[MANGA] Evangelion Volume 12

For talking about everything else Evangelion: from the various manga and video games to merchandising and video/audio releases.

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Postby Carl Horn » Fri Feb 18, 2011 5:47 pm

It might have been interesting to alter more than he did the "tactical events" of EoE (i.e., make the details of the basic narrative different, the way the Rebuild movies are doing vis-a-vis the original TV show), but I don't think that interests Sadamoto the way it does other members of the Eva team. I thought Sadamoto's outstanding creative contribution was Gendo's little father-son chat with Shinji. This was honest-to-God character development for a guy who seemed almost satirically laconic in 2.0 (his dinner with Rei: "Haa...haa...haa..."), just as Sadamoto expanded Kaworu's personality (and in a risky direction--I imagine Sadamoto doing standup a la Eddie Murphy: "I remember I drew Kaworu in a manga once...and otaku...lost their motherfucking minds") I couldn't help but wish that Gendo had this same confrontation with him in the anime.

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Postby Eva 02 » Fri Feb 18, 2011 5:55 pm

^ Yes, it did provide a slight sense of closure seeing what Gendou did, aye?
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Postby Killer Bee » Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:14 pm

View Original PostCarl Horn wrote:I thought Sadamoto's outstanding creative contribution was Gendo's little father-son chat with Shinji.

I couldn't help but wish that Gendo had this same confrontation with him in the anime.

Do you mean the scene in volume 12? I thought it came off as rather forced, narratively speaking. The biggest difference between Anno's cast and Sadamoto's is the level of subtlety in their dialogue and actions, I think. Sadamoto's characters are more open and you get a better sense of their motivations, while Anno's characters leave things ambiguous on the surface and require a little digging to get to the bottom of. They both have their strong points, I suppose; Sadamoto's characterization is easier to understand and sympathize with, but Anno's seem somehow more real.

View Original PostEva 02 wrote:...putting off the parts that he's going to have to think long & hard about adapting.


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Postby Carl Horn » Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:58 pm

View Original PostKiller Bee wrote:Do you mean the scene in volume 12? I thought it came off as rather forced, narratively speaking. The biggest difference between Anno's cast and Sadamoto's is the level of subtlety in their dialogue and actions, I think. Sadamoto's characters are more open and you get a better sense of their motivations, while Anno's characters leave things ambiguous on the surface and require a little digging to get to the bottom of. They both have their strong points, I suppose; Sadamoto's characterization is easier to understand and sympathize with, but Anno's seem somehow more real.



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Sadamoto has spoken before about the difference between his expression of the characters and Anno's. But I think the equation has also changed somewhat with the Rebuild films, in that Sadamoto is now, arguably, closer to the original Evangelion than Anno is. That isn't a value judgement, but a suggestion that whereas Anno is currently seeking to remake the story with a rearranged and altered narrative, and with new and alternate characters, Sadamoto is attempting an alternate interpretation of the original narrative and characters, and possibly with an alternate conclusion as well (the "long and hard" task ^_^).

I didn't see Gendo's remarks as forced, but being in Sadamoto's tradition of greater character "openness," as we also see in his versions of Kaji, Kaworu, and Shinji, all of whom are more direct about their feelings than they are in the anime. Again, this is a different approach, not necessarily a better or worse one. An interesting thing about what Gendo says to Shinji is that it doesn't improve their relationship one bit; it actually makes it colder and more terrifying that he's willing to say what he does. I wonder if this version of Gendo could possibly have the same last words as he did in EoE.

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Postby Reichu » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:47 am

View Original PostCarl Horn wrote:I couldn't help but wish that Gendo had this same confrontation with him in the anime.

I'm glad he didn't. The Sadamoto scene really wrings a lot of Alternate Character Interpretation straight out of the sponge.
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Postby esselfortium » Sat Feb 19, 2011 4:09 am

View Original PostReichu wrote:I'm glad he didn't. The Sadamoto scene really wrings a lot of Alternate Character Interpretation straight out of the sponge.

That's part of why it's such a great scene :3

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Postby Dark doom » Sat Feb 19, 2011 7:28 am

WATERSTONES HAVE IT BITCHES!!! :w00:
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And then we come to the merchandising... facepalm- Mr. Tines
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Postby Mr. Tines » Sat Feb 19, 2011 8:45 am

My copy arrived, along with Bokurano vol 3, from Amazon today. So now nothing seems to have shown in the way of new stages yet, I guess we have a 3-4 year wait in store for vol 13.
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Postby IrkenEvangelion » Sat Feb 19, 2011 12:00 pm

Just got mine an hour ago. Finished it... This volume makes me like Shinji again. Yes he still whined at the beginning but he stepped up at the end there.

SPOILER: Show
The alternate scenes were great, they added a lot more to the characters I think. I thought it was cool to see how Misato took everyone out instead of just blowing up.

I also loved how it ended, giving Asuka a ray of hope to her survival. Although Yui busting out could have been to just save Shinji from the JSSDF there, and she will refuse to save Asuka in volume 13... I thought the insight into her dream was nice as well.
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Postby gwern » Mon Feb 21, 2011 12:24 am

Looks like the extra materials got reused for the Shinji Ikari Raising Project vol 7 release; http://www.activeanime.com/html/content/view/7373/36/ says

This manga is not just a substitute for the original manga, which is still incomplete, but is a solidly entertaining look at the EVAverse in its own right. It does have its share of fan service high-jinks, with some nudity among characters being seen, but this is to be almost expected from a manga that is rate 16+. The notes by Carl Horn at the end of the volume, this time featuring an appearance by Yuko Miyamura and Tiffany Grant- the voices of Asuka from the anime series- are fine additions to the story itself, adding insight to the narrative and fan input into the world of EVANGELION.


(Which you have to admit sounds uncannily like everyone's descriptions of the Sadamoto manga bonus material.)

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Postby Sun Stealer » Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:15 am

Sadamoto flanderized Gendo something awful.
SPOILER: Show
Gendo's speech started out great and really showed you how dead he was inside and completely blind to everything but his mission to become as God, but then it turns into "I was jealous Yui showed you attention". The f**k?

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Postby Carl Horn » Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:38 pm

View Original PostSun Stealer wrote:Sadamoto flanderized Gendo something awful.
SPOILER: Show
Gendo's speech started out great and really showed you how dead he was inside and completely blind to everything but his mission to become as God, but then it turns into "I was jealous Yui showed you attention". The f**k?


I apologize, but his speech went in the opposite direction than what you say:
SPOILER: Show
first (on p. 41) he said he envied Shinji for taking Yui's love, and then afterwards on p. 42-45, he explained why he cursed God for what had happened, and wanted to avenge himself against him.
Is it possible you got a copy whose pages were assembled out of order? I'm not being facetious; that does sometimes happen, due to the way book binding works.

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Postby visionfactory » Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:07 am

Hello, Can somebody tell me where to read the new manga stage please?

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Postby Reichu » Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:12 am

View Original Postvisionfactory wrote:Hello, Can somebody tell me where to read the new manga stage please?

That's against our rules. If you're going to read it online, you have to find a source on your own.
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Postby gatotsu911 » Mon Mar 14, 2011 1:45 am

Leafed through this at a bookstore today. I found the segment at the end interesting. I was particularly surprised and intrigued to read Miyamura's bit about how she had kind of come to resent Asuka until she met Grant. That was definitely unexpected.

As for the manga itself... well. It is interesting to me, in that it strikes me as demonstrating the difference in the same story as told by a "normal" writer (Sadamoto) versus a bona fide genius (Anno).
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Postby esselfortium » Mon Mar 14, 2011 2:27 am

View Original Postgatotsu911 wrote:Leafed through this at a bookstore today. I found the segment at the end interesting. I was particularly surprised and intrigued to read Miyamura's bit about how she had kind of come to resent Asuka until she met Grant. That was definitely unexpected.

Really? Do you remember any more detail about what she said? That's pretty interesting.

As for the manga itself... well. It is interesting to me, in that it strikes me as demonstrating the difference in the same story as told by a "normal" writer (Sadamoto) versus a bona fide genius (Anno).

I'm just going to stay far, far away from this one.

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Postby C.A.P. » Mon Mar 14, 2011 8:44 pm

View Original Postesselfortium wrote:Really? Do you remember any more detail about what she said? That's pretty interesting.


Yes, do tell. Maybe we finally found something positive for the existence the dub! :D
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Postby gatotsu911 » Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:03 pm

View Original PostC.A.P. wrote:Yes, do tell. Maybe we finally found something positive for the existence the dub! :D

Well, excuuuuuse me. I liked the dub, as many of my posts have probably made clear by now.

As I recall (and mayhap I don't recall so well), she said that she'd kind of gotten sick of Asuka both because she'd been tied to the character for so long and because the character harbored so many negative emotions; something like that. She said she felt that, as another actress who had played the character, Grant was "the only one who could understand" what it felt like, and that Grant's love and enthusiasm for the character revitalized her own; since then she's come to see Asuka more like a daughter than like a part of herself she disliked.
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Postby Guyver Spawn » Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:16 pm

Wow I did not know that Vol. 12 was out for a while now. I need to pick it up soon, too bad my copy of Vol. 9 never came from last year :angry:.
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