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Postby Sachi » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:30 pm

But what about blood and LCL?

In EoE, when Asuka/Unit-02 gets impaled in the eye by the LoL copy, blood immediately starts gushing out of her eye.

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But it acts as if it's in air. But it's in another liquid, the blood of Lilith/LCL.

Now, does that mean LCL is almost thin as air, or Asuka's blood is thicker than it should be, or did somebody fuck up?
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Postby NemZ » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:45 pm

Same thing happens with Rei's tears in ep23.

It's dissatisfying, by my bet is on willful ignorance of fluid dynamics on the part of the staff for the purposes of making animation easier.
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Postby Iron Rooster » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:46 pm

I'd go with 'fuck up' on this. They did the same thing when Rei cried in Unit 00 in episode 23.

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Postby NemZ » Thu Jul 10, 2008 10:50 pm

^
I aim to please! :grin:
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Postby Gamer_2k4 » Fri Jul 11, 2008 7:44 am

Oh come on...you really expect them to have sort of a growing cloud of blood in front of Asuka's eye? You really expect them to have Rei's tears just kind of floating off? That would be WAY more WTF than the technical inaccuracies, and it would totally detract from the scene as people are trying to figure out what's going on.
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Postby Reichu » Sun Jul 13, 2008 5:23 pm

How's Rei supposed to gape at her tears if they instantly dissipate into the LCL? ;)
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Postby Ornette » Sun Jul 13, 2008 6:58 pm

http://www.evageeks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3778

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Postby chee » Sun Jul 13, 2008 9:45 pm

It's done for dramatic effect.

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Postby tinmeigut » Mon Jul 14, 2008 3:47 am

Actually you do see Shinji's blood suspending in the LCL in the rebuild movie.
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Postby master_lloyd » Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:14 am

tinmeigut wrote:Actually you do see Shinji's blood suspending in the LCL in the rebuild movie.


When?
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Postby tinmeigut » Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:42 am

After Eva 01 was forcefully 'sunk' back underground at the first encounter with Ramiel (designated as 6th Angel in the Rebuild), there was a shot which showed that CPR was given to Shinji by the plgusuit. That shot also showed that Shinji had possibly had nosebleeding, as a gush of blood was seen to be suspending in the LCL.
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Postby p06 » Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:49 am

screwup sounds the most likely

tempting to fanwank; but probably has been raised before:

Those scenes don't really portray the actual physical view of the entry plug, but shows some sort of the view from the pilots' souls. Like when they're connected to the evas they go into some dreamlike trance (realize how they can see outside of the evas when the entry plug is like enclosed, this seems to suggests a "brain in jar" sort of thing where what they experience is different from what is physically happening) so technically their souls are crying/bleeding/etc. in that trance but not physicall?
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Postby master_lloyd » Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:52 am

Good eye. Maybe they'll fix this 'LCL physics' crap in Rebuild. Or just confuse the whole subject even more. My guess is the latter.
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Postby tinmeigut » Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:55 am

p06 wrote:screwup sounds the most likely

Those scenes don't really portray the actual physical view of the entry plug, but shows some sort of the view from the pilots' souls. Like when they're connected to the evas they go into some dreamlike trance (realize how they can see outside of the evas when the entry plug is like enclosed, this seems to suggests a "brain in jar" sort of thing where what they experience is different from what is physically happening) so technically their souls are crying/bleeding/etc. in that trance but not physicall?


You raised an interesting argument which I had never thought about before. Sorry to be a bit lazy but I don't want to dig into the piles of old topics in order to find evidence to support your saying; can you suggest some to support your ground? Thanks.
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Postby Gamer_2k4 » Mon Jul 14, 2008 10:07 am

p06 wrote:Those scenes don't really portray the actual physical view of the entry plug, but shows some sort of the view from the pilots' souls. Like when they're connected to the evas they go into some dreamlike trance (realize how they can see outside of the evas when the entry plug is like enclosed, this seems to suggests a "brain in jar" sort of thing where what they experience is different from what is physically happening) so technically their souls are crying/bleeding/etc. in that trance but not physicall?


Do we ever actually see what the pilots see, aside from when they have the targeting helmets on? (Incidentally, the targeting helmets would kind of go against your theory that its just a dream-like state.) Do we actually know how the visual information is transmitted, or how it appears? At any rate, it would be easy enough to convert the Eva's optical information into a computer display; they'd have the technology by then (meaning that the total plug enclosure wouldn't be an issue).
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Postby Reichu » Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:19 pm

I think we're pretty much seeing what the pilots are seeing. The entry plug uses screen displays to convey the Eva's surroundings to the pilot ("screens" is written on the actual production art). The behavioral logic of LCL in the plug is most easily chalked up to artistic liberties.

As for Rebuild, it's after Shinji is recovered from Ramiel's attack and his nose is bleeding.
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Postby Rhyno » Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:22 pm

If you haven't read the thread provided by Ornette, I suggest you do so. I know that it is seven pages long, but it is worth the read. RahOtaku tries to turn it into a religious discussion, but there is something to be said for Dr. Nick's LCL liquid/gas theory.

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Postby p06 » Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:29 am

tinmeigut wrote:You raised an interesting argument which I had never thought about before. Sorry to be a bit lazy but I don't want to dig into the piles of old topics in order to find evidence to support your saying; can you suggest some to support your ground? Thanks.


no real evidence, but a few things led me to think of it as such:

The pilots feel pain of the EVAs. there is also the mention of nerve link connections. The pilots souls are also synchronised with the souls of the EVAs. Doesn't this seem to suggest that the link between the outside world to the evas to the pilots are less of a technological (as in screens and controls) nature?

Do the pilots really see outside from screens? What about Rei's poem? She apparently is seeing non physical things... this, together with the frequent hallucinations that occur to pilots within evas, seem to suggest it highly likely that their souls are interacting with the evas' directly.

Helmets: Apparently fanwank here, but it could very well be an "augmented virtual reality", where the helmets add to the virtual experience?
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Postby Zuggy » Tue Jul 15, 2008 10:03 am

Solution: Asuka bleeds oil.

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Postby Mr. Tines » Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:42 pm

p06 wrote:seem to suggest it highly likely that their souls are interacting with the evas' directly.


The 360degree psychedelic lightshow when the system boots up always made me think that most of the input would be coming in through the nerve induction head-sets.
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