Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment made its debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Asugran233 » Tue Aug 09, 2022 4:34 pm

View Original PostSzmitten wrote:In which I haphazardly self-indulge: https://imgur.com/a/fNx1Xoq


Evangelion itself is ugly but Asuka's plugsuit is a recolor of Mari's plug and I don't know what to say about it ...

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby ElMariachi » Tue Aug 09, 2022 5:40 pm

View Original PostAsugran233 wrote:Evangelion itself is ugly but Asuka's plugsuit is a recolor of Mari's plug and I don't know what to say about it ...

The 3.0 prequel manga reveal that Asuka too had a plugsuit of the same model as Mari, but changed to an older version for sentimental reasons for Operation US, so by all logic that's the plugsuit she wore the must during the 14 years of the timeskip.
But if I'm not mistaken, the color of the plugsuit is Szmitten's own interpretation, since the manga was in black and white.
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby JoelcrNeto » Tue Aug 09, 2022 6:38 pm

^ Yeah, that plugsuit has never been seen in colors.
View Original PostSzmitten wrote:In which I haphazardly self-indulge: https://imgur.com/a/fNx1Xoq

Oh, I liked it. Now I want to see this EVA-02 version in full officially.
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby FelipeFritschF » Wed Aug 10, 2022 5:21 am



View Original PostElMariachi wrote:The more I think about it, and the more I believe that by "The End of everything Evangelion", we should add "by Anno". He said in interviews that for him NTE was Shinji's story and that he was finished with his story, which opens the way for other members of the studio to explore the events surrounding his story (as noted by trattopen, they already started with the 3.0 prequel mini-manga), or even someone else to tell their own story of Evangelion: that what he said when in interviews when 1.0 was released, wanting to make Eva a franchise like Gundamn, although I'm curious to see how such a thing will pan out, since Evangelion is a story intrinsically tied to its creator and his mindset of the moment.


I haven't met a single Japanese (or Korean or Chinese) fan who belives the franchise is ending since they are keenly aware of its enormous commercial significance and Anno's decades-long plans to have it expand into a Gundam-like ecosystem. Western fans still largely believe Eva to be an underground cult thingy, so we see this notion and narratives censored around the "definitive answer and ending to Eva" quite often. At worse this manifests into the absurd multiverse bullshit we got Crunchyroll to thank for resurrecting.

Anyway, I'd personally like some high quality, character-focused OVAs for the time being, no more wasting time with inane and uninteresting 30-minute action scenes.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:31 pm

I honestly don't expect this to lead to anything except maybe a glimpse of this version of Unit 02 in an Asuka flashback in an extended final cut of Thrice Upon A Time on the eventual Blu-ray but whatever it is maybe we'll learn about it soon because the one Amazon Prime exclusivity on the film ends this Saturday. Then Khara should be allowed to move forward with things like a physical disc release.

I really hope it's not a new film or anything, let Eva rest for at least a while and I feel it is a shame a series is never allowed to end now, but that's just me.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby kuribo-04 » Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:07 pm

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote: because the one Amazon Prime exclusivity on the film ends this Saturday.

Oh interesting. Where did you get this from?
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:53 pm

kuribo-04 wrote:Oh interesting. Where did you get this from?


Mostly deducing. There's no official announcement or anything but the signs are there.
Streamers generally sign contracts for shows or movies they didn't make based on years.
Like " Streamer A' has paid X amount of $$ for 'Show B' to only stream on their service for X number of years"
For newer titles, shows or movies that aren't already out in the world, they can negotiate an Exclusivity deal where it's only on their service for a period of time.
Covid-19 created the weird scenario where Thrice was playing in Japanese theaters at a time when infection numbers were low but because the infection varied so much from country to country they couldn't get the movie out to all foreign countries so they worked out a deal with a streaming service that would do so.
Amazon Prime must have signed an exclusivity contract with Khara when they got the rights to stream Thrice Upon A Time cause there's been no theatrical or VOD release of any kind for the film outside Japan. Even more so there has been not a peep about a home video release in Japan over 17 months after the release.
Thrice Upon A Time went live on Amazon Prime starting Aug 13, 2021.
It's only lately that news has started about other types of releases for the film outside of streaming on Prime.
But nothing is happening before August 13, 2022.

Now Hong Kong is the first market outside Japan to give Thrice Upon A Time and the film is dated to be in theaters starting Aug 18. The very first Thursday, movies seem to start their runs on Thurs there, after the 13th.
And with South Korea, Italy i think, the United States and likely a few other countries all having made announcements of Thrice getting some kind of theatrical release "soon" - or in GKids case "Winter 2022" - it def seems like these contracts were all in order but couldn't really do anything until the movie on been on Prime for one year. Announcements started in July, etc but nothing dated and nothing pre mid-August.

This Saturday the movie will have been on Prime for exactly one year and unless Amazon made some other stipulation in there Khara and all distributors around the globe should be free to date or begin the next stage of the film's run. For overseas markets that means giving the film a theatrical run for fans who want one and in Japan's case it would mean finally getting the movie on a purchasable disc.

I don't think Saturday Khara will immediately go "Here's a Blu-ray announcement!" but if Amazon's exclusivity on the film is over they will be able to start when they want. I think/hope there will be news on a disc release by the end of August.



And, sure, this lantern could signify a New Eva project but considering Thrice Upon A Time has yet to really finish it's proper business run - physical media sales are down the world over but this will be a huge seller in Japan and will make Khara a huge profit - it would seem odd to begin marketing a new project before the previous is finished.

Eh. We'll see.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby BernardoCairo » Wed Aug 10, 2022 4:26 pm

Gendo'sPapa wrote:over 17 months after the release

Man, that's fucked up... So much has happened in my life since last year's March, but that Sunday the movie dropped feels like yesterday... I can feel it as if it was tangible. The more I get older, the faster time moves. Or at least it seems... It's similar to the first time I watched the movie. Damn, almost an entire year ago. I marathoned every EVA movie and then watched Q + Shin, as it was intended. I decided not to go out with my ex just to finish it once and for all LOL! A whole year... Fuck haha

Anyway, I do think that is probably the case. Khara wanted to release the film in the West before it got warm, but they couldn't. So they went ahead and signed a deal with the most suitable streaming service available just so they wouldn't lose any of that sweet money. They weren't in a position to negotiate much, and frankly, Amazon proved to be a good partner in my opinion. If the movie was released today, I'm sure this wouldn't happen. Sooner or later, 3.33 + 1.11 (or 3.03 + 1.01, fuck it) will come to our hands in Blu-ray and DVD format. After that, the future is unlimited. Welcome to the DBesque side of things we've been experiencing since 2013. We'll see who's gonna be EVA's Toyotaro XD
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby kuribo-04 » Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:02 am

@Gendo'sPapa
Ah that makes a lot of sense. Well looking forward to saturday and the days after then.
I really hope Rebuild stays on Prime though. It's a comfortable way to access the film + I feel we'd lose 3.0+1.01 otherwise.
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Thu Aug 11, 2022 1:51 pm

View Original Postkuribo-04 wrote:I really hope Rebuild stays on Prime though. It's a comfortable way to access the film + I feel we'd lose 3.0+1.01 otherwise.


Don't worry. The Rebuilds likely won't be leaving Prime for years. Or maybe ever.

Only change is that soon the final film will be accessible through other (legal) means besides Prime.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby ElMariachi » Sat Aug 13, 2022 5:53 pm

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:I honestly don't expect this to lead to anything except maybe a glimpse of this version of Unit 02 in an Asuka flashback in an extended final cut of Thrice Upon A Time on the eventual Blu-ray but whatever it is maybe we'll learn about it soon because the one Amazon Prime exclusivity on the film ends this Saturday. Then Khara should be allowed to move forward with things like a physical disc release.

I really hope it's not a new film or anything, let Eva rest for at least a while and I feel it is a shame a series is never allowed to end now, but that's just me.

I wouldn't be that surprised of a new movie, even without Anno: Evangelion by Anno was him pouring out his feelings through the characters, but especially through Shinji (even more so in NTE, even though he said in interview that he now feels closer to Gendo), but lets be honest: Shinji is the least popular of the main characters, way behind Asuka and Rei, and if we take the merchandise and advertising into account, even Mari seems to be more popular. Even among the male cast, Kaworu is more popular than Shinji.

So I could see a movie with only those characters and centered on them, or even with Shinji being a side-character, still being a hit and making a truckload of money.
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby JoelcrNeto » Sat Aug 13, 2022 6:20 pm

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:[...] Amazon Prime exclusivity on the film ends this Saturday.

Talking about it: Amazon Prime Video’s exclusivity in fact came to an end today (August 13). Japanese streaming service U-NEXT has included Shin Eva in its service. We’ll get a Blu-ray release announcement very soon, i guess.
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sat Aug 13, 2022 9:26 pm

ElMariachi wrote:I wouldn't be that surprised of a new movie, even without Anno... still being a hit and making a truckload of money.


The problem with the battle between Art & Commerce is there really is no winner.

There's zero debate that more Evangelion wouldn't make money. I would never say otherwise. I'd argue narratively there's honestly very little reason to tell what happened after Shinji went into the coma. Anno skipped it for a reason - at this point telling that story is just a lot of empty narrative table setting with little to no emotional through-line - and now with the two final films having filled in most of that backstory the need to tell that tale is even doubly unnecessary. But absolutely if Khara wants to be the most profitable studio it can be then that's the next things they should do. Then if they really want to be a money machine they should just "Marvelize" Evangelion and churn out new shows & movies as often as possible. Keep finding new unnecessary corners of the world to tell, narratives to spin off from and in a few years we can have a Tenchi Muyo like universe where there's a 26 episode show about Shinji's cousin twice-removed Kenji Ikari who lives on a medieval planet and fights Angels with his Evangelion sword**. More Evangelion All The Time would be the most financially rewarding path to take.

Creatively it would be tragic cause as much as I love the Rebuilds I'd argue the most exciting thing Khara has done was the Animator Expo. Khara has built relationships with a lot of exciting new voices and I would love to see them get the chance to tell their stories. The least interesting shorts from the Expo were the two - or three - Eva shorts. Buuuuuuut yeah. What would get more people talking & make money? An original film or series from a new artist OR that same artist telling a story set in the world of Evangelion?

Also, at the moment one thing that does still make Eva unique is outside the manga spinoffs & silly ancillary spinoffs the series proper - NGE & the movies - have all been works essentially spearheaded by Anno. Once they make a big deal Eva Project that Anno didn't write of direct it's no longer an issue to consider & like Disney Star Wars the floodgates can open. Churn out the content.

Arguing against More Evangelion is not a battle I would ever make. It's a losing one. Stories aren't allowed to end now. Fans have been trained to want more. Desire there. There's always a need for more.

It's just I hope they'll wait a little longer and do a few other things before looking back.

It's just not something I would find interesting but sadly that's the business. I would just hope that with the success of the Rebuilds + Shin Ultraman & what the Animator Expo promised that Anno would want Studio Khara to be a home to artists to make the kinds of work that couldn't get made anywhere else. If the studio goes right back to the Eva right after "Bye-Bye all of Evangelion" they may as well just rename themselves Studio Evangelion.

**Sidenote: I know once upon a time in 2007 Anno said he wanted to "Gundamize" Evangelion but I think the major flaw with that thinking & what will be the biggest hurdle to ever doing that is the true strength of Eva has always been this specific cast. There's a reason despite the existence of like six BILLION manga spin-offs they're all things like "Shinji, Asuka & Rei work as Ghosbusters and take orders from Misato to hunt Angels in Tokyo-3. They are Evangelion: AngelBusters". If they ever do intend to just make more Eva that's gonna be the biggest obstacle. The characters are what has kept the series alive for almost 30 years. If Anno REALLY - and I'd argue his mindset is very different today than it was in 2007 when the Rebuilds were meant to be a few quickies finished by 2009 - wants to "Gundamize" Eva and have it last for another 30 years they're gonna have to tell stories that don't involve Shinji, Asuka, Rei, Misato, etc.

JoelcrNeto wrote:Talking about it: Amazon Prime Video’s exclusivity in fact came to an end today (August 13). Japanese streaming service U-NEXT has included Shin Eva in its service.


BOOM. I do like those few times when I am right.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Konja7 » Sat Aug 13, 2022 10:31 pm

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:There's zero debate that more Evangelion wouldn't make money. I would never say otherwise. I'd argue narratively there's honestly very little reason to tell what happened after Shinji went into the coma. Anno skipped it for a reason - at this point telling that story is just a lot of empty narrative table setting with little to no emotional through-line - and now with the two final films having filled in most of that backstory the need to tell that tale is even doubly unnecessary. But absolutely if Khara wants to be the most profitable studio it can be then that's the next things they should do. Then if they really want to be a money machine they should just "Marvelize" Evangelion and churn out new shows & movies as often as possible. Keep finding new unnecessary corners of the world to tell, narratives to spin off from and in a few years we can have a Tenchi Muyo like universe where there's a 26 episode show about Shinji's cousin twice-removed Kenji Ikari who lives on a medieval planet and fights Angels with his Evangelion sword**. More Evangelion All The Time would be the most financially rewarding path to take.


Anno mentioned the reason why they skipped the original plans for 3.0 was because they don't feel adequate to make a movie without Shinji. As Shinji story has ended, maybe they would try to develop that story without Shinji.

I disagree with the idea that most of the backstory is filled. I mean, we still don't know the exact connection between the N3I and the Third Impact, which is the reason why Shinji is blamed by the humanity.

Honestly, it isn't necessary to be so cynic. It's true that studios always want to get money, but this doesn't mean they won't have an interesting story to tell.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby ElMariachi » Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:06 pm

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:There's zero debate that more Evangelion wouldn't make money. I would never say otherwise. I'd argue narratively there's honestly very little reason to tell what happened after Shinji went into the coma. Anno skipped it for a reason - at this point telling that story is just a lot of empty narrative table setting with little to no emotional through-line - and now with the two final films having filled in most of that backstory the need to tell that tale is even doubly unnecessary.

I strongly disagree with that statement. Firstly, there are a lot of people that are very interested by the events after 2.0, you just have to see how often the matter is brought in this very forum, and it seems to be the same with the Japanese fans, and Anno himself initially planned to cover these events, and only changed his mind because he didn't wanted to have a movie without the MC (and perhaps also to maximize the shock of the timeskip).
Secondly, it's not because a story is over and you know how it'll ultimately end that there's no narrative value nor emotional payoff to explore some of the past events and what the other characters were up to.

For example, would you say that the prequel trilogy of Star Wars is meaningless because we already know that the Republic will fall to be replaced by the Empire and that ultimately it'll be brought down by the rebellion and Luke? Or more fitting: would you say that the Clone Wars series is meaningless because we know that in the end, nearly all the Jedi will die, the separatists will be defeated and the Sith will win, even if it expand on most of the cast that's barely touched upon in Revenge of the Sith (the Jedis, Dooku, Grievous, the clones...) and even introduce some new characters and stories that aren't directly related to the main plot? (Ashoka, Rex, Ventress, the Bad Batch...)

Personally, I would be very interested in seeing things like Kaworu and Kaji's friendship, the tragic love between the later and Misato and the effect of her son's birth, Gendo and Fuyu's exile and eventual return to SEELE's grace, the plight of Asuka upon waking up with her curse and with all her friends dead and the beginning of her friendship with Mari, her implied falling out with Misato, Toji, Kensuke and Hikari's struggles to survive that will lead to the characters we see in Thrice, maybe the premises of Kensuke and Asuka's peculiar relationship (although that it started so early), the 11th and 12th Angels, Mark.06 in action, how did NERV and SEELE reacted to Mari's reappearance (especially Gendo and Fuyu), and above everything else, the real Third Impact, so we can understand why the bloody hell everyone blames Shinji for it. (which is something that is relevant to Shinji's story and not explained in the main movies)
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby BernardoCairo » Sun Aug 14, 2022 2:42 pm

I agree with Gendo'sPapa here. Don't get me wrong, the idea of "skipping" a movie and still making it a part of the canon was stupid as all hell. That said, what's done is done. I don't think they should keep milking Evangelion, but they'll do it anyway. So, in my opinion, they should at least try to do new things with it. NTE is so fucking done...
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby Archer » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:29 pm

What’s stupid was skipping it, instead of actually re-writing the story AROUND the fact that that period of time was no longer being covered.

The easy and obvious solution is just to make it so that the end of 2.0 actually WAS the end of the world. No near-third-impact bullshit, straight up just Shinji awakening Unit 1 causes the apocalypse and rewrite the rest of the story around that.

Which honestly isn’t even hard: instead of there being an extended period of time in between where apparently Gendo and Fuyutsuki get exiled, Kaji and Kaworu get promoted to commander, and Gendo and Fuyutsuki come back and sieze control and THEN the remaining NERV personnel rebel and form WILLE, literally just condense that all into the immediate aftermath of N3I: Gendo and Fuyutsuki summon Kaworu from the moon, Kaji makes a deal with Kaworu (which involves his own death) to betray Gendo. Then you can still justify it being called “near” Third Impact, because it wasn’t actually allowed to fully progress all the way. And now instead of the stupid Fourth Impact/Final Impact shit in 3.0+1.0, you just make the Gendo’s goal completing the still-unfinished Third Impact.

Not only does this get rid of the whole “entire movie’s worth of convoluted events that gets untold” thing, it honestly also makes it make WAY much more sense why everyone treats Shinji like a pariah, because at least in this scenario it’s pretty unarguable that he is directly responsible for the end of the world.

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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby BernardoCairo » Sun Aug 14, 2022 3:45 pm

I've come to the same conclusion as you a while back. Why not have Shinji actually destroy the world at the end of HA and that's it? It would've been so much more digestible to the viewer. But, no. Anno and Tsurumaki had to inject another impact there. I guess they have a boner for this sort of thing. Man, I just can't wrap my head around this whole mess. What were they thinking? It's so weird...
Some things could have been kept as mysteries, like the birth of WILLE or what exactly happened to Asuka. That way, the surprise and impactful nature of Q's first half would've been kept intact...

Anyway, recycling that lost 10-year-old movie now that the tetralogy has come to an end is so awkward. The story should be over and pandering it a bit more makes little sense. But we'll see...
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Re: Hideaki Anno's Bonbori Matsuri Lantern 2022

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Postby nerv bae » Sun Aug 14, 2022 7:48 pm

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:
View Original PostGendo'sPapa#936686 wrote:There's zero debate that more Evangelion wouldn't make money. I would never say otherwise. I'd argue narratively there's honestly very little reason to tell what happened after Shinji went into the coma. Anno skipped it for a reason - at this point telling that story is just a lot of empty narrative table setting with little to no emotional through-line - and now with the two final films having filled in most of that backstory the need to tell that tale is even doubly unnecessary.
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Personally, I would be very interested in seeing things like Kaworu and Kaji's friendship, the tragic love between the later and Misato and the effect of her son's birth, Gendo and Fuyu's exile and eventual return to SEELE's grace, the plight of Asuka upon waking up with her curse and with all her friends dead and the beginning of her friendship with Mari, her implied falling out with Misato, Toji, Kensuke and Hikari's struggles to survive that will lead to the characters we see in Thrice, maybe the premises of Kensuke and Asuka's peculiar relationship (although that it started so early), the 11th and 12th Angels, Mark.06 in action, how did NERV and SEELE reacted to Mari's reappearance (especially Gendo and Fuyu), and above everything else, the real Third Impact, so we can understand why the bloody hell everyone blames Shinji for it. (which is something that is relevant to Shinji's story and not explained in the main movies)

Gendo's Papa warns that the timeskip stories would lack an emotional through-line, but along with El Mariachi I earnestly disagree with this. I think that each of the characters and character interactions El Mariachi lists would easily support a feature film-length emotional through-line internally, and most of them would also further connect through most of the other movies. For example, telling a timeskip story focusing on Kaji would connect backward robustly to his values and purposes established in 2.0, and forward to his thematic, personal, and organizational legacies revealed in 3.0 and 3+1. Besides Kaji we can imagine emotional through-lines for most of the other listed characters as well.

Axx°N N.
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Postby Axx°N N. » Sun Aug 14, 2022 8:24 pm

Emotional through-lines don't exist in any premise until you breathe life into them, and every narrative scenario is inherently arbitrary until the through-lines are added. By that I mean that the same exact premise could be used to hang a comedy on as it can a tragedy or drama, and it's all about what you do in the space a premise carves out. "A world rocked by tragedy in which mysterious creatures attack a capital every week or so" could have gone any number of routes, and was initially supposed to, yet in the space this left a bunch of psychedelics and psychodramas were infused when they easily could have not.
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