Final Fantasy series

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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Fri May 15, 2020 5:19 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:Very yes.


Ahhh. In that case, yeah, they're quite, uhh, Nomura from my understanding? :sweatdrop: (I haven't played any "modern" FF titles except for 12, World of FF, or Dissidia NT, so.)

View Original Postrobersora wrote:The translation for FFXII was stellar, FFXV was fine as well. After bettering for so long this is a weird and sudden decline in quality. The German voice work and translation is ok, for the most part tho.


Another online friend of mine's been playing in German and is glad to hear how close it is to the Japanese. I believe the French version is, too.
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Justacrazyguy » Thu May 21, 2020 11:36 am

I said I was going to get into the FF franchise, didn't I?

Final Fantasy 7

Let’s get some of the technical bits out of the way. I’m playing this on the PS4. Said PS4 edition includes God mode, disabling encounters and 3X times speed at the distance of a button press. I only used the speed up to make some of the battles more bearable. Some enemies have really long battle animations (and so do your characters at times) and it just smooths over the random encounters and the grinding.
It does make the game easier at points and I’m not denying that, but I think it doesn’t remove all the challenge. I died plenty of times.

Touching on perhaps a now contentious issue, the graphics have mostly aged quite well, thanks to good visual direction and the pre rendered backgrounds. The cutscenes also look good for the most part, although some stiffness is noticeable, but this is all easy to forgive and overlook. And Tifas boobs giggling was very funny. Some guy at the FF7 team must have labored hard to get that effect. The character models, despite their age also look quite good… the battle animation ones.

The playmobil nonsense you have to deal with the rest of the game? Not so much. I was surprised that there were several people that actually really liked the legos, and I initially dismissed this as severe nostalgia, but on further inspection, it does make some sense. The models can be charismatic, especially on the lighter moments of the story. The goofy expressions lend themselves well to comedy.
But by the gods, when they are in serious situations they can be unbearable. They just look so out of place; it diminishes the impact of several dramatic parts. I did eventually get used to them, but the problem remained. Another, less serious issue caused by the playmobil models is that they can clash kind of hard against the backgrounds, to the point it becomes hard to tell where you can go (there is an option to show exits and climbable bits, and that does mostly solve the problem though).

About the music, it probably is the understatement of the year to say that it is fantastic. The only issue I can find is that there aren’t that many different tracks, but when they are all so good, it’s something easy to deal with.

The gameplay is mostly standard RPG stuff, although the materia and limit breaks do give something slightly different to chew on. It’s enjoyable. There have been talks by some people (mostly on youtube, where stupidity gathers) that turn based combat is obsolete and so on, and while I had no problem with the new combat system in the Remake, I’ve played several JRPGs before, some of them with much simpler gameplay, so this is nothing I haven’t seen before. Could it have been more complex? Sure, but ultimately not all games need that much focus on the gameplay. FF7 is a complete package, the game not being a massive challenge for some hardcore RPG players isn’t a big issue. (Yes, I know Ruby and Emerald exist)
Talking a bit about the minigames, they are mostly fine and “just there”, except for the Chocobo stuff, which is not only complex, but it is also very confusing. And the amount that is decided by RNG, it nearly drove me to tears. How anybody was supposed to get a Golden Chocobo back in the day without help I have no idea. I guess it’s obtuse because the rewards are substantial, but still…

And now I’ll go into the story. I’ll put everything in spoilers:

SPOILER: Show
The Midgar bit is very short compared to the remake, but I think extending this prologue on the remake was a good idea. A lot of the cooler set pieces and character moments are here, and giving it all more time to breath makes the experience better in general.

One of the story bits that caught me completely off guard was Cloud being a Sephiroth clone. Somehow, despite this game being one of the most well know ever, I never noticed this bit before. And I’m really thankful for that. It is shocking and they give you just enough to be able to suspect something without ever being able to point what exactly is going to happen. Going in to Clouds psyche with Tifa and fixing him was also a really cool moment, although Clouds large playmobil model tried it’s best to ruin it.
The sequence where you lose Cloud and Tifa felt a bit like a missed opportunity. I thought I was going to get some more quality time with the other characters, but it’s over almost the moment it starts. Instead the stories of the side characters get done when you get Cloud back.
Disc 3 being just the final dungeon is a bit silly, I guess they just barely didn’t have enough space for the 2 discs, but it feels a bit inefficient. The large final cutscene probably ate all the mb. Not like it matters on modern consoles or PC, but still.
Before I talk about the ending and stuff, a small note about the superbosses. Aside from the ridiculous grinding you have to do to beat them (yeah bruh, just be full level and have who knows how many end game materias and you’ll be fine) I found them kind of underwhelming in the context of the game. They’re just there… I get that they were sort of last minute additions for the USA and Europe editions of the game, but the fact that you have these superbosses that are way stronger than the final boss feel very silly to me. And yeah, I know that kind of stuff isn’t strange for JRPGs or even regular RPGs really. Just wish they had fleshed them out a bit more.
Now, the ending: frankly, I was surprised by how little dialog there was. Sephiroth is just completely silent pretty much the entire time. No big final monologue, nothing. Gives it an ominous vibe, which is good, because the final dungeon is kind of meh, and although it’s threatening gameplay wise, I wasn’t a fan of its visual design, just didn’t feel final (heh) enough. Cloud going against Sephiroth alone was an awesome moment and surprisingly “cinematic” for lack of a better word. Kind of annihilated him do to my high level tough.
I do wish there was a bigger epilogue tough. While the scene near the end with Tifa was cute (did they have sex then?) there should have been some conclusion for their relationship after the ending cutscene. And really, the same is true for every character, I wouldn’t mind seeing what they did after. But no, all we get is Red, the least interesting character along with the cat thing. I’m aware there’s movies and stuff, but I’m just judging the game by itself. I demand cute post credit scenes goddamit.


I can’t help but wonder how bad the translation is. You can tell they took a lot of liberties with the script. I hope they didn’t make very severe changes to the characters personality.

Still, casting aside these minor complaints, I thoroughly enjoyed my time with FF7.
If I had to give a score it would be an 8, or maybe a 9, or maybe something in between. Who cares, I liked it.

Only problem is that I want all the remake parts right now.
I guess I’ll go play FF8.
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby kuribo-04 » Thu May 21, 2020 12:03 pm

View Original PostJustacrazyguy wrote:The playmobil nonsense you have to deal with the rest of the game? Not so much. I was surprised that there were several people that actually really liked the legos, and I initially dismissed this as severe nostalgia, but on further inspection, it does make some sense.


Keep in mind the models on PS4 don't look how they are supposed to, which is low res, making them blend in with the backgrounds, making the animatioms look better, impriving immersion, etc. Alsp having mouths on the characters, with a constant :I face doesn't help either.
https://twitter.com/Kuribo4/status/1256692103754797058?s=19

I'm sorry you had to deal with that stuff, but that's how SE wants people to play now. I always recommend going for PSX or digital on PS3/PSP.
I'm glad you still enjoyed it though. It's my favourite videogame story.

Warning about VIII: It's a completely different beast. And VI is the FF I have enjoyed most other than VII so far, though it didn't come close. I really, really wanna play IV.
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Justacrazyguy » Thu May 21, 2020 3:24 pm

View Original Postkuribo-04 wrote:Keep in mind the models on PS4 don't look how they are supposed to, which is low res, making them blend in with the backgrounds, making the animatioms look better, impriving immersion, etc. Alsp having mouths on the characters, with a constant :I face doesn't help either.
https://twitter.com/Kuribo4/status/1256692103754797058?s=19


Even in the comparison you made there they still look kind of bad in my eyes. But yeah, in an old TV it would probably look less jarring.

About VIII, I've been told to pay close attention to the tutorials because the combat system is different from the usual. It'll be an interesting experience I think.
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Thu May 21, 2020 10:01 pm

Forever recommending this patch for fans who want to replay (or play) 6 the "right" way: https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/1386/

FF8 is good and it's wonderful how the Remastered version made it more accessible to newer fans, it's just a shame that they made Squall's hair his Dissidia NT look instead of his original model :sweatdrop: You absolutely want the tutorials for 8 (turn on Squall's console at his desk when the prompt pops up) because some of the story's lore is within it, too. Like any good RPG, talk to the NPCs/characters to get the full picture, too.

Seconding what Kuribo wrote about playing FF7 and such on a PS1 (with a CRT which removes ugly pixels. Or something like Retroarch with the right shaders) or digital via PSP which is a small enough screen to look "right".
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby kuribo-04 » Fri May 29, 2020 10:45 am

View Original PostJustacrazyguy wrote:Even in the comparison you made there they still look kind of bad in my eyes. But yeah, in an old TV it would probably look less jarring.

About VIII, I've been told to pay close attention to the tutorials because the combat system is different from the usual. It'll be an interesting experience I think.

I love the models that way honestly lol.

FFVIII is a battle system in which enemies level up with you. So you can just not do battles and destroy end bosses with one or two special attacks. However, tbh this also somehow lead to me being stuck at the end lol.
Every FF I have played with battle systems by Hiroyuki Ito had pretty broken battle systems (VI,VIII, Tactics) IMO.

Also FFVIII is super slow in many ways. If you play on PAL it's even slower. The battles are slow even at max velocity, the first airship you get is super slow.

It's a strange game that IMO doesn't come together too well, in many aspects. Just take this as a sort of warning...or something. Though with the talent involved there are good things too.
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Ryuko: "I'm gonna knock ya on your asses!"
-Asuka: THINK IN GERMAN!!! -Shinji: Öh... Baumkuchen...
Hayashida: "As game developers, our work is special. All of us here can put smiles on very many people's faces with our work."
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Justacrazyguy » Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:38 am

Final Fantasy VIII

This game is different, that's the best way to put it.
At first glance, this seems like a natural progression from FFVII: the graphics are better, the lego models are gone, there are 4 discs now...

But the gameplay, my god. I thought I got it mostly when I saw the tuturial, but I was not prepared for what was about to happen. I knew the enemies leveled with you, so I avoided grinding, and I knew I had to draw pretty much all the spells from enemies, but I somehow didn't notice that the larger the amount of spells of one type you had, the stronger they became.
I also didn't notice that certain bosses had drawable GFs, so that was fun.
Part of the problem is that the game lets you get away with not knowing any of this because of the GFs special attack, which will destroy anything till the end of disc 3, so when you get to the really hard stuff you'll die a lot and not get why.
I wish they had made the beggining of the game brutal in difficulty, because then you'd be forced to lean these mechanics.

Just like FF7, the game is weirdly lacking in dungeons, which is a shame, because the dungeon music is killer. It's a very story driven, very linear game. You can branch off early, but it's much easier to wait till nearly the end game, when exploring becomes much simpler and faster. Not that many sidequests though.

About the card game, it's actually really fun, and it gives some really strong rewards (without which I would probably still be stuck on the final boss, thank you Gilgamesh) but the mechanics for changing the rules are some arcane nonsense. Completing the sidequests is also difficult without previous knowledge.

Now the story in spoilers below

SPOILER: Show
I love Squall, I love how he tries to be this edgy, independent guy but is mocked and is made to suffer every step of the way because of it. The other characters reading him like a book is very fun.
He's not just a laughing stock though, his inner monologues are great. He's very self aware of his flaws but still has difficulty avoiding them, which is really endearing. He's probably my favourite character.
The rest of the cast is also fun, although I fell like they could have used just a little more development or something.

It's interesting that unlike FF7, you don't know the main villain until really late in the story, but this doesn't feel frustrating because your main cast doesn't know either.

The entire final sequence is fantastic, much better than the shitty final dungeon in FF7. The castle is ominous, different and offputting and it looks like they ripped it straight off from Castlevania, I love it. And the music, man...
Amazing final boss too, difficult as hell, and with a billion phases, but very cool.

To put in a simple way, I think that while the FF7 story is more consistent, FFVIII has higher high points.

Now, a final mention about the super bosses. They exist, that is all.


About the music, it's incredible, it has this distinct sound. I'd say it's better than the FF7 soundtrack.

All this said, I frankly still don't know which game I like more: FF7 or FFVIII

Maybe in a few days my thoughts will be clearer.
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby kuribo-04 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:23 pm

Glad you enjoyed it. For me it sadly was a pretty forgettable experience mostly. Like the talent was apparent, but elements never came together to form a cohesive whole.
Though to be fair I didn't play the very, very end.
Shinji: "Sooner or later I'll be betrayed... And they'll leave me. Still... I want to meet them again, because I believe my feelings at that time were real."
Ryuko: "I'm gonna knock ya on your asses!"
-Asuka: THINK IN GERMAN!!! -Shinji: Öh... Baumkuchen...
Hayashida: "As game developers, our work is special. All of us here can put smiles on very many people's faces with our work."
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:28 pm

View Original PostJustacrazyguy wrote:All this said, I frankly still don't know which game I like more: FF7 or FFVIII

Maybe in a few days my thoughts will be clearer.


7 is my personal favorite between the two (since it was my first "real" JRPG as a kid), but FF8 isn't any slouch for sure. They're equally incredibly good stuff!

Then again, 6-8 are my favorite of the three FFs.
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Re: Final Fantasy series

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Postby Sachi » Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:21 am

View Original PostJustacrazyguy wrote:The gameplay is mostly standard RPG stuff, although the materia and limit breaks do give something slightly different to chew on. It’s enjoyable. There have been talks by some people (mostly on youtube, where stupidity gathers) that turn based combat is obsolete and so on, and while I had no problem with the new combat system in the Remake, I’ve played several JRPGs before, some of them with much simpler gameplay, so this is nothing I haven’t seen before. Could it have been more complex? Sure, but ultimately not all games need that much focus on the gameplay. FF7 is a complete package, the game not being a massive challenge for some hardcore RPG players isn’t a big issue.

When done right, turn-based combat can be incredibly engaging, and the FF series has come up with some pretty nifty versions of it in some of their titles. I think FFX offers the best example of turn-based combat, in what is referred to as conditional turn-based combat. Displayed on the side of the screen are the next handful of turns in order, both players and enemies, and depending on actions taken by the current turn, the order of turns can be changed and even manipulated. This allows the player to engage in every battle more strategically, and abilities like haste/slow and delay attack/quick attack go far to exploit this. Then there's the mechanic of freely switching for any members outside the party at no cost of a turn, allowing them to instantly join the battle, which is useful for the game's emphasis on matching players to certain enemy types (Wakka targets flyers, Auron targets armored, etc). These simple additions to otherwise generic turn-based combat largely improve the experience and replay value.

Not to mention the story is fucking beautiful and makes me cry. Play FFX.
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