Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Alaska Slim » Mon Aug 24, 2020 12:14 am

View Original Postcyharding wrote:I recently rewatched the first season of IBO, and I was wondering how popular was the show in Japan


According to a 1.7 million poll taken two years ago, it's ranked #6 in the Franchise, and Orga is ranked #3 out of all Gundam Characters

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PzBQgBIeaI

OTOH, it had only half the viewers of Gundam 00 according to this chart from GBD:

Image

But with the internet, who knows? On Gundam Info views seem to be about even between them.

EDIT: Huh, didn't realize IBO got a spinoff. Looks like a rehash of Gundam X.
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:50 pm

Japan very much loves IBO (and loves memeing it even more so), and there's either S1 or S2 up on the Gundaminfo channel basically at all times, so I don't think that these figures are representative anymore, probably just the initial airing dates; 6th in the franchise does seem about right.

As for Urdr Hunt (the spinoff), I'm not exactly sure how you're getting AWGX from it beyond the basic dynamic of "boy wants power, girl has power", care to elaborate?
not that I'd mind another Gundam X, love that show
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby cyharding » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:41 pm

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:25 am

It's an interesting take to be sure, but I think it is massively impractical and counterproductive in all but a very small subset of debates that it would most definitely not see as much use as for topics where it is completely out of place.

I've had an argument over the canonicity of Thunderbolt a while ago with someone who was desperately trying to fit it into the main timeline (I'm camp "why does it matter, just let it do its own thing and stop worrying about it"), and the dude went to pretty ridiculous lengths using that principle as base of argument.
"The OVA is canon, but the manga it's based on isn't"
"If more of the manga gets adapted, that part of the OVA won't be canon"
"The things that don't fit in are just somebody misemembering things, that thing that doesn't fit in with the lore wasn't actually there" (to the point of "well, maybe that person who died onscreen isn't actually dead")
and a few more like that that I can't recall off the top of my head.

It is certainly a valid idea for discussing overarching themes and other more meta aspects, but for talking about timeline, it is too messy and leaves a ton of things unaccounted for.
Assuming linear time, which to my knowledge the Gundam franchise hasn't given any reason to assume otherwise, there is an absolute truth, and barring things specifically framed as subjective recollections, what we see on screen being the absolute truth should be the starting point, because any other premise is a complete non-starter, since from that point on, every fix point and boundary set is completely arbitrary, and if it really comes down to it nothing more than glorified fanfiction.

The real problem is not that Gundam has some inconsistencies in its lore, the problem is that fans, especially western, are way too anal about wanting to have everything fit into one singular timeline, even works like Origin or Thunderbolt, which from the very start have been explicitly stated by the author to not be canon to the main timeline. The solution to this is not to disregard cherrypick the events you like and disregard the ones you don't, not to write fanfiction on how if there is a whole seperate production branch that we have never heard of that line of custom suits never seen anywhere else might fit in (line of arguing from an unrelated Thunderbolt debate, the opposing side was mindlessly yelling about production numbers, so not much better), and definitely not to just declare things we see on screen to not have happened that way; the solution is to only treat those things as canon to another work that are explicitly stated to be canon, and have everything else take place in a mental AU where details may differ.
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:44 pm

I just finished bingewatching the last 15 episodes of G Gundam, and now have all of AU barring build under my belt.
It is also 4:40 in the morning and I'm on the edge of passing out, so I'm just gonna dump my thoughts here.
-9/10, gud show, had fun, go watch it
-probably the most hype soundtrack of all of 90s Gundam
-final arc went a little too hard on the spectacle creep for my taste
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby C5 Hurricane » Tue Oct 27, 2020 12:11 pm

Here is where I rank all the main entries.

Image

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Gus Hanson » Tue Oct 27, 2020 2:25 pm

Love the detail that went into making that chart, C5 Hurricane! ^_^
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Tue Oct 27, 2020 4:44 pm

We're doing Tier lists now? Alright, here's mine
SPOILER: Show
Image
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby robersora » Tue Oct 27, 2020 5:06 pm

I don't really care for Gundam. Tomino's directing makes me dizzy and the lore is generally boring. It's like combining the bad properties of something like the Star Wars Prequels and the Star Wars Sequels. There's a few exceptions tho. Here is my tier list:

here is my tier list  SPOILER: Show
2Q||3.33 _ 神殺しを行う
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Wed Oct 28, 2020 8:04 am

View Original Postrobersora wrote:Tomino's directing makes me dizzy and the lore is generally boring. It's like combining the bad properties of something like the Star Wars Prequels and the Star Wars Sequels.

Honestly, fair. The only Tomino shows I've seen so far were Turn A and G Reco; the former I love, the latter was a poorly paced and narratively pointless mess. You might enjoy non-Tomino Gundam more, but truth be told, about half of that is kinda garbage as well :P
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Gus Hanson » Wed Oct 28, 2020 9:33 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:Honestly, fair. The only Tomino shows I've seen so far were Turn A and G Reco; the former I love, the latter was a poorly paced and narratively pointless mess. You might enjoy non-Tomino Gundam more, but truth be told, about half of that is kinda garbage as well :P

I tried out G Reco and couldn't finish it due to how all over the place the pace was. I might take up Turn A, I got a question: I hear that Dianna and Kihel who look similar switch identities every other occasion so is it ever very confusing to tell which is which? BTW, after analyzing the PM I sent you, I decided to give Unicorn another shot especially since if I could watch it once, why am I making such a situation out of watching it again? :tongue:
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:09 pm

The whole Kihel/Dianna thing is honestly one of the best things in the show. It's not really confusing to the viewer since the changes don't happen often, but it is played sooo well. Turn A is just one of my favorites in general, it is such a good show

As for Unicorn; whatever you like most, lol. I'll give it a watch eventually, but for the time I'm kinda burnt out on watching new Gundam shows.
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Gus Hanson » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:26 pm

The first Gundam Hathaway's Flash film has a new release date due to coronavirus which is May 7, 2021.
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2 ... ay/.166247

Also, the third G Reco compilation film will premiere sometime next summer:
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2 ... er/.166248
"Damn it! Who do I have to screw around here just to get a stupid story?!" - Gail Hailstorm, author of the book You're Dead, I'm Rich (Scary Movie)

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:44 am

So, first episode of Build Divers Battlogue is out. That was really damn fun to watch, a cross-universe hero suit free for all. Only ten minutes unfortunately, definitely looking forward to more
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Gus Hanson » Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:25 pm

Watched the second 08th MS Team episode on it's original Japanese voicing and let me just say all the voices fit like gloves. Props to the late Keiji Fujiwara as Eledore giving him a more manly tone than the English VA who gave him the snarky guy personality to a T. Mami Koyama as Karen is also a joy as her character brings some of that tough love exterior to the still a rookie commander Shiro played flawlessly by energetic Nobuyuki Hiyama.
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Shamsiel-kun » Sat Nov 14, 2020 9:11 am

View Original PostBlockio wrote:The real problem is not that Gundam has some inconsistencies in its lore, the problem is that fans, especially western, are way too anal about wanting to have everything fit into one singular timeline, even works like Origin or Thunderbolt, which from the very start have been explicitly stated by the author to not be canon to the main timeline. The solution to this is not to disregard cherrypick the events you like and disregard the ones you don't, not to write fanfiction on how if there is a whole seperate production branch that we have never heard of that line of custom suits never seen anywhere else might fit in (line of arguing from an unrelated Thunderbolt debate, the opposing side was mindlessly yelling about production numbers, so not much better), and definitely not to just declare things we see on screen to not have happened that way; the solution is to only treat those things as canon to another work that are explicitly stated to be canon, and have everything else take place in a mental AU where details may differ.


It's not like it's actually possible to shoehorn everything U.C. into a single timeline, as there are various early manga- and novel-only works that are ostensibly U.C., but cannot possibly be in that timeline anymore because newer works have officially replaced their canonicity. ^_^
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:18 pm

Exactly, yeah. Things like Gaia Gear were written out of canon by newer works, and Beltorchika's Children is explicitly made as an alternate series of events, trying to argue that those are just as real isn't going to help anyone's case, it just makes you sound like a raving lunatic

EDIT: After just skimming over it last time, I went back and read the article in depth this time. I have to retract my statement about it being "massively impractical and counterproductive"; it is absolutely irredeemable horseshit, and an insult to anyone who has ever taken as little as a single class on history and academic research.
The massive stick this author has up his own ass and the idea that he is somehow entitled to everything getting an English release aside, anyone claiming that "historical revisionism is the main work of a historian" should be hit over the head with a folding chair.
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby cyharding » Sat Nov 14, 2020 9:00 pm

What was I thinking posting that link? :facepalm:

View Original PostBlockio wrote:Things like Gaia Gear were written out of canon by newer works


Yeah, but I can see G-Savior just as easily written out. Everything I've seen dealing with the "UC Next 100" project doesn't mention it while the other late UC works are. I can see it, with some modifications, being put back in.
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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Blockio » Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:00 pm

No harm done in posting it, your description of it being "an interesting take" wasn't wrong
I just want to hit whoever wrote that article over the head with a folding chair, jesus that was awful in so many different ways at the same time
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu

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Re: Gundam (In All Its Incarnations) Mk. II

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Postby Shamsiel-kun » Sun Nov 15, 2020 10:08 am

View Original Postcyharding wrote:Yeah, but I can see G-Savior just as easily written out. Everything I've seen dealing with the "UC Next 100" project doesn't mention it while the other late UC works are. I can see it, with some modifications, being put back in.


In the case of Gaia Gear those modifications would need to be pretty extensive, because its setting is mutually exclusive with the canon that replaced it.

Likewise with stuff like Go Ahead. Sure, it uses the Zeta Gundam universe to a degree and features mecha with the same origins and names, but the designs are so different from the Zeta designs that it cannot possibly have occurred in the same timeline. AFAIK, it's basically just known as Kazuhisa Kondo's take on Zeta. Doesn't take away that the designs are cool (besides, it has a mobile armor that shares its name with the USSR's space shuttle).
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