Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Tumbling Down » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:16 am

View Original Post(Not) wrote:No.

/thread

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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:29 am

The sights one sees when experiencing the effects of drugs are all based very much in an individual's subjectivity and personality. So much so that it's impossible to look at surrealist art and differentiate between that which was inspired by lucid dreaming from that which was inspired by an acid trip. (Heck, I saw some crazy weird images falling asleep while EBM was playing in the background once.) Anyone who has spent their whole lives exercising and utilizing their creativity probably doesn't need to drop acid in order to come up with stuff others struggle to see without acid's aid.
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Moap » Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:33 am

View Original PostunitM wrote:I do, and I in fact was going to make a thread on this.

I think Anno did drugs in the production of Evangelion. The concept of the AT field is something straight out of an acid trip. However, I believe Anno ingested a strong dose of hallucinogenic mushrooms when producing the End of Evangelion.

I have some reasoning for his shroom trip. 1., Anno is a vegeterian - I highly doubt it's been off his menu altogether. 2., I feel EoE is littered with images of this type of drug trip.


I want you to be right, but at the same note I'm a mountain hippie who's watched Eva on LSD and mushrooms multiple times. If I see a drug reference within Eva its hard for me to back it up, I'm a bit biased. I also watched Evangelion long before I would try hallucinogens, so I feel like of course I would have hallucinations similar to things Id already seen in the show, I love Eva. Regardless, I'd love to here you talk more about how AT fields relate to acid and the mushroom reference you see in EoE.

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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Shamsiel-kun » Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:44 pm

View Original PostReichu wrote:I'm moderately curious about what effect hallucinogens would have on people who are weird by default. Different brain chemistry can result in the same drug having radically different effect. (For instance, I couldn't abuse my Adderall to blaze through college even if I wanted to.)


I've read that giving hallucinogens to people with phobias or a mental health history (including manic-depressive disorder) can lead to very bad trips (including psychosis), and considering how many weird people tend to have (undiagnosed) issues... :siren:
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby BlueBasilisk » Fri Jan 01, 2016 1:48 pm

Anno does not do drugs. Anno is drugs and we are the addicts. /twist
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby one-eyed » Thu Mar 17, 2016 10:07 am

I do not surprise me if he used. It is not uncommon in artistic circles, so he would not be the first, would not be the only, and certainly would not be the last.

In 1885 the U.S. manufacturer Parke-Davis sold cocaine in various forms, including cigarettes, powder, and even a cocaine mixture that could be injected directly into the user's veins with the included needle. The company promised that its cocaine products would "supply the place of food, make the coward brave, the silent eloquent and render the sufferer insensitive to pain."

The Instrumentality itself already sounds like a magical drug, an entheogen, promising to solve all the world's problems. It remembers me how the cocaine was seen in the beginning, even by Freud that was user and prescribing for his patients, until he saw the side effects.

Another thing that does not help is that the effects of PCP drug (also known conveniently as Angel Dust) are severe changes in body image, loss of ego boundaries, paranoia, depersonalization, hallucinations, euphoria, suicidal impulses, well as occasional aggressive behavior, basically whole EoE was a bad trip this drug.

Instrumentality to me is insanity, escape reality for an illusory world, a paracosm, where everything is like you want, then it is empty and meaningless, but combined with a depressive guy who just wants to sleep the entire day to escape the pain.

I see various forms of hallucinogens and none of it have anything to do with Spiritual Awakenings or Seeing Truths as they are or any of that shit. It poisons your mind and your body and you hallucinate. You are not experiencing reality as it should be or any shit like that. The mind is incredibly capable of making you see, feel, and hear anything from colors to full blown 3 horned monsters trying to melt your face. There is a reason why some people never come back it's because it triggers a type of schizophrenic euphoria in most. Some it's psychopathic and can destroy you forever.

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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Gendo'sPapa » Fri Mar 18, 2016 2:16 pm

A lot of people overestimate the "effect" of drugs on creative endeavors. The best creative work comes from a place of absolute emotion and is a hell of a lot more pure then anything some drugs could ever produce. As someone who has done a load of drugs it really has little role in the process of creativity. Unless the artist is the type of tool who churns out subpar art and then has some killer PR in marketing it as "art from a real pure trip."

I don't think Anno ever did drugs. He doesn't strike me as the type of guy who would. But I've been wrong before.

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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Vegeta 20XX » Thu Mar 24, 2016 4:31 pm

Well, to repeat what a number of posters before me have said, but with differently arranged words:

The chances are incredibly low - apart from relative scarcity and potential cultural disdain, the legal risk of using alone probably wouldn't have been worth potentially sinking his career and/or his artistic endeavors. I'm not saying he necessarily did NOT ever use hallucinogens at any point in his life, but assuming he didn't is a pretty safe bet (barring a straightforward admission that balls were tripped).
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Postby Thomas68 » Fri Mar 25, 2016 11:51 pm

Lots of crack for the Angels design and Acid for the Instrumentality and Tang scenes.
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Postby Power Guido » Sat Mar 26, 2016 3:04 pm

A shitload of PCP
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Postby Shamsiel-kun » Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:13 pm

View Original PostThomas68 wrote:Lots of crack for the Angels design


A few books on strange creatures of the world. Maybe also a few about the Cambrian Explosion. Some of the biological body plans produced during that are much more weird than any of the Angels.
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby one-eyed » Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:10 am

The LSD effects and some of the effects of PCP are very similar to the description of the Instrumentality to be coincidence. Anno likes to shock and controversy then, to me, he experienced one or both precisely because be prohibited and severely punished in Japan.

See the description of Wikipedia and see if you see something familiar:

LSD is considered an entheogen because it can catalyze intense spiritual experiences, during which users may feel they have come into contact with a greater spiritual or cosmic order. Users sometimes report out of body experiences. In 1966, Timothy Leary established the League for Spiritual Discovery with LSD as its sacrament. Stanislav Grof has written that religious and mystical experiences observed during LSD sessions appear to be phenomenologically indistinguishable from similar descriptions in the sacred scriptures of the great religions of the world and the texts of ancient civilizations.

LSD's psychological effects (colloquially called a "trip") vary greatly between persons and places. If the user is in a hostile or otherwise unsettling environment, or is not mentally prepared for the powerful distortions in perception and thought that the drug causes, effects are more likely to be unpleasant than if he or she is in a comfortable environment and has a relaxed, balanced and open mindset.


An LSD trip can have long-term psychological or emotional effects; some users report the LSD experience caused significant long term changes in their personality and life perspective. Widely different effects emerge based on what Timothy Leary called set and setting; the "set" being the general mindset of the user, and the "setting" being the physical and social environment in which the drug's effects are experienced. Some psychological effects may include a sense that one's thoughts are spiraling into themselves and a loss of a sense of identity or the ego (known as "ego death"). Many users experience dissolution between themselves and the "outside world". This unitive quality may play a role in the spiritual and religious aspects of LSD. The drug sometimes leads to disintegration or restructuring of the user's historical personality and creates a mental state that some users report allows them to have more choice regarding the nature of their own personality.

Since 2008 there has been ongoing research into using LSD to alleviate anxiety for terminally ill cancer patients coping with their impending deaths. (From Wikipedia)

Aldous Huxley wrote The Doors of Perception, which recalls his experiences when taking LSD and others psychedelic substances. In his best known work "Brave New World" he creates a magical drug (Soma) replacing religion as opium for the masses. For me, Anno wanted to do the same thing, if religion/soma are the opium of the masses, the Instrumentality is the crack.

As Anno and Gendo see the instrumentality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuKp_pDnkso

And as I see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyUMBD5 ... tml5=False

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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Reichu » Wed Apr 13, 2016 5:13 pm

View Original Postone-eyed wrote:The LSD effects and some of the effects of PCP are very similar to the description of the Instrumentality to be coincidence.

Even if this is true (and I'm not so sure it is), one doesn't have to actually do the drugs to know about their effects...
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby gatotsu911 » Fri Apr 15, 2016 5:28 pm

Has anyone mentioned ITT how Japan has notoriously draconian drug laws

Also, mental health problems can be plenty psychedelic as is. Depression, mysticism and psychedelia all have a certain degree of natural overlap.
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Sachi » Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:54 pm

View Original Postgatotsu911 wrote:Has anyone mentioned ITT how Japan has notoriously draconian drug laws.

Multiple times, but some are choosing to ignore that.
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Postby mammaluser » Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:51 pm

View Original PostThomas68 wrote:Lots of crack for the Angels design


Have you seen the proposal angels?!
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Re: Do you think Anno did drugs?

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Postby Kouzou » Sat Apr 16, 2016 11:54 pm

View Original PostSachi wrote:Anno may not have taken any drugs, but he damn near created one. A helplessly addicting dive into the psyche, full of Freudian symbols and rapidly flashing images that leave you in altered state of mind and questioning who you are by the end of it, complete with random flashbacks years after the fact? The only thing missing is a broken family, bankruptcy, and a lifetime of regret, but I still have years of merchandise collecting before I can completely rule that one out.

Between this and tumbling downs comments being so awesome and in line with my view, I must say all that is missing is that Anno is a very cautious person. He is very controlling about any stimuli involving himself. For Example: He is a Vegetarian. Would someone that body conscious and well educated/read really take something so dangerous, even just once? Indeed, Anno hasn't done any hard drugs, but he did create one :)
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Postby MuscleRobo » Thu Jun 16, 2016 8:08 am

Culturally I have to say it's impossible. I'm not saying no one does drugs in Japan but it's much more difficult and much more rare. Sure you hear stories about the Sumiyoshi-gumi making heroin occasionally but you have to be pretty deep into the crime scene to even buy that stuff locally since most of it gets sent to China and Korea or southeast asia right? Plus any controlled substance has harsh penalties over there. Isn't the price of cannabis in Japan something like eight times higher than America and has a surprisingly high possible jail time?

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Postby Chuckman » Wed Jun 29, 2016 5:06 pm

The dissociative one-with-everything experience of psychedelic drugs isn't limited to any one substance and can be achieved through meditation. You don't need to do drugs to come up with that. It's not like Anno invented the idea of the oversoul or anything. Eva is more a mishmash of religion/occult than anything truly original, just put together in a novel way.
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Postby one-eyed » Mon Aug 01, 2016 9:22 am

Reichu wrote:Even if this is true (and I'm not so sure it is), one doesn't have to actually do the drugs to know about their effects...

This is true, but I still think quite possible he used. You may consider as prejudice on my part, but any Lotus Eater Machine trying to push me makes me consider as a veiled apology to drugs. I do not see big difference between what Kihl and Gendo planned to Instrumentality and that "The Old Man of the Mountain" was with his cult Hashishin.

Kozou wrote:He is a Vegetarian. Would someone that body conscious and well educated/read really take something so dangerous, even just once?

Being a vegetarian is a food option, it does not make one better or worse, wiser or more foolish: Ghandi was a vegetarian and Hitler too.

The Japanese "draconian" laws against drugs are docile compared to Indonesia laws and even then the drug traffic there increased by 45% in 2015. If Anno want to do something, even wrong, he will do and damn what others think. He makes the things he do just for himself first and very rarely (in the depressive phase) feels remorse, it was what I understood about him after EoE.

Kozou wrote:Indeed, Anno hasn't done any hard drugs, but he did create one

In more than one sense, I compare the Instrumentality with the “soma” of "Brave New World" or the "paradise" of the cult of the Assassins. For me it is the greatest example of Entheogen I know in fiction. After EoE, whenever I think of a Dummy Plug, I remember the mouse with a surgically implanted electrode in the head, stimulating the pleasure centers in the brain directly and I think, for Anno, that rat found paradise.

Chuckman wrote: Eva is more a mishmash of religion/occult than anything truly original, just put together in a novel way.


I always thought that, but I think it offends some people who only prefer the psychological aspects. Until it makes sense, since many consider the perceived connection between occultism and psychiatry was put Freud and Jung against each other.


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