Q Movie reactions (NO SPOILER)

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition"). The final instalment made its debut in Japan on March 8, 2021.

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Evangelion 3.0 Review

Postby MitsumuraKun51196 » Fri Jan 11, 2013 8:21 pm

I just got to say that I really enjoyed Evangelion 3.0 It was so much fun watching.I hope all of you here get the chance at watching this for real.
It gives a perfect Chaos/Happiness ratio.
8.0/10
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Postby slothen » Sat Jan 12, 2013 2:54 am

1 & 2 had me on the edge of my seat, heart in my mouth, jaw on the floor. This one had me checking the timer to see when it would be over. Extremely light on character development, in contrast to 1 & 2. Will watch again once DVD comes out, maybe seeing some of the action in decent quality (not camrip) will make up for the rest. My review in the spoilers section.
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Postby Evanut » Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:36 am

Just finished watching the camrip... I won't make my final judgment until I see a dvd-quality version, but initial impression is just utter confusion. No, I definitely liked the film, but the pacing seemed a bit off and the action scenes weren't quite the same level of epicness achieved in 2.0. Besides that I thought Shinji and Kaworu were surprisingly likeable and that Asuka and the rest of the cast were just flat and unrelatable. This is not the same show which I thought had the best anime characterizations in history... Well, hoping Anno adds about 15 extra minutes to the movie to clear some of those issues up before the release of 3.33.
Last edited by Evanut on Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby ToggleON » Sat Jan 12, 2013 6:21 am

I watched 3.0 a few days ago, and after thinking about it I wanted to find out what others thought about it and whether they had the same gripes that I had with it also. It seems that some agree and some don't.

Basically I feel a little underwhelmed to be honest... maybe even a little peeved. If the original Eva series and EoE never existed, then I imagine I'd be angry with the direction Q has took the series because from what droplet of character development you get from Q, it almost feels like a betrayal of all the work that went into the previous events of the movies. And it's this sheer lack of character focus, after thinking long and hard about it, that I think is what is responsible for the bitter taste that hasn't left me since seeing the movie.

Many of the main characters, whose personalities and histories are so complex and amazing, are reduced to 2D charactertures whose actions don't reflect their pasts. I can't even start with Mari. She actually reminded me of Vanille from Final Fantasy XIII (if you're familiar) as in her character doesn't seem to relate, reflect or react in any sane way in relation to the serious events that unfold around her. She seems to be a copy/paste character from a wacky-comedy anime...

While Shinji for most part acts in a similar fashion to the way he did in the previous Rebuild movies, I believe his main role here is to reflect the audiences bewilderment. However the movie isn't kind enough to address or alleviate this bewilderment and instead, adds further to it the more it goes on, only ever eventually explaining what the immediate situation is for Shinji/the audience after half way through, and only then it comes in a cryptic fashion (heh the Anno factor I suppose.)

The animation was fantastic, if a little different from the previous Rebuilds (lots of spinning and panning shots and characters with rather elongated bodies during action scenes, reminiscent of other anime.) A few scenes of angel fighting are amazing, however they didn't have the sheer tension and impact of 1.0 and 2.0, but then again, this is probably due to poor character focus i.e. its hard to care.

SPOILER: Show
I know some people have said they cried or really felt Kaworu's death, but even that didn't effect me so much, it was ruined by bizarre events, dialog and actions by the others around it.


It certainly wasn't what I was expecting, which was no doubt the intention. I just can't help but wonder if he can pull it off with 4.0, because everything in me tells me that the movie was not the Evangelion I love, no matter how I try rationalise the reason for the huge changes he made. People complained that the end of the original series and the EoE movie were a slap in the face by Anno, but I loved both. This however, I'm getting different vibes from altogether.

But anyway, whatever Anno has planned, I AM looking forward to seeing how this new direction comes to a conclusion. However as it stands, I will not be adding the Q movie to my bluray collection like I have with the others.

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Postby Nuclear Lunchbox » Sat Jan 12, 2013 11:37 pm

So yeah. I've forgotten what it was like to be confused with Evangelion. Now I remember. I remember it HARD. I feel like my brain is melting. :explode: Just... wow. Anno, what were you... I can't form a coherent sentence about anything anymore.

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Postby katanaswordfish » Sun Jan 13, 2013 2:38 am

Hey, I'm a newly registered member of EGF even though I've been prowling around for a long time. I'm a big fan of both the TV series as well of EoE and the first two rebuild films, but after watching the camrip of Q last night I left feeling a mix of disappointment and emptiness. Now, since I saw the camrip version, I have to put my final verdict on the audio/visual aspects of the movie on hold (although I'll touch upon them). The story, continuity and directorial choices were a pretty big disappointment to me considering that I have a lot of faith in both Anno and Tsurumaki.

Visuals: Having only seen the poor quality camrip I can't really come to a final conclusion about the quality of the animation. However, the visual style and aesthetics are similar to the previous two rebuild films. There's a heavy mix of 3D skeletal animation with traditional 2D animation composites. There seems to be more 3D in this film than either of the previous ones, with heavy use of 3D models for pretty much anything mechanical as well as many backgrounds. Like the previous movies, there are also times where the evas are rendered with traditional 2D animation. Nearly all of the 2D traditional animations in the movie seem extremely good. As for the 3D animations and backgrounds, they occasionally look very impressive, but there are times where the 3D animations were clearly very mediocre (lacking secondary motion, unnatural movement, and bad/flat timing..).

SPOILER: Show
Many of the new character/costume designs are very cool looking and reminiscent of Sadamoto's best designs from previous eva projects, diebuster, and nadia. The new mech designs range from pretty cool (Unit-08) to plain ugly (the Wunder).


Audio: Despite being generally disappointed with Q, I'm very impressed with the music. The music is generally less diverse in both style and emotional theme than in the previous films. However, there are tons of cool musical surprises and the quality of the compositions/arrangements/recordings are really excellent. It only takes about 10 minutes to get a sense of the musical style of the film. The soundtrack is very solid and will certainly stick with you if you're a fan of Shiro Sagisu's work in the other films. Also, in typical Eva fashion, the sound effects are very cool most of the time. There is very little I can say about the movie's audio that isn't positive.

SPOILER: Show
There is a significant amount of new compositions with motives derived from classic eva tunes. There are also a few arrangements of Nadia songs. Gods Message is phenominal. The Anthem is slightly too heavy handed on the low brass for my taste, but it's growing on me with each listen and it's still very cool.


Narrative: It's hard to know where to begin. Obviously I won't go into spoilers. The narrative of this film is extremely disappointing to me and after watching I had a sense that there was very little movement in the plot and that the experience was generally shallow and did little to provoke any emotion, excitement, or thought. As others have already stated, there is very little character development outside of Shinji and Kaworu. This might not sound like an issue. However, due to the facts that Eva Q is very different from anything we've seen in the past and goes out of its way to introduce a pretty hefty number of new concepts, I walked away feeling as if the eva universe was actually made less robust as a result. Much of the character continuity is completely disjointed from the previous films and so much is done off screen without being even addressed that it's very hard to suspend your disbelief. I can say with all honestly that I know nothing more about the Eva universe and it's characters than I did prior to watching the film. There are some unprecedented story-telling shortcomings that I can't really get into without spoiling. I would consider many aspects of the film to be relatively large plot holes and inconsistencies. Finally I'd say the film opens up multiple 'bags of worms' that end up inadvertently hurting the overall plot of the rebuild films.

I'll reserve my final judgements on this movie until I've seen it in better quality. I think that it has a lot to offer musically, I think the 2D animations are great, the 3D animations are a mixed bag, but the narrative isn't at all what I would consider to be up to Evangelion standards. There are definitely a few good scenes in this film that any eva fan would probably enjoy. However, it's hard to enjoy those scenes when the film seems to be so self-destructive in terms of it's continuity. It wasn't really what I was hoping for. I had an open mind for drastic changes, but the ones that we ended up getting were almost nonsensical and shallow. It's different, but I can't say it's good...
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Postby thegrove » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:48 am

I watched the subbed rip, and I have never experienced such a pure brew of black, hopelessness, complete disrepair, and utter hollowness. It's like I can't even see through the darkness I'm currently vicariously experiencing through Shinji.

Even though the movie may not be that great, discounting dashed expectations, that final scene two minutes before the credits will be forever etched into my mind.

I desire more of this scotch that Anno brews.

Oh, by the way, instant buy. I'll get the disc release as soon as I can afford it.
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Postby slothen » Sun Jan 13, 2013 8:41 pm

View Original Postthegrove wrote:I watched the subbed rip, and I have never experienced such a pure brew of black, hopelessness, complete disrepair, and utter hollowness. It's like I can't even see through the darkness I'm currently vicariously experiencing through Shinji.


I envy you. I couldn't bring myself to care enough to feel that way.
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Postby katanaswordfish » Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:29 pm

View Original Postthegrove wrote:I watched the subbed rip, and I have never experienced such a pure brew of black, hopelessness, complete disrepair, and utter hollowness.


I agree with the "utter hollowness" part... :ehh:

I think 3.0 kind of 'jumped the shark' in a few really big ways that I can't really get into here. Some of the concepts that were introduced are very destructive to the story. There are things I liked about the film, and it certainly wasn't boring or anything. In the end, I just left it feeling kind of empty and unsatisfied...
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Postby Psallite » Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:57 am

Maybe I'll have to watch it once again, but instead of many of the posts here, I enjoyed this movie as much as I enjoyed the predecessors. It took a real different way and although it left aspects of the transition between 2.22 and 3.0 unexplained (and some other things), it has THAT thing only Eva can bring us. Mysteries, shocking images, psychological and life issues etc.

And about those things that may raped some minds: HELL YEAH! This is Evangelion for me! If not answered in the final movie (they probably won't be), I don't mind seeking for them myself - I've done this with the entire series til now. I just wanna see more and more of Eva for many years!

My opinion about 3.0: a real kick-ass movie that I'll watch a couple of times for now on!

Edited for spoiler. Be more careful in future.

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Postby Marc012 » Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:50 pm

I saw 3.0 two days ago and after thinking about it i have to say it's a very grade movie if the challenge was to confuse me
a bit few information...

Edited for spoiler -- PLEASE be more careful in future
SPOILER: Show
Angel attack in orbit, timeskip, no NERV anymore, Forth Impact?, happy end?
...maybe I have to watch it again^^ (maybe i hoped for too much after the trailers an the prevew at the end of 2.0)
it was a camripp so i can't say much about the Visual quality i assume it's vety nice like 1.0 and 2.0)

but one question

SPOILER: Show
During the fight against the first angel in 3.0 (also shown in these 6 min prevew) Asuka said: "Do somthing, idiot Shinji"
my question is why was Shinji in this cube in orbit? i thougt he was in Unit 01 and became LCL after the fight against Zeruel. If it was Unit 01 in this Cube why was it in space and why was he able to activate Unit 01 in this spcial moment and not during the 14 year timeskit? before that, i think, they were not able to restore him except they haven't tried it...
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Postby SerenityMan » Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:15 pm

I loved the film. I found it to be a perfect mix of old and new. I can't wait until any possible screenings in my area, and I can't wait for the Blu-Ray release.

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Postby MarioAyanami128 » Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:09 pm

I am trully amazed at the general reaction to this film. I didn't watch it yet, but I can't imagine how a film directed by Hideaki Anno can fail in some points. From what I've seen, the visuals and the soundtrack is phenomenal, with the ongoing presence of the Fairy Fountain Theme from "The Legend of Zelda". I hope that most things that people wrote can be debunked by my first experience with 3.0.
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Postby Mr. Tines » Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:28 pm

It's hard to speak of what about the film caused that disappointment without getting into spoiler territory.
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Postby Legendary » Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:12 pm

I think my least favorite part was the relative screen time each character got. Some deserved more, others less. That's not particularly spoilerly, I expect.

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Postby katanaswordfish » Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:57 am

View Original PostMarioAyanami128 wrote:I didn't watch it yet, but I can't imagine how a film directed by Hideaki Anno can fail in some points. From what I've seen, the visuals and the soundtrack is phenomenal...


I can certainly agree that the soundtrack is phenomenal. The visuals, in my opinion, are a strange and glaring mix of absolutely stunning and terrible. I think a lot of the contrast in the visuals (or at least my subjective perception of them) is due to the difficult balancing act of combining 2D and 3D animation.

I think that the 2D animators who worked on this movie (like Anno, Imaishi, Nisho, Hiramatsu, Honda, Sushio, etc.) are some of the best 2D animators out there, period. I think that the 3D animation staff is both less experienced and less well directed, but I think that awesome scenes like the pre-title scenes of both 2.0 and 3.0 show us that some of the 3D animators are great and are probably only going to get better as time goes on. Of course, there is an inherent challenge in the combination (compositing) of 2D + 3D animation.

Anyone out their with limited animation experience will know that 2D and 3D animation are drastically different. Frankly, they're as different as stop-motion and 2D are. With 2D animation, everything is 'faked' by the animators and exists within the context of the camera (frame). Each frame is a new start and can be totally independent of the last, if desired. With 3D, the process is very different and requires modelling, rigging, shader materials, scene lighting, and finally animation. Often these processes are done by different people, unlike the Japanese style of 2D animation. They follow different 'rules' and, as such, it's very difficult to have a coherent mix of 2D and 3DCG that doesn't stick out like a sore thumb and hurt take away from the consistency of the image. I would say 'immersion' but that term kind of annoys me... To be fair, Khara and Production IG (specifically Ghost in the Shell: SAC) have been able to find ways of mixing 2D and 3D better than anyone else.

Like Tines said, it's hard to speak about what bothers me without going into spoilers. Most of the issues have to do with specific elements of the plot and continuity with the previous rebuild films. It's more of a narrative issue than a shot-by-shot direction issue. My disappointment (so far) with 3.0 came as a huge surprise to me, considering I'm a huge fan of both Anno and Tsurumaki's other works. That being said, if I ignore the narrative issues that I consider to be 'bad writing', there are significant chunks of the movie that I like (including the pre-title scene and a large chunk of the middle of the film). That's about all I can say. I hope my opinion changes over time. I know that it will only get better from here once I get to see the animation in non-shitty-camrip-quality.

Legendary wrote:I think my least favorite part was the relative screen time each character got. Some deserved more, others less.


That is certainly a thought/feeling that I had. I'm one of those people who both likes and empathizes with Shinji as a character, and I liked most of his development in the film. One of my favorite characters didn't appear in the film at all, which is weird because I considered the role to be a very valuable one in both the series and rebuild. Many of the other characters were just there to play a very flat role and didn't do much for the plot.

One of my biggest concerns is that the world in which 3.0 exists sounds like a really compelling one. When I consider what happened at the very end of 2.0, and think about what must have happened immediately after that, I feel like I'm left completely unfulfilled by 3.0. Ever since the film came out in Japan I've been reading about how drastically different everything is and how the 'world' of the rebuild films was altered by the events in 2.0. As an Eva fan, I didn't want or expect everything to be clearly laid out in front of me with typical 'shonen anime' exposition, but I did want to know what the real implications of the events in 2.0 were. I feel that, in 3.0, we're simply told what the implications of those events were and they aren't really shown them in a significant way. After watching 3.0, I simply heard that a ton of really interesting things happened, but I have no idea how/when/why or by what means they happened. It would be like if End of Evangelion just told us about the assault of Nerv HQ and the Asuka fight scene but didn't show it to us.

[elaboration with some vague spoilers:]
SPOILER: Show
In many ways, it sounds to me like that events that happened between 2.0 and 3.0 (the immediate aftermath of N3I, whatever Shinji may have experienced over that long period of time inside the core of Unit 01, the creation of Wille and Wunder, the pain and suffering that everyone else went through, why anyone would rationally blame it on Shinji, whatever the hell everyone else was doing during that time, etc.). It feels to me like the rationale for the time period of 3.0 has little to do with the main point of the story, and has more to do with logistics of having the Wunder, Wille, new costumes, and people like Sakura. That's the only way that I can understand that choice. I think that it was a bad one in terms of narrative and in terms of direction. And that's one of the big aspects of the plot that disappoints me. Along with the 'curse of eva', the lack of explanation for the 'N-Series', the almost ridiculous number of evas, the lack of elaboration on the infrastructure/politics/status of the world, etc. - Oh and while I'm at it, the white helix under the Wunder is hideous and the fight scene involving the Wunder was ridiculous, needless, and (worst of all) poorly animated... /nerdrage
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Postby Brainman » Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:35 am

Hey all,

I've been holding off posting my impressions here until I had seen the camrip at least (I read the spoilers at day 1 and beyond). The logic being that maybe I just had to actually see it. Maybe that would help...

My feelings about 3.0 are pretty much discussed verbatim by a lot of earlier posts so I'll be brief. I'll preface by saying that I really admire Anno for not taking a wimpy approach and really going for the jugular here. He reeeeeeeally went out on a limb here, and with such a big McDonalds-esque cartoon robot franchise I'm glad he went bold with it instead of phoning it in.

That said, after finally seeing it, I'm haunted by the immortal words of George Lucas himself, "I think I may have gone too far in a few places..."

There's a line, and Anno has done a lot to push that line in the past. Here I think it got blatantly crossed. Meaning that threshold between brilliant and 'too much' was broken. Again, while I think it was an admirable attempt, from a technical standpoint this movie just seems like a bunch of gobbledygook. Beyond sitting down and doing a Prometheus Questions review on all the missing or vague plot elements, there's really not much for me to say about it.

I've read some people compare this confusion with previous incarnations of Eva, but I feel like this is different. This seems more artificial. There's a difference between creating a sense of mystery and simply withholding information. When you have a scene where there's a bunch of people yaking and you as the audience are left completely out of the loop, it's disorienting in the wrong way. Eva has always been a character driven story, and when you have most of the characters behaving in baffling or unrelatable ways it just doesn't work. In old NGE, the was always different perspectives between different characters. No matter who you were, there would be at least one character you could relate to. But in 3.0 there's really not much to work with.

I know some people argue that this was intentional on the creator's part. I mean, yeah I know, it had to be. But the cost of the decision is the loss of a huge part of what made the original so successful.

So yeah, nice try. Gold star for effort. Here's your 'Participant' trophy. Ya did your best. We're still going to Pizza Hut after the game.



-
What kind of flips my lid regarding the fanbase is how much Rebuild still being discussed character-wise. Asuka this, Kawrou that, what's with Misato, etc etc. I mean it feels like endlessly talking about the jar of jellybeans after it's rolled off the desk and shattered on the floor into a million colorful but messy pieces. Just pick it up and throw it in the garbage. Seems totally pointless now. I have no desire for it.

The pooch is screwed, the shark is jumped, the milk is spilled. Just mop it up and go home already.
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Postby Reichu » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:16 am

View Original PostBrainman wrote:What kind of flips my lid regarding the fanbase is how much Rebuild still being discussed character-wise. (...) Seems totally pointless now. I have no desire for it.

Well, YMMV, and all.

While so many others were celebrating 2.0 and its ending, I was busy being disturbed and unsettled by it and feeling in my gut that not all was right. And now, again, my reaction is different from the norm. I've greeted 3.0 with open arms, and it has restored my faith in Anno and convinced me that he has something to say with these films after all. Prior to this, I was not really invested in NME for its own sake, but simply on account of its ties to a series I actually did like.

So, while Anno pissed a lot of people off, he got me to care again. Maybe I happened to be in just the right mental state to take all of this in stride and appreciate it for what it is. I'm guessing that 3.0 will be an acquired taste for a lot of fans. But, of course, some will never like it.
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Postby Brainman » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:29 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:While so many others were celebrating 2.0 and its ending, I was busy being disturbed and unsettled by it and feeling in my gut that not all was right.


Well, Anno throwing 2.0 back in the fans faces is what I liked about it (everyone had that coming). I kind of had that feeling when I first saw it. It was the "oh thank god" reaction I had when I realized that he hadn't lost his mind in the previous movie.

I just wish the rest of the movie was competent. It's not the message, it's the delivery. It kind of felt more like an "anything goes" animated experimental film than an actual blockbuster cartoon robot movie. Like, I've even heard people try to call this movie 'fun action movie status' but it's not really. It's still a little too far up it's own ass to qualify for that.
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Postby SerenityMan » Wed Jan 16, 2013 2:39 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:Well, YMMV, and all.

While so many others were celebrating 2.0 and its ending, I was busy being disturbed and unsettled by it and feeling in my gut that not all was right. And now, again, my reaction is different from the norm. I've greeted 3.0 with open arms, and it has restored my faith in Anno and convinced me that he has something to say with these films after all. Prior to this, I was not really invested in NME for its own sake, but simply on account of its ties to a series I actually did like.

So, while Anno pissed a lot of people off, he got me to care again. Maybe I happened to be in just the right mental state to take all of this in stride and appreciate it for what it is. I'm guessing that 3.0 will be an acquired taste for a lot of fans. But, of course, some will never like it.



I agree with this 100%.


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