Shinji will suddenly become happy and motivated, where it shouldn't be mentally possible. I just don't know if it will happen in the fanfic or in Final. Or maybe both.

In second chapter, Asuka says she don't hate him. But at the very least, she contepmt him. Shinji very well may become someone who will be once again doing what is demanded of him, but this time convinced that not only his life is unworthy, but even his death.

The most healthy outcome for him, would be if after he is deemed usless finally, to disappear somewhere and break any contact with those who knew him. That is if he ever manages to repent in their eyes and they let him go.
Another jaded man.
Wciąż stoję nieruchomo, w nieżywym już szeregu. Umieram na stojąco, niech inni giną w biegu.

NemZ
Token Misanthrope
Token Misanthrope
User avatar
Posts: 15804
Joined: Jun 28, 2008
Location: St. Louis
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby NemZ » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:44 am

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:And I must say that this chapter managed to ease many of my concerns : it confirms that Asuka's malice in the first chapter came more from her anger and frustration than outright hate and malice, in this chapter she's slightly softer toward Shinji and tries to rouse him instead of putting him down.


It was a bit better, at first. The conversation with ReiQ was awkward as hell though, and him going back into ragdoll mode was questionable. His recovery was pretty abrupt, but if you're going to do that then you should stick to it.
Rest In Peace ~ 1978 - 2017
"I'd consider myself a realist, alright? but in philosophical terms I'm what's called a pessimist. It means I'm bad at parties." - Rust Cohle
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize that half of 'em are stupider than that." - George Carlin
"The internet: It's like a training camp for never amounting to anything." - Oglaf
"I think internet message boards and the like are dangerous." - Anno

ElMariachi
Le Posteur Verbeux
Le Posteur Verbeux
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 7231
Joined: Feb 26, 2013
Location: France
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby ElMariachi » Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:45 pm

I think that the awkwardness of Shinji's conversation with ReiQ is pretty well rendered : ReiQ's bluntness in her questioning fits very well with someone as socially inept than her, and coupled with Shinji's unwillingness to talk about "his" Rei but still doing because he needs to talk to someone that won't judge him, or because he thinks he owes her that much is what makes that scene work so well.

I was also surprised by him going back into "ragdoll mode", especially since Asuka was much softer this time and actually tried to help Shinji, that's why I think that this time the cause may not be psychological, but physical...


View Original PostStillborn wrote:In second chapter, Asuka says she don't hate him. But at the very least, she contepmt him. Shinji very well may become someone who will be once again doing what is demanded of him, but this time convinced that not only his life is unworthy, but even his death.

The most healthy outcome for him, would be if after he is deemed usless finally, to disappear somewhere and break any contact with those who knew him. That is if he ever manages to repent in their eyes and they let him go.

She explicitly though that deep down, she still have hope that he could change for the better and move forward, and Asuka isn't someone who just wish silently for something to happen, but will make everything to make them happens, and judging by her comment about how from now on Shinji will observe her, do what she says and learn from her, she seems to have taken the role of "mentor" to this new world(at least unconsciously) and will certainly not allow Shinji to become some sort of Death Seeker a la Rei II!
Besides, to have the occasion to sacrifice himself, first he will have to be in a position to risks said life : for all we know Misato will put him on the cleaning team or in the kitchen!
And same thing about disappearing, Asuka will certainly not let him disappear like that, even if WILLE deems that they are done with him!

Now we will have to see if the fic will be only about Shinji coming in term with what he did and trying to find his place in the new world, or if some action will happen, in which case the plot will surely make it so Shinji will have to get into a fucking robot again!
And what I want to see is Mari's more than probable teasing about Asuka's taking the role of "Big Sister"("Well well princess, you seems awfully adamant about being the one to train the Puppy Boy! Did you missed him that much those past 14 years?" :nyao: )
Last edited by ElMariachi on Mon Jun 17, 2013 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Avatar: THE HIGHEST OF ALL HIGHS WE AAAAAAAAAARE!!!
Kensuke is a military otaku who, at one point, is shown creepily taking pictures of girls to sell. He would clearly fit right in as an animator at Studio Gainax. -- Compiling_Autumn
EoTV is a therapist, EoE is a drill instructor. -- Chuckman
Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger


Return to “Fanfiction”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests