Chaos Death Spiky Bits -- WH/DnD

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silvermoonlight
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Chaos Death Spiky Bits -- WH/DnD

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Postby silvermoonlight » Tue Jun 30, 2020 2:17 pm

View Original PostThuktun Flishithy wrote:Holy fuck yes, I'm glad other people share my opinion about Jackson's depiction of the Skull Islanders. FFS, he somehow managed to make it even worse than the original 1933 movie- at least in that one they're shown with a degree of sympathy when Kong razes their village, whereas in the 2005 movie they're depicted as inhuman brutes, more like Jackson's depiction of Orcs than any real culture. The bit where they focus on the kid grinning like a sociopath while Ann's being offered to Kong comes to mind. Hell, I could've sworn some supplementary materials claimed that the people living on the island had become a separate species from humanity, which only makes it even worse.


Yeah the kid gets to me to as well as the way they offer Ann up like the framing is just so terrible and the irony is could forgive the 1933 version because of the different film period and for the points you mentioned but I can't forgive Peter for this error because he knew better there were years of people speaking out against blackface and these kinds of racist depictions even in 2005 Hollywood yet he still went ahead and filmed it.

This is why Skull Island in my view is the best version because it fixes this issue on so many levels and I'm really hopeful this will now follow through into Godzilla vs Kong as it original 1963 version is problematic as well but it's more along the lines of the natives being a funny joke than Peter's inhuman animal version. Hopefully, it will be done in the same way as Skull Island and it will finally put this issue to bed and mean no one will be dumb enough to repeat it ever again in the US franchise or any reboots decades from now if it's revisited.
Last edited by silvermoonlight on Wed Jul 01, 2020 7:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:53 am

Yeah, even in the original King Kong and King Kong vs Godzilla you have a lot of humanizing moments with the native islanders. Sure, the Godzilla movie shows the islanders as being a bit more silly than the 1933 films, but the movie shows everyone as being relatively silly when it comes to their interactions with hyper capitalism and materialism. The Peter Jackson video has no humanization, not does it frame the portrayal of the islanders as being under the thumb of foreign hyper capitalism or materialism. They all feel demonized, like Jackson's still making non-whites look like orcs like he did in LOTR or something.

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Re: Godzilla & Kaiju General!

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Postby silvermoonlight » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:01 am

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:Yeah, even in the original King Kong and King Kong vs Godzilla you have a lot of humanizing moments with the native islanders. Sure, the Godzilla movie shows the islanders as being a bit more silly than the 1933 films, but the movie shows everyone as being relatively silly when it comes to their interactions with hyper capitalism and materialism. The Peter Jackson video has no humanization, not does it frame the portrayal of the islanders as being under the thumb of foreign hyper capitalism or materialism. They all feel demonized, like Jackson's still making non-whites look like orcs like he did in LOTR or something.


I'm generally interested to see how fantasy movies are going to change going forward as D and D have just said they will be updating the rules books going forward in the 5th edition (I don't expect Warhammer to do the same as there so out of touch and won't fix their long-standing lack of women or racism issues or everyone being white in 40k problem they keep promising then not following through in any meaningful way) but D and D's new rules are to end the deal with orcs as evil races and their idea od certain races being evil by default and it means going forward the whole fantasy world could be very different in film and media and books.

https://globalnews.ca/news/7103563/dungeons-dragons-evil-race-stereotypes/

I didn't notice this in LOTR till you guys pointed it out...and it's really shocking and your right all the Uruk-hai are played by people of colour which is really troubling. Also my bad for off topic...but I do feel this is important to make since it will change D and D forever going forward and mean people who pull that same crap as Peter will get into serious trouble and be called out way faster.
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My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3
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Re: Godzilla & Kaiju General!

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Postby Natalie the Cat » Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:28 pm

Games Workshop is doing better. The Age of Sigmar line is significantly more diverse and balanced than the Old World or 40k. Specifically there’s a lot more options as far as female characters and options for more diverse miniatures go.

40k is a different beast. The fundamental problem with the line is that it was originally conceived by fans of Judge Dredd, 2000 AD, heavy metal, etc. as a *satire* of a fascist empire. Now they’re trying to make it marketable outside of its niche and distance themselves from the satirical elements. So you end up trying to “fIx” an army fetishized bondage nuns or an army of over the top warrior monks who parody masculinity and play it serious while at the same time trying to get progressive.

Fantasy will change if it goes mainstream, it’s the grognards that trot out the excuses for everyone being white, male, conforming to a stereotype, etc.

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Re: Godzilla & Kaiju General!

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Postby Blockio » Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:38 pm

View Original PostNatalie the Cat wrote:40k is a different beast. The fundamental problem with the line is that it was originally conceived by fans of Judge Dredd, 2000 AD, heavy metal, etc. as a *satire* of a fascist empire. Now they’re trying to make it marketable outside of its niche and distance themselves from the satirical elements. So you end up trying to “fIx” an army fetishized bondage nuns or an army of over the top warrior monks who parody masculinity and play it serious while at the same time trying to get progressive.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the whole point of 40k that everyone is horrible and there is no good faction period? Unless that premise is wildly off which I doubt considering that people I generally trust with their opinions and who play it a lot have told me so unanimously and repeatedly, I have to admit that I don't really see the issue with having canonically and undoubtedly evil factions have politically and morally undesirable implications
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Re: Godzilla & Kaiju General!

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Postby silvermoonlight » Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:03 am

View Original PostNatalie the Cat wrote:Games Workshop is doing better. The Age of Sigmar line is significantly more diverse and balanced than the Old World or 40k. Specifically there’s a lot more options as far as female characters and options for more diverse miniatures go.

40k is a different beast. The fundamental problem with the line is that it was originally conceived by fans of Judge Dredd, 2000 AD, heavy metal, etc. as a *satire* of a fascist empire. Now they’re trying to make it marketable outside of its niche and distance themselves from the satirical elements. So you end up trying to “fIx” an army fetishized bondage nuns or an army of over the top warrior monks who parody masculinity and play it serious while at the same time trying to get progressive.

Fantasy will change if it goes mainstream, it’s the grognards that trot out the excuses for everyone being white, male, conforming to a stereotype, etc.


I've heard though Games workshops biggest issue is its current CEO over at Games Workshop World in Nottingham he is a notorious sexist dinosaur renowned for making sexist comments and a lot of people have pointed out that even with Age Of Sigma he has done the bare minimum and I've felt the effects of his all boys club bullshit as its gone all way down the ladder to the stores.

As during the 90's walking in to a games worship I was welcomed my gender was never an issue they were just happy that women were playing these games. Cut to the later 2000's I was suddenly made to feel very unwelcome and had smelly dirty neck beards telling what I should know about Skaven despite owning an army for over a two decades or trying to hit on me or being treated like you're a woman you know nothing fuck off out of our space you are not welcome...hence its little wonder I buy only online now and never enter the stores and now paint Japanese resin kits instead, and I am thinking of playing D and D in the future.

So I don't hold Games Workshop in high regard this all boys club attitude shit needs to die off and their CEO needs firing and someone who is more progressive and wants to take gaming in to the future like D and D are doing needs to take the wheel. Please note this is my bad experiences in UK stores and I realize it could be very different overseas.

I also can't answer the question regarding 40k as I played the fantasy game but I would argue that everyone has the ability to be evil and crappy so if you're gonna say 40k is a world where everyone is shitty then include everyone.

If someone wants to cut this in to its own thread Warhammer/D and D gaming thread please do
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Postby Natalie the Cat » Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:20 pm

View Original PostBlockio wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the whole point of 40k that everyone is horrible and there is no good faction period? Unless that premise is wildly off which I doubt considering that people I generally trust with their opinions and who play it a lot have told me so unanimously and repeatedly, I have to admit that I don't really see the issue with having canonically and undoubtedly evil factions have politically and morally undesirable implications


That **was** the point, but for the last few years they’ve been trying to pivot the Imperium to be marketable good guys and downplaying the “cruelest, most oppressive regime imaginable” stuff.

I’d prefer it if the kept the serious stuff to the books and kept the wacky beaky drinking Pepsi feel for the tabletop.

@silvermoonlight I haven’t been into a GW store in years, I have no idea how they’d treat me. I imagine it varies by locale. The online community is very hostile to players who don’t fit the “demographic”, though.

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Re: Godzilla & Kaiju General!

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Postby silvermoonlight » Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:28 am

View Original PostNatalie the Cat wrote:@silvermoonlight I haven’t been into a GW store in years, I have no idea how they’d treat me. I imagine it varies by locale. The online community is very hostile to players who don’t fit the “demographic”, though.


I'm always going to feel jaded about this as Games workshop used to be a home away from home as a young teen and I recall once being told by a super nice guy at 13 that some eavy metal painters were women in the Nottingham warhammer world and for years I did everything to get my painting better as it was ultimate dream to join that team and paint full time...so the tragedy of what happened when I was old enough to join and the stores whole shift was deeply devastating, the only upside of it was by this point I ready to move on to the larger Japanese resins and a few of them have won prizes so there is that.
Anywhere can be paradise as long as you have the will to live. After all, you are alive, so you will always have the chance to be happy.

My Eva fanfiction ff.net Fading In To The Stolen Light For download version please go to AO3
Sequal As The Divine Light Breaks For download version please go to AO3

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Postby Natalie the Cat » Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:05 pm

I’m more into the modeling and panting side of things these days myself. I haven’t set foot in a game store in a long time.

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Postby Blockio » Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:04 pm

That highly depends on the local community, yeah. I haven't played Tabletop with a public group in a while now, but I do relatively frequently visit my local hobby shop that specializes in Warhammer stuff to fuel my Gunpla addiction with Citadel paints, and while the demographic there definitely is unsurprisingly predominantly male, there is no hostility towards anyone there, and the handful of female regulars are as respected as anyone else
Why don't you save the Princess next time instead of being such a baby? She would love it and maybe you could get a sweet kiss. ~ Joseki
Your point of view is horny, and biased. ~ glitz2hard
What about titty-ten? ~ Reichu
The movies function on their own terms. If people can't accept them on those terms, and keep expecting them to be NGE, then they probably should have realized a while ago that they weren't going to have a good time. ~ Words of wisdom courtesy of Reichu


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