Misato & Shinji

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Postby the-artist-known-as-chris » Tue Nov 30, 2004 11:29 am

Carl Horn wrote:
the-artist-known-as-chris wrote:
Dark FireStar wrote:I wish it was that way for the U.S.


I think we all wish that. :lol: What guy at Shinji's age wouldnt want to live let alone be with a babe like Misato?


The only guy I can think of who actually wouldn't is Shinji ;-)


Which is hillarious in its own right. Though Misato may have her own ideas.

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Postby Dark FireStar » Tue Nov 30, 2004 3:06 pm

I wonder what would have happend between them is Shinji wasent such a wuss? >>>>>>>>___<<<<<<<<< ahhhhhh
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Postby DatDude » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:38 am

It seems this topic came up again in another thread to keep things all in one place im cutting and pasting things over to here.

kosure wrote:I just got finished watching EOE for the, i think, millionth time, and I came across something.

We all know Misato is a sex-fiend, and that she 'classically shows affection sexually.' But what if she really did live Shinji. I mean love Shinji. I think that might help explain some things.

Anyway, its something im workign on.

anyone care to comment?


Yes it would explain a lot. but its the "type" of love that every one seems to keep arguing about.

sadsadshinji wrote:i still dont agree with the "Misato loves Shinji in a sexual manner"
i feel that she expressed her emotions sexually, but that Kaji was the object of her affections.
and you spelled "love" wrong


Again I agree with you, if Misato was only or even mostly intresting in Shinji for sex I think it would have been easy for her to bang him and forget about him, but she tryed to help the poor kid more then once.

If this wasn't the case why did she try to get Shinji to make friends when beening the only influence on the poor kid would have made him easier to manipulate/seduce?


It is a fact that Misato did tryed to give a damn. Yes their are a lot of times when she's not their for ether of the children but it goes back to the problem of beening able to conncet with others thats so much at the core of eva's story.

I still say Misato cared for Shinji like a son or kid brother because of how alike they were and the things she went through at his age that made her the way she is. Granted that she didn't know how to express her feelings and when she tryed ( coming on to Shinji the adult kiss in EoE ) she failed and probly made things worse by confusing poor Shinji.
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Postby Reichu » Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:15 pm

It completely boggles me that you people who claim Misato was at no point trying to get into Shinji's pants completely ignore episode #25...

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Postby bp32 » Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:22 pm

Reichu wrote:It completely boggles me that you people who claim Misato was at no point trying to get into Shinji's pants completely ignore episode #25...


No one is ignoring it--we just view it as an attempt by Misato (a bad attempt) to 'motivate' Shinji at the end--like everyone has said, the only way she knows how to show affection is through sexual flirtation--flirtation doesn't mean she actually wants to have sex with Shinji, just this is the only way she feels comfortable expressing her feelings. It was a bad attempt to comfort/motivate Shinji while she is dying. For my money 25 could be interpreted either way--it isn't conclusive evidence for either viewpoint--just like everything else in the series :x
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Postby the_seventh_child » Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:24 pm

Reichu wrote:It completely boggles me that you people who claim Misato was at no point trying to get into Shinji's pants completely ignore episode #25...

well yeah but that doesn't mean that Misato wanted to get in Shinji's pants many times..this happened one time and it doesn't change the fact that Misato was more like mother to Shinji..
it was just a moment that Misato couldn't control herself and she felt that only she could give Shinji then was her body..
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Postby DatDude » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:28 pm

Reichu wrote:It completely boggles me that you people who claim Misato was at no point trying to get into Shinji's pants completely ignore episode #25...


Seeing as we've been thorugh this a few times before ( he-he love eva and its vague nature), mabe it would be best if you explained your view point one more time.

In the past its always seemed to me that you fealt that Misato had no other intention then to use Shinji in one way or another ( for revenge or sex), and that she never infact cared for him on anyother level. Is this the case ?

If yes Then as posted ubove many of us just don't agree with you on that.

For my view point I really think Misato cared for Shinji. Remember when her tears brought him back from unit-1 ? If she justed wanted him physicaly or as a tool for revenege I don't think that would have worked.

If no please try explaining it again but understand that we know that Misato has come on to Shinji on several instances we just view the motive behind her actions diffrently then you.
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Postby Reichu » Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:31 pm

Episode #25 (not the movie episode #25') references the scene from #23 in such a way as to make Misato's sexual intentions EXPLICIT. The idea of sleeping with Shinji was in her mind from day 1, but she kept it well contained until things started to fall apart. Anyone, read this again. And since people have such a hard time believing disturbing truth about Misato, I'll have to dig up some of the relevant threads on that OTHER forum later, since apparently they have not been linked to yet.

http://evageeks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=12541#12541

One has to remember that the characters in NGE are not cardboard cut-outs. They are very human and of conflicting interests. Misato's interest in being a maternal figure to Shinji not does automatically exclude some kind of underlying inappropriate interest in him. She sees it as one of her failings as his surrogate mother and is disgusted by this aspect of herself, but that does not stop it from being there.
Last edited by Reichu on Thu Dec 16, 2004 12:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Dave » Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:48 pm

Reichu wrote:She sees it as one of her failings as his surrogate mothe and is disgusted by this aspect of herself, but that does not stop it from being there.


I've never really thought of it that way. Gotta love Reichu. :wink: Correct me if I'm wrong (I can take it!), but it seems that sort of thing is rare in characters outside of Evangelion.
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Postby Carl Horn » Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:20 pm

Dave wrote:
Reichu wrote:She sees it as one of her failings as his surrogate mothe and is disgusted by this aspect of herself, but that does not stop it from being there.


I've never really thought of it that way. Gotta love Reichu. :wink: Correct me if I'm wrong (I can take it!), but it seems that sort of thing is rare in characters outside of Evangelion.


But much more common in real life; EVA is a pioneer in the radical theory of "imaginary characters with more than one personality trait."

--C.

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Postby DatDude » Wed Dec 15, 2004 9:10 pm

Reichu wrote:Episode #25 (not the movie episode #25') references the scene from #23 in such a way as to make Misato's sexual intentions EXPLICIT. The idea of sleeping with Shinji was in her mind from day 1, but she kept it well contained until things started to fall apart. Anyone, read this again. And since people have such a hard time believing disturbing truth about Misato, I'll have to dig up some of the relevant threads on that OTHER forum later, since apparently they have not been linked to yet.

http://evageeks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=12541#12541

One has to remember that the characters in NGE are not cardboard cut-outs. They are very human and of conflicting interests. Misato's interest in being a maternal figure to Shinji not does automatically exclude some kind of underlying inappropriate interest in him. She sees it as one of her failings as his surrogate mothe and is disgusted by this aspect of herself, but that does not stop it from being there.


Yes I do get that she was coming on to Shinji, I understand that given a willing Shinji she would have gone all the way in 23.

Can you look at the series and say it was her only motavation in taking him in?

Can you say that sexual attraction aside she had no intrest in Shinji at all?

You keep restating your stance but you don't seem to be trying to understand the other side, just writing it off as us not seeing what their. I do get that Misato was trying to sleep with Shinji but I just think that their are deeper reasons behind that attraction.
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Postby Reichu » Thu Dec 16, 2004 12:44 am

DatDude wrote:Can you look at the series and say it was her only motavation in taking him in?

Can you say that sexual attraction aside she had no intrest in Shinji at all?

You keep restating your stance but you don't seem to be trying to understand the other side, just writing it off as us not seeing what their. I do get that Misato was trying to sleep with Shinji but I just think that their are deeper reasons behind that attraction.


People like to write off the scene in episode #23 and the kiss, insisting that something motivated it completely separate from a sexual interest in him that had been there the whole time. To insist that this is so is, IMO, just dense and completely disregarding the clues that the show gives us.

By the same token, though, it is not merely an underlying sexual attraction that motivates Misato to do what she does. I would have to be pretty dense to propose that there is no more to Misato's relationship with Shinji than "forbidden desires". There just didn't seem to be any need for me to argue the point. Sorry about that.

As to why Misato sees a 14-year-old boy as a potential lover in the first place... That's something worth wondering about.

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Postby DatDude » Thu Dec 16, 2004 1:27 am

For he record Reichu your explanation of the Misato Shinji relation ship did help me see that she was looking to get into his pants way ealier then i'd picked up on before coming to these boards.

As for " to why Misato sees a 14-year-old boy as a potential lover " I'd probly have to go with Misato feeling for Shinji because she had a simular expearence growing up. Losing a parent and feeling unloved by the other one. She probly spent years feeling that way until she meet Kaji and fealt " ahem" loved. Now we can gather that she and Kaji however close never came out and said the words " I love you " even if they cared for each other deeply.

Leading back to my theory that Misato like a lot if not all of the characters in eva don't know how to say those word or mabe even know what they mean truly, even if they want to so badly.

To try to cut my rant shror she confues " physical " love and e" motional " love. Its an easy think to do and it happens every day.

To answer the question brough up in the " Misato and Shinji in a tree" thread yes i think Misato loved Shinji she just couldn't express in the way most of us would excpect a 29 year old to express it to a 14 year old.
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Postby Reichu » Thu Dec 16, 2004 4:39 pm

DatDude wrote:To try to cut my rant shror she confues " physical " love and e" motional " love. Its an easy think to do and it happens every day.


Of course, there are a great many times when it is appropriate to share physical love with someone you love emotionally.

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Postby DatDude » Thu Dec 16, 2004 5:50 pm

Yes but not when one party involved is 14 and the other is 29. :wink:
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Postby Carl Horn » Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:01 pm

Reichu wrote:
DatDude wrote:To try to cut my rant shror she confues " physical " love and e" motional " love. Its an easy think to do and it happens every day.


Of course, there are a great many times when it is appropriate to share physical love with someone you love emotionally.


Hmm. Maybe we've totally misinterpreted Episodes 1 and 2, and Sachiel was just trying to come on to Shinji, as his brother Tabris later would. He is kind of violently thrusting against him. This raises the important question: are there any straight Angels? I mean, Zeruel's dead butch, the two Israfels never leave each other alone, Shamshel's flailing those pink arms everywhere, and Arael is flaming brighter than a Bailey's Comet.

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Postby Tabris » Thu Dec 16, 2004 6:36 pm

Misato is a character with at least two very different facets, though, isn't she? It's made clear in ep. 25 of the TV series - there is the 'ordinary' Misato who attempts to be 'pure and noble' (in this case, her taking in of Shinji in the beginning was probably an example of trying to be this) and there's the 'real' Misato she tries to hide from everyone else (the one who wants to 'fill the hole in her heart with temporary escape', takes advantage of men, etc.). Both sides of her character are always present, right? The 'nobler' side of her personality is more dominant in the first half of the series though, supressing the other, but it does get eroded away to the point of her sleeping with Kaji (who you'd think would be the last person she'd sleep with from the way she was acting around him before). In Misato's case, I think she wouldn't have put the moves on Shinji (if we assume that's definitely what she was up to) if she hadn't been stressed out herself over Kaji's death and other events. It was obviously inappropriate for her to do it, and at no other point in the series does she ever try to comfort him or herself in that way... so I'd say it was a result not of her 'wanting to sex0rz Shinji' so much as being unable to cope herself with what was going on at the time, and the things she'd discovered... and selfishly wanting to be close to someone else. She obviously cared for Shinji in some way, but just how much or in what capacity would depend on the extent to which the 'real' Misato encorporated the 'noble' Misato as well. I wouldn't suggest it was a purely selfish thing, although love is, after all, (arguably) ultimately selfish, but with Misato it's hard to tell what her motivations are... even she doesn't seem to know half the time.

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Postby Reichu » Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:53 pm

DatDude: Are you pushing non-Japanese sensibilities onto Japanese characters? I thought I already covered that!

Carl Horn wrote:Hmm. Maybe we've totally misinterpreted Episodes 1 and 2, and Sachiel was just trying to come on to Shinji,


Actually, it's EVA-01 that he had an Oedipal attraction towards. ;) Under the armor, she basically looks like a brown, green-eyed version of his own mother.

the two Israfels never leave each other alone


Gold and silver represent the two sexes here. So that would make it having a heterosexual relationship with yourself -- which normally isn't possible.

Zeruel's machismo is a front. When you get him into bed, he's always on the bottom.

(Carl, this is all your fault...)

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Postby Hunter21 » Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:50 pm

Carl Horn wrote:Hmm. Maybe we've totally misinterpreted Episodes 1 and 2, and Sachiel was just trying to come on to Shinji, as his brother Tabris later would. He is kind of violently thrusting against him. This raises the important question: are there any straight Angels? I mean, Zeruel's dead butch, the two Israfels never leave each other alone, Shamshel's flailing those pink arms everywhere, and Arael is flaming brighter than a Bailey's Comet.

Now that I think about it, you may be on to something Carl.
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Postby Jamie the Great » Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:13 pm

I always thought that Misato wanted to comfort Shinji but the only way she really knew how to comfort others was by being sexual because that seems to help her. Like a "If-it-helps-me-then-it-should-help-others" mentality going on. And as for the kissing scene in EoE I assumed that Misato was just trying to give Shinji the extra nudge to pilot again. She was playing the Gendo (using sex and all that jazz to reach his own goal) and Shinji was the Ritsuko or her mother type (who took the bait). Or it could very well be that because Misato knew her time was up she figured she had nothing to lose and went ahead with her desire for Shinji.


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