Question about the LoL

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Postby AyrYntake » Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:15 am

Xard, I think that picture actually has a serious Biblical reference in it. If you read Revelations 1:12~16 you'll find a bit that says "I saw one like the Son of Man...and his voice was like the sound of many waters. In his right hand he held seven stars, and from his mouth came a sharp, two-edged sword".
Drop the bit about the stars, but isn't the LoL almost too obviously two-edged?
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Postby slothen » Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:39 am

two points =/= two-edged
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Postby AyrYntake » Fri Jun 27, 2008 11:54 am

Given the ambiguity of the Bible's translation, I'd allow for that error.
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Postby slothen » Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:31 pm

i wouldn't. a sword is a sword is a sword. not a spear.
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Postby Ornette » Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:46 pm

AyrYntake wrote:Given the ambiguity of the Bible's translation, I'd allow for that error.

Give that Anno and Tsurimaki both said there is no religious meaning in Evangelion and that they used these symbols to look cool, and I wouldn't.

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Postby AyrYntake » Fri Jun 27, 2008 2:36 pm

Point taken. In that case, how does the LoL actually penetrate AT Fields? Either
(a) it's unaffected by AT Fields, or
(b) it has an AT Field of its own.
Which of these seems more plausible, or have I missed something out?
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Postby Gamer_2k4 » Fri Jun 27, 2008 2:59 pm

AyrYntake wrote:Point taken. In that case, how does the LoL actually penetrate AT Fields? Either
(a) it's unaffected by AT Fields, or
(b) it has an AT Field of its own.
Which of these seems more plausible, or have I missed something out?

My guess would be that the LoL supersedes AT fields just as AT fields supersede normal matter. Like I said in another thread, it's just more "real" than anything else. The LoL is to an AT field what we are to a hologram.

Of course, this probably only applies to the replicas. The original Lance is in a class all by itself (note how it dispatched Ariel).
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Postby AyrYntake » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:31 pm

So that's basically (a) then. This was what led me to think that the LoL symbolized death when I was younger.
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Postby Gamer_2k4 » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:49 pm

AyrYntake wrote:So that's basically (a) then. This was what led me to think that the LoL symbolized death when I was younger.


Oh...yeah. Saying "option a" would have been much briefer.

As far as LoL symbolism, I'd say it represents control more than death. Lilith was kept in check by it. Unit 2 was brought to a complete stop with it (essentially being held down so the MP Evas could actually inflict damage). Control over Instrumentality (mainly its beginning) was significantly reduced when the Lance was lost. Sure, death often came from the use of the Lance, but that was more of a side effect of what it WAS, not what it was intended for.
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Postby AuraTwilight » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:56 pm

I simply figured that the Lance of Longinus functioned like a ridiculously UBER Prog Knife X A Million.
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Postby AyrYntake » Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:58 pm

Another thing: why didn't it kill Lilith on that cross?
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Postby Ornette » Fri Jun 27, 2008 5:25 pm

AyrYntake wrote:Another thing: why didn't it kill Lilith on that cross?

The same reason it didn't kill Adam when Adam was speared sometime after First Impact. They were made to put Seeds of Life in suspended animation, not kill them.

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Postby NemZ » Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:29 pm

Perhaps the reason the LoL has a dual-pronged form and seems to be unwindable into separate halves is that it is in fact two lances? Without going into duel of the seeds stuff (cool as that would be were it true!) I imagine it makes perfect sense that the auto-shutdown feature only works when two of the packaged-in lances work together, thus only being necessary when they get into a multi-seed situation as happened on earth.

So why did Adam get the shaft(s) despite her claim of first 'dibs' if there was no fight involved? Well, maybe ep24 wasn't the first time Kwarou had to make that kind of choice... or maybe rock/paper/scissors is a much older game than we think!
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Postby Ornette » Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:00 pm

NemZ wrote:Well, maybe ep24 wasn't the first time Kwarou had to make that kind of choice... or maybe rock/paper/scissors is a much older game than we think!

You'd be surprised

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Postby AuraTwilight » Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:02 am

NemZ wrote:Perhaps the reason the LoL has a dual-pronged form and seems to be unwindable into separate halves is that it is in fact two lances? Without going into duel of the seeds stuff (cool as that would be were it true!) I imagine it makes perfect sense that the auto-shutdown feature only works when two of the packaged-in lances work together, thus only being necessary when they get into a multi-seed situation as happened on earth.

So why did Adam get the shaft(s) despite her claim of first 'dibs' if there was no fight involved? Well, maybe ep24 wasn't the first time Kwarou had to make that kind of choice... or maybe rock/paper/scissors is a much older game than we think!


The Lance is one lance. Lilith's Lance was destroyed when she landed, so Adam's activated and skewered her, putting Adam into a sort of stasis until Second Impact.

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Postby Sharaz Destler » Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:34 am

Ornette wrote:
NemZ wrote:Well, maybe ep24 wasn't the first time Kwarou had to make that kind of choice... or maybe rock/paper/scissors is a much older game than we think!

You'd be surprised


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Postby NemZ » Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:09 am

AuraTwilight wrote:The Lance is one lance. Lilith's Lance was destroyed when she landed, so Adam's activated and skewered her, putting Adam into a sort of stasis until Second Impact.


Oh?

CI wrote:It is thought that a Spear acting as Lilith's counterpart was separated from her by the shock at the time of First Impact. This Spear has yet to be found. There is a chance that it may have been destroyed.


The CI seems to leave this all very much in a state of uncertainty.

What's wrong with the explanation that perhaps they can't find Lilith's because they don't realize they already have it?

If it is just one single object then why was it able to be unwound into two unconnected halves at the end?
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Postby Reichu » Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:53 pm

NemZ wrote:The CI seems to leave this all very much in a state of uncertainty.

Most NGE stuff is littered with conditionals.

If it is just one single object then why was it able to be unwound into two unconnected halves at the end?

The Spear is a double helix. In its default form, it unwinds at one end to form the two tines.
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Postby NemZ » Tue Jul 01, 2008 5:02 pm

Reichu wrote:The Spear is a double helix. In its default form, it unwinds at one end to form the two tines.


Yes, every time we see the true spear/lance that's the form it certainly is in, with various degrees of intertwining, ranging from a single-pointed throwing weapon to two completely separate pieces by the end of EOE. No argument.

My point is that maybe it was originally developed by the FAR in this separated form, each half packaged in with one of the seeds. If so, it only became the familiar dual-pronged version that was found in Adam's back when the "Oh Noes! 2 Seeds, 1 Cup!" :wink: function kicked in shortly after 1st impact.

If I'm right, this explains the mystery of the missing spear and the transformational nature of the weapon, makes perfect sense as a binary safety feature to prevent the 'forbidden union', and even brings your Duel of the Seeds thing back into play in a roundabout fashion. What's not to like?
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Postby Xard » Tue Jul 01, 2008 5:05 pm

the fact that is awfully contrived even for Evangelion? :tongue: And why wasn't Lilith skewered?

And why would you pack only half with Seed anyway?

And they're NEVER separated pieces. Their level of direct connection/coherence just changes.

That also excludes the fact Spear is living, sentient lifeform. not two lego blocks or something


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