-46h (GENERAL)

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment made its debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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Re: Shin Eva - Official Blu-ray Release 2022!

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Postby Konja7 » Wed Jan 18, 2023 4:47 am

View Original PostAsuQa_PsyOp_Langley wrote:That's one bit I was always curious about. Unless I'm mistaken, the editing goes right from an Eva command handle grip being racked inside Eva 13 by Shinji to the Kaworu commands being disengaged, suggesting causation. Kaworu did nothing to wrestle back control or interfere, I'm not sure Shinji would cut him off actively or consciously like that but it's definitely a moment where he's ignoring him and turning himself deaf to his warnings.

I assume that Shinji's strong will simply took all control away from Kaworu. I don't think it was a totally conscious act.

Shinji seemed to have trouble using Eva-13 properly because Kaworu wasn't helping to pilot (implied during the battle with Asuka). Not to mention that Kaworu's warnings and opposition to take the Spears should make Shinji feel that Kaworu will interfere soon.



View Original PostAsuQa_PsyOp_Langley wrote:Edit : I'd say this is a sequence where we have another exemple of this with Kaworu saying he'll fix things up before Eva 13 impales itself with the spears. The editing suggests there's a causation by virtue of how those events are sequenced but I know it's debated : the impalement seems part of the rite, not something that would stop the Impact -on the contrary- and his commands are deactivated at that point. Doesn't seem Kaworu is doing anything proactive apart from letting himself be neutralised by the DSS choker.

Honestly, I don't think the impalement of Eva-13 in 3.0 is part of the rite since the Spears of Longinus don't dissapear. In the 3.0+1.0, the Black Moon Spear dissapear when it's used for the rite of the Fourth Impact (the Spears of Longinus and Cassius dissapear for the rite of the Another Impsct too).

Also, in 3.0+1.0, the "purification" of souls starts when the Black Moon Spears goes through the Gates of Guff. Before Eva-13 impaled itself, it was rising up with the Spears of Longinus towards the Gates of Guf.

That's why I still think Kaworu control Eva-13 to impale itself trying to stop the Fourth Impact.
Last edited by Konja7 on Wed Jan 18, 2023 6:22 am, edited 13 times in total.

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Re: Shin Eva - Official Blu-ray Release 2022!

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Postby AsuQa_PsyOp_Langley » Wed Jan 18, 2023 5:26 am

^^^
Taking your points with interest, not certain what to make of the "mechanics" or lore in the films (and ultimately don't think it's very important but fun to discuss nonetheless).

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Re: Shin Eva - Official Blu-ray Release 2022!

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Postby Jinroh » Wed Jan 18, 2023 6:49 am

View Original PostKonja7 wrote:Also, in 3.0+1.0, the "purification" of souls starts when the Black Moon Spears goes through the Gates of Guff. Before Eva-13 impaled itself, it was rising up with the Spears of Longinus towards the Gates of Guf.

It's more like the black moon itself was rising towards the gate. I still don't understand the role it was supposed to fill if originally it wasn't supposed to be converted to spears.

Also it was already excavated, what for? Creating the previous lances? The whole thing is confusing.

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby nerv bae » Wed Jan 18, 2023 7:44 am

@AsuQa_PsyOp_Langley
The last place I think we talked about Kaworu's disconnection was a thread now buried in the quality containment thread, in this vicinity.

View Original PostAxx°N N. wrote:I think it might be a dramatic-irony "Harmony" at an obscuring angle.

That would indeed be dramatically ironic! But I just don't see the room for the "on" between "m" and "y":

SPOILER: Show
Image

What about this dog?

SPOILER: Show
Image

"MUKU"?

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby JoelcrNeto » Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:17 am

I also read "charmy" on her cap when I saw it for the first time; but, look like has two M -o-;
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby Axx°N N. » Wed Jan 18, 2023 1:03 pm

View Original Postnerv bae wrote:That would indeed be dramatically ironic! But I just don't see the room for the "on" between "m" and "y":

I think that first 'c' might just be cursive stylization of the h, and that the angle is turning the o into a straight line between the m and n. As eager to see what this hat really says as I am to see the 11th angel. :tongue:
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby AsuQa_PsyOp_Langley » Wed Jan 18, 2023 2:53 pm

View Original Postwriter wrote:
SPOILER: Show
It could be that the cloth is a quickly created defense against the angelic infection, suggesting that Asuka is loaded into whatever Eva this is to face something imminent (like an MP Eva attack or a 3I scenario).

My prediction is that -46h will start with N3I being stopped, the fallout from that event, and the tale of how 3I came to be. Wouldn’t it be grand to end with 3I initiating, knowing there is possibility for a full on EoE 3I remake? Even better if we get it in -46h, but it feels like this is only one part of a series of minis that will take bits and pieces of what was removed from Rebuild and recreate them to expand the narrative. Anno’s touch will still be there, but the rest of the creative team will have full reign to expand as they deem fit, adding clarity or mystery to expand the vaguer pieces of the puzzle.

Also, let’s hope for some juicy Mari scenes. I think she’s been mysterious long enough. I want solid details, and there is no better place for that than interrogation.


Would be cool to have more short or vignettes of the interim, would be a nice format to give a little love to everyone, play with styles and fill some of the story by small touches... Can you make this into a commercially sensible package though ?

I'd be curious seeing Tsurumaki and others putting even more of a spin artistically. And I agree it's as good a material you could hope to pass the torch.

I think future Eva material will have to grapple and answer the question of : "Can you do Eva without that story or cast of characters ?".
I thought Diebuster was a masterful sequel to an equally difficult exercice (if you hated the 14 years timeskip... :devil: ). I don't know the tone of Eva lends itself to that sort of radical sequel...

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby Jinroh » Wed Jan 18, 2023 4:50 pm

I saw this on reddit without much comments about it, does anyone know what it's about? Is it official?

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby Axx°N N. » Wed Jan 18, 2023 5:51 pm

View Original PostJinroh wrote:Does anyone know what it's about? Is it official?

That's from the PS2 game "Detective Evangelion." It's an angel called "Katsuragiman" and it's Misato's still-alive father fused with an S2 Organ. It's the same game that has a Nadia cameo where she's a brutally murdered corpse. So, highly non-canonical. That page is from the "official setting material" production booklet that comes with it.
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby AlphaZero » Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:54 pm

The symbols on the Dss choker are the typical glyphs. They quickly fade-in/fade-out in parts. 3.333 pic:

SPOILER: Show
Image


So I think it's the same with the cloth. Would have to take a closer look.

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby BernardoCairo » Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:32 pm

View Original PostJayfive wrote:Possibly that green light is the protector beaming the symbols onto here eyeline. There definately seems to be some tech underneath the cloth but over her ears. Unless that's were she's tucked her hair in. She's done something with it anyway, those seems to be bobby pins or hair clips in there.

To me, it looks like the green light is above some sort of piece that is holding a black ribbon, where these red symbols are being projected (almost like a VR headset). Below that black ribbon is a cloth covering her eye.
Maybe it's some sort of augmented reality thing. Like the headpiece they use in training.
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby FelipeFritschF » Wed Jan 18, 2023 9:42 pm

It'd seem Asuka is not wearing the exact same plugsuit as in -120 min and Q.

Image

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby AsukaShikinami10 » Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:06 pm

FelipeFritschF wrote:
It'd seem Asuka is not wearing the exact same plugsuit as in -120 min and Q.


Indeed. It seems to be a different plugsuit. I wonder if they are gonna reuse the one she wore during 2.0 or they are going to change the collar design again (I'm taking about the diamonds the plugsuits had on the neck section back in 2.0); after all, I think they're still gonna sell merch and they might want to make some small changes in her plugsuit design.

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby Szmitten » Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:02 pm

I can't see the neck but I believe it's the original 2.0 suit but still before any taping.

I was expecting -120 min's red-Mari-05 plugsuit instead but whatever.

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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby Jayfive » Thu Jan 19, 2023 9:59 pm

Yeah, everything points to this being the first suit we saw her in in 2.0.

Which would mean that this takes place a significant amount of time after the end of 2.0 because if they had taken her straight out of that containment/rehabilitation thing we saw and shoved into an Eva she's still be that "a bit revealing" Test type suit. but not post-timeskip because it's not damaged yet.
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby ElMariachi » Fri Jan 20, 2023 3:50 am

The tapped plugsuit in 3.0 is different than the one she had in 2.0, it has two valve things on the abdomen and the collar is different (the two blue diamonds are gone and replace with one blue protuberance).

So the timeline is probably: test plugsuit was destroyed or stored somewhere to study traces of contamination (good riddance), Asuka's back in her 2.0 plugsuit for the events of -46h, later it get replaced/modified into the one from 3.0, that one gets damaged during the timeskip and replaced by the advanced plugsuit that we see in -120min.
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby writer » Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:29 pm

View Original PostAsuQa_PsyOp_Langley wrote:Would be cool to have more short or vignettes of the interim, would be a nice format to give a little love to everyone, play with styles and fill some of the story by small touches... Can you make this into a commercially sensible package though ?

I'd be curious seeing Tsurumaki and others putting even more of a spin artistically. And I agree it's as good a material you could hope to pass the torch.

I think future Eva material will have to grapple and answer the question of : "Can you do Eva without that story or cast of characters ?".
I thought Diebuster was a masterful sequel to an equally difficult exercice (if you hated the 14 years timeskip... :devil: ). I don't know the tone of Eva lends itself to that sort of radical sequel...


I have been thinking about this a bit. From the Thrice documentary, or some subsequent interview, Anno revealed that, originally, Evangelion Q was going to come out shortly after 2.0. He, instead, chose to do the timeskip because he didn't feel like a film without Shinji would be understood or well-accepted by an audience not familiar with the Evangelion franchise. This leads me back to the end credit and preview scene from 2.0:

https://youtu.be/JdCCqR6Fw3I

If my memory serves, Q was meant to release a year after 2.0. This suggests that the film was very far in development, likely in post-production. After production on Thrice was complete, perhaps Khara went back and finalized production of Q. In this light, - 46h will start with the end scene of 2.0 and continue 46 hours afterward - Nerv HQ abandoned, pilots detained and questioned, Eva08 with Asuka quickening within, etc. We will get all of the details about 3I, Kaworu and Kaji's plan, the theft of Wunder, and of course fan service.

I highly expect - 46h to be similar to the Thrice and 3.0 ten minute intros, leading to a new film that covers all the details meant to be in Q. This leads to a whole new movie for merch; new costumes, locations, and scenarios to expand on, aa well as more details on all of the characters other than Shinji. And with the luxury of knowing the ending, Q has the opportunity of being even better than originally planned.

After the success of Thrice, an upcoming release would excite more people than ever. A ten minute preview of a film that's almost complete means a release in short notice, and the hype train to make it the best-selling feature in Rebuild.

Now for some speculation, has it been considered that the Shinkinami known as "My original" in Thrice may be the one within Eva02 during Thrice, and that the Shinkinami we meet in Thrice is a clone of that Asuka, perhaps sharing her memories or at least knowledge of her life and experiences?
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby hui43210 » Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:45 pm

View Original Postwriter wrote:If my memory serves, Q was meant to release a year after 2.0. This suggests that the film was very far in development, likely in post-production. After production on Thrice was complete, perhaps Khara went back and finalized production of Q. In this light, - 46h will start with the end scene of 2.0 and continue 46 hours afterward - Nerv HQ abandoned, pilots detained and questioned, Eva08 with Asuka quickening within, etc. We will get all of the details about 3I, Kaworu and Kaji's plan, the theft of Wunder, and of course fan service.


Shin was was also supposed to come out in 2008, those early schedules should not be taken as an indication of how far they got in production. The only thing they probably completed for the original Q was that preview and an outline, no way they would have shelved a film in post production.
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby writer » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:02 pm

View Original Posthui43210 wrote:
Shin was was also supposed to come out in 2008, those early schedules should not be taken as an indication of how far they got in production. The only thing they probably completed for the original Q was that preview and an outline, no way they would have shelved a film in post production.


Good point, and sorry for the poor memory. I still think they had many completed or at least well mocked scenes, and tons of unused storyboards from the various stages of production. Even if Q doesn't come out within a year, a trailer for it would still generate a ton of hype. And starting that with a tie to the end of 2.0, promising to answer all the questions we don't have answers to, could do just that.

In addition, even if Anno isn't on the driver's seat of this project, he would have written all the major arc points and developments. Letting himself take the back seat on this project would make sense to me. He has collected all the possible pieces, now it's up to his team to piece them all together in a coherent way.
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Re: -46h (GENERAL)

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Postby ElMariachi » Wed Jan 25, 2023 3:29 pm

View Original Postwriter wrote:Good point, and sorry for the poor memory. I still think they had many completed or at least well mocked scenes, and tons of unused storyboards from the various stages of production. Even if Q doesn't come out within a year, a trailer for it would still generate a ton of hype. And starting that with a tie to the end of 2.0, promising to answer all the questions we don't have answers to, could do just that.

I think you're mixing it with the early draft of 3.0 (which is available in the bonus of the 3.333 blu-ray): the surprise timeskip was already decided by the time 2.0 was released (Kaji mentioning the tale of Urashima Taro was a foreshadowing), Anno didn't got past initial ideas and plans for this movie (the NTP was made using what few elements he made from that initial idea).

What did got to the stage of partial storyboard was a first version of 3.0, which was supposed to have Shinji's time at NERV in the first half (which ended as 3.0 with a few key differences - such as Kaji being alive, Gendo having been crippled and disfigured, people still working at NERV...) and his time in the Village in the second (which from the few images we got was exactly like depicted in Thrice).

But in the end, the second half was pushed to Thrice. I don't think that we have explanations on why did Khara decided to do that, maybe we'll get more info in the CRC? One theory that I've seen is that after the devastating 2011 earthquake and tsunami, they removed the second part because having a group of survivors surviving in makeshift house would hit too close to home (since that was happening to hundreds of thousands of Japanese at that same moment), but this is just speculation.
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Seriously, that is the most fananked theory I've ever heard, more than Mari being Marty McFly travelling through time to keep her parents (Asushin) together. -- Jäeger


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