3.0+1.0 Emotional vomiting

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment made its debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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AdamMalkovitch
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3.0+1.0 Emotional vomiting

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Postby AdamMalkovitch » Thu Aug 12, 2021 9:16 pm

Didn't see a thread for this, but I think it fits. If it doesn't belong here, you can feel free to move it to another section of the forum.

I didn't cry until the end, but fuck did I cry. 6 years of emotion in those twisting, grunting tears, I can't imagine the feelings of someone who's been waiting since 3.0 actually released, and I'd be surprised if this didn't damn near kill all those who grew up watching Neon Genesis as it aired.

I always felt a sort of connection to EVA. The way the original series looked and sounded, resonated with me so closely that it felt like it was taken out of my own dreams and memories, a feeling seconded with the ending shot showing a city looking damn near identical to one I saw in a dream I had earlier this year, a dream of watching this movie. The connection, the bond, deepened when I learned NGE aired it's first episode exactly 5 years before my own birth. I saw myself in Shinji how he was portrayed in the original TV series, and I hated myself for what felt like decades because of it. I was still in high school then, 15 when I watched the series, and constantly surrounded by those I perceived as being better than me. Kids with lots of friends, kids in clubs, kids in advanced classes, kids going to college, it drove me insane. I looked at me, and wondered, "why do I have to be a Shinji?"

Since then, six years have passed. I learned about Anno's other works, and grew to admire him, pushing through the same self-loathing I did in order to make tons of incredible stuff. He even used his experiences to fuel things like the science in Gunbuster, Nadia's character, and Shinji's views of himself. Then I looked back at myself. I was still just a Shinji.

So many times I wanted to give up at "piloting the EVA", but that idea, Yui's testament of hope, "anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live," refused to leave me. It was my perspective. I was looking at the mountain I still had yet to climb, as well as other nearby mountains. So I turned around and looked how far I had already climbed. I enjoyed the view from that height. And that gave me the drive to keep climbing my own mountain.

I know he'll very likely never read this, I doubt any of the staff who worked on Neon Genesis, End of, the manga adaptation, or New Theatrical Evangelion will ever come across this, but I want to thank you. Your work had a major hand in keeping me alive, keeping me just hopeful enough to keep climbing. I haven't made much progress, but I'm moving forward, even just a bit. I even found my own Mari, someone who pushes me to keep climbing while reminding me to enjoy the view every once in a while. I don't know any of you, and I'd be lucky to ever meet even one of you, but your work, your perseverance and dedication changed my life.

To Director Anno, thank you. To Evangelion, goodbye. And to all those who are still climbing, congratulations!
*injects Angel blood* I know what the fuck an EVA is now :)

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Postby hui43210 » Thu Aug 12, 2021 9:59 pm

Well said! As someone who has waited the full 9 or so years, it's a very strange feeling having actually seen the movie now.
I mean, predictability is the central attraction and the narrative hook that we've all come to expect from the Evangelion franchise. How come Anno can't realize this? Twice? - FreakyFilmFan4ever

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Postby Registration2 » Thu Aug 12, 2021 10:54 pm

Nothing for me. I did cry when watching the B trailer but when the actual movie was there, nothing at all, did not like very much. The only thing that I feel right now is disappointment, a first with evangelion, in all levels.

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Postby komatsu007 » Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:08 am

View Original Posthui43210 wrote:Well said! As someone who has waited the full 9 or so years, it's a very strange feeling having actually seen the movie now.


It kind of feels like when I left the theater after watching Star Wars Episode III in one of those midnight premiere screenings. Is this it? Is Star Wars over? Boy, was I wrong.

I've been following EVA for 20+ years now, so in a way it feels bittersweet. At least now the New Theatrical Edition has an ending, though as an ending it was sappy, many parts of it were wholly unearned, etc. I can't escape the feeling Anno s*** the bed with the Rebuilds - a big opportunity wasted.
"Oh, play that thing! Mute glorious Storyvilles / Others may license, grouping around their chairs / Sporting-house girls like circus tigers (priced far above rubies) to pretend their fads/ While scholars manqués nod around unnoticed/Wrapped up in personnels like old plaids. On me your voice falls as they say love should, like an enormous yes" - "For Sidney Bechet", Philip Larkin

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Postby sephirotic » Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:48 am

The wait between 2000, when I first watched EoE until 2007 for the Rebuild felt twice as long and as exciting as the wait for 3.0+1.0. The fact that I really disliked 3.0 made this 9 years wait much more palatable.
I knew 3.0+1.0 wasn't going to fix what 3.0 ruined for me, so my expectations were low. I was expecting something EoEsque, again, but better executed than 3.0, and that is what I got. I had some emotional moments but didn't really cry as I did with 1.0, or 2.0 and even watching 3.0 trailer. I think this movie will hold a deeper meaning and be somewhat special in my memory because 12 of august is my birthday, and that is when I watched it. I still think Rebuild is not the remake I wanted it to be, but i think the final was the best it could have been. I still have to rewatch everything again to let this long 14 years ride (since 2007) sink in.
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Re-watching Eva since 1999
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Postby LightDragonman » Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:50 am

Don't know where else to say this, but here goes (posting what I wrote on another site).

(Note: A lot of this writing is me being writing a similar review to a certain former internet reviewer's thoughts on a film I found very much like it, so my thoughts are gonna line up quite a bit. If you find lines from my post to be almost the exact same as his, that's why.)

Well, I just finished watching 3.0+1.0.

To be honest, I fully entered into it expecting to just be blown away, with a satisfied feeling at the end. Maybe that's not the right word, given the franchise's history, but at the very least, I expected to be just wowed and left in awe at what Anno and crew delivered in the end. Even if 3.33 snuffed out a lot of my enthusiasm for the franchise, I was still more than willing to give this film the benefit of the doubt. If Anno could pull off one last epic twist, which given the lengthy development and possible rewrites, was also expected, than all else could be forgiven.

Heck, I quite enjoyed the works Anno made during the long 8 and 1/2 wait between films. He excels in the sort of pseudo-philosophical crap that I eat up like candy, and given his renewed creative juices following Shin Godzilla, I sat down with the high hopes that he'd, at the very least, justify all the suffering and character-bashing of Redo, and pull out all the stops.

On the whole, watching 3.0+1.0 was easy. Heck, I'll even say I had a much better time watching it than I did with 3.33, as it was nowhere near as mean-spirited or full of contempt as that one was. Writing about my feelings on it though? That's an entirely different kettle of fish. I say this because I really, really want to say that it was the ending the franchise and all of us deserved, and one that I liked as much as the original series and 2.22 (still my favorite out of the entire saga). Yet sitting down thinking it over after having seen it, I really can't.

For that matter, I think I came to a glum realization while watching the credits roll. We had spent the past 8 and 1/2 years of our lives debating over what it all meant, what exactly Anno had up his sleeve, how each of the characters connected to both each other and their original selves, when really, this is how it was always gonna end. A whole bunch of slow character-building moments at the beginning, a very long, visually dense action-packed climax, and a reset button ending with the fates of some characters left up in the air. There was no real big twist or shock planned at all. Show's over folks. Go on home.

To be fair, getting a completely closed off ending with all the questions answered isn't to be expected from Eva. After all, one of the major draws of the franchise is its open-endedness that encourages the viewer to come up with their own interpretations. But I was just hoping for something more. They could've gone whatever crazy route they wanted with this saga, and instead what we ended up with was, surprisingly, rather predictable, despite all the unsubtle religious and spiritual terms and ideas thrown about willy-nilly.

There are other problems with it sure (some really lackluster CG near the end, certain characters not getting enough development or screentime, resolutions to some relationships feeling rushed or unearned, symbolism that's only there to look cool, areas which felt like padding), but the thing is, the original series has similar problems, yet it worked. Heck, the previous Rebuild films, even 3.33 had that, and they still worked too. I think this film went wrong because it whole-heartedly leaned into the mystical and mind-screw territory, without really having enough build-up to really justify it. The films worked best when it was centered on Shinji's connection to the others, and how he and those close to him grew from them, and I just wanted to see more of that, not a whole bunch of abstract and visually dense imagery that really means bugger all when you start to analyze it.

And it's not just me simply wanting my favored ship or the like to come canon or have closure. A lot of things get that in this film. But it all just feels buried under the weight of everything that is jockeying for screentime. Lots of things explode, colors are assaulting the senses, nightmarish imagery is shown, and yet it all feels hollow. And it all culminates in an ending that is essentially a reset button, alongside making it clear that Anno clearly views it as less of a story and more of a way to express his own personal feelings at us.

To be fair, the original was that as well. But it was much more effective in it for a reason. The franchise's main source for its themes, beyond the mere window dressing of the religious symbolism and Freudian subtext, was that of the Hedgehog's Dilemma. How we all crave the affection and connection we share with others, and yet they also cause us to feel pain. Said pain may lead to us isolating from others to stay safe, but it is not at all what we as humans need to truly live. The world is filled with hardships and painful times, but it is all worth enduring it and living, because through them warmth and love can still reach you. Running away from all that just because you don't want to get hurt deprives you of what is beautiful in the world, and said beauty makes this harsh life worth it all in the end. More to the point, it is through it that we can learn to love both others and ourselves, and we can endure thanks to that.

And here in 3.0+1.0..................it all ends with an Impact that basically causes a reset button on the heroes' lives. Some have said that all the philosophical navel-gazing of the original show was little more than pretentious nonsense, and to an extent that may be true. But there's a reason as to why it became such a cultural touchstone. It was the very rare series that managed to tap even the dimmest basement-dweller and make them think about their lives, if only for a moment. For this film to not do it as well just leaves me with a hollow feeling.

I often said that I had this feeling watching the previews, and upon seeing the film, I hate to admit it, but I really do think that this is Eva's equivalent to The Matrix Revolutions. It's a film that, while having high ambitions and loads of themes and spectacle, ends up feeling anti-climactic and not as impactful as I hoped.

That said, I would still tell people to watch the movie. After all, my thoughts are just the thoughts of one person. Who knows, you may end up coming to the complete opposite of my final thoughts. Just for me though, I expected to be blown away, and yet by the time the credits rolled, I was left feeling nothing.

.....................Dang it, this saga could've been so fricken cool. I can't believe it.
Proud fanboy of Rei Ayanami. :p

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:00 am

View Original PostAdamMalkovitch wrote:I didn't cry until the end, but fuck did I cry.


I need time to let things settle. To really process it. And I need to rewatch it several more times before I can even being to start forming full opinions.

But when it comes to crying I cried a lot! I cried a whole lot! I was an emotional wreck the whole film!

After the first 18 minutes, which even after already having seen that portion a good dozen times I have still not tired of, I pretty much cried the entire first hour! Shinji's suffering. Rei's enlightenment. How Rei's care & concern for Shinji is what saved him. Shinji's slow quiet growth into self acceptance. Rei's quiet acceptance of her death. Her death! And Shinji's determination to not make her life be in vain. ALL DESTROYED ME EMOTIONALLY.

I've only seen it the one time, and I won't make any definite proclamations just yet, but I think the 50 or so minutes in Village 3 may be my favorite chapter in the entirety of the Rebuild saga if not maybe all of Evangelion! It's perfect.

I did cry a few more times later in the film, especially near the end, but I was not as emotionally elevated as I was in the first half but that's kinda expected since SO MUCH HAPPENS in the 2nd half.

I loved it. I know it's going to be my favorite Rebuild film and my favorite film of 2021.

There's so much to process.

I'm going to try and get some sleep.

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Postby Stuart » Mon Aug 16, 2021 12:52 am

AdamMalkovitch, I feel you big time.

I was 14 when I first watched NGE 20 years ago. It's been a huge part of my life.

In my darkest moments, genuinely I have thought to myself many times that I can't commit suicide because I haven't seen the Final Eva film yet. It's helped me to process the suicide of a friend. It helped me to realise my sexuality. It just resonated with me in the exact same way you describe.

It's difficult for people who are not Eva fans to understand the gravity which the movie has for all of us. None of my friends really understood when I warned them in advance that I would be an emotional wreck all weekend.

In the end, I wasn't. My initial reaction at the end credit roll was anger at Anno for pairing Shinji with Mari. At that point, I wished he had never even made the Rebuilds. I quickly started to get over that, however. I've read that final scene as Anno's way of telling us that Shinji isn't ours anymore, and that if we truly love him we just need to be happy that he is now happy. I think this was made more explicit via the Kaworu instrumentality sequence, when Kaworu realises he was seeking his own happiness through Shinji.

A big part of growing up is accepting that the ones we love often don't want the same things, and that we have to let them go if they are to find their own happiness. So, I'm at peace with the ending now - it feels like it was Shinji's will, and that he's now free from Eva, free from the story, free from the shippers, and has actually advanced forward with his life.

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Postby Mishrak » Mon Aug 16, 2021 10:52 am

View Original PostAdamMalkovitch wrote:I didn't cry until the end, but fuck did I cry. 6 years of emotion in those twisting, grunting tears, I can't imagine the feelings of someone who's been waiting since 3.0 actually released, and I'd be surprised if this didn't damn near kill all those who grew up watching Neon Genesis as it aired.


I watched NGE on VHS in middle school so this was basically a 24 year trip for me. When One Last Kiss dropped before the movie, I intentionally hid from it because I knew. I was right. When that song started up I just cried like a baby for the whole duration of the credits. 24 years and finally actual closure. I didn’t really think we’d ever get it. But there it was and it felt so good.

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Postby EvaChero » Mon Aug 16, 2021 1:04 pm

SPOILER: Show
That moment when Misato pulls off the hat and glasses and lets her hair down before ramming home the spear with the Wunder.........


really got me.
who doesn't want to kick back with Misato and have a few beers?

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Postby writer » Mon Aug 16, 2021 1:13 pm

I first watched Eva when I was probably 14 or 15. I had learned about it from an IRC room that I frequented. I was on dial-up, so I could only download about 1 episode per-day. I would stay up until the episode finished downloading, then I'd watch it, ruminate on the episode, start up the next episode downloading, and go to sleep. I remember near the end having some wild thoughts, many of which were exact things that I had thought in my life. Things about being alienated, the Hedgehog's DIlemma, and many of the other themes stuck with me permanently. I felt like I learned so much from it and that each episode was something to savor. After EoE I was stunned; I had never seen anything so amazing before. I rewatched the show and EoE countless times through the years and always hoped there would be more Eva.

That was 20 years ago.

When Rebuild was announced I was so excited. The first movie was really cool, but I was kind of sad that it seemed Rebuild would just be a remake of the original. I had seen the original so many times, and I was really hoping for something new. But there were signs in the movie that lead me to believe that this was not just a remake but actually some form of continuation. This lead me back to the original series, which I rewatched along with EoE and Death/Rebirth many times. At the end of 2.0, when N3I happened, I was completely shocked. The small changes in the narrative had culminated into Shinji initiating an impact WAY too early. We didn't get Asuka development, didn't get to see all of the Angels; was this it? When Kaworu came down from the clouds and ended N3I, I was screaming. I didn't know what was coming next but what I did know is that the minor deviations were leading to something new, and I couldn't wait to see what it was.

3.0 was a mixed bag for me. On my initial watch I was so confused that I immediately watched it again. I had some negative opinions, and many were echoed through the online forums I was visiting. But over the years of waiting for Thrice I just kept watching it, kept learning a bit more each time, until I finally understood as much as I could from the film. As an emotional and psychological mechanism, 3.0 was one of the best in the series, it just took a keen eye and the ability to shed off all expectation to see what would come next. Any time I was faced with the "3.0 sucks" argument I immediately responded that Thrice would explain what needed to be explained. I never had a doubt for a second that Anno would deliver something meaningful, and that it would be what the series needed to finally have closure.

ReiQ getting to learn about life and respect it, Shinji growing up and realizing his place in the universe, Misato and Kaji having a son, then Misato abandoning him so that she could give him and the rest of the world a chance, Ritsuko becoming her mother, Kaji's double-agent nature being explored (at least partially), Toji and Kensuke being believable versions of themselves in the future, Misato's bad-ass death scene, Gendo's redemption arc, Asuka's variation (clone) and the effects of that on her as a person, and so many other things about Thrice just hit home for me. Even with the Eva Imaginary scenes, I knew with just a couple of rewatches it would all make sense to me.

I cried when Gendo hugged Shinji and realized Yui had been there all along. I smiled as Shinji resolved his issues with Asuka, both before the 4I and during final Instrumentality. I cheered when Misato fulfilled her final task. I smiled as Mari saved Shinji from the crumbling old reality. I teared up when Kaworu told Shinji that he's really acting differently. I cried when Yui and Gendo gave Shinji a chance to live, and was proud of him for finally making the decision. And finally, I sobbed as Shinji and Mari ran off from the station, releasing me from this eternal loop of suffering and somehow giving me a chance to just breathe. It was a piece of work that crowns the history of Evangelion so perfectly; now we know Gendo's motivations, and we know that Shinji comes out on top at the end, not only saving his friends but creating a world where the threat of Angels and Evas is impossible. I could not imagine any changes and understand the challenge and timeline to create this.

I still think there's a chance we'll have a Madoka situation, where the removal of the Evas create some other threat, but mostly I'm waiting for the announcement for a 2.0+3.0 film, OVA, short series, Manga, novel (idc what) that will cover the 14 year gap and expand even more on Kaworu, Kaji, and Mari. But I can wait as long as it takes. I also believe, at some point, that Thrice will get the EoE treatment, and that Thrice really gives us more of a 25/26 ending than something equivalent to an EoE. I think, one day, we'll get Evangelion 4.0 and that it will show Instrumentality as it actually occurred in the world. I also think we'll get a new series based off of Anima, but this is all just daydreaming.

I think the removal of all symbolism, the breaking down of the experience into nothing more than a stage show, and a release from all characters to live a life as plain as all of ours has allowed me to find closure for them all. For those who are still open ended, I await the next pieces of the tale. But I no longer feel the need to defend Eva or even attempt to make others watch it. I don't feel the urge to discuss it with those who have not invested the time, nor do I feel like I should try to bring people into the experience. Those of us who Eva touched, it touched for a reason. And that reason is very human; it is a place of understanding where we can explore ourselves through Anno's vision.

I hope this won't be the end, but if it is, I can't imagine a better place for a happy Sayonara. Thank you, Anno. And everyone. Thank you.
Shinji did nothing wrong!

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Postby driftking18594 » Mon Aug 16, 2021 2:29 pm

I made the mistake of watching this on Sunday evening and fucking my sleep schedule. I've just had this pit in my stomach all day.

Two moments really stick with me as gut punches: Asuka force-feeding Shinji (just because of the motion of the camera, and I guess that was a 3D-animated scene) and finding out the full details of the Shikinami Series. I heard about it, and I seen screenshots of Asuka getting absorbed into Unit-13, but I thought - or rather, hoped - that Asuka was going to get to turn the tables. I thought it was like a fragment of her soul, like Kyoko's in Unit-02, albeit contaminated by Bardiel. Sure, she was saved, but the Asuka Tier 3 Sub in me wanted her to save herself...but that'd just defeat the point of her arc, wouldn't it.

But the most disturbing part is the fate of the would-be Asukas who didn't make the cut. It's a literal eugenics programme, with the added twist that she's German. In the grand scheme of things, what's dozens of dead girls when you're planning to meld all life into a single god? But, I'm a fiend for world-building and headcanon. I can't help but imagine the failed candidates getting shot in the back of the head and then incinerated.

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Postby kuribo-04 » Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:58 pm

Kensuke taking Shinji to his home, telling him not everything about Near Third Impact was bad, while the film shows us the beautiful landscape, with floating debree, and while Prettiest Star from the OST sounds in the background, that got me.

Shinji and Asuka meeting at Kensuke's house, with Prettiest Star still going, just was depressing as shit. Made me feel heartbroken.

The sequence of young Asuka training in her Eva got me. So did Gendo embracing Shinji on the train station platform.

Was close to crying many times, but what really did it was Yui appearing to stop Shinji from sacrificing himself.

The final live action shot of the film transitioning into the credits, together with the understanding I had of that last scene (Shinji leaving the train station with Mari while the rest of the classic pilots board a train, which the camera follows leaving for a bit = Us and Anno saying goodbye to Eva and the fantasy), plus hearing the full version of One Last Kiss for the first time was the final push I needed to let it all out. Left for the living room afterwards, explaining that the film just had been that beautiful as I wiped my eyes lol.
Shinji: "Sooner or later I'll be betrayed... And they'll leave me. Still... I want to meet them again, because I believe my feelings at that time were real."
Ryuko: "I'm gonna knock ya on your asses!"
-Asuka: THINK IN GERMAN!!! -Shinji: Öh... Baumkuchen...
Hayashida: "As game developers, our work is special. All of us here can put smiles on very many people's faces with our work."
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Postby geistygal » Fri Oct 01, 2021 3:03 pm

I started to cry the second I realized Toji was still alive. It never really stopped, with big outbursts from me every time I realized someone else had survived (I was BAWLING when I saw Kensuke, I love that sweet boy), choking sobbing when Rei Q died, and pretty much having screaming crying fits from the entry into the Minus Universe onwards. I think I wound up spending the rest of the day in a breakdown just sobbing and sobbing and sobbing.

Fantastic movie.

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Postby Mark 6 » Wed Oct 13, 2021 12:48 am

I was tearing up during the early segment of the movie when Shinji wakes up inside Touji's clinic and is then introduced to Village 3 alongside Rei. The accompanying musical piano piece was perfect for the scene, with Rei being cute and curious about her new surroundings in direct contrast to Shinji who was looking downwards and very solemn, avoiding eye contact with people; feeling guilty and ashamed for his role in what led to this new extreme way of life for all the people in the village. Hikari and Touji being so welcoming of Rei and Shinji into their home, treating the sudden and miraculous reappearance of their former childhood schoolmates as a blessing was beautiful. Shinji lifting his head just a little when he is greeted by Kensuke made me almost cry. Shinji was happy to realize Kensuke is alive and well and probably wanted to greet Kensuke back really bad but is just too broken and extremely ashamed about everything at the moment. :spout:

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Postby kuribo-04 » Thu Oct 14, 2021 12:35 am

∆ Yeah those little details in Shinji's body language told so much
Shinji: "Sooner or later I'll be betrayed... And they'll leave me. Still... I want to meet them again, because I believe my feelings at that time were real."
Ryuko: "I'm gonna knock ya on your asses!"
-Asuka: THINK IN GERMAN!!! -Shinji: Öh... Baumkuchen...
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