BernardoCairo wrote:This is true. That's why I consider her endgame to be so emotional. Shinji saved Asuka and sent her back to Kensuke's house. She is finally free of any angelic traits and is able to grow, like any human. Asuka can finally live the life she deserves.

See, this is where I'm of the opposite opinion. NuclearLunchbox's translation muddies the waters a little ("We're just like our them:"), but I'm pretty sure she's saying to Rei that the Eva pilots are the same as the Evas. What Shinji does is not freeing her of her bonds. He makes them permanent. Her "angelic traits" are her inborn traits. That's was has been suppressed all her life, kept in check, her very being altered by conditioning (she only makes it explicit in Rei's case, with her being programmed to like Shinji). "Don't surpass human limits." "Here, Asuka: you are a human now. Isn't that great?"

But you are right, of course. We need to see the movie to come to more accurate conclusions here. I'm of course aware that my current interpretation is bound to be overturned at some point, and I do not claim to be right. But personally, I think there's too much dubious stuff going on to subcribe to a carefully positive reading of the whole situation.

Derantor wrote:What Shinji does is not freeing her of her bonds. He makes them permanent. Her "angelic traits" are her inborn traits. That's was has been suppressed all her life, kept in check, her very being altered by conditioning

When I said that she had no angelic traits, I was talking about two things in particular. Firstly, she can now grow. That's a fact. Secondly, her left eye appears to be back to "normal". In other words, she seems to be free of the ninth angel. These two things, in particular, used to haunt Asuka and make her feel "out of place" and "disconnected". Shikinami tried to deny her own humanity, but as Mari said: "In your hair reside god, dirt, earthly desires. It's the representation of the heart of a chaotic person. Princess, without any doubt, it's proof that you're human." It doesn't matter if she was created inside of a lab, I guess. By the way, Shinji, Gendo and Yui created a world without Evangelions. It seems to be close to our own reality, to be honest. Therefore, the reverberations of EVAs and Angels must also have been erased from the universe. That includes the pilots' original nature. If you think about it, the change started even before the world was rebuilded. Ayanami was "programmed" to like Shinji. However, in their last conversation, she was ready to move on and live by herself.
Asuka dealt with her problems, grew up, said goodbye to Shinji and was sent back to Kensuke's house (one of her only friends). What does all this mean? I don't know. As you said, we have to wait and see!

Thinking about it, the reason Asuka was surprised to had been able to go back to the Wunder could be because she thought that WILLE wouldn't had any use for her (she self-destroyed her Eva in Q and didn't know that it was salvaged and repaired) and thus would abandon her.
And extrapolating from here, maybe she thought that once the war was over, the Lilin would get rid of her (since she wouldn't be useful anymore and this have a piece of Angel in her), sp her removing her eyepatch to go all out (and activating her DSS Choker) could had been a way to die on her own terms. Maybe that's also part of the reason why she wanted to have a closure with Shinji before departing for the last battle, if she truly intended to die.

By the way, if she's now Major Shikinami, that means that she got a promotion from her previous rank of Captain in 2.0, not that it really means something, nor she seems to care about it.


But still, that doesn't explain why they increased the amount of explosive in hers and Mari's room, nor why they trust them even less (they fucking saved the world!) as a reaction of Shinji's actions in Q. Hell, we don't know why they put explosives in their room in the first place!

It's pretty ironic: before the Eva pilots were the rockstars of Tokyo-3 and deemed the protectors of mankind, and now they are pariah treated as radioactive weapons that are only used because WILLE don't have another choice.

Although Misato's callous precautions toward the Eva pilots puts Asuka's line to her in Q under a very different line: "in this world, one life means nothing. Right, captain Katsuragi?", that make me think that Asuka might had complained about her treatment (DSS Choker, explosives in the room) in the past, and that Misato told her those exact words. If that was the case, then Asuka throwing back those words to Misato could be a thinly-veiled jab at her to see if she'll stick to what she told her years ago and treat him like any other pilot despite their past relationship, or if she'll make a special treatment for him.

But yeah, thinking about it, it's a shame that Misato never apologized to Asuka and Mari for treating them like that for 14 years, because they both deserve an apology even more than Shinji.

Derantor wrote:She's different. She's feared and mistrusted, and they didn't let her forget that for 28 years. She doesn't need to eat - she doesn't grow. She can't even sleep. Yeah, I would self-isolate too.

Wait, the curse of Eva also remove the need (and capacity) to sleep?!

ElMariachi wrote:But still, that doesn't explain why they increased the amount of explosive in hers and Mari's room, nor why they trust them even less (they fucking saved the world!) as a reaction of Shinji's actions in Q. Hell, we don't know why they put explosives in their room in the first place!

Yeah. I was surprised and horrified when I read about that. WILLE have been working 14 years with Mari and Asuka, but they still treat that way.

You would expect WILLE was going to thank Mari for helping to stop the Fourth Impact, but NO. WILLE's answer is more explosives.

The DSS choker in Asuka and Mari should be a hint to WILLE lack of trust, but I thought it was just a precaution. The explosives in their room are too much.


PS: I don't think Rebuild's staff like WILLE very much.

BernardoCairo wrote:

Derantor wrote: "I don't live here" can also simply mean "this is not the place where I belong."

I thought about this! It would make sense if Asuka said it by herself. However, she was answering Ayanami's question. Taking into account the context, I believe that Rei said "live" in the literal sense of the word. Nuke-senpai's translation made this even clearer to me.

The word choice she uses is 居る所 irutokoro, which you can absolutely translate as "the place where I belong". It's a more casual way of saying 居場所 ibasho, which literally translates to "the place where one is", but the subtext of which is "the place where one belongs and can be oneself". I chose to translate it as "This isn't a place I live" in order to preserve the language in Rei Q's question ("Do you live here without working"), because I felt having Asuka say "This isn't a place I belong" wouldn't read as well as the next line in that sequence.

Derantor wrote:NuclearLunchbox's translation muddies the waters a little ("We're just like our them:"), but I'm pretty sure she's saying to Rei that the Eva pilots are the same as the Evas. What Shinji does is not freeing her of her bonds. He makes them permanent. Her "angelic traits" are her inborn traits. That's was has been suppressed all her life, kept in check, her very being altered by conditioning (she only makes it explicit in Rei's case, with her being programmed to like Shinji). "Don't surpass human limits." "Here, Asuka: you are a human now. Isn't that great?"

"Our them" was an error I didn't catch. It should say "We're just like the Eva", and it seems I replaced the text in my draft on my PC but not on the site. (エヴァ同様 Eva douyou) Error has been corrected. Whoops!

Nuclear Lunchbox wrote:I chose to translate it as "This isn't a place I live" in order to preserve the language in Rei Q's question ("Do you live here without working"), because I felt having Asuka say "This isn't a place I belong" wouldn't read as well as the next line in that sequence.

Thanks for the insight! I see what you're saying.
As I said before, by itself, Asuka's line can be read as "this is not a place I belong" (in the sense that she just doesn't feel part of the community). That said, if we take Ayanami's question into account, it sounds a bit weird. I mean, she was talking to Rei, who said "live" in the literal sense of the word. So it makes sense for her to respond appropriately, right?

I don't think Rei Q said "live" in the literal sense of the word, she said 居る iru with a て te conjugation, which functions as a) an imperative, b) a conjunction, c) an indicator of doing something while doing something else. Iru is like to be, to exist, to be somewhere. If I wanted to say I was at the office, I would use the word iru.

To live, to be alive, is a separate word 生きる ikiru. Rei Q says, "あなたは この村にいて 仕事をしないの?" A fluent/native speaker would not conclude that Rei Q is using the word "live" to mean "be alive", but rather that she is using it in the context of to live somewhere, be somewhere, exist somewhere.

Oh, that's the "live" I mean! The one we use to talk about the places where we live. I live somewhere = I exist somewhere.
What I meant is that Ayanami questioned Asuka about literally living in the village. She was not asking if Shikinami belonged to the community or not (in the sense of feeling part of it). So it makes sense for Asuka to answer her accordingly, I guess.

"In your hair reside god, dirt, earthly desires. It's the representation of the heart of a chaotic person. Princess, without any doubt, it's proof that you're human."

Evas and Angels are the same thing, and all of them are human anyway. :P

BernardoCairo wrote:In other words, she seems to be free of the ninth angel.

Funny thing about that - the ninth Angel might actually be the amalgamated Shikinami series. So ... it is also her. But that requires a lot of explanation I won't attempt now, because the point below is sufficient:

Shikinami tried to deny her own humanity [...] Therefore, the reverberations of EVAs and Angels must also have been erased from the universe. That includes the pilots' original nature.

She denied being Lilin - because she isn't. And her original nature being erased is why I said that Shinji made her restrictions permanent. It's like the Little Mermaid who has to give up her special nature to be able to live alongside humans. Which she regrets heavily, IIRC. The implications here are not at all kind: "If you are different, we will make you just like us, only then will we allow you to live alongside us." The situation would probably much more easily seen for what it is if the story revolved around a boys club, and the only female character is given an involuntary sexchange, so that she can finally join. She, now he, got his place to belong. Hurray, I guess? Funnily enough, Gendo and Yui get to spend eternity in Evaform in some other dimension. They are the true winners here, or at least Gendo is - he got exactly what he wanted all along.

Derantor wrote:She denied being Lilin - because she isn't. And her original nature being erased is why I said that Shinji made her restrictions permanent. It's like the Little Mermaid who has to give up her special nature to be able to live alongside humans. Which she regrets heavily, IIRC. The implications here are not at all kind: "If you are different, we will make you just like us, only then will we allow you to live alongside us." The situation would probably much more easily seen for what it is if the story revolved around a boys club, and the only female character is given an involuntary sexchange, so that she can finally join. She, now he, got his place to belong. Hurray, I guess? Funnily enough, Gendo and Yui get to spend eternity in Evaform in some other dimension. They are the true winners here, or at least Gendo is - he got exactly what he wanted all along.

To be fair, I think Asuka really wants to be human and grow.

Asuka doesn't feel comfortable with the Lilin, but she doesn't find comfortable to be an eternal 14 years old either.


PS: I think Gendo and Yui died. Although that would still be what Gendo want since he died along Yui.

Derantor wrote:Evas and Angels are the same thing, and all of them are human anyway.

Yeah, but I believe that Mari was using the word "human" in the "conventional sense". Later, when Asuka began to use the powers that she inherited from the ninth angel, Mari said "princess, do you plan on discarding your humanity?" Asuka is trying to distance herself from "regular" humans. However, although her body is different, she is still human at heart and soul. Asuka doesn't seem to be a big fan of the self-isolation under which she imposes herself.

Derantor wrote:Funny thing about that - the ninth Angel might actually be the amalgamated Shikinami series. So ... it is also her. But that requires a lot of explanation I won't attempt now

What do you mean by that? The ninth angel is Bardiel's equivalent. It was a separate entity from Asuka until the incident with Unit 03. That was when she got infected and her eye became a receptacle for the angel.
There are many questions to be answered about the Shikinami series. We don't know who "OG Asuka" is, we don't know who donated his/her DNA to "Project Shikinami" and we don't know if the clones were created from angels. As far as we know, Asuka may just be a good old human clone. She was created and raised to pilot the Evangelion and to help with Gendo's plans. If you think about it, she was treated more like a normal weapon than a "divine creature" (this is reflected in the way she was selected to be the pilot for Unit 02).
It's impossible to reach a conclusion until we watch the movie and have more answers. That said, I believe that Asuka had nothing to do with the angel who infected Unit 03 until she came into contact with it. As for the other traits that separate her from being Lilin, they seem to be unrelated to the ninth angel. I mean, Meri suffers from the same thing and Asuka suggests that even Shiji will eventually follow suit.

Derantor wrote:She denied being Lilin - because she isn't. And her original nature being erased is why I said that Shinji made her restrictions permanent. It's like the Little Mermaid who has to give up her special nature to be able to live alongside humans. Which she regrets heavily, IIRC. The implications here are not at all kind: "If you are different, we will make you just like us, only then will we allow you to live alongside us."

I'm not going to lie, that was an interesting read (even if I don't agree with it). I see what you're saying. Here's the thing, though. I don't know if Asuka was comfortable with her condition, even if she "accepted" it. It appears to me that she wanted to grow up and have a normal life! I mean, she woke up in that body after acknowledging and overcoming her own insecurities. I guess we'll have to wait and draw our own conclusions.

Derantor wrote:She denied being Lilin - because she isn't. And her original nature being erased is why I said that Shinji made her restrictions permanent. It's like the Little Mermaid who has to give up her special nature to be able to live alongside humans. Which she regrets heavily, IIRC. The implications here are not at all kind: "If you are different, we will make you just like us, only then will we allow you to live alongside us." The situation would probably much more easily seen for what it is if the story revolved around a boys club, and the only female character is given an involuntary sexchange, so that she can finally join. She, now he, got his place to belong. Hurray, I guess? Funnily enough, Gendo and Yui get to spend eternity in Evaform in some other dimension. They are the true winners here, or at least Gendo is - he got exactly what he wanted all along.

Her original nature is being a regular human that happened to be a clone. The rest of her "special nature" came from her infection from Bardiel and the curse of Eva that it give her, and frankly the effects are the picture definition of "Blessed with suck": sure she's ageless and immune to the L-Barrier, but in exchange is trapped in a 14 years old body, can't digest food anymore and has to live with a piece of one of humanity's mortal enemies that risk to resurrect if her eyepatch ever falls off.

Also I'm not sure that it was Shinji that gave her this body, it seems that Asuka herself chose it as this is her ideal self-image and Shinji only gave her the mean to get this ideal body thanks to Instrumentality.

ElMariachi wrote:Her original nature is being a regular human that happened to be a clone.

No, not really.
"Let me tell you something. We, the Eva pilots, are the same as the Eva. They/we were constrained at the time of design in order not to surpass the framework/limit/box of humans."
"At the time of design", meaning, right from the start.
Asuka is like Kaworu or Rei. Kaworu is the first Angel who fell to become the Thirteenth, Rei is still an emanation of Lilith. That was their true nature all along - that they are also members of a clone series doesn't change that. Gendo and Misato have an interesting exchange regarding that.
Misato: "That's why you're treating Asuka like a disposable, Ikari Gendo?!"
Gendo: "It's because the Ayanami and Shikinami Type pilots were prepped for this purpose from the very start. Without issue."
(Please read the rest of the exchange for additional context.)
Mentioning the Shikinami and Ayanami type pilots in the same breath draws another parallel between them, and I don't think anybody doubts Rei's special nature.

Mari and Shinji are similar in that they are Metahumans, too - remember, Shinji is able to awaken Eva 01 in Ha, changing his eye color, and he is able to pilot in the first place. Mari has been around for a long time; Fuyutsuki recognizes her as "Maria of Iscariot", and she mentions that she hasn't heard that name in a long time. Notice also that there's no longer any restriction on who can pilot which Eva Unit - Asuka switches from 02 to 03 without any problem, Mari can pilot 05, 02 and 08, Shinji 01 and 13. So it's not about maternal bonds - it's the special nature of the pilots, long before any curse or Angelic "infection" kicks in, which allows them to pilot.

As for Asuka being the Ninth Angel: there's ... a lot, but it would require an extensive write-up. Trying to keep it simple: in Ha, when Asuka is "infected", pay close attention to what actually happens. Asuka sprouts wings of light, and is pulled towards the front end of the plug (the pilot chair falls away at that point). She sees something - a blue cross, with a creepy looking child's face barely visible (her "reflection"). She falls towards that blue, shining cross. Before she reaches is, her skin is peeled off, revealing blue stuff beneath. At first glance, it would seem that she's splattered with the Ninth Angel's blue goo, but no, the blue stuff was there before. Her skin peeling away reveals what lay beneath the whole time. Later on, Ritsuko remarks that "her cellular tissue is free of any sign of contamination", but that they would never dispose of her "because she's a valuable specimen." Yet in Q, we see she has a glowing eye. That sounds like ... a really mindboggingly obvious sign of "cellular contamination" - unless, of course, that's not a "contamination", but simply her true nature shining through, which also explains why she is such a valuable specimen.

As for not being treated differently from a "regular" weapon: the Evas are divine beings too, and we see thousands of them in Shin - their divine nature doesn't preclude use as disposable weapons of war.

Derantor wrote:No, not really.
"Let me tell you something. We, the Eva pilots, are the same as the Eva. They/we were constrained at the time of design in order not to surpass the framework/limit/box of humans."
"At the time of design", meaning, right from the start.
Asuka is like Kaworu or Rei. Kaworu is the first Angel who fell to become the Thirteenth, Rei is still an emanation of Lilith. That was their true nature all along - that they are also members of a clone series doesn't change that. Gendo and Misato have an interesting exchange regarding that.
Misato: "That's why you're treating Asuka like a disposable, Ikari Gendo?!"
Gendo: "It's because the Ayanami and Shikinami Type pilots were prepped for this purpose from the very start. Without issue."
(Please read the rest of the exchange for additional context.)
Mentioning the Shikinami and Ayanami type pilots in the same breath draws another parallel between them, and I don't think anybody doubts Rei's special nature.

Asuka is a clone. Furthermore, she was designed alongside the other Shikinami clones. That's likely another reason why she doesn't feel human.

However, her angelic aspect in Shin seems to come from the Ninth Angel. So, at most, I think Gendo planned that a Shikinami clone will fuse with one of the Angels at some point.


Rei likely has a connection to Lillith, but Gendo has always access to Lillith. So, it is easy to see how he could create that connection.

The Ninth Angel doesn't appear until 2.0 after the Eight Angel was defeated.

Derantor wrote:No, not really.
"Let me tell you something. We, the Eva pilots, are the same as the Eva. They/we were constrained at the time of design in order not to surpass the framework/limit/box of humans."
"At the time of design", meaning, right from the start.
Asuka is like Kaworu or Rei. Kaworu is the first Angel who fell to become the Thirteenth, Rei is still an emanation of Lilith. That was their true nature all along - that they are also members of a clone series doesn't change that. Gendo and Misato have an interesting exchange regarding that.
Misato: "That's why you're treating Asuka like a disposable, Ikari Gendo?!"
Gendo: "It's because the Ayanami and Shikinami Type pilots were prepped for this purpose from the very start. Without issue."
(Please read the rest of the exchange for additional context.)
Mentioning the Shikinami and Ayanami type pilots in the same breath draws another parallel between them, and I don't think anybody doubts Rei's special nature.

Frankly the requisites for each successive Impacts is becoming so absurdly convoluted that I don't know what to think anymore, so what, was Asuka being infected by Bardiel planned all along by Gendo? Was she actually designed to be infected all along? (which means that Gendo managed to hide that fact from SEELE since the Shikinami-type inception?) So that means that in 2.0 Asuka would had been the pilot of EVA-03 even if she didn't decided to take Rei's place so the later could prepare her diner party?

As for Asuka's line that the Ayanami and Shikinami types were designed to "not surpass the limit of humans", I took it that those who designed them could had created them as super-soldiers with superhuman strength, resistance, maybe some AT-Field powers (probably by mixing in some angelic DNA) but chose to make them as regular humans to keep them under control.
Although Asuka breaking the security glass in Q can be interpreted that her angelic contamination let her go beyond human limitations.

Another thing interesting is that Misato's line that Gendo treats Asuka like a disposable tool implies that Misato herself don't see Asuka like that, but as her own individual with her inherent worth as a person. (although that contradict with how she treats her pilots, with the whole room rigged with explosives thing)
In short, that deep down she still cares about Asuka like she cares about Shinji.

ElMariachi wrote:Frankly the requisites for each successive Impacts is becoming so absurdly convoluted that I don't know what to think anymore, so what, was Asuka being infected by Bardiel planned all along by Gendo? Was she actually designed to be infected all along? (which means that Gendo managed to hide that fact from SEELE since the Shikinami-type inception?) So that means that in 2.0 Asuka would had been the pilot of EVA-03 even if she didn't decided to take Rei's place so the later could prepare her diner party?

I think Gendo planned that an Angel will infect a Shikinami clone at some point. However, I don't think he especifically expected the Bardiel situation.

Gendo's plans in Rebuild depends a lot on luck. One thing that didn't go right for him and his whole plan was ruined.

ElMariachi wrote:Frankly the requisites for each successive Impacts is becoming so absurdly convoluted that I don't know what to think anymore, so what, was Asuka being infected by Bardiel planned all along by Gendo? Was she actually designed to be infected all along? (which means that Gendo managed to hide that fact from SEELE since the Shikinami-type inception?) So that means that in 2.0 Asuka would had been the pilot of EVA-03 even if she didn't decided to take Rei's place so the later could prepare her diner party?

Honestly, probably no. This requires so many logical leaps that it's insane! Not only is it convoluted and unbelievable, but it also undermines several elements of the core story being told. Evangelion's most meaningful sequences come from its characters and how they interact. Asuka's choice to take Ayanami's place is an important moment for her character. By saying that this situation was planned from the beginning, we are diminishing the impact and relevance of the scene. Why should I pay attention to a narrative in which there are no nuances and everything is carefully outlined from the start? It's tedious and takes the tension away.
Furthermore, no one knew that Unit 03 was infected by the ninth angel before it was activated. That's literally what the movie is telling us. By the way, even after knowing about it, Gendo was willing to kill Asuka (in a similar fashion to what happened with Toji in the original series). Getting rid of the angel was his priority. I very much doubt that he planned what happened that day. Ikari probably just worked with what he got (reshaping his schemes from that point onwards). It's really hard for me to believe that everything went exactly as he wanted for over 28 years. Knowing how to improvise can be important. Gendo himself suggested this during the original series.

Derantor wrote:At first glance, it would seem that she's splattered with the Ninth Angel's blue goo, but no, the blue stuff was there before. Her skin peeling away reveals what lay beneath the whole time. Later on, Ritsuko remarks that "her cellular tissue is free of any sign of contamination"

I just took a look at this scene and I had a completely different impression. I feel like the ninth angel was interacting with Asuka's body through the LCL and gradually infecting her. That's why, at that specific point, there was already "blue goo" underneath her skin.
If you think about it, everyone treats the ninth angel as a separate entity from Asuka. After the battle, Ritsuko even says: "we cannot rule out the possibility of mental contamination from the angel."
By the way, Ritsuko never remark that her cellular tissue was free from any contamination. Instead, she just says: "the cellular erosion has dissipated."

Personally I saw this as a classic "veteran reflexes" situation like you hear how military ppl have all these protocols drilled into them &how this can be hard to switch off even in peacetime.

ElMariachi wrote:Thinking about it, the reason Asuka was surprised to had been able to go back to the Wunder could be because she thought that WILLE wouldn't had any use for her (she self-destroyed her Eva in Q and didn't know that it was salvaged and repaired) and thus would abandon her.
And extrapolating from here, maybe she thought that once the war was over, the Lilin would get rid of her (since she wouldn't be useful anymore and this have a piece of Angel in her), sp her removing her eyepatch to go all out (and activating her DSS Choker) could had been a way to die on her own terms. Maybe that's also part of the reason why she wanted to have a closure with Shinji before departing for the last battle, if she truly intended to die.

That was my impression, too - and that a lot of it is internalized. Kensuke treats her pretty normally, & seeing how they treat Rei who is even further from a standard human I don't think Asuka would have been rejected.

Note that she triggered the self-destruction during the final showdown in Q - she probably thought EVA 02 was down for the count. They probably only bothered trying to fix it 'cause they have no replacements.

She probably went through some very traumatizing period where she woke up disfigured & in containment because of the angel contamination, Shinji's apocalyptic mishap had just revealed to everyone that the EVAs are super dangerous necessitating new security measures, and then she probably found out her own origins around the same time.

She's dumping all this on ReiQ as a kind of gotcha, like she wants her to go & have an existential crisis over it, too, but then ReiQ takes it very differently.
Has a lot of the same energy as the "I am neither false or fake, I am simply me" line.
It's not like regular people get to pick what their 'type' is.
Though of course Rei always knew she was artificial, she didn't have this experience of feeling she had her humanity "taken away" by the revelation.

ElMariachi wrote:By the way, if she's now Major Shikinami, that means that she got a promotion from her previous rank of Captain in 2.0, not that it really means something, nor she seems to care about it.

That seems to further lampshade how she's kind of in Misato's spot now that Misato has Gendo's job.

As you can tell by my previous posts, I pretty much agree with everything that you said. I believe that Asuka's reaction is the outcome of war and self-isolating habits. Speaking of which, these are related to her self-esteem issues. It's something internalized and probably has nothing to do with the villagers (who seem to be really nice people).
The only thing I'm not sure about is if Asuka tried to break Ayanami down while telling her the truth. Maybe Shikinami is just tired of this "circus" in which everyone has pre-established roles and quirks. I can see this being something that directly messes with her. The idea of being "artificial". That said, Ayanami doesn't really care about it. Unlike Asuka, she is "fine" with herself. Perhaps Shikinami was seeing herself in Ayanami and that's why she felt the need to "warn" her. Well, that's just a thought.

Kendrix wrote:That seems to further lampshade how she's kind of in Misato's spot now that Misato has Gendo's job.

Yeah, I agree! Honestly, since the end of Q, I have the impression that Asuka took the place that Misato used to occupy (in EoE). I mean, she is a strong, older woman who tries to bring Shinji back to reality in her own way. Even though Asuka has to deal with her own problems, she drags Shinji around (in the hopes that he will recover). They are not perfect parallels, but there are some interesting similarities between them.

ElMariachi wrote:Another thing interesting is that Misato's line that Gendo treats Asuka like a disposable tool implies that Misato herself don't see Asuka like that, but as her own individual with her inherent worth as a person. (although that contradict with how she treats her pilots, with the whole room rigged with explosives thing)
In short, that deep down she still cares about Asuka like she cares about Shinji.

Yeah. I'm pretty sure Misato cares about Asuka and doesn't see her only as a weapon.

However, I also think Misato and WILLE don't totally trust Asuka or Mari. They see Eva's pilots as a risk for everyone (that's why they put DSS choker and explosives in their room).