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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:38 am

View Original PostBagheera wrote:I don't think a dead girl trying desperately not to be completely forgotten by everyone she ever knew (and failing) is first world problems at all.

And yet the series passes her off as a joke most of the time.
PM me if you want specific spoilers for Shin Eva 3.0+1.0, but don't want the whole movie spoiled for you!

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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:42 am

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:And yet the series passes her off as a joke most of the time.


How can it if she's gone and no one remembers her?

Either way, I still fail to see how her fate is first world problems.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
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Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby pwhodges » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:43 am

This review seems to explain the widely varying views (from a different viewpoint, admittedly).
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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:52 am

View Original Postpwhodges wrote:This review seems to explain the widely varying views (from a different viewpoint, admittedly).


That strikes me as a legit and very useful review, thanks.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:52 am

^^That perfectly states most of my issues with Clannad, though I can’t agree that I was affected by their obvious ploys.

View Original PostBagheera wrote:How can it if she's gone and no one remembers her?

Either way, I still fail to see how her fate is first world problems.

Her fate admittedly isn’t First World Problems, and was actually one of the few interesting things to have taken place in Season 1. But even after her little arc in Season 1, she pops up briefly for absolutely no reason, does something cute/funny with a star-shaped thing, and then leaves again. At this point she becomes a gimmick or a joke character in the show, serving only as a reminder of a time I was actually sorta interested in what was happening in the show, while also reminding me of how much I currently hate having to this through the rest of this narratively forced trash.
PM me if you want specific spoilers for Shin Eva 3.0+1.0, but don't want the whole movie spoiled for you!

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Postby robersora » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:28 am

View Original PostBagheera wrote:How is Yoko Kanno's work in any way grating? I mean, she covers every genre imaginable (save perhaps for country) and delivers a bunch of solid rock pieces for Frontier. If you don't like the show you don't, but calling out the music specifically strikes me as all manner of bizarre.


Well... Since I realised how much Kanno is straight up copying from other artists, she has lost appeal to me. For me Yoko Kanno has become a woman who's going to be called if you want the sound of a specific musician or artist but don't want to pay licence fees for.
Also, until now I've failed to get into AKB-like pop music. I'm not saying, that it's bad, it just doesn't work for me.


View Original PostBagheera wrote:By contrast, genuine loss -- loss that doesn't come with a reset button -- is much more tragic and harrowing.


:kaworusparkle: :Kaji: :ritsuko_mug:

They can't be salvaged since they died pre-instrumentality.
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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:30 am

View Original Postrobersora wrote:Well... Since I realised how much Kanno is straight up copying from other artists, she has lost appeal to me. For me Yoko Kanno has become a woman who's going to be called if you want the sound of a specific musician or artist but don't want to pay licence fees for.


Do you have proof of this, or is it just stuff "everybody knows"?

:kaworusparkle: :Kaji: :ritsuko_mug:

They can't be salvaged since they died pre-instrumentality.


I see no reason to think that, particularly since Kaji and Ritsuko were actually in Instrumentality (and Kaworu doesn't need to be salvaged since he's a ghost).
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby robersora » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:38 am

^
Here, Come to your own conclusion :)

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View Original PostBagheera wrote:Kaworu doesn't need to be salvaged since he's a ghost).


This does not please please me.
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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:57 am



Not impressed. See here and here for why. Long story short: she's put out so much original work, the vast majority of which does not appear to be plagiarized, that her borrowing a bit here and there is both expected and typical. It is not really noteworthy and does not diminish her talents or accomplishments in the least (and seriously, some of those comparisons in those YouTube videos are a huge stretch. Some hit the mark, yes, but come on).
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby robersora » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:17 pm

^
Yeah, I already had that debate, and I still like a lot of her output. It's just that I used to deify her a little, when I was younger. So for me she stands a little bit for the obligatory disillusionment one ought to experience when growing up. And I'm still not quite over it, haha.

I'm fully aware that my dislike for Macross and my under appreciating for Kanno are directly linked to very subjective preferences and personal hangups, so that's why I put them into the controversial opinion thread :)
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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:22 pm

View Original Postrobersora wrote:^
Yeah, I already had that debate, and I still like a lot of her output. It's just that I used to deify her a little, when I was younger. So for me she stands a little bit for the obligatory disillusionment one ought to experience when growing up. And I'm still not quite over it, haha.

I'm fully aware that my dislike for Macross and my under appreciating for Kanno are directly linked to very subjective preferences and personal hangups, so that's why I put them into the controversial opinion thread :)


Heh. Fair enough. But if it helps, there's still no question she displays a staggering amount of diversity, and that she's also a talented musician in her own right (as anyone who's seen her perform can attest). So you can deify her a little and not feel too bad. :asuka_thumbsup: After all, we're talking about the difference between "superhuman" and "really freakin' talented and a super hard worker", and the latter's still not too shabby!
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby Bryan » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:24 pm

View Original PostBagheera wrote:I don't think a dead girl trying desperately not to be completely forgotten by everyone she ever knew (and failing) is first world problems at all. I think it's about the worst fate I can imagine, and that the cast of NGE got off lightly by comparison.

I can never understand why people think Eva is so gruelling, honestly. Nothing that happens is permanent, so what the hell? It's rough the first time through, yes, but once you know what's going on it's plain ol' character development and not all that terrible at all. By contrast, genuine loss -- loss that doesn't come with a reset button -- is much more tragic and harrowing.


Holy crap Bagheera. You are wrong in an awesome way so I would suggest not reading what I have in the spoilers. I am not going to actually spoil what happens (not really) but I think you should keep your interpretation forever and not look at what I feel the need to point out.

SPOILER: Show
First of all, she's not dead, she's in a coma, just trust me on that one. You were probably confused about this because the anime is incredibly stupid about it (She's not breathing, but yup she's totally alive)

Second of all, she wasn't doing it out of some desperate desire to stay remembered, she just wanted people to attend her sister's wedding before she inevitably disappeared and her spirit was forgotten. That could be seen as tragic, but the thing is that's not what Fuko actually cared about at all, it was all about the wedding.

Third of all, if you got something out of Clannad season 1 that was cool I don't want to diminish that because that's awesome. I really just find it amazing to find out that anyone could. Fuko's supernatural shenanigans were still the most interesting part, but I found it to be one pretty small exception that wasn't very interesting to me anyway.

But I will admit, the Clannad you describe does sound a hell of a lot better.

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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:37 pm

View Original PostBryan wrote:Holy crap Bagheera. You are wrong in an awesome way so I would suggest not reading what I have in the spoilers. I am not going to actually spoil what happens (not really) but I think you should keep your interpretation forever and not look at what I feel the need to point out.

SPOILER: Show
First of all, she's not dead, she's in a coma, just trust me on that one. You were probably confused about this because the anime is incredibly stupid about it (She's not breathing, but yup she's totally alive)

Second of all, she wasn't doing it out of some desperate desire to stay remembered, she just wanted people to attend her sister's wedding before she inevitably disappeared and her spirit was forgotten. That could be seen as tragic, but the thing is that's not what Fuko actually cared about at all, it was all about the wedding.

Third of all, if you got something out of Clannad season 1 that was cool I don't want to diminish that because that's awesome. I really just find it amazing to find out that anyone could. Fuko's supernatural shenanigans were still the most interesting part, but I found it to be one pretty small exception that wasn't very interesting to me anyway.

But I will admit, the Clannad you describe does sound a hell of a lot better.


Fair enough, but even so being stuck in a coma is hardly a first world problem. Neither is wanting your sister's wedding to be a success, come to that. But I admit, having characters come back in the next season does take away a lot of the punch.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby Mr. Tines » Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:09 pm

View Original PostDefectron wrote:I could never get into any of the gundam series, the closest I ever got was with Gundam wing and G-Gundam.
I think that having watched Space Runaway Ideon to see what this influence on NGE was about served in good stead -- original Gundam and Zeta showed much more variety in their episode structure.

View Original Postrobersora wrote:Additionally I hate the main trio composed of a selfish, ugly hag, a stupid, ugly little girl and a mopey, stupid teen.
Your attempt at Xard summoning seems to have failed.

View Original PostGendo'sPapa wrote:Also, any good recent anime recommendations?
We have some threads for that, like here and here.
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Postby Guy Nacks » Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:08 pm

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:As for my controversial anime opinion, I absolutely hated Clannad. Just flat out hated it. Hated it so much, I dropped it after season 1. I just couldn't stand it. The female characters seem to follow this trend where they are only interesting characters because the lead male protagonist allows them or deems them to be, not because the filmmakers believe that the female characters believe they're interesting or have merit on their own. The whole droopy sad-eye girl gimmick, whether visually or narratively, just got way too old way too fast. I found it boring and tedious, and just wanted it to end. So I dropped it after season 1. It's not that I find slice-of-life boring or anything, its just that the way the narrative and characters were handled bothered me to no end. If you are somehow able to manage that "OMG ALL OF THE FEALZ" emotion while watching it, that's fine, I guess. I just couldn't stand it.



It's much regarded that Clannad doesn't really earn it's stripes until After Story.

Bryan wrote:What? Really? Surely you must have misspoke. NGE puts you through the emotional wringer. Clannad is First world problems: the anime.


Again, After Story strongly begs to differ.

Bagheera wrote:I put it on hold halfway through season 1 because the first arc put me through the emotional wringer.

Allow me to resurrect Xard. :resurrect:

Xard wrote:You are so fucked if you ever make it to After Story.




I think the criticism about it being overly manipulative is valid, but it works. If you want to be moved by something, this is the series to watch....plus apparently anything by Jun Maeda, who really seems to feed off people's tears to sustain his life force.
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Postby robersora » Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:13 pm

View Original PostMr. Tines wrote:Your attempt at Xard summoning seems to have failed.


Ah, we already had this discussion. He quickly noticed that I'm no match for his analytic überbrain; I simply dislike some things, and he got bored. The next time I saw him he dropped a mega post about why my penis is wrong. Then he left. I miss this wicked motherfucker.
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Postby Bagheera » Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:21 pm

View Original Postrobersora wrote:Ah, we already had this discussion. He quickly noticed that I'm no match for his analytic überbrain; I simply dislike some things, and he got bored. The next time I saw him he dropped a mega post about why my penis is wrong. Then he left. I miss this wicked motherfucker.


I don't think he's the one with the uberbrain, there. But whatevs, you like what you like, and that's fine.
For my post-3I fic, go here.
The law doesn't protect people. People protect the law. -- Akane Tsunemori, Psycho-Pass
People's deaths are to be mourned. The ability to save people should be celebrated. Life itself should be exalted. -- Volken Macmani, Tatakau Shisho: The Book of Bantorra
I hate myself. But maybe I can learn to love myself. Maybe it's okay for me to be here! That's right! I'm me, nothing more, nothing less! I'm me. I want to be me! I want to be here! And it's okay for me to be here! -- Shinji Ikari, Neon Genesis Evangelion
Yes, I know. You thought it would be something about Asuka. You're such idiots.

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Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:23 pm

View Original PostGuy Nacks wrote:It's much regarded that Clannad doesn't really earn it's stripes until After Story.

I’d rather not go that far with the show, then. Season 1 doesn’t need to drive me to tears, it just needed to feel more natural, balanced, and less forced. To have to sit through an After Story that hits me hard with ALL DEM FEELZ only after mostly boring me with a Season 1 feels, I dunno... wrong, I guess.

If I wanted something that was just a happy little slice-of-life before getting hit with powerful emotions, well, that’s what Kiki’s Delivery Service does for me. It’s all nice and pleasant and cheerful until Kiki’s broom breaks. Then she starts feeling sad, and then I start feeling sad. Sadder than a broken broom should make me feel. And it does that because Kiki acts like a human being from Earth, rather than a robot pre-programmed to eye-sparkle at me twice per episode.
PM me if you want specific spoilers for Shin Eva 3.0+1.0, but don't want the whole movie spoiled for you!

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Postby Rosenakahara » Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:08 pm

For me, SOL before feels would be Haibane Renmei, even if the SOL (not even really that just a general relaxing nature) only lasts for a few episodes.
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Postby robersora » Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:53 pm

What is SOL?
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