Asuka's role in 3.0 & Beyond

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

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Postby fadadio » Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:08 pm

Her Role?...hmmmm not much of a role other than be the pissed off battle pirate. Which is sad seeing as she had some decent character Arc going to her in 2.0. Now its like Anno has jumped the shark and dumped all the other character Arcs in favor of Shinji...Yes as with the original series the main protagonist is Shinji but what made the Original so interesting was the fact that other characters had their own Stories. So I am dissapointed with how Asuka showed no developement whatsoever in this movie. Perhaps in Final we can get something more juicy involving her and the other characters but im not getting my hopes up. :irked:
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Postby Giji Shinka » Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:46 am

View Original Postfadadio wrote:Her Role?...hmmmm not much of a role other than be the pissed off battle pirate. Which is sad seeing as she had some decent character Arc going to her in 2.0. Now its like Anno has jumped the shark and dumped all the other character Arcs in favor of Shinji...Yes as with the original series the main protagonist is Shinji but what made the Original so interesting was the fact that other characters had their own Stories. So I am disapointed with how Asuka showed no development whatsoever in this movie. Perhaps in Final we can get something more juicy involving her and the other characters but im not getting my hopes up. :irked:

I must disagree with you about Asuka's character development, she HAD one, OFF-SCREEN. While watching Q i noticed that Asuka had matured a bit in these 14-years. Character developments doesn't have to be huge or positive like usually in anime, like they suddenly grow up from wussy to badass in one second. (Evangelion has always been about realistic characters.) What kind of character development direction would you have liked Asuka to go to? I think It's almost impossible for any character to go "happy/energetic" direction now that world has ended almost twice. It really lowers the mood. And of course this is Shinji's story so he has more screen time. But, i must agree with you about the fact that original series was more than just Shinji's character, and unlike you, i am quite hopeful for some development for others as well in 4.0. :smirk:
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Postby fadadio » Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:17 am

I dont see how she has matured, she still calls Shinji a idiot and lashed out at him in anger when she first saw him. The only thing I noticed is that she no longer gets angry over others helping her in combat, seeing as before she used to be miss do it herself(infact she scolds Mari for being late when she needs the support) but I dont see this as a big development because she already learned that she needs help from others from the Sahaquiel fight. Other than her eyepatch there is nothing really new about her which is unfortunate since she had a nice bit of development going for her in 2.0

However I did enjoy the Development with Shinji and Kaworu in 3.0 it was more slow paced and sincere than in the first series in my opinion. With that being said in 4.0 I dont know what to expect seeing as there are many other character arcs that need to be explored but only 1 movie left.
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Postby CCri » Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:51 pm

Asuka has definitely not matured in the past 14 yrs. Think about when you were 14 and then you got out of college and then started working. Two complete people. Keep in mind that this is also post apocalyptic world that they live in now. She probably has not done much in the past 14 yrs except piloting, trying to survive, and suppressing her past. thats not much emotional growth at all. if you think about her emotional growth from when she was a small child up to when she became 14 there was very little of that as well. If you recall in the original series, Shinji refrained from kissing the sleeping Asuka who has sleepwalked into his room because she had muttered "Mama."

I believe there is still a way for she and Shinji to reconcile. Anno purposefully made it so they are going to be spending a great deal of time together since theyre now stranded. Asuka is clearly resentful towards Shinji but she still has some sort of feelings towards him (even though she punched the window, she still took the time to go down and visit him).
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Postby elemileTLDR » Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:57 am

View Original PostCCri wrote:Asuka has definitely not matured in the past 14 yrs. [...] if you think about her emotional growth from when she was a small child up to when she became 14 there was very little of that as well. If you recall in the original series, Shinji refrained from kissing the sleeping Asuka who has sleepwalked into his room because she had muttered "Mama."


Well, that was indeed Sohryu, not Shikinami. But, in any case, the accusation is most unfair; although Shinji and many of us got the wrong impression that time, that wasn't an emotional toddler calling for her mom in the dark: that one Mama she called during her presumable nightmare was the one who went insane and systematically rejected her until hanging herself, which she also saw with her very eyes. If anything, I'd call her precocious in many ways, including emotionally, by the means of shock.

About Shikinami's maturity (whatever that might be)... I don't know. To my eyes, at least, she's no teen tsundere anymore: she's clearly harden up for real and sucked up stuff. If, regardless, Shinji remains a huge character in her life whom she's still trying to come to terms with... well, that's just good news for the story; after such a leap, at least I really long for some hints like those to get a sense of narrative continuity from the entire Rebuild.
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Postby Nuclear Lunchbox » Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:12 am

View Original PostelemileTLDR wrote:About Shikinami's maturity (whatever that might be)... I don't know. To my eyes, at least, she's no teen tsundere anymore: she's clearly harden up for real and sucked up stuff. If, regardless, Shinji remains a huge character in her life whom she's still trying to come to terms with... well, that's just good news for the story; after such a leap, at least I really long for some hints like those to get a sense of narrative continuity from the entire Rebuild.

Actually, there's a great word to describe her. Kuudere. It's close, except the affection is displayed in the most ambiguous manner possible and rarely, if at all. However, the only role she seemed to play in 3.0 was that of a background antagonist, at least from the film's very Shinji-centric point of view.

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Postby TMBounty_Hunter » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:31 pm

View Original PostCCri wrote:I believe there is still a way for she and Shinji to reconcile. Anno purposefully made it so they are going to be spending a great deal of time together since theyre now stranded. Asuka is clearly resentful towards Shinji but she still has some sort of feelings towards him (even though she punched the window, she still took the time to go down and visit him).



I just hope whatever time they spend together in FINAL, she doesn't keep this up

SPOILER: Show

Image
Image
Image


Because last time that earned her a choking.


It will definitely be nice to see her play a bigger role next time.
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Postby ElMariachi » Thu Apr 25, 2013 3:31 am

View Original PostTMBounty_Hunter wrote:I just hope whatever time they spend together in FINAL, she doesn't keep this up

SPOILER: Show

Image
Image
Image


Because last time that earned her a choking.


It will definitely be nice to see her play a bigger role next time.

Oh man I just can't help myself to laugh everytime I see the last gif! :lol:

And quite the contrary, I think she will continue this stuff as long as Shinji is unresponsive, at first she was indeed venting some frustration on him, but after that it's more her way to make him get a hold of himself. It's brutal, but that's how Asuka is, be it Soryu or Shikinami.

And what she did in the kitchen scene was far more vicious than what she did at the end of 3.0, in EoE that was a pure emotional beating done precisely to harm Shinji on the worst way possible.
Last edited by ElMariachi on Thu Apr 25, 2013 8:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Shinoyami65 » Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:40 am

View Original PostElMariachi wrote:
And what she did in the kitchen scene was far more vicious than what she did at the end of 3.0, in EoE that was a pure emotional beating done precisely to harm Shinji on the worst way possible.


Yeah, her 3.0 attacks seem more like a rant combined with some attempts to get him to respond, which is much better than torturing the poor boy mentally until he is motivated to kill her. Granted, physical attacks seem brutal, but at least she isn't tearing his eyes out, breaking his arm or doing anything to cause him serious agony or death.
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Postby bladerj » Thu Apr 25, 2013 8:51 am

what do you use to make gifs
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Postby Nuclear Lunchbox » Thu Apr 25, 2013 9:35 am

View Original PostShinoyami65 wrote:Yeah, her 3.0 attacks seem more like a rant combined with some attempts to get him to respond, which is much better than torturing the poor boy mentally until he is motivated to kill her. Granted, physical attacks seem brutal, but at least she isn't tearing his eyes out, breaking his arm or doing anything to cause him serious agony or death.

It seems more petulant than anything, actually. Just a "Do something, I'm bored" sort of thing. Obviously without the bored part, but you get my point.

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Postby Reichu » Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:58 am

Split the eye stuff.

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Postby ElMariachi » Fri May 03, 2013 9:06 pm

During a new view of the movie today, I noticed something very symbolic and powerful while subtle : her nicknames for Shinji.

In the two movies, she NEVER ever calls Shinji simply "Shinji", but nicknames that, when you think about it, are a clear indication of how she feels about him at the moment :
- in 2.0 she starts by calling him "daddy's boy", thinking he's only a pilot thanks to his father being NERV commander(which is true) and that because of that he's an inferior pilot than her.
- after the battle against Sahaquiel, she graciously gives him the authorization to call her Asuka, while from now on she will calls him "baka Shinji", it's the sign that she have grown to respect Shinji as a pilot and a person(it takes a fuckton of courage and resilience to keep fighting with its hands impaled like that!), of course the "baka" is here because it's Asuka we're talking about!
- in 3.0 the first two times we see Asuka mentioning Shinji, she keeps using the nickname "baka Shinji" : when she "calls" for his help during Operation US, and when she goes to see him in the Quarantine Room. Take in account that it's the first time in 3.0 that a character shows a behavior similar of that of 2.0. Subconsciously, it's a relief because her nickname acts like an anchor, a sign that some things are still as what they were(take in account that by the second time she calls him baka Shinji is the moment we learn about the time skip)... of course that made it all the more jarring when she then punches the glass and acts more condescending that she has ever been toward him.
- and then when Shinji escapes with ReiQ, another shift in Asuka's feelings toward Shinji occurs : she drop the nickname of "baka" and replace it with "gaki"(brat). While the baka was somewhat playful, by using gaki she clearly goes back to think of Shinji as an inferior being, a poor and stupid ignorant who flee his responsibilities at the first opportunity(even if he didn't knew what was his responsibilities, but this is irrelevant here)
- when they meet again in Central Dogma, Asuka is so surprised by the fact that Shinji is piloting an EVA that she uses the "baka" again... but from here she will exclusively use the "gaki" nickname, and you have to see the scorn with which she uses that term! That change of surname marks Asuka's transition to the "other side" : the side of the people who completely changed over the past 14 years, especially toward Shinji, and are now unrecognizable : seriously, would you have ever imagined until 3.0 that moment where Asuka would attack Shinji with such a rage and murderous intent, while in their respective EVA, would ever occur?

I think that if Final will have some character development for her and try to have her and Shinji mend their relationship, the big moment that will mark her transition back to more friendly feelings will be the moment she will change again his nickname, maybe she will come back to the old "baka", or maybe she will found a new one.
Last edited by ElMariachi on Sat May 11, 2013 12:51 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby nervshatter » Fri May 03, 2013 9:34 pm

Hopefully cyclops(Asuka) at least attempts to break Shinji out of his broken state, although it wouldn't surprise me if her reason for taking Shinji along was so she can have his ass thrown back into custody again, also since she is 14yrs older than him it is possible that whatever feelings she had for him are pretty much dead.
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Postby Monk Ed » Fri May 03, 2013 9:45 pm

View Original Postnervshatter wrote:Hopefully cyclops(Asuka) at least attempts to break Shinji out of his broken state, although it wouldn't surprise me if her reason for taking Shinji along was so she can have his ass thrown back into custody again, also since she is 14yrs older than him it is possible that whatever feelings she had for him are pretty much dead.

I think it's just about guaranteed, which makes for a huge break from NGE. Possibly the biggest break of all, being the LAS-shipper that I am -o-;. This, more than anything else, communicates Anno's message to me, "This is a different story. These are different people. This Asuka is not the Asuka you once knew." And it saddened me. :sigh: But at the same time, it piques my interest to see where this new story will go.
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Postby Seele00TextOnly » Fri May 03, 2013 10:10 pm

Asuka is completely recognizable, having a justified contempt for Shinji does not strip away her character or make her unrecognizable.

Overidentification-with-the-main-character insanity syndrome going on a lot around here.
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Postby nervshatter » Fri May 03, 2013 10:21 pm

View Original PostMonk Ed wrote:I think it's just about guaranteed, which makes for a huge break from NGE. Possibly the biggest break of all, being the LAS-shipper that I am -o-;. This, more than anything else, communicates Anno's message to me, "This is a different story. These are different people. This Asuka is not the Asuka you once knew." And it saddened me. :sigh: But at the same time, it piques my interest to see where this new story will go.


I personally love that Anno is going with a completely different route here with the characters rather than rehashing them from NGE, and as for cyclops(Asuka) I wont deny that the possibility that she might still have feelings for Shinji, but I do wish that she at least expresses how she feels towards him in 4.0 after all she is suppose to be more mature.
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Postby Monk Ed » Fri May 03, 2013 10:22 pm

View Original PostSeele00TextOnly wrote:Asuka is completely recognizable, having a justified contempt for Shinji does not strip away her character or make her unrecognizable.

I didn't say Asuka was unrecognizable, or are you talking to someone else? Is it your contention that Shikinami is a lot more like Sohryu than I seem to think? That her feelings for Shinji really are more like what Sohryu seemed to have for Shinji in NGE?

Overidentification-with-the-main-character insanity syndrome going on a lot around here.

If that's true, isn't that to the movie's credit? :lol:
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Postby Bagheera » Fri May 03, 2013 10:42 pm

View Original PostMonk Ed wrote:I didn't say Asuka was unrecognizable, or are you talking to someone else? Is it your contention that Shikinami is a lot more like Sohryu than I seem to think? That her feelings for Shinji really are more like what Sohryu seemed to have for Shinji in NGE?


What, a mixture of hatred, disgust, contempt, and desperation? I rather thought Shikinami liked Shinji in Ha, and that she was merely angry with him in Q. I'm not sure if she was ever really crushing on him (she gave up rather easily once she had an excuse to do so), but who knows? One doesn't nurse a grudge like that unless there's some real feeling behind it so maybe she thinks of him as her first love.

But OTOH she's always been more stable than Soryu was so it's quite possible she's long since moved on. It wouldn't surprise me if she worked herself up into a frenzy after recovering Shogoki, remembering long-forgotten feelings even though she'd never given the guy a second thought in the fourteen years beforehand.
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Postby TMBounty_Hunter » Fri May 03, 2013 11:09 pm

View Original Postnervshatter wrote:also since she is 14yrs older than him it is possible that whatever feelings she had for him are pretty much dead.

I'm disappointed noone invoked the Curve of Eva on this.

If some people are gonna claim same body = same permenant raging hormones, might as well extend it to feelings too. :D
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