Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Ray » Fri Jul 07, 2017 2:36 pm

Jeez, and some people on this forum say I bend over backwards to defend filmmakers and movies I like.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby silvermoonlight » Fri Jul 07, 2017 4:28 pm

View Original PostChuckman wrote:Image

The Socialist Democratic Federated Republic of Carbombya is a kingdom located in the Sahara Desert region of the continent of Africa on the planet Earth. It has a coastline, with foreign ships that venture too close to it often being fired upon. This intensely xenophobic state is ruled by Abdul Fakkadi, and apparently derives most of its wealth from particularly fine oil. The people are often heard swearing on the lives of their mother's camels and so forth. This is of course hilarious offensively stereotypical. [Source]


No offence intended but just because racist stereotypes are in the older Transformers cartoons does not mean it will resonate with a modern audiences times change and taste changes it's the reason why Tom and Jerry now have a disclaimer on there box set saying.
Image
“Tom & Jerry” shorts may depict some ethnic and racial prejudices that were once commonplace in American society. Such depictions were wrong then and are wrong today. While not representing the Warner Bros. view of today's society, these shorts are being presented as they were originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed.


They keep it in the cartoons to educate people on these issues but Bay is not educating or breaking the mould to show how its wrong. I get it you like Michael Bay and that's perfectly fine but please don't bend over to defend these stereotypes there really damaging.
Last edited by silvermoonlight on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Tankred » Fri Jul 07, 2017 4:34 pm

View Original PostRay wrote:Jeez, and some people on this forum say I bend over backwards to defend filmmakers and movies I like.


I don't think Chuckman is necessarily defending the man, more of an observation, even though Dadaism is far left nonsense for the most part. Much of the major modern film producers of the USA are in fact part of left leaning corporate bodies themselves, so I don't know what that means about Bay, I suppose he just doesn't care overall and he's making a statement with these films like a child draws somethings rude on a wall or in sand.

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Chuckman » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:58 pm

Do I have to write I'm not defending it in bold before people stop accusing me of defending it?

It's a deliberate use of an offensive aspect of Transformers G1 in movies that are harsh Starship Troopers style parodies of G1.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:55 am

Whereas I can totally see Bay's Transformers movies as an excersise in Dadaism, I don't think Bay is as skilled a filmmaker as he should be in order to make that clear to his audiences. Verhoven's Starship Troopers and Mel Brooks' Blazing Saddles are able to make their movies in such a way where audiences get what the filmmakers are trying to do. There's no such luck for M Bae. (This'll be Bay's name from here on out.)

Lindsay Ellis is doing a fantastic series that discusses and analyzes Bae's Transformers series on YouTube called The Whole Plate. It's the first academically minded deconstruction of the series so far that I know of.

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay B/

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Postby Alaska Slim » Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:30 am

As someone else has put it; Bay is a slave to his own eye, constantly chasing after spectacle where he can display images faster than the mind can register, but not faster than the eye can follow.

You have objects of varying scale, objects moving in multiple directions, with the camera itself in motion to create parallax, all to service making each shot as dynamic as possible, leading into cuts that are equally as dynamic as possible.

He's good at making scenes feel visceral and creating a tremendous sense of scale, but he's bad at knowing when he should employ them. He's just as likely to accentuate a nothing dialogue exchange where characters are being obnoxious, as important moments where critical plot occurs.


In short, he's developed a knack for tapping into visual cues that grab our attention, but he fires kind of blindly with it, as he's chasing after what he thinks are good cuts, even if the scene itself doesn't justify it.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby MuscleRobo » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:42 pm

Something I found interesting as someone who has recently gotten into Transformers and learned about the toys as well from the movies because they sometimes cross pollinate with the "regular" Transformers toy line is that the movie had at least three planned waves of toys and only part of the second wave is just now hitting store shelves. The movie is getting a home release before the second wave of toys is even out! This seems odd to me, but maybe these Bay movies are finally done for

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Ray » Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:10 pm

Well it's like the difference between the X-Men and the comic books and cartoons and the X-Men movies.

When people go to see the X-Men movies and everyone is dressed in identical black leather or street clothes. People aren't going to buy the toys where they look comic book accurate.

I mean just compare the sales from merchandise connected to Batman v Superman compared to the sales from Merch Suicide Squad and Wonder Woman.

Which toy do you think a 7year old is more likely to buy Optimus Prime the way he looks like in the original G1 cartoon where he's square and friendly and red? Or Optimus Prime in the bay Farmers movies where he's grey with some barely noticeable red and spikes and has a bad attitude?
I’ll escape now from this world, from the world of Jean Valjean, Jean Valjean is nothing now! Another story must begin!
Avatar: "There's a Starman, waiting in the sky. He'd like to come and meet me, but he thinks he'd blow my mind."
Phew, I’m not tense anymore… now I’m just miserable.
People say "be yourself" but that's bad advice, if we were all to "be ourselves" many of us would stop wearing clothes. -Chuckman

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Ray » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:21 pm

https://www.polygon.com/2018/2/16/17021 ... ichael-bay

Transformers REBOOT and why NOW

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZjnvMGqOtU

There's rumors that after the Bumblebee Prequel directed by Travis Knight. Transformers is planning to hard Reboot for the franchise.

Great for me. I haven't seen any of the movies after the 3rd one.
I’ll escape now from this world, from the world of Jean Valjean, Jean Valjean is nothing now! Another story must begin!
Avatar: "There's a Starman, waiting in the sky. He'd like to come and meet me, but he thinks he'd blow my mind."
Phew, I’m not tense anymore… now I’m just miserable.
People say "be yourself" but that's bad advice, if we were all to "be ourselves" many of us would stop wearing clothes. -Chuckman

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Thu Nov 29, 2018 9:51 am


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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Thu Nov 29, 2018 12:42 pm

I dunno. Like, does anyone even care anymore about Transformers movies?

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Thu Nov 29, 2018 12:47 pm

^ Nope, they lost me at Mark Walberg being a scientist with the whole "bf banging underage gf" thing.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Chuckman » Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:46 pm

The underage girlfriend was a dig at the audience of adults demanding that a children’s cartoon cater to them.

The movies actively despise their audience.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby silvermoonlight » Fri Nov 30, 2018 6:29 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:The underage girlfriend was a dig at the audience of adults demanding that a children’s cartoon cater to them.

The movies actively despise their audience.


That reminds me of how Anno made the hosbital scene in EOE a direct jab at the otaku but in both cases it has the opposite effect and implies yeah it perfectly fine to date underage girls or wank off on them. Though Shinji does get some serious turn about in EOE the older guy in Transformers gets no real punishment as he should have been put in jail for sleeping with an underage girl, as if you want to send as message like that in my view you show consequences and real punishments.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Fri Nov 30, 2018 6:48 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:The underage girlfriend was a dig at the audience of adults demanding that a children’s cartoon cater to them.

The movies actively despise their audience.

Yeah, I guess the adults got confused by the first movie where Megan Fox is all but striped naked for us all to oogle at. Cause that was so directed at children :rolleyes:
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Chuckman » Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:25 am

The absurd level of male gaze in the first Transformers movie is just Bay saying “why do you care about dumb toys when there are girls, you dork.”
the prophecy is true

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:34 am

View Original PostChuckman wrote:The absurd level of male gaze in the first Transformers movie is just Bay saying “why do you care about dumb toys when there are girls, you dork.”

Because giant fucking robots are awesome! ...... The concept of which Bay still doesn't seem to understand, which is why his default is T&A&E.
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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Dec 01, 2018 1:51 am

The series lost what little interest I had when Optimus Prime died in 2formers and I didn't care at all about it.

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby Chuckman » Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:37 pm

Oh, you Optimuses do love to sacrifice yourselves, don’t you?
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Statistical fact: Cops will never pull over a man with a huge bong in his car. Why? They fear this man. They know he sees further than they and he will bind them with ancient logics. —Marty Mikalski

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Re: Transformers: We Deserve Better Than Michael Bay

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Postby DarkBluePhoenix » Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:46 pm

^ Almost like its DBZ where there's a built in reset button.
Avatar - Heero Yuy, pilot of Wing Gundam Zero. If you want to read my NGE fanfic go to my profile here - DarkBluePhoenix on FanFiction.net or DarkBluePhoenix on AO3

Voted in college to be Most likely to Take Over the World, how to do that however, will require at least Four Evangelions. Thanks for the idea Misato-san!
"Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds." Said at the beginning of the nuclear age by J. Robert Oppenheimer.
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger." Words of Wisdom from German Philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche.


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