Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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gelflinghand
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Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby gelflinghand » Fri May 27, 2022 6:29 pm

Trailer: https://vimeo.com/714625530

When single shines the triple sun, what was sundered and undone shall be whole, the two made one, by GelflingHand, or else by the Concurrency Project.

I've taken the opposite approach to the Concurrency Project, though - rather than incorporating TV scenes into End of Evangelion, I've extended the TV series to 28 episodes by incorporating material from EoE (mostly Air).

Would anyone be willing to check out an early version and give me feedback before it goes into general release? It's basically finished aside from the subtitles, and any changes I need to make in response to feedback.

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Re: Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby CoolJosh2002 » Sun May 29, 2022 11:10 pm

This is a very cool idea, and I'd be interested to check it out when its done. I just had a couple questions, largely related to the ADV/Manga Dub and the Subs for the Japanese Version.

In terms of Subs, are you going to be using existing sources? Like Platinum or Khara Subs? Or are you making your own?

Regarding the ADV/Manga dub, what source are you using for the TV 25/26 stuff? The Original Dub with Tristan MacAvery, Jason Lee, Kendra Benham etc. or the Remastered Platinum Dub with John Swasey, Monica Rial, Vic Mignogna etc.?

Besides those two questions this is really cool, and I'm curious to see what you've picked out from EoE for use in this FanEdit.

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Re: Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby gelflinghand » Mon May 30, 2022 5:16 pm

Thanks!

I'm starting from the Platinum and EoE DVD subs, but will be making a few tweaks. "I love you" is staying (there's an optional episode 24 to go with the original 21-23), and "just like Adam was" will definitely be fixed. I'll be comparing with the blu-ray subs for other significant discrepancies that might need consideration. Is there a list of specific issues with the DVD subtitles anywhere?

I'm mostly using the remastered dub, aside from one scene that uses Gendo dialogue from both movie and series. I didn't know 25 and 26 had been rerecorded when I started the project, and I don't think I could do an adequate job of converting the original version from stereo to 5.1 myself.

It also features Platinum-style English language openings and closings, recreated in HD.

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Re: Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby CoolJosh2002 » Tue May 31, 2022 1:20 am

No problem!

In terms of DVD/Blu-Ray "Classic" subs vs. Blu-Ray "Official" subs, there isn't an overly massive difference I don't think, although I believe there is more mistakes in Manga's EoE Subs than the Khara Subs. Although I don't think there's a proper listing anywhere of all the mistranslations. Platinum is about the same, with maybe a couple of minor mistakes in early episodes. I find Khara's Subs to word things very differently, especially after I watched both dubs with subs back to back on Episode 9, and Khara's Subs do translate most of the extra 5.1 Dialogue in the background that ADV didn't.

Yeah, 25/26 were not completely rerecorded, but all the characters who were recast for the DC dubs because reasons did rerecord their characters' dialogue in the last two episodes largely for consistency reasons than anything. Considering those original versions with the complete original cast is only on the old VHS and Perfect DVDs and only in Stereo, I understand why you'd use the Remastered 5.1 Platinum Dubs for it instead.

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Re: Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby gelflinghand » Tue May 31, 2022 3:47 pm

View Original PostCoolJosh2002 wrote:Khara's Subs do translate most of the extra 5.1 Dialogue in the background that ADV didn't.


Ah, I'll definitely look at incorporating that into my subs, then - thanks.

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Re: Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby gelflinghand » Fri Jun 17, 2022 7:35 pm

View Original PostCoolJosh2002 wrote:Khara's Subs do translate most of the extra 5.1 Dialogue in the background that ADV didn't.


Most of it is background noise that I think is best left untranslated - adding subtitles draws excessive attention to it and distracts from the foreground dialogue. I am including a few extra lines that were missing from the DVD, though.

Where the DVD and Blu-ray subs differ, I've ended up going back to the original Japanese to try to see what that says, and sometimes doing my own translation. A bit ridiculous since my Japanese vocabulary is about a dozen words and I'm spending ages looking up every single Kanji, but I'm finding it really interesting. I'm trying to stick a little bit closer to a literal translation, while still keeping the English sounding natural.

As an example, the Japanese has Shinji saying something like "Everything's already awful. I want to die." The DVD subs ignore the first part entirely, while the Blu-ray has "I'm done." The latter isn't an awful translation, but it sounds to me like something you'd say at the end of working a double shift in retail just before Christmas, not while government troops are massacring everyone you know. I've gone with "I can't take any more", which I think gets across the sentiment better.

Asuka's mother is particularly difficult. One of her repeated lines is literally just "don't kill", which the subs translate variously as "I'll protect you", "I won't let them kill you", and "don't kill her". I'm guessing "I won't let them kill you" is the best translation, but an awful lot is being left to implication! Both subs have "don't kill her" towards the end, presumably directed at the suicidal aspect of herself, but I'm sure that's wrong - all her Japanese lines are repeated, so I think she's still talking to Asuka.

She also repeats "mada" many times, ie "yet / still / so far". My best guess is that in context it means something vaguely along the lines of "come on, you've made it this far", but I can't come up with a good way to phrase that. I'm not surprised both official subs mostly ignore it! (And I don't like "don't die yet" - that implies "you can die later" which I don't think fits at all)

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Re: Fan Edit: Congratulations of Evangelion

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Postby CoolJosh2002 » Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:33 pm

gelflinghand wrote:Most of it is background noise that I think is best left untranslated - adding subtitles draws excessive attention to it and distracts from the foreground dialogue. I am including a few extra lines that were missing from the DVD, though.


I agree with this. Watching the Khara subs on the Blu-Rays there are quite a few moments (mainly during Angel fights) where there are subs on both the top and bottom of the screen. I like that they're there, as officially much of this 5.1 dialogue hadn't been translated before, but they can be very distracting, especially during very visual moments. Which is part of the reason why I prefer the DVD/Classic Blu-Ray Subs, much less going on, which means I can focus on what's happening more, and they can honestly be a bit more visually dynamic as well. (For instance, during the Japanese Episode Eyecatch, the Classic Subs put them above the equivalent Written Japanese (or near it), while the Offical/Khara Subs just translate the whole thing and put it at the top of the screen.)

gelflinghand wrote:Where the DVD and Blu-ray subs differ, I've ended up going back to the original Japanese to try to see what that says, and sometimes doing my own translation. A bit ridiculous since my Japanese vocabulary is about a dozen words and I'm spending ages looking up every single Kanji, but I'm finding it really interesting. I'm trying to stick a little bit closer to a literal translation, while still keeping the English sounding natural.


I find a lot of cases where the Khara Subs have the line written with very different wording to what the Platinum Subs did. It seems to be different for the sake of being different, like Asuka's weird "Balls to the Wall" comment in Episode 9 in the Khara Subs and VSI Dub. (I'm pretty sure that's in the Khara Subs.) Going for both fidelity to the Japanese text and proper English seems to be the best course of action.

Even the Amazon Rebuild Subs have this problem. Shinji's very first line in 1.11 is rendered as "Drat!" in the Amazon Subs, but the more natural and I believe closer to Japanese "It's no good." in Funimation's Subs. It's interesting to look at the differences between the Subs.


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