Metal Gear Solid

Discussions about non-Evangelion related video games, board games, card games and gaming in general.

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Sun Oct 25, 2015 7:39 pm

So uh, this seems very interesting from Kojima himself, although lengthy as hell. Spoilers, naturally: https://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/3q4h85/kojimas_thoughts_about_the_novelization_and_the/

Hope it'll get a retranslation to be a bit more clear!

Blue Monday: Hm, you really think Venom would go nuclear? It's hard for me to say for sure since the dialogue can be seen either way, but
SPOILER: Show
in the voice-over for the credits of the nukes ending, it's mentioned how destroying nukes = good thing, what The Boss would want. Initially I figured credits voice-over + "lay down the gun" MGS4 line = Big Boss (real).

But something about it could be Venom, too: Jack's meme ironically being the one to understand The Boss' will (while it took Jack until the end of his life to finally get it).


The nukes end unlocking will never become a reality at this rate! :crybaby: ...If that's how it's even unlocked.
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Postby Blue Monday » Sun Oct 25, 2015 7:57 pm

I thought Outer Heaven was eventually equipped with nuclear weapons via the TX-55, so to me it's just a logical stepping stone to that.

SPOILER: Show
In the Nuclear Disarmament cutscene I remember there being dialogue from Ocelot talking about the irony of disarming other PFs' nukes yet still having a nuke themselves (I'm most likely remembering that wrong though and I can't rewatch because I'm at work).

I know Zanzibar is later dabbling with nuclear weapons too, because a plot point in MG2 is that the rest of the world is anti-proliferation whilst they do the opposite and arm.

Also, seeing as we really didn't get the morally polarising demon descent in TPP, I like to think it just happens later, post-Phantom Pain.

;)
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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Sun Oct 25, 2015 9:00 pm

Mmh, considering the weirdness of the ending cut scene with
SPOILER: Show
Venom Snake being full-on Demon Snake, I think that maybe losing Quiet is in part what made him go nutty.


Definitely check out the above linked write-up by Kojima. THE PHANTOM FEELS.
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Postby IronEvangelion » Mon Oct 26, 2015 1:06 am

View Original PostBlue Monday wrote:I, too, want to go nuclear, because I like to think Venom and co would continuity-wise, and it's one of the only things left I want to do in the main game. I'm finishing my level four FOB platforms at the moment, but I'm worried that as soon as I get a nuke that I'm basically painting a target on my back for Philanthropy. Makes me reticent, as I just want to be left alone when it comes to FOB.


I've had my nuke for almost 48 hours now and I still haven't been attacked, even though I've seen a Philanthropy member on the leaderboard in my grade (easy to spot, they use a special emblem: A globe with a red border emblazoned with the word 'Philanthropy"). From what I've read, once you have a nuke you can't even be attacked unless the attacker has a nuke as well or has hero status (over 150,000 Heroism). That said, I'm still laying low. My FOB only has 2 platforms, and I never attack anyone as a rule, so hopefully I can go unnoticed. In case I do get attacked, I've got all the security devices in place. My guards are decked out in high grade battle dress and armed with machineguns and honeybees. Hopefully they can fight off any aggressors. After a week or so I'll let you know if I've had any attacks

Wish we could have nukes on Mother Base and not on our FOBs.

Yes, I too wish we could have many offline nukes! Stacks and stacks of them! And each with their own names! I named mine Gary by the way...




Oh man, someone swapped DD's model with Ocelot during a cut scene, and the results... I could not stop laughing! Warning: NSFW
Not safe for work.  SPOILER: Show
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L1WYMKSaTA
[Redacted]

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Postby Monk Ed » Mon Oct 26, 2015 3:55 am

^

"He'll get bigger?"

"Yeah -- like this"

:lol: :rofl: :hitthetable:
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Postby IronEvangelion » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:25 am

I tried the Extreme Quiet fight earlier. After I got tired of getting her stamina halfway down and getting insta-killed, I decided to change tactics and smote her with the divine art of Senshado. Turns out not even a superhuman sniper can go toe to toe with a Magloader tank. After all, the tank doesn't have any toes. For once, she was the one running and hiding while I was safe in the belly of the panzer. And I S-ranked the damn mission too! :lol:


Also, I found the Ground Zeroes Truth Mission on youtube. This is what really went down at Camp Omega!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TSWQJJJkxA
[Redacted]

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Postby Monk Ed » Tue Oct 27, 2015 4:16 am

Found a deployment cost mod that actually does what it says on the tin and I am very happy with the results. Although it's not the perfect solution (I actually like having my equipment cost something, but I'd rather it be a restocking fee), I enjoy deploying with a huge loadout at no extra cost, which has also freed me to play around with equipment I never bothered with because of the cost.

The mod also eliminates research time, which I wasn't keen on at first but which I've found is no big cheat anyway because the time it takes to earn enough GMP to do more research is an effective stand-in for research time. And with no deployment cost, I am free to take what I please on these money-making missions and find I'm progressing at a steady clip and enjoying myself at the same time, when there used to be a tradeoff between the two.

I'm tempted to start playing around with Boss's appearance, like removing that horn for roleplaying reasons. :shifty: Game modification gets addictive.
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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:57 pm

View Original PostSailor Star Dust wrote:So uh, this seems very interesting from Kojima himself, although lengthy as hell. Spoilers, naturally: https://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/3q4h85/kojimas_thoughts_about_the_novelization_and_the/

Hope it'll get a retranslation to be a bit more clear!


:!: Related: https://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/3qeyux/spoiler_quiet_and_mgs_v_novel/

The most important :wink: bit is of course, about everyone's waifu:

Major ending  SPOILER: Show
Kojima stated Quiet's not dead in-game. Ties in nicely with what I initially thought back in September. The game IS meant to be vague whether or not Quiet's dead. It's more the sense of losing her that hits you, phantom pains, all that good(?) stuff.

In other words...

INB4 QUIET OR VENOM CONFIRMED FOR A CYBORG NINJA IN RISING 2 BECAUSE NOBODY STAYS DEAD IN MGS. :derp:


Here's a bit of sad news: https://www.reddit.com/r/metalgearsolid/comments/3qeuzs/japanese_illustrator_who_did_work_on_metal_gear/ Those pics sure are nicely creepy, he did some amazing work!

____

As for my ficcy, it's slow but chugging along nicely. I'm giving a rough "I'll post it online" estimate of next week-ish?
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Postby IronEvangelion » Tue Oct 27, 2015 10:39 pm

Unfortunately my nuke got jacked today. The intruder went undetected so a retaliation wormhole didn't open. Not that I would have retaliated anyway. He was definitely after the nuke, since he ignored the platform that had resources on it and attacked the one with the nuke. Got 10 of my men too, but they were all trash tier (A+ and below) except for one A++, so no big loss there. I do not believe the attack was Philanthropy-related however, since the intruder used a different emblem. Of course there is the possibility that they don't use any specific emblem and the one I saw before was just coincidence, but for now I feel it was just a guy trying to get a disarmament trophy without developing his own nuke.

I'm going to grind away my remaining demon points, buff up my underleveled base defense team, and try again. I almost have enough materials for another nuke already. Glad I took pictures of the first one I made, the memories will never disappear.

Today I also fired up Ground Zeroes for a while. I needed to see someone again, a special person whose loss I feel every time I deploy on a mission in TPP. A true comrade whose life was cut short by an explosion. I needed to hear him say those three little word to me one more time. The words in question? "This is Morpho", of course. I miss you every day, Morpho. Every time I go on a mission I wish you could be there by my side. You would have been a worthy chariot for Quiet. You can never be replaced, Pequod can rot for all I care.
[Redacted]

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Postby TehDonutKing » Thu Oct 29, 2015 11:53 am

An early design concept for Metal Gear Solid: Rising, before Raiden was decided on as a main character, was a game where you play as Gray Fox and fight zombies. Perhaps the reason behind the cut chapter 3 and the bizarre cutscene with Code Talker mumbling about...something while in a trance are a lead-in to Metal Gear Rising 2, where we play as a human Gray Fox and use Fox Engine stealth and Metal Gear Rising style attacks and kills against the parasite zombies and Skulls, which are now controlled by Psycho Mantis. The game's story would explain the origins of the characters from MG1, MG2, and MGS as well.

I hope this happens.
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Postby Blue Monday » Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:14 pm

Personally I still want the Metal Gear Solid: Rising where we were going to play as Raiden post-MGS2, pre-MGS4; where he goes to Area 51 to free an infant Sunny, but is captured, tortured and turned into a cyborg by the Patriots instead (which could've been the prologue a la the Tanker Incident or Ground Zeroes). Then, once Paradise Lost busts him out, he sets out to acquire Big Boss' remains for Eva and attempt to free Sunny again (the main sequence of the story). With the kind of gameplay elements you mention above, Donut - Fox Engine, proper stealth mechanics, basically what we saw in the original E3 2010 trailer - that's my dream game, not Platinum hack and slash nonsense.

Grey Fox versus zombies sounds like a hell of a lot of fun too though. The only other entry I'd possibly want out of Metal Gear post-Kojimbo is a Fox Engine remake of MG1 and/or MG2:SS, and call it Metal Gear Redux or something. Like everyone else, I'm hoping for future story DLC for TPP as well.
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Postby TehDonutKing » Thu Oct 29, 2015 9:22 pm

I'd also like to see the ending to Revengeance be resolved.
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Postby StarShaper7 » Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:51 pm

View Original PostBlue Monday wrote:the original E3 2010 trailer - that's my dream game, not Platinum hack and slash nonsense.


I remember seeing that trailer back when it was first released and being totally hyped for Rising. It's a shame that designing a game around the "cutting" mechanic turned out to be impractical on the Fox engine. Looked like the series was going in an awesome new direction.

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:58 am

MG2: Your daily reminder that Big Boss had eventually lost his mind. (Spoiler-free but maybe watch out for the Comments?)

http://karaii.deviantart.com/art/MG2-Squeaky-Sand-46617425

http://spoonybardess.deviantart.com/art/POISONOUS-RODENTS-WTF-BIG-BOSS-193335881

Edit MGSV hilarity screenshots. No spoilers but mind the comments section:

http://www.deviantart.com/art/spoilers-E-E-R-s-MGSV-playthrough-in-a-nutshell-561225384
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Postby Blue Monday » Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:38 am

This is from the MGS4 art book but I recall reading the team were planning on implementing it in the original Rising; basically baby Sunny would cry on your back, so you'd have to give her a rattle toy to calm her down. Problem is she would rattle it at random intervals, setting off guard caution alerts all over the place:

SPOILER: Show
Image

So cute and so undeniably Metal Gear that I can't help but smile. I really wish we got that game.


View Original PostStarShaper7 wrote:I remember seeing that trailer back when it was first released and being totally hyped for Rising. It's a shame that designing a game around the "cutting" mechanic turned out to be impractical on the Fox engine. Looked like the series was going in an awesome new direction.

For sure. Reading up on the game's doomed development, I think the team really lacked a strong leadership without Kojima directing, and they struggled to find the right balance with the action and stealth elements. The style of stealth was referred to as more of a "hunting stealth" as opposed to the traditional hide-and-seek, espionage oriented stuff in the main games. Also, that, and the fact that they had trouble with scaling because you'd could practically one-hit all human enemies by cutting them in half. In lieu of that, bosses would've been a whole other problem altogether. So, without an assertive director to tie everyone together with a strong singular vision, KojiPro just kind of floundered, and understandably so almost. However, after MGSV, I believe they'd have better context and experience to implement their original idea and concept of Rising, especially in regards to small open-world sandbox maps and the like.

I really, really wish we got that game. Too bad we never will.
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Postby IronEvangelion » Fri Oct 30, 2015 4:37 pm

A bit of a warning for anyone who wants to go nuclear: You get hit with -50,000 hero points and +50,000 demon points for every single nuke you develop, not just the first time. On the bright side, once you turn Demon Snake back to regular Venom, the points thresholds get boosted and it gets harder for him to go full demon again. The first nuke I developed put him at full demon, but after I ground away the demon points and developed another nuke, it only put him in "Horned Snake" status. That's stage 2, whereas Demon Snake is stage 3.

The fastest way I know of to remove demon points is to grind Mission 23 "The White Mamba". Fultoning child soldiers gives you -120 DP per kid. Extracting them via helicopter gives you double that, but is a tremendous pain in the ass and takes forever. There are 20 child soldiers besides Eli in the mission, so if you fulton all of them that's roughly -2,400 DP per mission. To grind away 50,000 DP you would have to do the mission roughly 21 times. That's about 420 kids to fulton. :lol:

Alternatively, you could just visit the animal conservation platform over and over. Each visit gives you -300 DP, so if you visit it 167 times you'll erase the 50,000 DP. Not sure which method would be faster.


I started writing my fanfic, by the way. I'm about halfway done with the prologue right now.
[Redacted]

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:13 pm

View Original PostBlue Monday wrote:So cute and so undeniably Metal Gear that I can't help but smile. I really wish we got that game.


Damn, that really does sound Metal Gear-like! Super cute. I don't know much about Rising yet (avoiding spoilers until we either play it ourselves or watch the KefkaProduction video), but jeez, why do companies do this to us?! I'm hesitant about Rising for this reason, since I stubbornly like my Metal Gears about stealth, not shooting (in this case hacking) things up.

Anyway, I'm just sitting here waiting for an MG 1-2 remake with whatever ideas I long ago typed out in-thread. :crybaby: I'd assume it'd either include more missions than just those two, unless 1 and 2 have tons of extra padding (more likely)? I'd want the game to be "Tactical Espionage Action" once last time instead of "Operations", honestly...

At least there's this fan project that was...ceased by Konami, for apparently numerous reasons.

Quick! What 90's music tapes would they include if they'd be smart and follow Kojima's style?
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Postby IronEvangelion » Fri Oct 30, 2015 6:38 pm

Rising is actually really fun if you don't think too hard about the story or action sequences. Do not question Raiden's ability to slice a Ray in half lengthwise with his sword, just accept it and move on. :lol:
The free-cut mechanic is more fun than it has any right to be, and on replays I frequently find myself dicing up all the crates for the hell of it. Also, Blade Wolf is one of my favorite sidekicks in the series, especially after he gets an armor swap that makes him look like an evangelion designed for dogs. If you like rock it also has one of the best soundtracks in the series.

In terms of '90s music for a MG1 or MG2 remake, I'd hope they'd include some stuff by Will Smith and/or The Backstreet Boys (hey I grew up listening to them on the radio, I love their music, I don't care how much people think they suck). Also I hope they'd add some more '80s music as well. Not having "Can't Touch This" or "I Like Big Butts" by MC Hammer in TPP was a major screwup.

I have an idea for a two-part MG1 remake, this just came to me.
SPOILER: Show
Part One would be called Metal Gear: Uprising and would be a prequel to the original where Big Boss, Venom, and Grey Fox co-create the new Outer Heaven. All three of them would be playable at all times, as well as any soldiers you recruit. It would be open-world stealth game like TPP, but the story would be far more integrated with the gameplay and use similar storytelling methods to Red Dead Redemption (No ACC, plenty of non-hostile NPCs to interact with, all story missions accessible on the maps themselves without needing an Idroid, and no need to return to OH after every mission for cut scenes). There would be at least 4 maps: Outer Heaven (the main base), Diamond Dogs Mother Base (now finished and used as a forward operating base for harvesting resources to build OH), South Africa (field ops area), and Iraq (field ops area). In addition to an expanded buddy system, you'd also have the option of taking up to 3 of your enlisted soldiers with you on missions (max total of 3 supporting characters including your selected buddy) for tactical squad-based operations. Having your soldiers wear enemy uniforms to disguise themselves would also make a comeback. After the main story was completed once, your save data would be transferrable to Part 2.

Part 2 would be called Metal Gear: Intrusion. You would play as Solid Snake and go on a series of missions in each of the 4 maps to destroy Outer Heaven's operations in those regions, culminating in Operation Intrude (the infiltration and destruction of Outer Heaven itself). It would be a very emotional experience since they player would be destroying everything he/she built in the first part. The player would be killing the very soldiers and buddies they had once trained and fought alongside.

Uprising and Intrusion would be packaged and sold separately as full-size games, much like how The Lord of the Rings was split into 3 separate books. This way people would be able to play Uprising while Intrusion was still being developed, hopefully eliminating the need to rush the game out.
[Redacted]

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Postby Sailor Star Dust » Fri Oct 30, 2015 9:48 pm

Heh, I bet music tapes would include some later 90's stuff as you mentioned. I can't help but wonder if it'd include Ace of Base or Celine Dion :lol:

Some cool news that made me happy:

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Postby TehDonutKing » Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:17 pm

View Original PostIronEvangelion wrote:If you like rock it also has one of the best soundtracks in the series.

I have to disagree. The music isn't bad, but the production is absolutely terrible, with a bunch of unnecessary layers that contribute nothing but background noise that obscures the actual music.
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