Watching the trailer I think the Z-man is correct....very pretty to look at I hope it carries the substance with it.
DUNE
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Re: DUNE
EvaChero wrote: Watching the trailer I think the Z-man is correct....very pretty to look at I hope it carries the substance with it.
"The Z-Man" is such a cool name I almost feel I should have named myself that instead of Zusuchan, hehe.
Agree re:substance-the film will absolutely be epic and awesome, but whether it'll be able to effectively tackle its themes (supposing that Villeneuve's themes are largely the same as those of Herbert) is still up in the air. But I'd wager it'll be considerably better than Lynch's movie anyway and better than most other films of the year.
- UrsusArctos
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Re: DUNE
Having seen the trailer and Jason Momoa's portrayal of Duncan Idaho/ the line delivery now it really does come off as a joke and not as a "What the hell?" moment (but it's a Marvel-style dumb joke that really doesn't fit with the setting). Visually it's magnificent, but so was The Rise of Skywalker and we know how the latter movie turned out; the fact that even a director of David Lynch's caliber couldn't make a good movie out of Dune bodes ill.
Personally, I think Dune would work out better as a 10-13 episode TV series than a single movie, unless this is the first of a series of movies, Star Wars-style, covering the book over the course of a trilogy or quadrilogy.
Personally, I think Dune would work out better as a 10-13 episode TV series than a single movie, unless this is the first of a series of movies, Star Wars-style, covering the book over the course of a trilogy or quadrilogy.
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WAAAAAAAAGH!!!!!(<-link to lunacy)...Taste me, if you can bear it. (Warning: Language NSFW)
The main point of idiocy is for the smart to have their lulz. Without human idiocy, trolling would not exist, and that's uncool, since a large part of my entertainment consists of mocking the absurdity and dumbassery of the world, especially the Internet.-MaggotMaster
- pwhodges
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Re: DUNE
I think I saw somewhere that this is the first of two films.
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Re: DUNE
I'm just kind of tired of the Marvel jokes I don't find half of them funny, and I'm bored of every movie copying the model because they think it's poplar instead of breaking the mould and doing their own thing.
SYFY channel, back when they were excellent before they went really lazy and bad, did do a Dune miniseries in 2000 which you can buy on blue ray and it's really good it's the truest version I've seen compared to the books though sadly they didn't do the whole book series. It's also really underrated and has somehow gotten lost and forgotten.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxDjnSnbNhw
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- UrsusArctos
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Re: DUNE
Neither do I, I find such jokes annoying and substandard more often than not and like you said, they're being copied everywhere to the point that it's almost impossible to avoid them.
I remember hearing mixed reviews about the 2000 miniseries, although now that you mention it I should probably check it out.
The last really good show on SyFy was The Expanse before Amazon acquired it. Season 1 was nothing great and full of unnecessary drama, but Seasons 2 and 3 were much better. If they put the same production quality as Season 2 and 3 of The Expanse into a new Dune miniseries, I think it'd turn out well as long as SyFy didn't pull their usual habit of canceling a high-quality show in the middle of its run.
I remember hearing mixed reviews about the 2000 miniseries, although now that you mention it I should probably check it out.
The last really good show on SyFy was The Expanse before Amazon acquired it. Season 1 was nothing great and full of unnecessary drama, but Seasons 2 and 3 were much better. If they put the same production quality as Season 2 and 3 of The Expanse into a new Dune miniseries, I think it'd turn out well as long as SyFy didn't pull their usual habit of canceling a high-quality show in the middle of its run.
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Not knowing that Monk is bi is like not knowing the Pope is Catholic - ZapX
You're either really bad at interpreting jokes or really good at pretending you are and I have no idea which.-Monk Ed
WAAAAAAAAGH!!!!!(<-link to lunacy)...Taste me, if you can bear it. (Warning: Language NSFW)
The main point of idiocy is for the smart to have their lulz. Without human idiocy, trolling would not exist, and that's uncool, since a large part of my entertainment consists of mocking the absurdity and dumbassery of the world, especially the Internet.-MaggotMaster
Not knowing that Monk is bi is like not knowing the Pope is Catholic - ZapX
You're either really bad at interpreting jokes or really good at pretending you are and I have no idea which.-Monk Ed
WAAAAAAAAGH!!!!!(<-link to lunacy)...Taste me, if you can bear it. (Warning: Language NSFW)
The main point of idiocy is for the smart to have their lulz. Without human idiocy, trolling would not exist, and that's uncool, since a large part of my entertainment consists of mocking the absurdity and dumbassery of the world, especially the Internet.-MaggotMaster
- pwhodges
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Re: DUNE
It's widely considered the best adaptation of Dune yet. The original series "Frank Herbert's Dune" covers the first book, and the sequel series "Children of Dune" covers the second and third.
The reviews of the Blurays that I recall suggest that it's no improvement over the DVDs.
"Being human, having your health; that's what's important." (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?" (from: The Eccentric Family )
Avatar: The end of the journey (details); Past avatars.
Before 3.0+1.0 there was Afterwards... my post-Q Evangelion fanfic (discussion)
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?" (from: The Eccentric Family )
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Before 3.0+1.0 there was Afterwards... my post-Q Evangelion fanfic (discussion)
- EvaChero
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Re: DUNE
It's like mass production Eva's, too much of the same thing and it pecks away at your soul until creativity is dead (or its entrails lay scattered about you......)
I'm only a casual fan and I did enjoy the old movie with "Sting" in it (other than the creepy little sister) so I hope for the sake of the heavy duty fans that they
"get it right"
I'm only a casual fan and I did enjoy the old movie with "Sting" in it (other than the creepy little sister) so I hope for the sake of the heavy duty fans that they
"get it right"
who doesn't want to kick back with Misato and have a few beers?
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Re: DUNE
I think the old 80's movie gets a bad rep as I think the voice-over idea they used worked really well, and it was trying really hard at the time despite its production hell. I think people forget 80's movie effects were time-consuming and very hard, you had to get it right in one take sometimes and if you didn't there was 5/6 hours to reset. So I think for effects alone the film deserves merit, as Dune is like LOTR in that you have to do a lot of groundwork to make a person feel like their part of that universe.
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- Natalie the Cat
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Re: DUNE
I will defend Lynch's Dune to the day that I day. I wish there were more movies like it, even now. It's unabashedly weird and doesn't hold the audience's hand, nor talk down to it. It just is what it is without dissembling, which is what makes it a masterpiece even in a butchered form that doesn't reflect Lynch's original vision. The only thing I don't really like about it was the decision to replace the weirding way martial art concept with the little boxes and sound blasts, but I think that if Lynch thought that the Fremen kung fu fighting their way across Arrakis would look silly, he was probably right- at least as far as his vision of Arakkis goes, anyway. The Sardaukar look so ridiculous (yet in a way that fits everything else, so they don't stand out) that having people in skintight suits punching them probably would have been pretty off.
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Re: DUNE
Natalie the Cat wrote:I think that if Lynch thought that the Fremen kung fu fighting their way across Arrakis would look silly, he was probably right- at least as far as his vision of Arakkis goes, anyway. The Sardaukar look so ridiculous (yet in a way that fits everything else, so they don't stand out) that having people in skintight suits punching them probably would have been pretty off.
I would agree with that as time frame wise the 70's kung fu fighting films were in decline, and he was probably very self-aware of this granted there was the karate kid series in 1984, but this was a one off and in realty the dying breaths of these kinds of films. As the kickboxing style was on the rise and that would take over the main stream in how characters battled on screen in things like Buffy and the Matrix and Blade.
Anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live. After all, you are alive, so you will always have the chance to be happy.
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- Thuktun Flishithy
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Re: DUNE
Honestly my big sticking point for this new movie will be how they handle Paul. Dune is many things- a story of the follies of overestimating or misunderstanding our abilities, a parable of the dangers of basing your entire civilization on a single cornerstone that can be controlled or destroyed, an ecological tale, and so much more.
No adaptation can be all of these things, regardless of the media. To adapt is to translate, and to translate is to betray, as Ken Liu said. Something will be lost, some things will be gained. That's not necessarily a bad thing, as long as you don't lose the most important stuff, and replace what is lost with something of good substance.
For me, the most important thing, whose loss would doom the film for me, is what sort of hero Paul is. Because Dune is most importantly a story of the dangers of charismatic leaders who take power not because they're the actual best and moral choice, but because they knew what to do or say to take power.
Paul is a false Messiah. He's a talented nobleman who takes advantage of the indigenous belief system -as well as chance of birth and a shitload of space LSD- and creates a cult of personality about himself in order to take vengeance and become Emperor. But this same role he has made for himself traps him just as his powers do, and sets him on a course he can't really avoid, which kills tens of billions of people. After all, he is the Kwisatz Haderach, who will lead the Fremen on a jihad, right?
That's where Lynch's Dune really fucks the dog. That Paul is portrayed as the hero he pretends to be, the actual Kwisatz Haderach who brings rain to Arrakis, and therefore is hollow for it. Hopefully, the Paul of this movie will hew closer to Herbert's vision, if his worried statement about a crusade coming means anything.
No adaptation can be all of these things, regardless of the media. To adapt is to translate, and to translate is to betray, as Ken Liu said. Something will be lost, some things will be gained. That's not necessarily a bad thing, as long as you don't lose the most important stuff, and replace what is lost with something of good substance.
For me, the most important thing, whose loss would doom the film for me, is what sort of hero Paul is. Because Dune is most importantly a story of the dangers of charismatic leaders who take power not because they're the actual best and moral choice, but because they knew what to do or say to take power.
Paul is a false Messiah. He's a talented nobleman who takes advantage of the indigenous belief system -as well as chance of birth and a shitload of space LSD- and creates a cult of personality about himself in order to take vengeance and become Emperor. But this same role he has made for himself traps him just as his powers do, and sets him on a course he can't really avoid, which kills tens of billions of people. After all, he is the Kwisatz Haderach, who will lead the Fremen on a jihad, right?
That's where Lynch's Dune really fucks the dog. That Paul is portrayed as the hero he pretends to be, the actual Kwisatz Haderach who brings rain to Arrakis, and therefore is hollow for it. Hopefully, the Paul of this movie will hew closer to Herbert's vision, if his worried statement about a crusade coming means anything.
Re: DUNE
Watched Villeneuve's Dune yesterday. It's a wonderful, beautiful visual feast with dozens of great moments, scenes and direction, with actors who fit their roles surprisingly well (Ferguson and Chalamet were especially great). There's honestly probably not a single bad performance, scene or shot and it's the sort of film that really seems to understand what the adjective "epic" could be at its best. I was a bit on the fence about the visual style of the residences (was expecting something a lot more overtly luxurious and imperial), but the style grew on me and I ended up loving it a lot. Hans Zimmer's also the best he's been in a long time, with the score being actually interesting, great and hitting. The film was unafraid of being huger, weirder and different from most sci-fi fare (the scope is fucking insane and a lot of devices are designed almost perfectly), and a lot of Herbert's themes and ideas (environmentalism, colonialism, civilization's dependence on a national resource, etc) were communicated in a suitably, excitingly subtle way. The film's way of not outright telling a lot of things and relying more on bits of info on which the audience needs to build themselves was very welcome. As for the problems-there were a few plot holes (those who've read the novel will be fine, though), Yueh's character definitely deserved a better and more nuanced interpretation, it does end a bit abruptly and the way Jamis' duel and its aftermath were treated does make me worry about how well the second film would continue the 'messiah' themes and even though I can understand they're not really flaws within the internal landscape of the film only, I honestly would've liked a bit more political stuff.
Over-all, I liked it a great deal and it's probably my favorite film of the year by far and it very much is a showcase of Villeneuve's talents as a filmmaker. Despite having had a few problems, it's great to see a film this well made on the levels of direction, acting, cinematography and visuals that on top also is really the absolute best when watched in a cinema.
SPOILER: Show
The cutting of the banquet scene, Leto's implicit understanding of the Emperor wanting House Atreides gone and the entire "Thufir-thinks-Jessica-is-a-traitor" situation are the obvious omissions. I don't want to fault the film for those too much because it doesn't need to have the exact same story and it's always better to look at adaptations as works that are very much separate from their sources, but it's slightly disappointing still to not have even an inkling of such interesting things in the film.
Over-all, I liked it a great deal and it's probably my favorite film of the year by far and it very much is a showcase of Villeneuve's talents as a filmmaker. Despite having had a few problems, it's great to see a film this well made on the levels of direction, acting, cinematography and visuals that on top also is really the absolute best when watched in a cinema.
- Thuktun Flishithy
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Re: DUNE
Holy shit this movie was amazing. Denis somehow managed to do the Lord's work and actually effectively translate the book's content to the screen. My dad who had never read the book came to watch it with me and was gushing about it after, talking about how interesting the plot was. The aesthetic felt like it was ripped right out of the best of classic science fiction artwork.
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Re: DUNE
Dune is probably the first movie in a very long time that really astonished me, in a visual sense. True, a lot movies these days seem to be trying to outdo each other with how much eye-popping CGI they contain, but Dune is the first one I've seen where it really took my breath away. The scene where the giant sandworm emerges from the desert reminds me of that first glimpse of the Brachiosaurus in Jurassic Park-- it's simply majestic.
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Do you like Eva? Do you like Pokemon? Then check out Neon Genesis Evangelemon-- You Can (Not) Catch 'Em All thread/16052/Neon-Genesis-Evangelemon/
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Re: DUNE
hhhhNNNNGwoaaahbaaheeee, haaaaaaaambambarim, beren, berumberumberamberaaaam, berambergungubaaaaamburuummm
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- Thuktun Flishithy
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Re: DUNE
Memes are messages from the deep.
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Re: DUNE
Rundown on the making off of (?) the movie: https://youtu.be/PNutE4Fajus
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