Shin Gojira (a.k.a. Godzilla Resurgence)

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Jul 30, 2016 7:40 pm

View Original PostGuy Nacks wrote:That's not only a very cynical viewpoint, but further paints the man as ridiculously egocentric. He doesn't acknowledge the existence of Cowboy Bebop, FMA, Madoka Magica, Paranoia Agent, Clannad: After Story, Monster, fucking SPIRITED AWAY, or any number of other highly regarded properties that have influenced the medium in some way since NGE's original airing?

Seriously?

He's not saying that they're not unique, only that they're not original. Seriously, Cowboy Bebop is dropped in nostalgia of Americana, and nostalgia cannot exist unless the work is inherently unoriginal. Miyazaki's titles are created from Japanese nostalgia, and the same situation exists there. Madoka Magica is what would happen if The Devil and Daniel Webster had gotten lost at a Sailor Moon convention, FMA's supposed originality only decreases after it's third telling, Clannad: After Story introduced nothing new with its tears, and Paranoia Agent is an episode of The Twilight Zone stretched out into an entire season. All of these titles are unique. None of these titles are original.

Evangelion's not original either; it's a story that repeats itself.

There is nothing new under the sun.

All is vanity and chasing after the wind...

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Clover » Sat Jul 30, 2016 9:07 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:He's not saying that they're not unique, only that they're not original. Seriously, Cowboy Bebop is dropped in nostalgia of Americana, and nostalgia cannot exist unless the work is inherently unoriginal. Miyazaki's titles are created from Japanese nostalgia, and the same situation exists there. Madoka Magica is what would happen if The Devil and Daniel Webster had gotten lost at a Sailor Moon convention, FMA's supposed originality only decreases after it's third telling, Clannad: After Story introduced nothing new with its tears, and Paranoia Agent is an episode of The Twilight Zone stretched out into an entire season. All of these titles are unique. None of these titles are original.

Evangelion's not original either; it's a story that repeats itself.

There is nothing new under the sun.

All is vanity and chasing after the wind...


You're not even being a real person right now.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sat Jul 30, 2016 9:35 pm

^ Okay, so maybe not all of them are unique. Only, like, Eva, Bebop, Miyazaki, and Paranoia Agent.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby KRandMJ » Sat Jul 30, 2016 10:56 pm

If anyone is interested to know the English lyrics in the OST; according to MeltingNightmare
"An anon on /m/ transcribed the lyrics from the pamphlet with their CD."
http://pastebin.com/HG8zZm58
SPOILER: Show
Track 01 - Persecution of the masses
persecution of the masses
sacred blessings count for nothing
Oh God give us your protection
let no blame lie at the innocents
who have prayed
if your high praise is all we have
let not us be without you

Track 10 - Black Angels
out for revenge
we will fight to the end
and the profit of doom
will be silence again

just to be crushed to despair
with no blood to be sparred
as a thunderous cloud will descend
like black angels of the lost

Track 12 - Defeat is no option
Lift your head up from the battle
Though your spirit may be fragile
So your skin is pale and ashen
In your blood runs pride and passion
Only defeat
Only defeat is no option
Lift your head for one more battle
Then your spirit may be free

Track 13 - Who will know
If i die in this world who will know something of me
I am lost, no-one knows, there's no trace of my yearning
But i must, carry on, nothing worse, can befall
all my fears, all my tears, tell my heart there's a hole

I wear a void, not even hope, a downward slope is all i see
as long as breath comes from my mouth
i may yet stand the slightest chance
a shaft of light is all I need
to cease the darkness killing me

Track 20, 21, 27, 32 - Under a Burning Sky
under a burning sky
torrents of rage reigning down from high
sin and you shall repent
suffer the pain and the consequence, instead

Temper the beast that lies within
fight to repeal all mortal sin
judgement on us will befall

sleep thoughts of all resentment
think not holy redemption

I think track 13 is the best out of the whole OST; It's what I imagine Anno would insert into 3+1.
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby pwhodges » Sun Jul 31, 2016 6:08 am

View Original PostKRandMJ wrote:Evangelion 3.33 - Tout est Perplexe (Theme Q)
https://youtu.be/jKk8xsaPx7k?t=1m8s

Heard in context, I don't find that comes over as either a homage to or plagiarisation of the Zelda theme - the repetition (only twice at a time) of a very basic four-note motif can as easily be a complete coincidence.
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sun Jul 31, 2016 7:12 am

^ I agree. Also, If there really was a legal plagiaristic issue with Eva Q's musical score and Zelda's music, then I'm sure Nintendo would file a lawsuit posthaste. Nintendo issues more Copyright Infringement notices when it comes to "protecting" their intellectual property than Paramount does with Star Trek.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Arcadia's legacy » Sun Jul 31, 2016 1:58 pm

Full detailed plot summary discovered on Reddit
SPOILER: Show
The film starts with the coast guard investigating an abandoned small yacht off the coast of Tokyo. Because there is no sign of struggle, they theorize a suicide.

Suddenly the boat is disturbed by a huge eruption in the water. At the same time, a car tunnel under the ocean collapses and copious amounts of red liquid spill into the tunnel.

The government convenes an emergency meeting with all the bigwigs to discuss. The prevailing theory is volcanic activity from an undersea volcano. However, one person brings up a theory that has already surfaced online: that it’s some unknown giant creature. This person is the closest character to a “main character” in the film: Yaguchi. He is the assistant secretary of the cabinet, which is not too high in the overall government scheme but is #2 responsibility for handling national crises.



Yaguchi is mocked, until an enormous tail comes out of the ocean. Stunned and unsure what the right thing to do is, the government has all the ministers put on emergency rescue gear as if they are going to help deal with a crisis directly. After some debate, the prime minister gives an emergency press conference decked out in his emergency crisis gear, announcing that there is no risk of the monster making landfall.

This is a deliberate call-back to the March 11, 2011 disaster, when the prime minister in real life took a lot of public flack for appearing in press conferences wearing emergency rescue gear as if he was going to go help at Fukushima in person, which of course he never did.

Ironically, right after this press conference, the creature makes landfall. Cue “Persecution of the Masses.”



A stupefied government watches as a giant creature comes crawling out into Tokyo. This is Godzilla’s first form, totally unrecognizable, crawling on all fours with gills in its neck spilling more red liquid on the streets.

As it destroys everything in its path, killing civilians, the government finally scrambles helicopters to attack. As they approach, Godzilla suddenly stops and evolves to his second form, growing arms and standing on two legs.

The prime minister is extremely indecisive about order the helicopters to open fire. This is because Japan has a peace clause in its constitution and takes weapon usage really seriously. In real life, this is a major political topic in Japan right now as the very right-wing Prime Minister Abe wants to revise the constitution to give Japan the most military autonomy it’s had since WWII.

Eventually the prime minister orders the helicopters to fire but immediately retracts the order when they see that civilians still haven’t completely evacuated the area. Godzilla mk 2 gives a skreeonk that is verbatim the exact same as the one from Gojira 1954. He goes back on all 4s into the ocean.



Cue long government discussion scenes.

The government divides into 2 groups: The main ministers focus military strategy and civilian safety, while a vindicated Yaguchi is put in charge of a team of young all-stars to research the monster.

3 major discoveries happen at this point:

1. A monster that big could only possibly use nuclear energy to sustain itself. Further, the monster leaves a trail of radiation in its wake. From this, they figure out that Godzilla has nuclear fission constantly occurring inside of him, which continuously heats him up, and that he went back into the ocean to cool off.

2. The second “main character,” Kayoco Ann Patterson, a Japanese American liason to the American Ambassador in Japan, arrives to say that the owner of the deserted ship at the start of the movie was a now-missing zoologist that was researching the monster. He figured out that something big was down in in the bottom of the ocean, which he named “Gojira” after a local legend in his hometown. The Americans got wind of his research and give the creature the codename “Godzilla” in English.

3. They figured out that Godzilla was eating nuclear waste buried at the bottom of the ocean.



In the midst of all this research, Godzilla reappears, further evolved into his “main,” familiar form, walking on two legs and twice as big as before. He makes land in Kamakura, which is a ways south of Tokyo, and slowly walks up towards Tokyo, destroying everything in his path.

The Japanese Self Defense Force (SDF) prepares helicopters, tanks, and bombers to attack Godzilla. Once again, the Prime Minister is extremely hesitant to give the order to fire, but eventually he does, this time for real. The SDF lets lose, and in classic Godzilla fashion, nothing phases him. The prime minister orders retreat but it is too late for some SDF members.



The US military offers to step-in and help, and after some hesitation the Prime Minister agrees. This harkens to another major political hot topic in real-life Japan today: the right-wing government and its supporters feel that Japan is overly dependant on the US military and needs to get more military, political, and economic autonomy in order to be a truly legitimate international player.

The government figures out that the location where the prime minister and the cabinet are gathered is in Godzilla’s probably path of destruction, so Yaguchi talks the prime minister and most of his other ministers to flee via helicopter, while Yaguchi and other lower-level officials flee by car.



As they flee, the US military sends in stealth bombers, which are finally able to deal a noticeable wound to Godzilla. In retaliation, Godzilla glows purple, “Who Will Know (Tragedy)” plays, and Godzilla delivers the most epic atomic breath attack of all time, turning 3 districts of Tokyo into a fiery wasteland, destroying the American bombers, and taking down the helicopter with the Prime Minister and cabinet in the process.

After this great expulsion of energy, Godzilla stops and enters a state of hibernation.



With the Prime Minister and the next 10 in line to succeed him all dead, the Minister of Agriculture becomes temporary Prime Minister. He complains about how hard the job is.

At this point, Yaguchi’s team tracks down the rest of the zoologist’s research. Additionally, the US and Japan are able to get somewhat close to take readings. But not too close—Godzilla has a sort of natural sensor and will disrupt any equipment that gets too close.

Through this, there are 3 more revelations:

1. Given the amount of energy that Godzilla expelled, they figure out that it will take 15 days for him to recover and reawaken.

2. Godzilla doesn’t have “normal” cells, he’s made up of ancient, nuclear-energy-consuming mixotrophs. They theorize that Godzilla started as a collection of these ancient mixotrophs that ate the nuclear waste dumped into the ocean. This caused them to evolve and come together. The pace of evolution increased, to the point that Godzilla goes from undersea creature, to 4-legged Godzilla mk 1, to 2-legged Godzilla mk 2 in a matter of hours, and soon after became the Godzilla we know and love.

3. Bits of Godzilla fell off him in his attack, and these also start the process of evolution. They realize that Godzilla can reproduce asexually (like a worm, not like GINO), and that if they can’t stop him soon the world will be overrun by constantly evolving, unstoppable monsters.



The US Government fears that Godzilla will evolve and reproduce out of control. They decide to use the H-Bomb to wipe him out, and give Japan 2 weeks to evacuate Tokyo.

The new interim prime minister fears that nothing else can be done, and agrees with the US’s plan. But Yaguchi and Kayoco, who’s grandmother died in the Hiroshima nuking, want to come up with another plan. They don’t want Japan to once again be the victim of a bombing that will take decades to recover from.

Kayoco decides to use her political connections to get France to convince the US, Russia, and China to extend the countdown until they nuke Godzilla by one day, i.e. until right before he wakes back up. The American Ambassador to Japan warns her that if her plan fails, it will destroy her political career and shatter her dreams of becoming US President in her 40s. She decides to proceed nonetheless.



Kayoco and Yaguchi’s plan is pump freezing liquid into Godzilla, cooling the organisms inside him until he completely freezes over. They call this plan Operation Yashiori (Yashiori Sakusen). This name goes 3 layers deep:

1. Everyone wanted to call it Operation Yaguchi but he didn’t want to take all the credit, so he took the “Ya” and made it Operation Yashiori.

2. “Yashiori” comes from yashiori no sake. In Japanese folklore, yashiori no sake is a legendary sake that is given to the demon Orochi in order to make him drunk, leading to his defeat. If you’ve played the game Okami, there is a boss fight where you defeat Orochi by feeding him Yashiori no Sake. In this movie, they force feed Godzilla coolants in order to defeat him, a la Yashiori no Sake

3. It harkens back to the name “Operation Yashima” (Yashima Sakusen), which originally comes from Neon Genesis Evangelion, and then was used on the internet in 2011 to refer to the nationwide campaign to conserve energy after the Fukushima nuclear reactor meltdown.



They complete preparations on time, and on the day of the operation, Yaguchi gives a rousing speech to those who are participating in the operation, thanking them for their service and their sacrifice, since there is no guarantee they will make it out alive or be safe from radiation poisoning.

They first use unoccupied trains and drones to send explosives at Godzilla. This is a ruse to get him to expend all his energy via atomic breath. When he runs out of juice, they topple him by causing the buildings around him to fall on him. When he’s down, they force feed him coolant via fire trucks.

It takes a couple attempts and many lives are lost, but eventually it works, and Godzilla is frozen.



After the climax, we learn that the half-life of Godzilla’s radiation is only 20 days, meaning Tokyo will be able to make a quick recovery. The Americans postpone the nuke, but remind Japan that, should Godzilla ever reawaken, they will finish the job and nuke him. Yaguchi declares his intent to help rebuild the government into something stronger, that can support Japan in the age of Godzilla.

The film ends with a close-up of Godzilla’s tail. We see human skeletons coming off of it, reaching for the sky. No explanation is given for why they are there.
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Reichu » Sun Jul 31, 2016 2:55 pm

That summary is so dripping with "Anno" it makes me wonder how anyone could take the fake one(s) seriously for any longer than the time required to process their contents.

So hype. Can't wait to see this.
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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Sun Jul 31, 2016 3:41 pm

Hype meters surpassed all possible expectations.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Sun Jul 31, 2016 10:30 pm

Some things just don't change. :lol:
SPOILER: Show
Image


A little more info from someone on twitter:
SPOILER: Show
"@HccvJPE8Dk: Rewatched godzilla the things at the end are NOT human they have fins and weird xenomorph like heads (no eyes)"
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Sun Jul 31, 2016 11:15 pm

Regarding the tail:
SPOILER: Show
If that plot synopsis is correct & this Godzilla can reproduce asexually wouldn't it make the most sense the human(esque) skeletons coming out of the tail in the ending are Godzilla offspring?

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby KRandMJ » Mon Aug 01, 2016 12:31 am

Apparently in this article Shiro Sagisu explains why Anno uses Eva soundtrack in this film.
http://www.cinematoday.jp/page/A0005070?p=2

I can't confirm it; the article is in Japanese. Can someone look into this?
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Postby BlueBasilisk » Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:03 am

Kaiju A and B revealed:
SPOILER: Show
http://www.b-boys.jp/godzilla/products/shin_godzilla.php
Think I'll give these a pass.
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Postby Zeta_One » Mon Aug 01, 2016 5:13 pm

It appears the rumors were indeed true. 2ch had it right back in Spring. I wonder why Ragone backtracked like that.

Shin Gojira was number one at Japanese box office this weekend. And apparently the film has been received well, if a few professional Japanese reviews and audience twitter comments are any indication. Some reviews described it as a masterpiece. It opened better than Godzilla (2014). If the positive feedback holds, it might pull better numbers than both Hollywood adaptations. Japanese box office of course. Looking through various forums, it seems that some Western fans are pretty furious about Hideaki Anno's creative decisions. I can understand this new interpretation not appealing to one's tastes, though trying to seriously argue that "Anno ruined Godzilla" or "this isn't Godzilla" is kind of ridiculous. Personally, I can't wait to see it. It sounds like a modern re-imagining of Gojira(1954) with Evangelion influences. Persecution of the Masses and Who Will Know are amazing selections.

Also, meet Mansai Nomura, the man behind the monster.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Stillborn » Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:34 pm

Judging from the provided summary, as far as I can tell, it's nothing to write home about. It's pretty much generic social commentray disguised as a movie, with some "Evangelion creepyness" shoehorned there as if it was necessary. It may be good as a reimagining of original Godzilla, but for me it sounds completly "meh" and I wouldn't watch it. It just doesn't sound interesting or enjoyable for me.
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Arcadia's legacy » Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:37 pm

Well, as we all know, it all comes down to execution. Even the worst script can be adapted into the greatest film if put in the right hands
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:47 pm

View Original PostZeta_One wrote:Looking through various forums, it seems that some Western fans are pretty furious about Hideaki Anno's creative decisions. I can understand this new interpretation not appealing to one's tastes, though trying to seriously argue that "Anno ruined Godzilla" or "this isn't Godzilla" is kind of ridiculous. Personally, I can't wait to see it. It sounds like a modern re-imagining of Gojira(1954) with Evangelion influences. Persecution of the Masses and Who Will Know are amazing selections.


My favorite part is that people who were shitting on Godzilla 2014 not even a week ago for not being an "authentic" Godzilla movie because it wasn't made in Japan by Toho are now doing a 180 and shitting on THIS movie and claiming it's not authentic Godzilla because it's too different. And that Toho is lazy because Godzilla's roar is basically the same as the Showa version. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:08 pm

View Original PostZeta_One wrote:Looking through various forums, it seems that some Western fans are pretty furious about Hideaki Anno's creative decisions. I can understand this new interpretation not appealing to one's tastes, though trying to seriously argue that "Anno ruined Godzilla" or "this isn't Godzilla" is kind of ridiculous.

Hatred or harsh reaction to Anno's work tend to be more of a Western thing than a Japanese thing anyway. Most of the time his works will be well-received in Japan while American reviewers will respond with "I don't get it," and then proceed to piss all over Anno's furniture out of spite.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby Zeta_One » Mon Aug 01, 2016 8:58 pm

View Original PostStillborn wrote:Judging from the provided summary, as far as I can tell, it's nothing to write home about. It's pretty much generic social commentray disguised as a movie, with some "Evangelion creepyness" shoehorned there as if it was necessary. It may be good as a reimagining of original Godzilla, but for me it sounds completly "meh" and I wouldn't watch it. It just doesn't sound interesting or enjoyable for me.


As Arcadia's legacy mentioned above, execution is critical. To my understanding, based on various reviews, Anno really pushes the cinematography and the film is sort of a black comedy (specifically the first half). What might sound dull on paper supposedly comes across well on screen due to Anno's unique presentation, Sagisu's score, and the strong performances from the actors and actresses. Audience members have described Godzilla as genuinely frightening and one reviewer claimed the film was evocative of NGE's 19th episode. There's allegedly a considerable amount happening, both in terms of visuals and dialogue, and unless you have a thorough understanding of the language you might not fully appreciate all that the film is doing. Even if you understand Japanese you might need multiple rewatches. With that said, assuming these thoughts are true, I'm wondering if non-Japanese reviewers who were initially left unimpressed will have a change of heart once subtitles or dubs become available.

View Original PostBlueBasilisk wrote:My favorite part is that people who were shitting on Godzilla 2014 not even a week ago for not being an "authentic" Godzilla movie because it wasn't made in Japan by Toho are now doing a 180 and shitting on THIS movie and claiming it's not authentic Godzilla because it's too different. And that Toho is lazy because Godzilla's roar is basically the same as the Showa version. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


I think there's a good chunk of Godzilla fans unfamiliar with Hideaki Anno (who can be divisive) and Toho isn't exactly known for allowing people to take too many creative liberties with the character, so that created something of a perfect storm. But it's still clearly Godzilla. There's no reason for mistaking him with any other monster. Anno's Godzilla still has the iconic roar, atomic breath, nuclear origins, and basic appearance: bipedal, reptilian monster with an erect posture, tail, and multiple rows of dorsal plates. Different origins and abilities have been introduced over the years. Anno has continued that trend, taking a slightly more extreme and grotesque approach.

Anno loves tokusatsu and especially the Showa films, so he simply raided Toho's library for everything from military sound effects to music.

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:Hatred or harsh reaction to Anno's work tend to be more of a Western thing than a Japanese thing anyway. Most of the time his works will be well-received in Japan while American reviewers will respond with "I don't get it," and then proceed to piss all over Anno's furniture out of spite.

I honestly wonder how that might impact the film's theatrical run in the States later this year. Some Godzilla fans have been passionately against this film since the first image was released and I have trouble imagining them going out of their way to see it. Hopefully, Eva fans will show support and it'll have a profitable run.

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Re: Anno is writing and directing a Godzilla movie

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Postby backseatjesus » Mon Aug 01, 2016 11:50 pm

I will be definitely be seeing this in theaters if I get the opportunity. The last movie I saw in theaters was Tron Legacy. It's been a while.


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