The other countries in NGE and RB

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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The other countries in NGE and RB

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Postby Flick » Wed Aug 03, 2011 10:35 pm

I haven't seen NGE in along time, although I'm revisiting the series now, but I recently seen the rebuild 1.11 and 2.22 and have atleast two questions that been bugging me.

As most of you know in the rebuild theres a limitation on how many active Evas are allowed active in a country at once, I'm not sure if that was ever mentioned in the original series or not but that doesn't effect my questions too much.

I'm going to make the assumption that rest of the world has EVA's of their own, and we already know this is atleast partly true with germany having 03 and america with 04 and in the rebuild with Europe and Russia having Unit 05, now with that said are there other units simply not known about in the show? I'm going to assume yes due to the fact theres a limit of how many each nation can have or perhaps Japan was simply first to hit that limit with the rest of the worlds nerv programs trying to play catch-up.

Part two, if the rest of the world has Eva's does that also mean that angels have been attacking the rest of the world and if they are what is their goal? I thought Lilith and the third impact was their main driving force into attacking Tokyo-3 trying to enter the dogma, perhaps that is their goal and they merely cross into other countries on their route.

Or am I missing something? Perhaps the rest of the world is ignorant to the third impact possibility and the angels for the most part and only have EVA's as a new arms race like a nuclear arm race being the equivalent.
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Postby Warren Peace » Wed Aug 03, 2011 11:22 pm

Other countries aid in Project Eva because the fate of the whole world is at stake. Third Impact would mean the obliteration of us all, so it's an easy rallying point. Your "arms race" comparison is spot on, the limit is about not letting any one country have too much of this new power.

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Re: The other countries in NGE and RB

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Postby Hyper Shinchan » Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:08 am

View Original PostFlick wrote:I'm going to make the assumption that rest of the world has EVA's of their own, and we already know this is atleast partly true with germany having 03 and america with 04

Maybe it was just a typo but Germany/Europe produced only Eva-02 before the mass production of Eva Series in NGE, Eva-03 and 04 were both produced by US in both NGE and NME.
View Original PostFlick wrote:Europe and Russia having Unit 05

I don't think it's ever been mentioned who produced Eva-05, I thought that it was Russia but it's only a personal vibe (I'd exclude US because they produced already two Evas, it's possible that it was moved from Europe, though).
View Original PostFlick wrote:Part two, if the rest of the world has Eva's does that also mean that angels have been attacking the rest of the world and if they are what is their goal? I thought Lilith and the third impact was their main driving force into attacking Tokyo-3 trying to enter the dogma, perhaps that is their goal and they merely cross into other countries on their route.

Or am I missing something? Perhaps the rest of the world is ignorant to the third impact possibility and the angels for the most part and only have EVA's as a new arms race like a nuclear arm race being the equivalent.

It's like you mentioned at the end, only Eva-05 was placed there with a precise purpose, guarding the Third Angel, the other units have been produced and are controlled by other countries simply for a game of political balance, Evas are first and foremost powerful weapons from a military and political point of view.
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Postby Petrucio » Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:26 am

Maybe the second impact caused so much damage in some countries that they had to start an EVA of their own. Or maybe they already had plans to do this even before the second impact.

Or maybe some countries were secretly making their Evas inside other countries (like in that movie/book, "Contact", America built one of those giant gates that exploded first, due to sabotage, and then after that we learn there was another one being secretly built in Japan.)

Nevertheless, if a country can build an Eva, they are smart enough not to start using it in some type of attack against other countries. Maybe the angels are after the missing pieces of Lilith, and this is why some countries need an Eva of their own. Maybe there are more than one black moon buried deep in the ground. Or maybe there are more than one passage leading to it, othen than the Geo-Front.

The Geofront passage is straight to the point, but maybe the other passages are tortuous and like a labyrinth. It is easy to get inside trough those, but to get out, due to the gravitational pull, the GeoFront is the only way out.

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Postby Flick » Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:09 am

Thanks for the replies guys.

Warren Peace

Other countries aid in Project Eva because the fate of the whole world is at stake. Third Impact would mean the obliteration of us all, so it's an easy rallying point. Your "arms race" comparison is spot on, the limit is about not letting any one country have too much of this new power.


Thats assuming the rest of the world knows about the chance of a "third impact"

Hyper Shinchan

Maybe it was just a typo but Germany/Europe produced only Eva-02 before the mass production of Eva Series in NGE, Eva-03 and 04 were both produced by US in both NGE and NME.


Yes it was a typo

I don't think it's ever been mentioned who produced Eva-05, I thought that it was Russia but it's only a personal vibe (I'd exclude US because they produced already two Evas, it's possible that it was moved from Europe, though).


I think it's only suggested due to the fact it the facility was in Russian Waters, with Russian Cyrillic running everywhere with a UK pilot running 05.


It's like you mentioned at the end, only Eva-05 was placed there with a precise purpose, guarding the Third Angel, the other units have been produced and are controlled by other countries simply for a game of political balance, Evas are first and foremost powerful weapons from a military and political point of view.


And as for your last point, if the world knows about the chance of a third impact why would they even care about political balances? We see that the UN has almost complete control over the worlds military in a combined effort to prevent angel attacks and helping nerv when it can, so why would they even care about having EVA's of their own if they know the world could end as suddenly as we've seen angels appear over or near nerv HQ in Japan, It makes no sense to have you don't allow your goal to defend on his own, you have a defensive line for a reason and only having a possible 3 of 27(I came up with this number due to the amount of nerv HQ's and the 3 evas per country rule) players possible evas on the field especially if thats where the ball almost always is.

I understand Seele might of been behind a lot of this, but still doesn't make any sense, they can't be that powerful


Petrucio

Maybe the second impact caused so much damage in some countries that they had to start an EVA of their own. Or maybe they already had plans to do this even before the second impact.

Or maybe some countries were secretly making their Evas inside other countries (like in that movie/book, "Contact", America built one of those giant gates that exploded first, due to sabotage, and then after that we learn there was another one being secretly built in Japan.)


Thats assuming they knew about adam and had samples of him or Lilith to make clones/copies of their own to create evas

Nevertheless, if a country can build an Eva, they are smart enough not to start using it in some type of attack against other countries. Maybe the angels are after the missing pieces of Lilith, and this is why some countries need an Eva of their own. Maybe there are more than one black moon buried deep in the ground. Or maybe there are more than one passage leading to it, othen than the Geo-Front.

The Geofront passage is straight to the point, but maybe the other passages are tortuous and like a labyrinth. It is easy to get inside trough those, but to get out, due to the gravitational pull, the GeoFront is the only way out.


I like the box side the box thinking you got going on with these two paragraphs

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Postby Reichu » Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:14 am

Flick: Your reply format is rather difficult to understand (why isn't the author's name included in the quote tags? why are you replying within the quotes?), and makes it difficult for people to respond to you in turn (try replying to your own post, and you'll see what I mean). If you could use the format that is standard across the board, it would be much appreciated.
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Postby Petrucio » Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:23 am

Maybe when Adam exploded, its pieces were scattered around the world. They are pulled like a magnet to the pieces of lilith, and since this is not an entirely natural phenomenon, this search of the pieces of Adam attracted to the pieces of lilith leave marks in nature. They don't unite because the Lilith pieces are faster and join the Lilith in Central Dogma, but they leave a trail, and so does the pieces of Adam. Those pieces can be collected by other countries and thus they can make Evas.

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Postby SaltyJoe » Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:24 pm

Personally, i would speculate that the factions of the world that have the capacity to construct Evangelions were presented with a version of the story where an Angel attack is something that can occur anywhere, and probably something about individual Angels being able to cause Third Impact on their own.

This way, everyone is motivated to build Evas as fast as possible, Seele doesn't have to spill the beans about keeping Lilith, the "Third Impact Trigger" intact in a basement for reasons that are only beneficial to them, and once the Evas are actually completed, they can pull strings from the shadows to get them where they want them (Tokyo III).

Also, a possible justification for the Vatican Treaty, besides that whole four Adams thing, might be a case of considering the potential threat presented by the Evas after the Angels are dealt with. If any country that has the resources to build several Evangelions manages to develop, say, some technology that would allow Evas to operate without an external power source (like the US tried with Unit-04), then that country would gain an overwhelming tactical advantage over pretty muvh everyone else. Limiting the number of Evas any one faction can produce (probably under the threat of severe repercussions if it is discovered that the treaty is being breached) sort of works as a countermeasure against potential "Eva armies".
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Postby Petrucio » Thu Aug 04, 2011 2:34 pm

View Original PostSaltyJoe wrote:Limiting the number of Evas any one faction can produce (probably under the threat of severe repercussions if it is discovered that the treaty is being breached) sort of works as a countermeasure against potential "Eva armies".

Sorry, couldn't resist.
"Eva armies"

Who does the liming or draws the borders anyway? I don't think it's Seele, neither the Vatican. There are vast untouched territories separating the Evas in each faction. The only risk of an individual attempt at starting the third impact is only for the individual factions, in case the EVA goes berserk or it's super solenoid core explodes. There would be absolutely no connection between Tokyo III and such separate event.

HOWEVER, such event would not be entirely without profit for Seele, since Seele has to increase their efforts at controlling the scenario.

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Postby Fireand'chutes77 » Thu Aug 04, 2011 6:37 pm

I seem to remember another thread (or part of a thread) wondering where Russia was in the Eva -verse. Anybody know where it is?
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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:14 pm

View Original PostFlick wrote:As most of you know in the rebuild theres a limitation on how many active Evas are allowed active in a country at once, I'm not sure if that was ever mentioned in the original series or not but that doesn't effect my questions too much.

Wow! You're one of the few who paid attention to the film enough notice the two whole scenes in which that treaty was discussed! I'm impressed!

View Original PostFlick wrote:I'm going to make the assumption that rest of the world has EVA's of their own, and we already know this is atleast partly true with germany having 03 and america with 04 and in the rebuild with Europe and Russia having Unit 05, now with that said are there other units simply not known about in the show? I'm going to assume yes due to the fact theres a limit of how many each nation can have or perhaps Japan was simply first to hit that limit with the rest of the worlds nerv programs trying to play catch-up.

Well, other nations seem to be building Evas. The preview at the end of 2.22 eludes to another Eva being built. But they all seem to have to come over to Japan at some point because of the answer to your next question.

View Original PostFlick wrote:Part two, if the rest of the world has Eva's does that also mean that angels have been attacking the rest of the world and if they are what is their goal? I thought Lilith and the third impact was their main driving force into attacking Tokyo-3 trying to enter the dogma, perhaps that is their goal and they merely cross into other countries on their route.

Or am I missing something? Perhaps the rest of the world is ignorant to the third impact possibility and the angels for the most part and only have EVA's as a new arms race like a nuclear arm race being the equivalent.

A few select from rest of the world seem to know about it. It's never mentioned of EVERYBODY knows about "Third Impact", but I can imagine it would be pretty hard not to get Angel fight footage away from the Evening News programs (or the internet).

That being said, it was never established that Angels were actively attacking any other place other than Japan. The one in the tunnel in Europe at the beginning of 2.x might have been after something way back when the scientists might have been doing something with Adam/Lilith/who knows there. (This might be the case, since the original TV series says there was a German Branch in Episode 21. But anything like that with Russia or any other place in the new films is pure speculation at this point, with the only evidence we might have being the third Angel being in Russia for some reason.)
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Re: The other countries in NGE and RB

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Postby Azathoth » Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:29 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:Well, other nations seem to be building Evas. The preview at the end of 2.22 eludes to another Eva being built. But they all seem to have to come over to Japan at some point because of the answer to your next question.


The reason for this is pretty obvious: even if they're only needed in Japan, strictly speaking, everybody wants a piece of the giant god warrior action - and neither could Japan feasibly construct every single Eva SEELE wants constructed, given the immense resources such a task requires.

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:The one in the tunnel in Europe at the beginning of 2.x might have been after something way back when the scientists might have been doing something with Adam/Lilith/who knows there.


They found the 3rd Angel there, according to Kaji. I assume it was some sort of Sandalphon deal where they found it in some kind of embryonic (or hibernating?) form, only this time they actually captured it and performed ungodly experiments on it or something. It's pretty clear, anyway, that the Angel wasn't so interested in attacking the base as it was in escaping it. As a rule, even the grumpier Angels (Zeruel, for instance) don't much care about bloodshed when they could be trying to get into Nerv's basement.
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Postby Hyper Shinchan » Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:18 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:Wow! You're one of the few who paid attention to the film enough notice the two whole scenes in which that treaty was discussed! I'm impressed!

Is it really weird? I think it was explained quite clearly, I remember a discussion about the lack of mentions about this treaty in 1.11 but I don't remember that someone didn't notice the Vatican Treaty (well, the name is so funny, how could you forget it?).
View Original PostFireand'chutes77 wrote:I seem to remember another thread (or part of a thread) wondering where Russia was in the Eva -verse. Anybody know where it is?

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Postby svenge » Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:22 pm

View Original PostHyper Shinchan wrote:[Regarding Russia question:] I'm not drunk but I'm not understanding the question.


I think the question is what role Russia plays in the Evangelion universe. It's hardly mentioned at all in the TV/EoE continuity.

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Postby Fireand'chutes77 » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:21 am

View Original PostFireand'chutes77 wrote:I seem to remember another thread (or part of a thread) wondering where Russia was in the Eva -verse. Anybody know where it is?

View Original PostHyper Shinchan wrote:I'm not drunk but I'm not understanding the question.


The location of the thread that contains the discussion, not Russia itself. My bad. :lol: :lol:
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Postby Hyper Shinchan » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:24 am

View Original PostFireand'chutes77 wrote:The location of the thread that contains the discussion, not Russia itself. :lol:

OMG, I was really confused by your question, sorry.
Probably you were searching this thread.
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Postby Fireand'chutes77 » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:26 am

View Original PostHyper Shinchan wrote:OMG, I was really confused by your question, sorry.
Probably you were searching this thread.

Yep! That's the one.
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Postby Agent_Koopa » Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:29 pm

It seems to me that although SEELE secretly directs NERV and the construction of the Evangelions, matters of politics and human nature are out of their hands to control. An Evangelion is a weapon unstoppable by any force besides another Evangelion, so it makes sense that no country would want any other to have too many, although to be honest three seems an awfully arbitrary number, especially since no other country seems to have more than one or so, if the numbering is to be believed.
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Postby Warren Peace » Fri Aug 05, 2011 11:30 pm

In NGE, Seele was presented as being in control of every single important organization in the world. Maybe things are different in Rebuild, but it was just different heads of the hydra in the original.

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Postby Reichu » Fri Aug 05, 2011 11:55 pm

View Original PostAgent_Koopa wrote:although to be honest three seems an awfully arbitrary number, especially since no other country seems to have more than one or so, if the numbering is to be believed.

It's probably limited to three because four Evas in one place at one time would carry an above-average risk of Impacty stuff happening. And Seele wouldn't want that to happen before they say "go".

Warren Peace wrote:In NGE, Seele was presented as being in control of every single important organization in the world. Maybe things are different in Rebuild, but it was just different heads of the hydra in the original.

Aside from dispensing with the Committee and throwing in an organization to watchdog Nerv, I don't see any indication that their role has changed.
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