The known languages (besides Japanese) of the TV series release:

English: ADV Films, Madman Entertainment
French: Dybex
Spanish: Selecta Vision
Italian: Dynit (Dynamic Italia)
German: Universum Films, OVA Films, ACOG, Panini Video
Russian: MC Entertainment
Tagalog: ABS-CBN
Polish: ? (broadcasted by Hyper)
Portuguese: ?
Swedish: Enima AB
Chinese: Proware Multimedia International

There's a ton of German distributors, but I don't know how similar Dutch is to German, they sound pretty different to me. The last time I was in Holland, everyone spoke either Dutch or English.

Dutch =/= German, though they do share some cognates... at least I think they do.

But I was just noting that because Holland is pretty much surrounded by nations that have it distributed and on shelves.

Eva Yojimbo wrote:I think the point Killer Bee was trying to make is that if you become a passionate fan about something in the broad sense (literature, anime, etc.) then it behooves you to understand its history and the most important works and the most important artists. So if you really love anime then it should be enlightening to understand the evolution of the medium. In that respect, NGE was a watershed in the modern era. Perhaps no work in the last 20 years has had a comparable effect. Similarly, if you're interested in great literature then you're never going to understand it unless you understand how the medium was built from the ground up, and Shakespeare would certainly be an essential stop on one's journey.

But I still think Killer Bee's point holds that if you're a fan of anime "in general" then NGE should certainly be on the top of the short list of must-see animes from its era.

Thank you. Yes, that's what I was trying to say.

:( It's sad going to an Eva panel at conventions; I expect they'll get filled up, so I get there early. And then the room ends up being a bit barren instead.

So far I haven't run into any anime fans that haven't heard of EVA. Just a lot of fans who haven't seen it outside of AMVs.

At cons, EVA panels were starting to get stale until the rebuild when the fan-base got a lot of much needed revitalization.

Hell, when the perfect collection came out I thought that was amazing, cleaning up the scene transitions and overall clarity.

i liked that hamlet analogy. so i'm gonna hang on to that.

for the record, i've never read hamlet or even seen the play. it's not exactly required reading in schools in my country (cervantes is our shakespeare, lol), but the play is enough of a classic, and has become such an important part of general culture, that i know enough about it to recognize where it has influenced other works. i also know enough about it to recognize that i probably wouldn't like it-- it's just really not my thing, and as such i have no interest in reading/watching it.

but not knowing anything about hamlet? not even knowing it existed? it boggles my mind.

that's sort of the case, i feel, with EVA. not that EVA is exactly anime's hamlet, but the situation is somewhat similar. it's not that everybody has to like it. it's not even that everybody should have seen it. but not knowing anything about it... well, i guess it happens, but personally i just think it's sad.

carla wrote:i also know enough about it to recognize that i probably wouldn't like it-- it's just really not my thing, and as such i have no interest in reading/watching it.

You should at least give it a try once. It's basically all of the life-and-death stuff in NGE rolled up into a deceptively simple revenge drama. If you just want to try it once, rent/buy/see Brannagh's version (and forgive him his indulgences).

carla wrote:that's sort of the case, i feel, with EVA. not that EVA is exactly anime's hamlet, but the situation is somewhat similar. it's not that everybody has to like it. it's not even that everybody should have seen it. but not knowing anything about it... well, i guess it happens, but personally i just think it's sad.

The problem is that anime isn't respected like literature was. If animation had that same level of respect then people would know of NGE like people know of Hamlet. You can't put the cart before the horse.

i've actually considered renting brannagh's version. because it's kenneth brannagh. but somehow i never get around to it. it's not exactly widely available either-- one copy in blockbuster and i'd have to really dig around to find it. i don't know, maybe one of these days i'll give it a try.

Eva Yojimbo wrote:The problem is that anime isn't respected like literature was. If animation had that same level of respect then people would know of NGE like people know of Hamlet. You can't put the cart before the horse.

that's true, but i didn't really mean that in general; obviously, i'm not going to walk up to my grandmother and go: "YOU'VE NEVER HEARD OF EVANGELION, WTF WOMAN?!" but in niche groups, like anime communities and clubs, people there do respect the genre (or at least they should, otherwise what the hell are they even doing there?), and those are the kind of people who, for me, should at least have heard about EVA at some point.

Maybe if NO ONE watched Evangelion, we wouldn't have this problem in the first place.

carla wrote:i've actually considered renting brannagh's version. because it's kenneth brannagh.

I love Brannagh myself. He's probably the only modern Shakespeare interpreter that really brings his plays to life for a modern audience. It's a shame he's done so few. His Hamlet was an impressive production from every angle. It was one of the last movies ever shot in 70mm and probably the longest, and it's the only movie Hamlet to do the entire play.

carla wrote:but in niche groups, like anime communities and clubs, people there do respect the genre (or at least they should, otherwise what the hell are they even doing there?), and those are the kind of people who, for me, should at least have heard about EVA at some point.

A lot of anime fans are like a lot of movie fans in that they only care about it from an entertainment perspective and not an artistic/appreciative perspective. They only care about what new thing out there can impress them. Anything old is automatically dated, uninteresting, obsolete, etc. This attitude is pretty much applicable to superficial fans across all the arts. Harry Potter/Twilight fans probably don't care much about Cervantes and Homer and stuff.

Eva Yojimbo wrote:They only care about what new thing out there can impress them. Anything old is automatically dated, uninteresting, obsolete, etc. This attitude is pretty much applicable to superficial fans across all the arts. Harry Potter/Twilight fans probably don't care much about Cervantes and Homer and stuff.

agreed, completely. and i can understand it to a point, i mean it's not like i go out of my way to read/watch older stuff... only if the subject matter interests me.

but still, to go from not caring to never having heard of it is, i feel, too much of a stretch. any person who manages to go through life without ever hearing anything about hamlet, well, let's just say the urge to hit them with a baseball bat and/or permanently stop them from procreating is big. and any self-proclaimed anime fan who hasn't ever heard of EVA is... hm, at the very least it's very sad. not for EVA, but for that person, in my opinion.

Eva Yojimbo wrote:A lot of anime fans are like a lot of movie fans in that they only care about it from an entertainment perspective and not an artistic/appreciative perspective. They only care about what new thing out there can impress them. Anything old is automatically dated, uninteresting, obsolete, etc. This attitude is pretty much applicable to superficial fans across all the arts. Harry Potter/Twilight fans probably don't care much about Cervantes and Homer and stuff.

But I watch old anime all the time, and I don't feel artsy at all.

Finnish drinking culture somewhat stifles artistic feelings, from what /lit/ tells me.

A lot of old anime has significant art value.

the anime-watchers at my school that obsessively follow bleach and naruto and those other horrible animes haven't even heard of evangelion, but the people that don't seem like they'd watch anime/casual watchers have at least heard evangelion. in 4-5 hours at animazement i think i was the only one i spotted in any form of evangelion cosplay.

evaunit13 wrote:the anime-watchers at my school that obsessively follow bleach and naruto and those other horrible animes

Dude, Bleach is a huge troll at times, but Naruto IS good actually.

And to reply to the OP, i rarely come across someone that has not heard/watched Eva. Shit is like first chapter of bible for anime fans.

ran1 wrote:Finnish drinking culture somewhat stifles artistic feelings, from what /lit/ tells me.

Stifles? It has inspired most of Finnish artists, you know. So many respected authors are also known for their bad drinking habits.

Shit is like first chapter of bible for anime fans.

OHOHOHOHO I SEE WHAT U DID THAR ELL OH ELL.

Dr. Nick wrote: But I watch old anime all the time, and I don't feel artsy at all.

I guess he’s just saying that you respect the medium more than “superficial fans”.

Though in a medium like anime, I’m not sure how big a difference there is between a ‘superficial fan’ and a ‘hardcore fan’ that only watches new stuff. It’s not like a great deal of anime has much artistic worth to it to begin with, since it was only relatively recently that most of this artsy stuff started coming out. “Anime”-anime is moe and otaku-pandering with the occasional giant robot or SF plot (which seems to be disappearing lately?). It’s not like Tomino set out to sculpt an artistic masterpiece with Mobile Suit Gundam; he just wanted to make something entertaining. That mindset describes just about every anime title ever done.

not to mention that I’m unsure how to even define ‘art-anime’ to begin with

Oz wrote: So many respected authors are also known for their bad drinking habits.

not like it’s any different in English speaking countries

carla wrote:but still, to go from not caring to never having heard of it is, i feel, too much of a stretch.

True, though it probably depends on one's context too. I mean, Goethe is to Germany what Shakespeare is to the Western English speaking world, but I'd guess that there's quite a few people around the world who has never heard his name (perhaps they've heard of Faust, but Faust wasn't exclusively Goethe's). Since anime is only a rather niche sub-culture it's not surprising that none but the most massively popular series, usually those aimed at kids, have become mainstream names. So popularity and context does have a lot to do with it.

Dr. Nick wrote:But I watch old anime all the time, and I don't feel artsy at all.

Well, I don't think you have to feel arty to have an interest in a particular art-form. I guess I could replace artistic appreciation with simply being a connoisseur, or whatever word you want to substitute. I basically just mean what Merridian said.

Merridian wrote:Though in a medium like anime, I’m not sure how big a difference there is between a ‘superficial fan’ and a ‘hardcore fan’ that only watches new stuff.

Are there hardcore fans that ONLY watch new stuff? It seems to me you'd eventually run out of stuff to watch. I guess I'm thinking more like the difference between people who are willing to watch anime from eras and learn about its history, influences, movements, trends, etc. and those who simply watch what comes on Adult Swim and maybe some other popular titles they've heard about. I'm sure there's a middle ground, though.

the_seventh_child wrote:Dude, Bleach is a huge troll at times, but Naruto IS good actually.

you got it backwards.

no, i'm kidding. they can both be trolls at times IMO. personally, i like both bleach and naruto, actually. but that's kinda the point, that just because you like the newer stuff doesn't excuse you from being completely ignorant of the stuff that came before. or at least of those few series that were actually massively groundbreaking.

Eva Yojimbo wrote:True, though it probably depends on one's context too.

oh, definitely. i mean, from the PoV of an outsider to the western english-speaking world, i can tell you that shakespeare is a lot more universal than goethe is, precisely because of the influence the english-speaking world, particularly the USA, have had on the rest of the world. so that's why EVA isn't exactly like hamlet; i wouldn't expect every person who's never watched a single anime series to have heard of EVA. (although finding someone who hasn't heard of goethe either still kind of makes me want to itch for a baseball bat...)

but maybe EVA should be to anime enthusiasts like goethe is to germans.

what i mean is: maybe newbies to the genre may not have heard of it. sort of like i wouldn't necessarily expect a three-year-old german kid to know goethe or his work. but by the time that kid makes it to his/her teens, it's just ignorant if he/she can't recognize at least the name. or in my case, i'd expect panamanian kids to know cervantes by the time their age is in double digits; don quijote is taught in schools, after all.

with anime i think it's similar: as soon as newbies start browsing through a few more titles and trying more genres, they're bound to come across EVA in one way or the other. if you've had enough exposure to anime as a genre to actually call yourself an anime fan (looked titles up in the web, read reviews, maybe even joined anime clubs or been to conventions...), then you kinda have to have heard of EVA.

if the only exposure to anime some person has had is, say, naruto, then sure, i don't expect him/her to know EVA. but i wouldn't call him/her an anime fan either. you can't be an enthusiast for the whole genre if you've only seen one or two series. if the person's a true anime fan, i expect them to be a little more informed than that... and they'll definitely have heard of EVA if that's the case.