airman4 wrote:Did mark 06 got the lilith mask before it was construct ?

Yep, it had the seven eyed mask since the very beginning :

Since the explanation of Evangelion states that it was excavated from the Moon, that the bump in the torso imply that it had a core and that Lilith have a different mask in NTE, the most likely explanation is that it's one of the four ADAMs, like EVA-13 many years later.
And indeed there was an unused storyboard(or script I don't remember exactly) for the 2I flash-back were it was shown that a giant spurt of blood erupted from the vortex and left the big blood streak on the Moon and implicitly ejected one of the ADAMs and the LoC with it.

wiser3754 wrote:The lingering questions about Mark.06 are as follows:

-It merged with Lilith, but the FOI are in EVA-01's image and Lilith bares no resemblance to Mark.06, why?

-It held the Cassius (now morphed to Longinus as Kaworu concludes) spear in an attempt to impale itself or trying to stop it's attacker from impaling it, which one is it?

-The twelve angel was found alive inside of it, whether the twelve angel was powering the Mark.06 at first (hence Mark.06's halo in 2.0 and briefly shown it 3.0) , the twelve angel made contact with Lilith and set off 3rd impact (FOi and Lilith's image don't add up with the exception of the head) or the twelve angel (made entirely out of core, wink) was born of Lilith via the merger of Mark.06 and Lilith.

-Made into an autonomous type, exploited by NERV and SEELE and brought to ruin. Why make it autonomous and what made it autonomous, dummy plug or the twelve angel taking control of it?

Any more lingering questions that I've missed, or these have already been answered, comment.

- Since Lilith's corpse is atop the pile of skulls(which most likely belonged to the FoIs) the more probable explanation is that the FoIs were created before Mark.06's intervention. As for why they are at EVA-01's image, again it's a mystery, a possibility is that if like in NGE Rei has Lilith's soul and 01 was directly made from Lilith's flesh, then when Rei was absorbed inside the Eva and it awakened, it created a "mental link" with the rest of Lilith's body, and when said body activated it created the FoIs at the image of the current body her soul resided(EVA-01), that would also explain why Lilith got Rei's face too.

- Looking at the position of Mark.06's arms, outstretched, it's clear that it was impaling itself. If he wanted to pull out the spears, the hands would be closer to the penetration point of the lance.

- Since it's implied that Mark.06 is one of the ADAMs, that must more likely be the reason why it could fly and had an halo(remember that Mark.09 could do the same thing, and EVA-01 got an halo during a brief time, and none of the two had an Angel inside them, most likely they are Angels themselves). As for what the hell the 12th Angel was doing inside Mark.06, we don't have any idea. If it's the Rbuild equivalent of Armisael, then maybe it tried to possess Mark.06 when they were fighting and then fuse with Lilith, or it attained Lilith and started 3I and Mark.06 descended to stop it, and then tried to fuse Mark.06 with him already fused with Lilith(explaining why Mark.06 was fused with Lilith's neck stump and inflated to the insane size it ahd when EVA-13 met it 14 years later)
Maybe it's something else, we don't know.

- we don't have any single idea either, maybe SEELE wanted Mark.06 to be usable while Kaworu had other tasks to do(like keeping an eye on Gendo), maybe they feared that some particular task would present a risk too high for Kaworu, or maybe it was made autonomous just for the fight against the 12th Angel because they knew that they will have to sacrifice it to stop the Angel... we don't know.
Same thing as to how they did it : maybe it was with the Dummy System, or maybe something else(they proved that they had something not needing an entry plug to control the Eva with Mark.09 in 3.0, although that one is very special in its composition)

What I'd also like to know is how the being's skin on the moon turned form white to green, what did SEELE add to change it's pigment?

Actually, the green skin we see in 2.0 is the giant actual skin color, the "white skin" we see in 1.0 is a "suit" it wear.
The script say it flatly that he's covered in a "rubber-like white suit for a skin".

I love how the only person who actually gives us ANY information of the 14yr gap is wrong about all of it in the end.

Trying to fill the gaps with anything Kawuro says is probably pointless. I bet mark06 was never autonomous, and that he was the pilot for that battle.

Fuyustski clearly says Shinji had his memory erased. Gendo probably did the exact thing to kawuro, and filled it with all the junk he needed to in order for him to carry out his plans.

Looking at the position of Mark.06's arms, outstretched, it's clear that it was impaling itself. If he wanted to pull out the spears, the hands would be closer to the penetration point of the lance.

Indeed, but what's not to say Mark06 was speared by someone else fist, then leant back to drive it further into lilith. Keep in mind THIS spear was probably the cassius spear to begin with. The spear is what made kawuro suss. I'm guessing (X amount of years later) he had no idea that 12th Angel was inside Mark06, and that it's contact with the 12th Angel is what changed it's form.

I dunno, I just, can't bother with anything Kawuro says in that movie lol.

wiser3754 wrote:The mask on Lilith is her actual face

How do you know that? Closer examination revealed that her "eyes" are actually bolts nailed into her face, and they could be bolts holding on the mask.

ElMariachi wrote:Actually, the green skin we see in 2.0 is the giant actual skin color

How do you know that's not just another suit? 06 was in the middle of being outfitted, after all.

Monk Ed wrote:
How do you know that's not just another suit? 06 was in the middle of being outfitted, after all.

Well, the mask appears to be attached directly to the dark green layer during the close-up of the Mark.06's face, so either that's its real skin or the mask was added by SEELE as well. The script certainly doesn't seem to say yea or nay about it.

Monk Ed wrote:How do you know that? Closer examination revealed that her "eyes" are actually bolts nailed into her face, and they could be bolts holding on the mask.

I think the evidence that support the mask belong to lilith is eva 01 itself. after it absorbed Rei, its head grew into the same shape as the mask that is on lilith.(which also support theory that evangelion 01 is made of lilith). .

Eva-01 is connected to Lilith, but not in the way you might think. Check out this thread. The Lilith stuff comes in at the end, but it needs everything before that for context.

thread/19857/Adams-Children-and-the-Nature-of-the-Cycle/

You know if I was Nerv or Seele the best course of action to implement something that's never been done before would be to experiment first on a small scale before going all out on full scale.

wiser3754 wrote:You know if I was Nerv or Seele the best course of action to implement something that's never been done before would be to experiment first on a small scale before going all out on full scale.

I'm not sure what you're responding to, but what makes you think they DIDN'T?

Reichu wrote:I'm not sure what you're responding to, but what makes you think they DIDN'T?

Kaworu's conversation to Shinji about the Mark.06 remodeled to an autonomous type and being brought to ruin via experimentation by the Lilin aka Nerv/Seele In doing so my thoughts were that Seele, who haven't done instrumentality before, would propose to experiment first on a small scale before handling it proper.

wiser: I assume you're recalling the github translation, where the line in question actually mentions "exploitation", not "experimentation":

01:07:35 {Kaworu} Yes, the Eva Mark.06.
01:07:38 {Kaworu} Remodeled into an autonomous type,
01:07:40 {Kaworu} exploitation by the Lilin brought the unit to this state of ruin.

In terms of experimentation by Seele, you don't have to look any further than what happened to Eva-04. Its activation resulted in a pseudo-Impact event; Kaji wondered if it was really an accident; and when Gendo phrased its loss as a serious setback, Seele simply dismiss the notion. Later on, a shit-load of Angel-like Evas show up that have "4" in their name somewhere; we know at least some of these are considered "Mark" units, which in the only other two known cases is used to label Evas developed for Seele's personal use. Hmmmmm.

When you consider that instrumentality is a world wide life changing event, botching it on your first try doesn't leave you room to try again.
Kaworu stating to Shinji before they suit up that the Spears Longinus and Cassius are to be used for instrumentality. They were or were to be used with Lilith in conjunction with the Mark.06 and the possibly the twelfth angel concludes to me that Seele/Nerv were attempting instrumentality albeit small scale. You know, to make sure it works when you attempt it fully. Might also explain why the FOI originate from Lilith's chamber.

But again, why in the image of Unit 01? Ritsuko says at N3I that life would be elimanated to create just the one being of light, not make thousands of copies of it's former self.

Again, not sure where you're getting the idea that Third Impact is a "first try". There's Second (where it's plainly implied that the outcome was something Seele wanted), there's experiments like what happened to Eva-04 as mentioned, and there's also the complete unknown of First Impact.

I'm also struggling to see how you can look at Third Impact's aftereffects -- which are far more dramatic than even Second Impact's -- and somehow conclude that it must have been a small-scale experiment. Third Impact screams "complete uncontrolled clusterfuck that nobody actually wanted (except Gendo maybe)".

In any case, this isn't really the best thread for such a discussion, as the line of thought is at best tangential to Mark.06.