Shinji's portrayal in Eva 2.0/2.22

Discussion of the new series of Evangelion movies ( "Evangelion Shin Gekijōban", meaning "Evangelion: New Theatrical Edition").
The third installment debuted in Japan on November 17, 2012.

Moderators: New Moderators, Board Staff

apocrypha
Embryo
Age: 58
Posts: 8
Joined: Dec 15, 2010
Gender: Male

Shinji in Rebuild: better or worse than in NGE

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby apocrypha » Tue Apr 19, 2011 12:05 am

[LordEvan88 said
Haven't you ever said something you don't mean? Like yelling 'I hate you' at a parent. You say it in a particular context when you are agitated and they have hurt you, but in retrospect you didn't mean it.
]

I brought that up in an earlier post, but many people insist on taking Shinji's statement as a literal and knowing condemnation of the world. Do you really think that Shinji would condemn Asuka and Misato without a care? I don't.[/quote]
Just Seeing Your Rainy Little Face Makes Me Roll My Eyes and Sigh

MegucaMagica
Embryo
User avatar
Age: 28
Posts: 19
Joined: Apr 22, 2011
Location: Canada
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby MegucaMagica » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:40 am

I found Shinji to be more likable in the Rebuild. He mans up at the end of 2.0 and puts on his i am not ok face and saves Rei. He decided to pilot the Eva for himself and not for anyone else. Also he can cook making him not useless.

Seele00TextOnly
Phospholipid Bilayer
Phospholipid Bilayer
User avatar
Age: 40
Posts: 1806
Joined: Sep 23, 2007
Location: Wilmington, NC
Gender: Female

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Seele00TextOnly » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:47 am

View Original PostMegucaMagica wrote:He mans up at the end of 2.0 and puts on his i am not ok face and saves Rei.

He did the exact same thing throughout most of the entire series, most similarly to 2.0 in episode 19.
He decided to pilot the Eva for himself and not for anyone else.

That didn't happen; not in the movie, and not in the show. He was piloting at the end of the movie to defeat the Angel / retrieve Rei. Not for himself; for others / people he cared about, which was the same as episode 19.
Also he can cook making him not useless.

He did this exact same thing throughout the entire run of the TV show.
Check out my AMVs: Kaji/Misato in "18 Apostolos" & Kaworu and the Harpies in "The Beast That Shouted 'I' at the Heart of the World" w/ music by Esselfortium!!
Shinji embraces the otaku empowerment fantasy and dives headfirst into his mother's basement. -Chrad
Acts of man are better than acts of god. -Misato

MegucaMagica
Embryo
User avatar
Age: 28
Posts: 19
Joined: Apr 22, 2011
Location: Canada
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby MegucaMagica » Sun Apr 24, 2011 2:45 pm

View Original PostSeele00TextOnly wrote:He did the exact same thing throughout most of the entire series, most similarly to 2.0 in episode 19.

That didn't happen; not in the movie, and not in the show. He was piloting at the end of the movie to defeat the Angel / retrieve Rei. Not for himself; for others / people he cared about, which was the same as episode 19.



I don't know, for me at least it was more noticeable in the rebuild. It was Misato that said she wanted Shinji to pilot the Eva for himself; his own desire to protect. Yeah Shinji didn't realize it, at least not yet in the rebuild. And plus I haven't watched EvaTv for along time so my memory is kind of bad.

The Dreaming Tree
Embryo
Age: 32
Posts: 2
Joined: May 24, 2011
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
Gender: Male

Give Ayanami Back!

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby The Dreaming Tree » Tue May 24, 2011 4:50 am

Did that give anyone else shivers? After decades of little-boy Ikari, this was certainly unexpected...

As an American fan, I much prefer Spike's dub of this line. But, preference is just that.
Last edited by The Dreaming Tree on Tue May 24, 2011 5:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

evafanatic
Adam
User avatar
Age: 27
Posts: 51
Joined: Jan 13, 2011
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby evafanatic » Tue May 24, 2011 5:07 am

Yea, had shivers running down my spine the first time I viewed it as well; it was pretty unexpected and epic to say the least.

Hatsumi92
Shamshel
Shamshel
User avatar
Posts: 299
Joined: Nov 13, 2009
Gender: Female

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Hatsumi92 » Tue May 24, 2011 8:11 am

I really love the dub, but there was one bit in that scene which made me laugh a little.

When Shinji shouted "Rei, COME ON!" aside from just "Ayanami!"

I don't know, just something about it is so funny. Like he's saying "Come on Rei, at least try to help me help you! You're just fucking with me now."


Edit: Oh wait you're talking about the awakening scene where as I'm talking about the part where Shinji is reaching for her.

FreakyFilmFan4ever
(In)Sufficient Director
(In)Sufficient Director
User avatar
Age: 32
Posts: 8342
Joined: Jun 09, 2009
Location: Playing amongst the stars
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Tue May 24, 2011 8:24 am

I saw those red eyes and was thoroughly freaked out. I was not expecting that at all. Then the rest of it made me burst uncontrollably into tears. It was scary, and awesome, and touching, and tragic, all at the same time.

God, I'm envious of Anno's story-telling capabilities....

The Eva Monkey
Administrator
Administrator
User avatar
Posts: 9010
Joined: Jun 14, 2004
Location: The Evanets.
Gender: Male
Contact:

Re: Give Ayanami Back!

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby The Eva Monkey » Tue May 24, 2011 9:10 am

View Original PostThe Dreaming Tree wrote:Did that give anyone else shivers? After decades of little-boy Ikari, this was certainly unexpected...

As an American fan, I much prefer Spike's dub of this line. But, preference is just that.

I really liked that moment. But only Ogata's performance, not Spencer's.
Webmaster, EvaMonkey.com; Co-founder, EvaGeeks.org; Moderator, r/evangelion.

Follow me on Social Media! [YouTube] [Twitter] [Facebook] [Tumblr] [Twitch]

Kendrix
Defender of Puppy Boy
Defender of Puppy Boy
User avatar
Age: 26
Posts: 5088
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Location: Germany
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Kendrix » Tue May 24, 2011 9:40 am

Methinks Spencer was as good as anyone who isn't Ogata could have been, I mean, he's anything but half assed with the screams and makes it sound like there's some raw emotion in there...

And yeah, that final scene, or heck, actually all of the final showdown was epic win/teh art. It left me completely gaping in awe...

Firstly, it's unexpected since you expected Rei to kick the bucket/it looked as if she already HAD kicked it... Then, you know that it is way more of an effort for Shinji to do something like that than it is for your random shoneb hero, since he had to overcome his own limitations... You've seen these characters fail and suffer before, so seing them like that is quite the catharsis.

The most hearwarming is the "You're the only you there is!" line, tough.
That's about the nicest thing one could possibly say to someone who angsts about being replacable/ not real etc. Of course, Shinji doesn't know why exactly she has these troubles, but imagine what it must mean to Rei... also, in this big world with billions of people on it, who doesn't feel happy when someone tells them they're unique?

Mostly that image of him pulling Rei out/hugging her, with both of them being little more than silhouettes of light floeating in the middle of nowhere, They both look like... Gods or something, in a void, looking towards an uncertain future after a long roead of suffering, but, to quote Shinji, "It's fine like this" because they have each other...
It has something epic, soul-touching about it. (Which is probably why it spawned such masses of fanart)
Also, would you ever have expected Shinji to actively hug someone this close? I think the only time he's EVER been hugged since the age of four is in episode 16, and that wasn't in Rebuild anyway. He's always very uncertain/shy about human contact, and that extends to phisical aspects of it... You can get large reactions out of him just by as much as touching his hand, he doesn't really know touch and how to deal with/enjoy it...
And yet here, he's completely at ease here, with his arms tightly wrapped around someone and most of their upper torsos touching...
(Cue obligatory Boobie joke)

It's just one big catharsis.
Make Clone Love Not Clone War

Tarnsman
Faustian Iodide
Faustian Iodide
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 1190
Joined: Apr 28, 2011
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Tarnsman » Tue May 24, 2011 10:37 am

I didn't like either Spencer or Ogata's performance. :tongue:

Shinji going God mode at the end of 2.xx didn't do it for me, especially since it was just, "power off -> God mode,". In the original, him struggling and begging the Eva to work really added emotion to the scene. In Rebuild he just decides, "Oh power is out, I want Ayanami back, so too bad."
"You, sir, are the very heart of the rot that has corrupted humanity from the very beginning!" - tehprognoob
"I know that "chan" is Japanese for something like Mr. or something like that" - TSDA
"If I wanted porn without emotional damage, I'd watch Rebuild." - Azathoth
"because Evangelion and Pokemon are the same show when you really get down to it" - esselfortium
"i obviously have low standards, i liked Eva." - Seele00TextOnly

FreakyFilmFan4ever
(In)Sufficient Director
(In)Sufficient Director
User avatar
Age: 32
Posts: 8342
Joined: Jun 09, 2009
Location: Playing amongst the stars
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby FreakyFilmFan4ever » Tue May 24, 2011 10:45 am

View Original PostTarnsman wrote:I didn't like either Spencer or Ogata's performance. :tongue:

Shinji going God mode at the end of 2.xx didn't do it for me, especially since it was just, "power off -> God mode,". In the original, him struggling and begging the Eva to work really added emotion to the scene. In Rebuild he just decides, "Oh power is out, I want Ayanami back, so too bad."

First, performance =/= story-telling. It's just a vehicle used for story-telling, but isn't story-telling in it of itself.

Second, I think Shinji's red-eyes may have had something to do with the whole "God Mode" thing, it just hasn't been explained yet. And to be fair, it holds as much scientific validity as Shinji's begging and pleading in NGE. So......

But emotionally, they set out to accomplish two different things. NGE sets up Shinji's mom taking over again, while NME suggests that Shinji may have been taking the initiative for the first time, which drastically contrasts from the "Dummy System" scene that was Asuka's undoing earlier in the film. Not that the Dummy System is no longer available, the gloves are off so Shinji and Yui can go balls out this time around.

Someone
Sandalphon
Sandalphon
User avatar
Age: 25
Posts: 512
Joined: Apr 29, 2011
Location: Survivor Colony Somewhere
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Someone » Tue May 24, 2011 10:52 am

First time Shinji actually showed some backspine if you ask me.

Tarnsman
Faustian Iodide
Faustian Iodide
User avatar
Age: 33
Posts: 1190
Joined: Apr 28, 2011
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Gender: Male

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Tarnsman » Tue May 24, 2011 11:02 am

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:First, performance =/= story-telling. It's just a vehicle used for story-telling, but isn't story-telling in it of itself.


No crap. I was simply following in the footsteps everyone starting their post with a comment about the dub. :grin:

View Original PostFreakyFilmFan4ever wrote:Second, I think Shinji's red-eyes may have had something to do with the whole "God Mode" thing, it just hasn't been explained yet. And to be fair, it holds as much scientific validity as Shinji's begging and pleading in NGE. So......

But emotionally, they set out to accomplish two different things. NGE sets up Shinji's mom taking over again, while NME suggests that Shinji may have been taking the initiative for the first time, which drastically contrasts from the "Dummy System" scene that was Asuka's undoing earlier in the film. Not that the Dummy System is no longer available, the gloves are off so Shinji and Yui can go balls out this time around.


Yet again, no crap. None of that makes me enjoy it any more. I understood the point of the scene, I just didn't like it. Shinji being helpless and having to rely on others (his mom) in the TV series had a larger emotional impact on me. He had the will, but not the means to accomplish what he wanted. In Rebuild he's just yet another mecha protagonist going God mode to save his friend/love interest/mom/MacGuffin. Whoopty-do.

Yes, the scene was visually pleasing to watch and had a "fuck yeah" vibe, but it didn't have any emotional impact on me. I didn't cry, I didn't feel shivers, I simply felt like I have for everything in Rebuild. It's fun to watch and that's it.

I got everything I wanted emotionally out of NGE TV + EoE, Rebuild is visual porn for me and that's it. The context of the scene and the intent of the change does nothing to make it have a stronger impact on me.
"You, sir, are the very heart of the rot that has corrupted humanity from the very beginning!" - tehprognoob
"I know that "chan" is Japanese for something like Mr. or something like that" - TSDA
"If I wanted porn without emotional damage, I'd watch Rebuild." - Azathoth
"because Evangelion and Pokemon are the same show when you really get down to it" - esselfortium
"i obviously have low standards, i liked Eva." - Seele00TextOnly

Kendrix
Defender of Puppy Boy
Defender of Puppy Boy
User avatar
Age: 26
Posts: 5088
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Location: Germany
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Kendrix » Tue May 24, 2011 11:09 am

The begging and pleading worked fine for a survival battle, but simply wouldn't cut it for a rescue mission... also, it's meant to be "OGM suddenly a new thing out of the blue! with nothing to fereshadow it. "

I tthe new version is just as emotionally intense given the slightly different context, because he simply goes "I demand stuff"

---

Still, saying this is the only cool think Shinji has ever done isn't quite fair, he has his moments. *pats him*
Make Clone Love Not Clone War

Warren Peace
Lilin
Lilin
User avatar
Age: 89
Posts: 1737
Joined: May 28, 2010

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Warren Peace » Tue May 24, 2011 12:05 pm

View Original PostTarnsman wrote:Shinji going God mode at the end of 2.xx didn't do it for me, especially since it was just, "power off -> God mode,". In the original, him struggling and begging the Eva to work really added emotion to the scene. In Rebuild he just decides, "Oh power is out, I want Ayanami back, so too bad."


I'm not sure where you're getting that. Shinji doesn't say "too bad", he just immediately goes into God Mode, that's all. Cutting the struggle to reactivate the Eva was a good deletion, considering what follows. Shinji's screaming torment to reclaim Rei is enough.

Also, the end of 2.0 and it's corresponding scene in the series isn't really that different, as far as Shinji goes. They make the exact same point. In NGE, Shinji "cuts the cord" and gains an infinite source of internal power. The Eva's armor, which were really "restraints", is cast off. The stuff with Rei is of course exclusive to Rebuild, but both scenes represent Shinji gaining some backbone and standing up for himself.

SpacemanSchmuck
Embryo
User avatar
Age: 38
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 22, 2009
Location: Portland, ME
Gender: Male
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby SpacemanSchmuck » Tue May 24, 2011 12:11 pm

yes. it was awesome. Words can't describe my feelings at that moment.
"This time, I will definitely make you happy."
---
Yes, I have watched Evangelion, the series and all four movies, at least thirty times in the past ten years. Some of it much more than that.

I just want to say I'm not very active in this forum because I get WAY too passionate about Eva and my opinions and theories and I know it, and I don't want to get carried away and start flamewars. It's (not) what I really want to do. ha ;)
http://www.recklessillumination.org

Reichu
Space-Time Teratoma
Space-Time Teratoma
User avatar
Posts: 23618
Joined: Aug 21, 2004
Location: Watching the world burn
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Reichu » Tue May 24, 2011 1:47 pm

The 2.XX finale works on me mostly on a "holy shit, that's creepy" level. The schmaltz doesn't penetrate; Shinji's moaning and grunting is more annoying than anything else. I'm utterly overwhelmed by the visceral wrongness of the underlying situation. The feeling is comparable to the reworked version of Armisael's defeat and certain parts of EoE, with all these weird body horror and reproductive/erotic interactions and transfigurations unfolding before my eyes in accordance with a logic that's dream-like at best.

So I have to at least give Anno & Co. credit for making me profoundly and ambiguously uncomfortable. But I can't pump my first and bellow "Fuck yeah" here the same way I can for Yui's liberation back in 19. There is something comforting to me about the straightforward savagery of that moment.
Last edited by Reichu on Tue May 24, 2011 1:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Kendrix
Defender of Puppy Boy
Defender of Puppy Boy
User avatar
Age: 26
Posts: 5088
Joined: Jul 27, 2010
Location: Germany
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Kendrix » Tue May 24, 2011 1:51 pm

Actually, Rei was conveniently blowing up in the backgroung in NGE while Shinji watches from Kaji's melon patch and probably indirectly helping the issue...
Re!Zeruel's mistake was to eat her instead of just immobilizing EVA 00.
Then again, one might say that it was Rebuild's fancy self-destruct system that was to blame/made the nomming of Zerogoki necessary...

But honestly, Zeruel was screwed either way, wasn't he? neither of his fates were particulary enjoyable. What did we learn? Yes, hands off Asuka, Misato, Mari and/or Rei. Especially Rei.
Make Clone Love Not Clone War

Reichu
Space-Time Teratoma
Space-Time Teratoma
User avatar
Posts: 23618
Joined: Aug 21, 2004
Location: Watching the world burn
Gender: Female
Contact:

  •      
  •      
  • Quote

Postby Reichu » Tue May 24, 2011 1:58 pm

Kendrix: Who are you replying to? (A lot of your posts have this problem, incidentally.)


Return to “Rebuild of Evangelion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests